Late night discussion: Should Josh Allen run less in 2019?

[HOUSE]

Should the Bills try to scale back Allen's rushing attempts in 2019?

 

Louie DiBiase

Twitter- @DiBiaseLOE

In his rookie season, Bills QB Josh Allen led the entire NFL in rushing yards and touchdowns with 631 yards and 8 touchdowns on 89 attempts.

Out of Wyoming, Allen was known for his mobility, but the 2018 1st-round pick kicked it up a notch in his first season.  Individual rushing performances included games of 135, 101, 99, and 95 yards. 

Allen's legs were able to create big plays for the offense even when the passing game struggled. But do the Bills want this style of play to continue into year-two? Should Allen continue to run the football at the high volume he did in his rookie season? 

Fans took to Twitter for Wednesday's late night discussion to give their two-cents. 

To run or not to run:

Contributors to the discussion were almost evenly split on whether Buffalo should try and scale back the amount of rushing attempts their QB will have in 2019. 

51% believe Allen's rushing ability is what makes him dangerous while 49% say they would like to see the QB run less to preserve his health. 

Many fans don't believe reducing plays that fit Allen's strengths is a good idea

https://wgr550.radio.com/articles/opinion/late-night-discussion-should-josh-allen-run-less-2019

Edited August 15, 2019 by HOUSE

[Augie]

Yes. 

[aristocrat]

Not as much but not much less. As long as his passing yards go up. 

[HOUSE]

 

[Buffalo_Gal]

Run less? Yes. No one wants to see him get killed.

Stop running? No. It is a big part of his game, and keeps defenses on their toes.

[Florida Bills Fanatic]

The quantity of runs may not be the real issue.  Running as the game and the play dictates should be the determining factor.  Take what the defense is giving. Getting out of bounds or sliding to avoid contact needs to be the priority.  Hurdling linebackers is just a stupid thing for a starting QB to attempt regardless of how cool it was.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Obviously.   well at least IMO. 

 

I don't want to see him rushing for 90 + yards a game   (unless it's on 1 play) 

[oldmanfan]

Should they have less designed running plays for him?  Yes.  But I don't think much of his running last year; it was Allen taking off when he saw a gap.

 

Should he run less on scrambles?  Yes, because it will save him from unnecessary contact, and because it means he is learning to get the ball out quicker and to use his short passing game. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

He’s a big boy. Do what you gotta do to win. 

 

 

[ddaryl]

I think it will happen naturally as Allan develops the pass 1st mentality. He will still run but it will be more about what the D is giving him then him trying to make it happen because of rookie jitters a poor WR group and the worst Bills OL of all time.

[Augie]

Run a little less, and a lot smarter. Know when to slide or slip OB. Take fewer risks and hits. He did better with that as the season went on.

 

It’s encouraging that he CAN slide, as opposed to EJ who looked like a giraffe trying to play baseball for the first time. What was up with THAT? Did he not even play T-Ball? 

[K-9]

18 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

 

Love watching him abuse Kiko. Never gets old.

[BigBuff423]

I think Josh Allen WILL run less and I think he SHOULD run less. Last year's rushing attempts and yards was a direct result of two things: 1. Rookie learning new Offense and how to adjust to Defenses while standing in the pocket to pass 2. Because he HAD to run given the lack of protection in front of him.

 

I think this year Josh will start to use his running and athletic ability much more situationally - i.e. designed runs, and to scramble to find an extra second to pass - much the way Rodgers and Russ Wilson do. I am NOT comparing him, don't put words in my mouth, I'm only saying I think given his development (as it seems much discussed thus far) as well as an improved Offensive line, we'll see him use his running ability along those lines more so than last year's use of his legs. JMO

[JESSEFEFFER]

Some of my opinions:

 

1)  Josh scrambling is better than checkdowns.  It's equivalent to passing stats of 47/47 for 508 yds, 5 TD and 2 Int (I think he had two scramble fumbles.)  The passer rating for that is 129.  I don't think any QB does that on checkdowns.

 

2)  His running is a function of poor protection, poor WR separation, Josh being predisposed to holding the ball as a rookie and his being very talented at running. 

 

3)  A collapsing pocket is way more dangerous than running through the defense.  He can out run, stiff arm, slide, run out-of-bounds or dive.  At least he can see the hazards coming and has options.  He is somewhat unaware and unprotected against many hazards in the pocket much like the injury that cost him 4 starts.

 

4)  I want him to run less because the team around him is better and he is noticeably improved as a passer.  Be a good and getting better passer and pick your spots to sustain critical drives or put points on the board.   I'd like his mindset to be to play like Bruce Wayne but when the Bat Signal goes up, head for the Bat Cave.

 

 

[Kirby Jackson]

This one is tricky to me. I think that the obvious answer would be “yes.” I’m not so sure though. If that is what the defense is “giving him” than he should take it. Josh is an ELITE runner, not a good one. If he has a lane and can get to the markers (especially on 3rd down) I’d rather he run than try to squeeze one in. He’s more likely to move the chains that way. 

 

This may sound like a BS answer but I want Josh to make the right decision. In theory, that could result in running more (I doubt that it will but it could). My guess is that he runs less because he sees the field faster and that’s fine too. Just make good decisions

[HOUSE]

 

[Original Byrd Man]

I worry about injury, but on the other hand he is quite fast for someone his size and has a definite ability to make people miss in the open field so I'm not sure what I think they should do.

[BruceVilanch]

as long as he doesn't go airborne and if he learns how to slide I think it's a great weapon for him while he's still developing.

46 minutes ago, JESSEFEFFER said:

Some of my opinions:

 

1)  Josh scrambling is better than checkdowns.  It's equivalent to passing stats of 47/47 for 508 yds, 5 TD and 2 Int (I think he had two scramble fumbles.)  The passer rating for that is 129.  I don't think any QB does that on checkdowns.

 

2)  His running is a function of poor protection, poor WR separation, Josh being predisposed to holding the ball as a rookie and his being very talented at running. 

 

3)  A collapsing pocket is way more dangerous than running through the defense.  He can out run, stiff arm, slide, run out-of-bounds or dive.  At least he can see the hazards coming and has options.  He is somewhat unaware and unprotected against many hazards in the pocket much like the injury that cost him 4 starts.

 

4)  I want him to run less because the team around him is better and he is noticeably improved as a passer.  Be a good and getting better passer and pick your spots to sustain critical drives or put points on the board.   I'd like his mindset to be to play like Bruce Wayne but when the Bat Signal goes up, head for the Bat Cave.

 

 

100% correct, I always get terrified when I see the line collapsing and I am just waiting for a knee to get rolled up on.

[Bills4Ever4Life]

51 minutes ago, JESSEFEFFER said:

Some of my opinions:

 

1)  Josh scrambling is better than checkdowns.  It's equivalent to passing stats of 47/47 for 508 yds, 5 TD and 2 Int (I think he had two scramble fumbles.)  The passer rating for that is 129.  I don't think any QB does that on checkdowns.

 

2)  His running is a function of poor protection, poor WR separation, Josh being predisposed to holding the ball as a rookie and his being very talented at running. 

 

3)  A collapsing pocket is way more dangerous than running through the defense.  He can out run, stiff arm, slide, run out-of-bounds or dive.  At least he can see the hazards coming and has options.  He is somewhat unaware and unprotected against many hazards in the pocket much like the injury that cost him 4 starts.

 

4)  I want him to run less because the team around him is better and he is noticeably improved as a passer.  Be a good and getting better passer and pick your spots to sustain critical drives or put points on the board.   I'd like his mindset to be to play like Bruce Wayne but when the Bat Signal goes up, head for the Bat Cave.

 

 

This is my sentiment for the most part. I want Josh Allen to be Josh Allen. I want to see him run less because he doesn't HAVE to run as much. I want him to run less because his O-line is giving him better protection and his play makers are getting open. In other words, I want him to run when he has to and I hope that will be less often.

As for designed plays. I don't want them to go Cam Newton / Russell Wilson but I am a fan of the Run Pass Option and I think it keeps the defense on their toes. Forces them to keep a spy on the QB. 

 

Overall I think that Josh's scramble ability raises the level of the team. This first pre-season game I could see him holding on to the ball and throwing it away where last year he would have taken off with it. I am hoping this was just a pre-season thing and he will be back to scrambling when the play just isn't there. 

[Flip Johnson]

52 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

This one is tricky to me. I think that the obvious answer would be “yes.” I’m not so sure though. If that is what the defense is “giving him” than he should take it. Josh is an ELITE runner, not a good one. If he has a lane and can get to the markers (especially on 3rd down) I’d rather he run than try to squeeze one in. He’s more likely to move the chains that way. 

 

This may sound like a BS answer but I want Josh to make the right decision. In theory, that could result in running more (I doubt that it will but it could). My guess is that he runs less because he sees the field faster and that’s fine too. Just make good decisions

 

The decision making is key - I don't necessarily want to see fewer carries - I want to see fewer plays where JA sees one guy covered, feels pressure and takes off helter-skelter.

 

He is a historically good runner and could keep running 6-10 times per game even as he develops as a passer.

 

Josh ran 7.4 times per game last year.

Cam Newton was running 7.8 times per game his first two seasons in the league and averaging 1.5 yards less per carry.

Russell Wilson was running 6-7 times per game in his early years and it was a huge part of his effectiveness.

 

Wilson and Newton have gotten more banged up in the pocket than they have on the move. Allen's injury last year was in the pocket.

 

There is a difference between being a "running QB" a la RG3 or Lamar Jackson or Michael Vick. That's nearly impossible to sustain. What we want Allen to become is a good pocket passer who maintains a dynamic running ability.

[Victory Formation]

He’s only a 2nd year player, if he wants to run, yes, let him run. He could possibly get hurt, but that’s when your coach steps in and teaches him to slide, run out of bounds and not take the big hit. Nobody told Michael Vick not to run, they’re similar players in many respects. Think Lamar Jackson won’t run this year? Of course he will. We could be looking at the #1 rushing offense when you factor in Allen, our line and our hefty backfield. That’s a pretty attractive reality and Allen is a big part in that. If Allen puts up 600yds rushing again, I think the Bills will lead the league in overall rushing yards.

[hondo in seattle]

I don't think he should be asked to run less.  Running is a huge part of his game and a real threat to opposing defenses.

I do think he should be trained to read defenses and run through his progressions better.  Finding the most open guy quickly will  result in a more potent passing attack and - at the same time - have him running and  risking injury less.  

 

But if taking off on his own is the best option on a particular play, I want him to run.

[SCBills]

Not necessarily less, but smarter.  This team should be good enough that he doesn't need to take on defenders for an extra 4-5 years, unless it's an absolutely crucial play.  Just pick up what you can and slide down or run out of bounds.

[Teddy KGB]

Hell no.    Let that boy run 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

9 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

I don't think he should be asked to run less.  Running is a huge part of his game and a real threat to opposing defenses.

I do think he should be trained to read defenses and run through his progressions better.  Finding the most open guy quickly will  result in a more potent passing attack and - at the same time - have him running and  risking injury less.  

 

But if taking off on his own is the best option on a particular play, I want him to run.

you hit the points square on the head. 

 

It comes down to designed run plays or RPO's 

He should not be asked to run less, he just needs to run through his progressions and throw the ball away 

 

and for heavens sake LOSE the huge scrambles backwards for a sack 

Edited August 15, 2019 by ShadyBillsFan

[JESSEFEFFER]

21 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

you hit the points square on the head. 

 

It comes down to designed run plays or RPO's 

He should not be asked to run less, he just needs to run through his progressions and throw the ball away 

 

and for heavens sake LOSE the huge scrambles backwards for a sack 

 

I remember the JP Pirouettes and Rob Johnson pulling this quite a bit.  I do not think of this as a JA problem, especially later in the second half of his 1st season.  Do you have any specifically in mind?  None come to me.

[Figster]

I don't think Allen should be asked to run less. Although I do think Josh Allen should use his relief valves more in the short passing game because Buffalo is well equipped to move the football on the ground via RB IMO.

[Sherlock Holmes]

Run Joshy Run!!! Run more if he can not get injured, he makes huge plays on his feet, his running is ridicuously underrated. He has the chance to be the best rushing QB of all time real quick. Hopefully he can balance it out with best passing QB of all time as well!

[Seasons1992]

Whatever wins us games. If he's our leading rusher, fine. Just win games. He didn't get hurt running (praise almighty) and he's a big strong guy.

[whatdrought]

I think you have to ask first, why did he run as much as he did? 

 

He had three kinds of runs last year. 

 

1- Designed runs (I do not remember many of these at all) 

 

2- Broken plays where he escaped pressure, or saw that there was nothing happening, and bailed out. 

 

3- Runs where he got antsy and did not settle into the pocket, maybe even missed seeing an open receiver, and took off. 

 

Run types 2 and 3 were most prevalent, and were most successful. That being said, I am fine with type #2, as it's an important part of his game. Type #3, I believe, is something we need to see less of. He needs to get better at seeing the whole field, going through all of his reads, and taking an easy out instead of running. I think this will be helped by better line play, and receivers that get better separation.

 

Two things that are encouraging about his running style is that, for the most part (and definitely down the stretch) he seemed more willing to avoid hits- this is huge. And secondly, until he commits to running and crossing the LOS, he keeps his eyes downfield looking for a throw. This will turn into big plays when receivers work back and defenses are keyed to stop him from running, especially given his arm talent and that he can literally deliver the ball anywhere on the field at a moments notice.  

[JESSEFEFFER]

2 hours ago, HOUSE said:

 

 

Thanks for posting this.  It's been awhile since I had watched it.  The whole running = risking injury narative is not valid, imo.  If you watch it, point out a hit that gives you pause and makes you think that he took a bad, potentially injury causing shot.  Kiko's cheap shot attempt that turned into a leg whip maybe.  Defenders can cheap shot the QB anywhere if they don't mind getting the flag or risking ejection.  The pocket hits are much more dangerous, imo.  Often unexpected and with the QB in vulnerable positions and with potential harm from head to toe. 

 

I see alot of gassed defenders taking bad angles, slides, stepping out-of-bounds.  Josh does it pretty smartly, I think.

[Freddie's Dead]

No.  Play your game.  Slide and get down, don't take the big hits.  Lead this team.

[LABILLBACKER]

Yes he should run less for the sake of health & longevity. But he still should take a scramble or 2 considering his athleticism.  If Peterman can go 50, so can Josh. Stress to him to channel his inner Russell Wilson and know when to slide. That way we get the best of both worlds with our upgraded OL. You don't want JA to become RG3.......

[The Plastic Cup]

He needs to run smarter.  He’s not a twig like many mobile QBs so yes he can take, and deliver, some punishment, but hurdling LBs and similar is not a good idea.

 

If he runs, get the first down and get down.

 

[TigerJ]

Sleep is generally more productive than late night discussions.

[elroy16]

Assuming he has better blocking in front of him, I imagine we'll see quite a bit less running. There will probably be games where teams load up on coverage and he runs a bit more and then there will be games like against the Lions where they focus on the running and he doesn't run at all. Like last year, I don't expect a lot of designed runs and that's how I prefer it. 

 

 

I was watching an old Cover 1 video and grabbed the screenshot below. Not a single lineman was blocking someone when he was about to pass the ball. Just downright, utterly terrible. 

 

The only person between a defender and Allen is Zay Jones of all people. 

 

 

 

Edited August 15, 2019 by elroy16

[BobChalmers]

The vast majority of his 2018 "runs" were scrambles, forced on him by our woeful combo of OL that couldn't block and receivers that couldn't get open.

 

As long as that's the case, there is nothing wrong with him running.  There were VERY few instances of him scrambling when he shouldn't have.

 

The hope this year is that with better OL and WR play he won't need to scramble as much, but the way this question is often (and here) worded makes it sound like it's on Allen or the coaches to change something - misses the mark badly.

[ProcessAccepted]

It should naturally decline from last year. Most of Allen's runs were not designed runs, he ran because he had to. I think they may have more designed runs for him this year in the playbook (last year they didn't know that he was so athletic when they drafted him). The threat of the run will be to keep the defense honest and have to keep a spy. With the WRs we have this year and the improved OL Allen wont have to run because he's forced to. He'll run if it's available.

[Buffalo Boy]

Less!!!!

   As I stated in the Training camp thread , they had him run an option play against the Panther’s D. He kept it and ran just off LT into LBs. 

   I also noticed that the pocket they are forming really pushes the DEs up field forcing him to step up into the pocket. At the same time it is leaving him and out on either side. 

   I think it will be a struggle for him not to take advantage of those openings. When the bleep is hitting the fan it seems to be a natural instinct for him to bail out. One good hit is all it’s going to take to end a season for him. 

    I want to see him, with time behind a good line, figure out the passing game. It means a fewer wins in the short term but could really pay dividends in the future, both health wise and passing production wise

[Bangarang]

He needs to do whatever it takes to put up points and win lots of games.