Senior Bowl executive director Jim Nagy on Jake Fromm

[Nervous Guy]

7 hours ago, CBennett said:

I saw a bunch of guys say look he doesnt have a ROCKET arm but when they compared his arm strength they directly compared it to Brady, Manning(both mannings), Montana,there was one other successful..maybe Brees they also put in there and said he has the same/equal as those guys....not great NOT a noodle arm.

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/patriots/tom-bradys-nfl-scouting-combine-report-highlights-are-hilarious-retrospect

[BillsNutHawaii]

9 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

For now....we will revisit that comment at the end of this season.  By that time it may very well be Fromm's team. 

 

I hope you’re wrong, but I think by the end of the 2021 season you could be right about Fromm.  I don’t hate JA, I think he’s a truly great guy, really nice too.  But if we are looking for the nicest guy to be the QB, then I’ll nominate my neighbor. And it’s not that Fromm is / will be great .... I’m just not sure JA will consistently be able to avoid injury and I’m not sure he will ever be able to translate the game to the satisfaction of the HC.... hope I’m wrong. 

[BillsNutHawaii]

10 hours ago, Cal said:

You clowns still pushing Fromm lol. He is a bum. Was a 5th round pick for a reason. Go root for another team, this is Allen's team. Like is said before, don't understand the hate for Allen from 90% of you from the get go.

 

We hate Josh? Haven’t seen any evidence of hating JA here.  I do see you called others here “clowns” and you already came to the conclusion Fromm is a “Bum” and he hasn’t even been with the team for a full week yet.  But it’s the others who are “hating”.... that’s great ! 

[atlbillsfan1975]

Anyone who thinks Fromm is Peterman 2.0, doesn’t have a firm grasp of the players careers so far.

Fromm beat out two other very good quarterbacks in college, Peterman had to transfer out because he lost his job. Fromm played in the SEC, best conference in college, the draft proved that again. Fromm is going to win his coaches and teammates over. Fromm doesn’t have the talent Allen does. Fromm is the better prospect than Barkley. This isn’t a Fromm verse Allen discussion. 
I will feel a lot better with Fromm on the bench than Barkley. Fromm stepped In his freshman year and his team went to the National Championship game. Fromm kept his team in every game except the Auburn regular season game. UGA came back and destroyed Auburn in the SEC championship game. 
I am a UGA fan, I am also someone who didn’t think Fromm was going to get drafted before the third round. You turn on Fromm’s tape and nothing really stands out. I will say, I think Fromm is good at giving his receivers a shot at a ball. When he has good receivers he excels. This past season he had very little play makers in the SEC which is the best group of football teams outside of the NFL. Fromm will beat out Barkley, we should all be hoping for that. Fromm is a winner, I want a confident calm backup who doesn’t let the situation get to him. Fromm already showed he could do that in college when he took his team into Notre Dame for his first start and led UGA to victory. 

Edited May 5, 2020 by atlbillsfan1975

[PromoTheRobot]

You know I don't recall Frank Reich having a rocket launcher arm. He worked out.

[JaCrispy]

Watching his “highlights” I can’t help but think that Fromm looks like a poor man’s Matt Barkley to me...very disappointing that we missed out on Eason and Morgan...at least their arm talent would give you hope that maybe, one day, they could turn into NFL QBs...

[H2o]

I think within the next couple of years Fromm will take over for Barkley. He's a smart young man and will pick up the the offense. His arm strength is on par with or better than Barkley's as well. At the same time I don't believe that Josh needs to be looking over his shoulder at all. The only way Fromm gets thrust into starting is if Allen gets injured or completely regresses to year one Josh, the former more likely than the latter. It was a good value pick for the Bills in the 5th. Fromm faced the toughest competition in the nation playing in the SEC and held his own. 

[Don Otreply]

14 hours ago, inaugural balls said:

 

You don't say? 

But, but, but, doesn’t he always say...

?

[Don Otreply]

9 hours ago, eball said:

And, you have an issue with them at WR. And, you have an issue with them at OL. And...

 

The guys got issues...

[mannc]

13 hours ago, Lurker said:

 

Arm strength doesn't mean dropping balls in a bucket.     NFL QBs have to throw the majority of their balls with less arc than college QBs due to the better recovery time of DBs, tighter coverage, etc.    All of Fromm's passes (that I've seen) have a pronounced arc, even his dump offs.    If he can't overcome that, it won't matter what kind of head he has on his shoulders... 

 

Not buying it. At UGA, he played week after week against teams like Alabama, Florida, LSU, and Auburn—all packed with NFL-caliber DBs.  He’s not playing against future insurance salesmen.

[1ManRaid]

14 hours ago, DJB said:

Again I posted this in the Fromm thread

 

 

 

 

A beautiful pass from his own 14 to the opposing 40 right in the bucket hitting the WR in stride. 

The 14?  You must be the ball setter for Patriots games.

2 hours ago, JaCrispy said:

Watching his “highlights” I can’t help but think that Fromm looks like a poor man’s Matt Barkley to me...very disappointing that we missed out on Eason and Morgan...at least their arm talent would give you hope that maybe, one day, they could turn into NFL QBs...

Dude, it's a fifth round pick.  Find me a QB, or any player really, from the late rounds that doesn't have some sort of red flag.  They're all project fliers at that point.

[BillsFanNC]

12 hours ago, Cal said:

You clowns still pushing Fromm lol. He is a bum. Was a 5th round pick for a reason. Go root for another team, this is Allen's team. Like is said before, don't understand the hate for Allen from 90% of you from the get go.

 

You dont understand the irrational hate for Allen, but its ok to have some irrational hate for Fromm?

 

The only fact here is that he was picked in the 5th round. Another fact is that the Bills had him significantly higher on their board. 4th? 3rd? Only Beane and his staff knows. 

 

He could have been a 1st rounder and still nobody would know what kind of qb he will be on the scale from bum to hof'er. Nobody. You, me, Beane or Fromm himself. Let things play out.

[GunnerBill]

11 hours ago, Doc said:

 

Settle down.  First of all, if you're thinking Fromm has a chance to unseat Allen anytime soon, you'll be sorely disappointed.

 

As for the video, I'm using it to illustrate what a 10-yard out means to me.  And whether Fromm has thrown any of those (without it getting INT'd).  And if there are none of those...it means he's smart enough to know he can't make that play.

 

Even the Fromm throw in that video from the Florida game..... I'm not sure that gets there in an NFL game. An NFL DB has the speed and recognition to break on that ball and at the very least force an incompletion IMO. He is better than Nathan Peterman, it is hard to be that bad. But he isn't close to a Josh Allen.

[Doc]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

Even the Fromm throw in that video from the Florida game..... I'm not sure that gets there in an NFL game. An NFL DB has the speed and recognition to break on that ball and at the very least force an incompletion IMO. He is better than Nathan Peterman, it is hard to be that bad. But he isn't close to a Josh Allen.

 

Like i said, it was a nice throw, but the WR was leading the CB.  I'd expect him to be able to make that throw.  Again it's those throws in the Peterman video that would tell me more.  Although, like I said, I hate those throws.

[MarlinTheMagician]

I think the Seattle scout Nagy's comparison of Fromm to Dalton is very encouraging. I saw another scout compare him to former Jet Chad Pennington, another heady quarterback with a mediocre arm.  No reason to believe any of our posters have more insight than those scouts (even if their comments are valid), so why not give the kid a chance?  His film to me shows a leader and gamer and with exceptional pocket-awareness and decision-making.  I choose to be optimistic, and if he can be the equivalent of a Dalton or Pennington (picked in the 2nd and 1st respectively), he is an absolute steal.  Welcome to Buffalo Jake, go get 'em!  

[wvbillsfan]

Every time I’ve seen this guy he looks like he’s throwing with all arm. No real torque or rotation in his lower half to generate velocity 

not a qb guru at all but something doesn’t look right when he throws. 

[Doc]

4 minutes ago, MarlinTheMagician said:

I think the Seattle scout Nagy's comparison of Fromm to Dalton is very encouraging. I saw another scout compare him to former Jet Chad Pennington, another heady quarterback with a mediocre arm.  No reason to believe any of our posters have more insight than those scouts (even if their comments are valid), so why not give the kid a chance?  His film to me shows a leader and gamer and with exceptional pocket-awareness and decision-making.  I choose to be optimistic, and if he can be the equivalent of a Dalton or Pennington (picked in the 2nd and 1st respectively), he is an absolute steal.  Welcome to Buffalo Jake, go get 'em!  

 

Yeah, not sure why people are making definitive statements before we actually see Fromm, or any player for that matter, in an actual NFL game.

[Paup 1995MVP]

16 minutes ago, 1ManRaid said:

The 14?  You must be the ball setter for Patriots games.

Dude, it's a fifth round pick.  Find me a QB, or any player really, from the late rounds that doesn't have some sort of red flag.  They're all project fliers at that point.

Even first round QB's have red flags.  There is no certainty of success from any draft pick.  These are young men that are going up to a higher level of competition.  It is certainly not easy to succeed as an NFL QB.  But agreed taking Jake Fromm in the 5th round, the downside is minimal.  The kid is a winner.  He is a gamer.  He competes hard, is smart and can make plays.  Does he have amazing physical tools?  Not to the level of some QB prospects.  But that's not a necessity to being a solid NFL QB.  Joe Montana did not have a cannon for an arm, the fastest 40, or was 6'5 250 pounds.  But he was an amazing QB in an era where the defense was allowed to beat the snot out of the QB w impunity.  (look up the hit he took from Jim Burt in the Meadowlands in the playoff game against the Giants in 86 or 87.  My goodness)   Physical tools are great but understanding the nuances of the game and using the mental side to always have the edge is what separates the champions of every sport.  A quick example:  The best starting pitcher of the modern baseball era (since 1980's) was.....Greg Maddux.  From a physical perspective he was maybe 5'11 and 180 pounds.  The most normal looking guy ever.  Guy won over 350 games!!  He barely ever threw above 88-89 mph.  But he knew how to pitch better then anyone, and his ball was always moving.  Anyone who watched him knows what I mean.  He took his physical ability and combined that with superior knowledge of how to pitch, and an amazing grit and competitiveness.  Loved watching him.   Not saying that Fromm is that.  But you all should get the point.  He will make the Bills better at the least because he will be much better then Matt Barkley.  Anything further then that remains to be seen.  But for anyone to say he is trash or a scrub (my kids included) are sorely mistaken.

[MarlinTheMagician]

I am not sure why people are making definitive statements either.  As I recall, the board exploded with outrage last year when we took Singletary in the third -- battle cries went up.  "Wasted pick, running back in the third," and "he is a gadget player at his size, a luxury pick with our roster full of holes."  And I was all like "yeah, did we really need a running back there."  Then I saw him play!

I trust Beane and the quality staff he has assembled.  If he was sticking out on the Beane's board, I am glad that we got him in the 5th. 

[BeastMaster]

15 hours ago, DJB said:

Again I posted this in the Fromm thread

 

 

 

 

A beautiful pass from his own 14 to the opposing 40 right in the bucket hitting the WR in stride. 

Wasn't that in a dome?

 

Try doing that in NewEra

[MarlinTheMagician]

But maybe he knew he was in a dome, and would have thrown it with a flatter trajectory at The Ralph.  I am all-in on give the kid a chance.  The poster with the Maddux analogy is right.  Little to lose.  Does Brady have a stronger arm?  Not sure he ever did.  Is he faster?  Taller?   

[Bockeye]

4 hours ago, Nervous Guy said:

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/patriots/tom-bradys-nfl-scouting-combine-report-highlights-are-hilarious-retrospect

Fromm has weak arm, blah, blah, blah...  Fromm was an exceptional college QB. To follow up on nervous guys post, look at this highlight reel of Brady from Michigan - all floaters, WR’s coming back to the ball.  Terrible.

 

Fromm is NOT the next Tom Brady, but to write him off before taking an NFL snap is idiocy. 
 

 

[Alphadawg7]

Anyone think they are over analyzing a 5th round pick here?  
 

I mean, if he makes the team and provides value, it’s a great pick at that spot.  If he doesn’t, nothing really lost.  
 

All reward, no risk pick essentially.  He was NOT drafted to challenge Allen.  He was drafted as the value was too good to pass on and he will be given a chance to push Barkley.  If he succeeds, he could also be flipped for a higher draft asset if he shows well in preseason or any chances he gets if he has to fill in for Allen.

 

This is Allen’s team without question. 

[BeastMaster]

7 minutes ago, MarlinTheMagician said:

But maybe he knew he was in a dome, and would have thrown it with a flatter trajectory at The Ralph.  I am all-in on give the kid a chance.  The poster with the Maddux analogy is right.  Little to lose.  Does Brady have a stronger arm?  Not sure he ever did.  Is he faster?  Taller?   

I just see him as a similar version of Barkley where his arm just won't cut it in Buffalo. You can only play the screen game/dink and dunk for so long, and this Oline doesn't get outside the hashes well enough to do it successfully even with Allen so consider me highly skeptical. 

 

Getting drafted in Buffalo hurts him if he actually ends up having to play, I think. If he played for a dome team like NO or ATL, I think he'd have a better shot.

 

[MarlinTheMagician]

1 minute ago, BeastMaster said:

just see him as a similar version of Barkley where his arm just won't cut it in Buffalo. You can only play the screen game/dink and dunk for so long, and this Oline doesn't get outside the hashes well enough to do it successfully even with Allen so consider me highly skeptical. 

 

Getting drafted in Buffalo hurts him if he actually ends up having to play, I think. If he played for a dome team like NO or ATL, I think he'd have a better shot.

 

This is not crazy at all, but give the kid a shot.  If he shows good NFL awareness they may trade him for a pick with a trade partner in a more Fromm-friendly City.  And we really don't know what he can or cannot do here.  He could be a great 10 year back-up if he would accept that (which I doubt).  Hell, he could be a starter.  We just don't know.

[C.Biscuit97]

I’m been paying attention to Fromm for his whole career because I liked him on QB1.  I like his poise but he has been very meh to me and Georgia is one of the best situations in the nfl.  That racist baseball player in Georgia making Fields transfer is a killer for them.  
 

so unless we play Georgia Tech (Fromm had 10 tds and 0 ints against them!), I think we just drafted a younger version of Matt Barkley. 

19 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Anyone think they are over analyzing a 5th round pick here?  
 

I mean, if he makes the team and provides value, it’s a great pick at that spot.  If he doesn’t, nothing really lost.  
 

All reward, no risk pick essentially.  He was NOT drafted to challenge Allen.  He was drafted as the value was too good to pass on and he will be given a chance to push Barkley.  If he succeeds, he could also be flipped for a higher draft asset if he shows well in preseason or any chances he gets if he has to fill in for Allen.

 

This is Allen’s team without question. 

Every qb pick will be over evaluate.  And I think with a guy like Fromm, he seems to have little upside.  That late, I’d rather have an Allen type prospect who is raw and has a higher ceiling.  
 

fromm isn’t who I would have picked but I always like drafting qb.  If Allen doesn’t progress or Fromm isn’t good enough, I hope they draft another guy next year.

[Lurker]

1 hour ago, Bockeye said:

Fromm has weak arm, blah, blah, blah...  Fromm was an exceptional college QB. To follow up on nervous guys post, look at this highlight reel of Brady from Michigan - all floaters, WR’s coming back to the ball.  Terrible.

 

Fromm is NOT the next Tom Brady, but to write him off before taking an NFL snap is idiocy. 
 

 

 

Brady's footwork, release and---above all, his recognition--all look the same in that video as what we've seen for the past 19 years.    And they're well ahead of Fromm's college tape, IMO.   

 

Not going to lose sleep or get overly excited by the pick.    Until he gets on the field, this is just another TSW "Tastes Great, Less Filling" multi-page extravaganza destined for the junk heap of time...  

[4BillsintheBurgh]

14 hours ago, Doc said:

 

A good throw but that's not what I think of when I think of a 10-12 yard out. I'm thinking more of what happens in the following video at 1:02 and 2:50:

 

 

I'd like to sit down with McDermott and ask him how difficult it was to send Kelvin Benjamin onto the field every week. Wow, I forgot how bad he was.

[Turbo44]

2 hours ago, BeastMaster said:

Wasn't that in a dome?

 

Try doing that in NewEra

a lot of glass half empty people here. Especially for a 5th rd pick and a late 5th in that 

[TwistofFate]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Even the Fromm throw in that video from the Florida game..... I'm not sure that gets there in an NFL game. An NFL DB has the speed and recognition to break on that ball and at the very least force an incompletion IMO. He is better than Nathan Peterman, it is hard to be that bad. But he isn't close to a Josh Allen.

You realize he's played against NFL caliber Dbs his whole career, right? 

 

Its silly to say it doesn't get there in the NFL. 

 

Qbs that throw with anticipation and have a decent arm will succeed, period. 

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

You realize he's played against NFL caliber Dbs his whole career, right? 

 

Its silly to say it doesn't get there in the NFL. 

 

Qbs that throw with anticipation and have a decent arm will succeed, period. 

 

There are some good DBs in the SEC, no doubt. I don't think that is a completion in the NFL. 

[McBean]

When Josh Allen wins MVP this year, the Fromm talk will be toast.

 

However, I do believe Fromm is a good QB.

[Doc]

If Fromm shows anything at all, he'll make the team.  The only question is whether they value Barkley as a mentor to Josh, thus keeping him as a 3rd QB.

[HomeskillitMoorman]

17 hours ago, Ralonzo said:

 

Don't rewind to :28, yeeeesh

 

 

Haha yikes, I just saw that. I don't know what that was. 

17 hours ago, Cheektowaga Chad said:

Fromm this past season and fromm 2 years ago are completely different players.

 

Not sure what exactly happened. Maybe it was surrounding talent maybe it was a scheme change. 

 

That's a concern to me as well. It didn't feel like he got better as his college career went along. Although I really only saw him in "big" games so I wouldn't know the entire scope of what his seasons looked like. 

 

I've come around more to the pick though. I did want us to draft a QB, I am not in the camp of fully trusting Matt Barkley off of one good game he had against a bad team when the rest of his career he hasn't even shown to be a reliable backup, I definitely wanted some competition for the backup role and even possibly a potential contingency plan for Allen in case he doesn't take the leap in year 3. I personally don't think Fromm is high-potential enough for the latter, but I think he could be a solid backup, which would still make that a good pick in round 5. 

Edited May 2, 2020 by HomeskillitMoorman

[JimmyNoodles]

11 minutes ago, Doc said:

If Fromm shows anything at all, he'll make the team.  The only question is whether they value Barkley as a mentor to Josh, thus keeping him as a 3rd QB.

With roster we have now, I really hope mentor days are over at all positions. They’ve instilled the “process” now we need to run with it based on ability. 

[BuffaninSarasota]

17 hours ago, Dr. Who said:

UGA fan. I think Fromm can be good. I like the pick. But as others have pointed out, arm strength is more an issue when it comes to mid-range outs and the like. Fella like Allen can zip them in and Fromm can't do that. He'll kill you with anticipation and reading the field. Personally, I think there's a fairly good chance both work out. For a fifth round pick, Fromm is a steal.

 

Watched every game Fromm played at  UGA - agree 100% with Dr. Who. Plus Fromm is super smart, humble, and will be an asset in the QB room.

[Doc]

3 minutes ago, JimmyNoodles said:

With roster we have now, I really hope mentor days are over at all positions. They’ve instilled the “process” now we need to run with it based on ability. 

 

That's what I'm thinking/hoping as well.  And with Ken Dorsey as QB coach, the mentor-playe-QB isn't necessary.

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

57 minutes ago, TwistofFate said:

You realize he's played against NFL caliber Dbs his whole career, right? 

 

Its silly to say it doesn't get there in the NFL. 

 

Qbs that throw with anticipation and have a decent arm will succeed, period. 

 

You keep saying that if you can do it against SEC DBs that it will translate to the pro game, yet the fact is most of the QBs who succeeded in college it doesn't translate. Even the ones that had the most success in the SEC all-time.

 

Here are the Top 10 all-time SEC quarterbacks ranked by career passing yards.

Player	School	Passing Yards	Years
1. Aaron Murray	Georgia	13,166	2010-13
2. David Greene	Georgia	11,528	2001-04
3. Chris Leak	Florida	11,213	2003-06
4. Peyton Manning	Tennessee	11,201	1994-97
5. Eric Zeier	Georgia	11,153	1991-94
6. Danny Wuerffel	Florida	10,875	1993-96
7. Jared Lorenzen	Kentucky	10,354	2000-03
8. Eli Manning	Ole Miss	10,119	2000-03
9. Casey Clausen	Tennessee	9,707	2000-03
10. Bo Wallace	Ole Miss	9,534	2012-14

 

And here are the Top 10 all-time SEC quarterbacks ranked by career touchdown passes.

Player	School	Passing Yards	Years
1. Aaron Murray	Georgia	121	2010-13
2. Danny Wuerffel	Florida	114	1993-96
3. Peyton Manning	Tennessee	89	1994-97
T4. Chris Leak	Florida	88	2003-06
T4. Tim Tebow	Florida	88	2006-09
6. Eli Manning	Ole Miss	81	2000-03
7. Andre Woodson	Kentucky	79	2004-07
8. Jared Lorenzen	Kentucky	78	2000-03
T9. Rex Grossman	Florida	77	2000-02
T9. AJ McCarron	Alabama	77	2010-13

 

As you can see the two lists above are riddled with QBs that did nothing or next to nothing in the pro game.

[TheBrownBear]

Fromm looks like the perfect backup to me.  Smart, take what the defense gives you, get you through 2-3 games, Frank Reich 2.0.

[ColoradoBills]

2 hours ago, Doc said:

If Fromm shows anything at all, he'll make the team.  The only question is whether they value Barkley as a mentor to Josh, thus keeping him as a 3rd QB.

 

Josh Allen is quickly outgrowing anything Barkley can teach him.  His job is about done in that sense.  I will be interested on how Fromm looks.