Can Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah cover Kelce as effectively as Lavonte David?

[NewEra]

I haven’t watched any of his full games.  Strictly highlights and some casual watching during his career. His cover skills look legit.  To those in the know, how is his discipline?  Is he easily baited by QBs eyes and play action?  If he can be what we thought Edmunds might be, a TE stopper, we should trade up and snag him. He’s a Jack of all trades and exactly what this D needs.  It’s a rare skill set and he could be a superstar of used correctly. We could use someone to cover Kelce and possibly Pitts if he goes to Miami,  
 

thoughts?  Worth trading up for?

Edited April 23, 2021 by NewEra

[MJS]

I googled "Jok" and came up with some kind of Thai food.

[Buffalo716]

19 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I haven’t watched any of his full games.  Strictly highlights and some casual watching during his career. His cover skills look legit.  To those in the know, how is his discipline?  Is he easily baited by QBs eyes and play action?  If he can be what we thought Edmunds might be, a TE stopper, we should trade up and snag him. He’s a Jack of all trades and exactly what this D needs.  It’s a rare skill set and he could be a superstar of used correctly. We could use someone to cover Kelce and possibly Pitts if he goes to Miami,  
 

thoughts?  Worth trading up for?

The problem with that is in zone coverage an elite tight end will find the soft spot the majority of the time.. especially when the quarterback has time to throw 

 

 

Tremaine has done a good job of clogging up passing lanes for the majority of his career which is what McDermott asks

 

In McDermott's nickel defense which is basically his base.. in man-to-man Tremaine is lined up on running backs alot 

 

[papazoid]

Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah

 

LB - Notre Dame

[Dablitzkrieg]

I firmly believe neutralizing Kelce is the key. They can bracket Hill.  I like the thought, but honestly have no clue if he is good enough

Edited April 23, 2021 by Dablitzkrieg

[Coach Tuesday]

[BornAgainBillsFan]

Hey, @NewEra. I think you meant 2022 3rd rd pick, i.e. next year.

[machine gun kelly]

2 hours ago, papazoid said:

Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah

 

LB - Notre Dame

Thanks Papzoid.  I had no idea who they were talking about and I like ND.  I’ve just always known him by his given name.

 

Born Again,  I read he declared as he finished his Junior year.  He’s undersized so he’d have to play more of a big nickel safety as he’s a tweaner.  I wouldn’t have a problem with him in the 3rd round, but our 1st is probably going to be an Edge Rusher, CB, or not my choice anymore, but RB.

Edited April 23, 2021 by machine gun kelly

[Doc Brown]

It'll be tough to find a player that limits Kelce to 133 yards on 10 catches.  No.  You'd be nuts to give that much up for JOK.  Just stay put at 30 and pick BPA in position of need.  It's more likely the Bills trade up in rounds 2 or 3.

[Matt_In_NH]

Is this a jok?  We dont all know the initials of every guy in the NFL.  Seriously though, just not covering him did not work in the championship game, nice try to confuse the Chiefs but it did not work.

[H2o]

I've watched every game of Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah's career at Notre Dame. He was a 190lb LB coming out of HS in Hampton, VA. They knew he was a top tier athlete, but it took Clark Lea to put him in a position to be the most successful. In 2019 they put him at an OLB position they call the "Rover" on defense. He immediately began making an impact. His instincts are off the charts. He processes what's in front of him and attacks the ball carrier. That's why he's had 25 tfl's over the last two seasons. His closing burst is 2nd to none and when he gets to the ball carrier the pop in his pads is evident. In coverage? He can cover RB's, TE's, and slot WR's if necessary. He can run with them all. He's 6'2", 221lbs, with long arms, and he understands his roles in coverage. I think he's tailor made for this defense to play that Thomas Davis role and can easily add another 10lbs without the loss of any athleticism. He absolutely could cover Kelce and would be effective. 

 

Even with that said, I'm not trading up for anyone in this draft unless Jaycee Horn or Surtain somehow fall into the late teens. 

Edited April 23, 2021 by H2o

[TBBills]

Depends if our defensive coaches play press coverage or allow them to run free.

[Thurman#1]

No. Nor should it be considered.

[HOUSE]

1 minute ago, Thurman#1 said:

No. Nor should it be considered.

The Thai food or the basketball player ?

[Thurman#1]

If he falls to 23 or around there, and if they want him there, start offering more modestly.

 

Again, Massey-Thaler.

 

 

7 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

The Thai food or the basketball player ?

 

 

If the Thai food is anything like pad thai or tom yum goong, it is heaven on earth and should be brought in weekly.

Edited April 23, 2021 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

44 minutes ago, H2o said:

I've watched every game of Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah's career at Notre Dame. He was a 190lb LB coming out of HS in Hampton, VA. They knew he was a top tier athlete, but it took Clark Lea to put him in a position to be the most successful. In 2019 they put him at an OLB position they call the "Rover" on defense. He immediately began making an impact. His instincts are off the charts. He processes what's in front of him and attacks the ball carrier. That's why he's had 25 tfl's over the last two seasons. His closing burst is 2nd to none and when he gets to the ball carrier the pop in his pads is evident. In coverage? He can cover RB's, TE's, and slot WR's if necessary. He can run with them all. He's 6'2", 221lbs, with long arms, and he understands his roles in coverage. I think he's tailor made for this defense to play that Thomas Davis role and can easily add another 10lbs without the loss of any athleticism. He absolutely could cover Kelce and would be effective. 

 

Even with that said, I'm not trading up for anyone in this draft unless Jaycee Horn or Surtain somehow fall into the late teens. 

 

 

Nice summary. Thanks. You make him sound interesting.

Edited April 23, 2021 by Thurman#1

[DJB]

JOK has been my #1 draft target for us for a while now. 

 

He is the big nickle we need and covet. 

[Royale with Cheese]

Kelce in 2 games against TB had 18 catches and 200 yards receiving....

[TPS]

Wish I could find the article, but I recently read that one of the reasons Jamin Davis is jammin up the rankings is how he was able to stay with Kyle Pitts relatively well. I assume that means he could stay with Kelce?

[NewEra]

6 hours ago, BornAgainBillsFan said:

Hey, @NewEra. I think you meant 2022 3rd rd pick, i.e. next year.

Thanks.  Fixed

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

I don't know that it was David's coverage that made the hugest difference.  They were in Mahomes face all night and kept them behind the sticks.  KC didn't or wouldn't run the ball and it killed them.  They had KC settling for field goals and punting more than 

 

Between that and defensive penalties putting points on the board for TB were the difference.  Offside on a FG attempt is a 4 point switch, and then letting brady get not 1 but 2 DPI penalties in the last minute added 7 more.  21-6 at half instead of something like 10-6 is a pretty huge swing.  

[NewEra]

8 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

The problem with that is in zone coverage an elite tight end will find the soft spot the majority of the time.. especially when the quarterback has time to throw 

 

 

Tremaine has done a good job of clogging up passing lanes for the majority of his career which is what McDermott asks

 

In McDermott's nickel defense which is basically his base.. in man-to-man Tremaine is lined up on running backs alot 

 

Here’s the thing.....McD and co need to adapt.  We can’t just run out the same defensive scheme with the same tendencies year after year.  We need a new wrinkle.  
 

I’m not saying the JOK is the only answer to that, but he certainly is a possibility.  The more we stay the same, the worse off we are.  It’s unlikely that we add a game changing pass rusher @30 (or in this draft entirely).  Will a CB rd 1 or 2 change the way in which McD/Frazier calls a game?  Maybe.  I really hope that we draft a CB with one of our first 2 picks, but this guy could change the dynamic of our defense.  We neee game changers on D.   Right now, we might have 1 (Tre’davious).  We need more.
 

just a thought.  

3 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

If he falls to 23 or around there, and if they want him there, start offering more modestly.

 

Again, Massey-Thaler.

 

 

 

 

If the Thai food is anything like pad thai or tom yum goong, it is heaven on earth and should be brought in weekly.

The trade I proposed has value to get up to around 21

2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Kelce in 2 games against TB had 18 catches and 200 yards receiving....

And 0 TDs.  Kelce in 2 games vs the Bills..... he had 4 TDs.

[stinky finger]

9 hours ago, MJS said:

I googled "Jok" and came up with some kind of Thai food.

 

I’d trade you my tuna salad sammy and a frito-lay product to be named later for that Thai concoction. 😁

[stinky finger]

I’ve only seen some tape, nothing live. He certainly covers ground and puts a wallop on the ball carrier. 

 

Where’s his place in our defensive system? He certainly looks like a 3 down player. 

 

That price though.....steep. I’m gonna say no. 

 

 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

9 hours ago, NewEra said:

I haven’t watched any of his full games.  Strictly highlights and some casual watching during his career. His cover skills look legit.  To those in the know, how is his discipline?  Is he easily baited by QBs eyes and play action?  If he can be what we thought Edmunds might be, a TE stopper, we should trade up and snag him. He’s a Jack of all trades and exactly what this D needs.  It’s a rare skill set and he could be a superstar of used correctly. We could use someone to cover Kelce and possibly Pitts if he goes to Miami,  
 

thoughts?  Worth trading up for?

no one can really slow Kelce down, including David. The chiefs line was a mess And David did an excellent job, and Kelce still had 10 catches for 130

yards in the super bowl.  
 

I would argue that you need to put an elite safety on him to have a Chance. If there is a LB that could defend him, it would be Milano. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

9 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

The problem with that is in zone coverage an elite tight end will find the soft spot the majority of the time.. especially when the quarterback has time to throw 

 

This.  Especially with a QB who is master at manipulating the zone with his eyes....like Mahomes.

The key is to affect the QB, pressure him, make him uncomfortable.

 

[LABILLBACKER]

5 hours ago, TBBills said:

Depends if our defensive coaches play press coverage or allow them to run free.

 

1 hour ago, TPS said:

Wish I could find the article, but I recently read that one of the reasons Jamin Davis is jammin up the rankings is how he was able to stay with Kyle Pitts relatively well. I assume that means he could stay with Kelce?

I don't care who jams Kelce as long as somebody does it. This ND kid is 6-2 and 220 so he's still giving up alot of size to TK. The guys almost 32, just jam his ass at the los. Older players hate getting hit.

[GoBills808]

10/113 is what you call effective coverage😂😂

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

11 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

 

I don't care who jams Kelce as long as somebody does it. This ND kid is 6-2 and 220 so he's still giving up alot of size to TK. The guys almost 32, just jam his ass at the los. Older players hate getting hit.

if you look what some teams do against Kelce, they spread their line out, and have their DE’s jam kelce  hard at the LOS. Most pundits say that you never want to give Kelce a free release, yet that’s what the Bills did in the AFCCG. 

[NewEra]

12 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

10/113 is what you call effective coverage😂😂

Yeah.  0 Tds in two games.  He scored 4 in two games on our head.  After 3 quarters he had 6 catches for 55 yards.....and the game was over.
 

Final box scores don’t tell the story.  Watch the game as opposed to looking at end game stats.. Kelce was shut down the majority of the game......but think what you like.  It was 133 btw.  78 yards in the 4th qtr with the game already being decided.  

Edited April 23, 2021 by NewEra

[Rigotz]

Can we get a third option for:

 

"Don't trade unnecessary draft picks and hope he either falls to us or another good player does?"

[NewEra]

2 minutes ago, Rigotz said:

Can we get a third option for:

 

"Don't trade unnecessary draft picks and hope he either falls to us or another good player does?"

No.  Not what I was looking to find out

[John from Riverside]

You don’t trade up for any players in the first round except for QB therefore no trade ups in the first round

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

25 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Yeah.  0 Tds in two games.  He scored 4 in two games on our head.  After 3 quarters he had 6 catches for 55 yards.....and the game was over.
 

Final box scores don’t tell the story.  Watch the game as opposed to looking at end game stats.. Kelce was shut down the majority of the game......but think what you like.  It was 133 btw.  78 yards in the 4th qtr with the game already being decided.  

They ran 50+ pass plays and completed half.  A- thats not remotely balance.  B- that is terrible execution.  243 net yards across 52 pass plays is less than 5 a pop.  They wrecked the line in that game and made mahomes move more than usual.  

[NewEra]

8 minutes ago, dneveu said:

They ran 50+ pass plays and completed half.  A- thats not remotely balance.  B- that is terrible execution.  243 net yards across 52 pass plays is less than 5 a pop.  They wrecked the line in that game and made mahomes move more than usual.  

Yeah, I realize that. What does that have to do with my post?  

 

I’ve said a million times, imo, the result of that game was due to the KC OL being broken and playing out of position. We’ve never seen a team dominate the chiefs OL like that before.  Likely won’t ever again.  In their first matchup, they didn’t have Benadryl the same success.  The Bucs DL is very good and much better than ours, but their 4 man rush wouldn’t have gotten home nearly that often as they had Eric fisher not tore his Achilles in the AFCCG, which created mayhem along the KC OL.  
 

If our front offices game plan is to build a pass rush that will dominance the KC OL like tampa did in the SB......they better get moving.....fast.  Time is running out and the options are few.  By the look of their offseason so far, building a dominant pass rush isn’t on their agenda.  We better have guys that can cover....or it’ll be a repeat of last season

 

[Royale with Cheese]

2 hours ago, NewEra said:

Here’s the thing.....McD and co need to adapt.  We can’t just run out the same defensive scheme with the same tendencies year after year.  We need a new wrinkle.  
 

I’m not saying the JOK is the only answer to that, but he certainly is a possibility.  The more we stay the same, the worse off we are.  It’s unlikely that we add a game changing pass rusher @30 (or in this draft entirely).  Will a CB rd 1 or 2 change the way in which McD/Frazier calls a game?  Maybe.  I really hope that we draft a CB with one of our first 2 picks, but this guy could change the dynamic of our defense.  We neee game changers on D.   Right now, we might have 1 (Tre’davious).  We need more.
 

just a thought.  

The trade I proposed has value to get up to around 21

And 0 TDs.  Kelce in 2 games vs the Bills..... he had 4 TDs.

Yes but its not like he was stopped or covered well.  

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

Yeah, I realize that. What does that have to do with my post?  

 

I’ve said a million times, imo, the result of that game was due to the KC OL being broken and playing out of position. We’ve never seen a team dominate the chiefs OL like that before.  Likely won’t ever again.  In their first matchup, they didn’t have Benadryl the same success.  The Bucs DL is very good and much better than ours, but their 4 man rush wouldn’t have gotten home nearly that often as they had Eric fisher not tore his Achilles in the AFCCG, which created mayhem along the KC OL.  
 

If our front offices game plan is to build a pass rush that will dominance the KC OL like tampa did in the SB......they better get moving.....fast.  Time is running out and the options are few.  By the look of their offseason so far, building a dominant pass rush isn’t on their agenda.  We better have guys that can cover....or it’ll be a repeat of last season

 

 

In the 2 games we deployed vastly different strategies, but both were predicated on eliminating big plays.  In the first game we played pass on every rpo and they ran it all day.  In the 2nd game buffalo clogged the middle of the field more and sat in their quarters.  That left some plays to be had between zones and they picked us apart.  

With the bills defense, i think they need to run more man, and they probably need to blitz more.  Put pressure on mahomes and do your best in coverage.  It sort of goes against everything the bills defense is about, but it might be necessary to win that game.

[buffaloboyinATL]

9 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

I firmly believe neutralizing Kelce is the key. They can bracket Hill.  I like the thought, but honestly have no clue if he is good enough

I feel like the key is getting pressure on Mahomes, like Tampa did, but I honestly don’t know if there is anyone in this draft (that we can get to) that will make that possible. 

[NewEra]

34 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Yes but its not like he was stopped or covered well.  

Who?  Kelce?  The guy had 6 catches for 55 yards when the game was over.  He had zero TDs.  He was stopped. You might not consider that stopped because you look at his 4th qtr stats....when the game was over.  I consider him stopped

[NewEra]

31 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

In the 2 games we deployed vastly different strategies, but both were predicated on eliminating big plays.  In the first game we played pass on every rpo and they ran it all day.  In the 2nd game buffalo clogged the middle of the field more and sat in their quarters.  That left some plays to be had between zones and they picked us apart.  

With the bills defense, i think they need to run more man, and they probably need to blitz more.  Put pressure on mahomes and do your best in coverage.  It sort of goes against everything the bills defense is about, but it might be necessary to win that game.

This is my point...this is why I made the post.  I feel that he’s the type of player that will allow us to play more man and less zone.  The type of player that can defend Kelce....maybe not shut him down....but make it uncomfortable to throw him the ball.  Unlike the defense we employed in both games last year.  
 

Everyone says that the best way to beating the chiefs is to dominate with a 4 man rush. That may be the case.  We saw what Tampa’s 4 man rush did to them.....but the problem with that:  1:  easier said than done.  JPP, Suh, Barrett and Vea aren’t walking through the doors anytime soon.  2:  the chiefs OL that the bucs dominated is an OL that you’ll never see again.  The Bucs were seriously lucky they were able to fade that mishmash unit of crap.  
 

So, if we aren’t going to have a dominant pass rush, what’s plan b?  Acquiring versatile defenders that can blitz, cover and tackle while moving them around and disguising coverages to confuse Mahomes (and every other QB).  A good, well executed game plan with the proper players/skill sets to make it happen 

31 minutes ago, buffaloboyinATL said:

I feel like the key is getting pressure on Mahomes, like Tampa did, but I honestly don’t know if there is anyone in this draft (that we can get to) that will make that possible. 

This is the problem.  If we plan on getting the kind of pressure that Tampa did, we will likely come up short.  We won’t be getting pressure on Mahomes the way tampa did.  Tampa played the same defense that we did against Kc (4 man rush, little to no blitzes). Tampa faced a much different OL and has much more talent.