What is your level of patience on not advancing to the Super Bowl?

[Chaos]

Patience is a virtue.  That is not in dispute. 
So it is arguable that the more patience one has the more virtuous one is being. 
This poll is a test of your virtue. 

More undisputed facts:

• Sean McDermott Bills head coach since 2017
• The Bills have made the playoffs 6 of those 7 years
• The Bill have not made it to the super bowl in any of those 7 years. 
• Only three NFL head coaches (Reid, Tomlin, Harbaugh) have been with their teams longer (all have coached Super Bowl champions in their career)
• Two other coaches have the same number of years (McVay, Shanahan) Both have been to the Super Bowl twice. One has won a Super Bowl (weaker NFC)

 

Generally speaking teams in the NFL do not seem to be patient with coaches.  Teams have fired relatively recent super bowl winners (Pederson, Bellichek, Riveria for example). Teams have fired other coaches that made the playoffs numerous times.  Some teams have been more patient (Shottenheimer, Marvin Lewis, Dan Reeves spring to mind) 

This poll is intended to record your level of virtue.  The bigger the number you pick, the more virtuous you are. 

Edited February 16 by Chaos

[BarleyNY]

2 hours ago, Chaos said:

Patience is a virtue.  That is not in dispute. 
So it is arguable that the more patience one has the more virtuous one is being. 
This poll is a test of your virtue. 

More undisputed facts:

• Sean McDermott Bills head coach since 2017
• The Bills have made the playoffs 6 of those 7 years
• The Bill have not made it to the super bowl in any of those 7 years. 
• Only three NFL head coaches (Reid, Tomlin, Harbaugh) have been with their teams longer (all have coached Super Bowl champions in their career)
• Two other coaches have the same number of years (McVay, Shanahan) Both have been to the Super Bowl twice. One has won a Super Bowl (weaker NFC)

 

Generally speaking teams in the NFL do not seem to be patient with coaches.  Teams have fired relatively recent super bowl winners (Pederson, Bellichek, Riveria for example). Teams have fired other coaches that made the playoffs numerous times.  Some teams have been more patient (Shottenheimer, Marvin Lewis, Dan Reeves spring to mind) 

This poll is intended to record your level of virtue.  The bigger the number you pick, the more virtuous you are. 

 

Most highly successful, self-made people give up most of their endeavors quickly. Their common gift is quickly determining which endeavors will be fruitful and which will be a waste of their energy, time, money and other resources. 

Edited February 16 by BarleyNY

[Westside]

I don’t personally care for answering questions with a limited amount of answers to choose from. 
If not winning championships all the time  ruins your ability to enjoy the game, maybe, just maybe you shouldn’t watch anymore?

[Not Applicable]

13 Seconds was such an unforgivable loss that McDermott can't redeem himself in any way other than winning a Super Bowl. 

 

Last year, the team was decimated with injuries, this year they'll probably be worse due to cap casualties. My gut tells me that 2025 will be the "all-in" year and also his last chance. Allen turns 30 that offseason, so a change is absolutely necessary if he hasn't gotten over the hump by then.

[SoMAn]

this makes no sense.

 

No, patience I would already have made a change    What does that even mean?

 

1, 2, or 3 more seasons.....

or what? Take up Pickleball on Sunday afternoons?

 

 

 

 

[BuffaloBillyG]

2 minutes ago, Westside said:

I don’t personally care for answering questions with a limited amount of answers to choose from. 
If not winning championships all the time  ruins your ability to enjoy the game, maybe, just maybe you shouldn’t watch anymore?

Agree. The answers also don't really allow for many details other than a timeline.

 

For instance, this season I really can't be too disappointed with how it ended up considering the injuries to key players. Match that up with KC coming in pretty healthy and it tips the scale a bit in their favor. It sucks to end the season at home and to that team...but at least there is logical reasoning.

 

My answer to the question is simply, you keep the coach in place until a change is needed. Currently, there is one team in the NFL that has made the playoffs in more consecutive season than the Bills. That team is Kansas City. After nearing 2 decades of missing the playoffs, this is an extremely outstanding accomplishment. 

 

Also, judging by the reaction of the players that are in the locker room after the Dunne hit piece...his players still believe in him and he has not lost the locker room. That is the ONE thing that could make a move necessary while still making the playoffs. 

[Virgil]

This is tough for me.  Normally, I would say they should make the change this offseason.  But then again, what are we really asking for here?  We are looking for someone to do what no one else can.  I'd argue that McD plays Reid better than any other coach.  We scored more points against the Chiefs than anyone else did in the playoffs, same in prior years.  

 

With that being said, you're asking do we drop the #2 coach for a hopeful coach that can do what no one else has.  

 

I'm not sure how to answer that honestly.  

[GunnerBill]

Yea my level of patience isn't endless but the how is as important as the what. If they lose to Tua and the Dolphins in the playoffs for example I am much more likely to say "okay you have to make a change" than if they lose by a field goal to Mahomes and Reid. 

 

I think there does come a point when even if you don't think Sean McDermott is problem (and I don't with the exception of 13 seconds) you have to try something different just for the sake of a new voice. I'm probably two seasons away from that to be honest, and that just so happens to line up with the point where you kind of have to re-do Josh's deal ahead of his age 30 season. That is the point where even if I don't think this regime has done enough to justify a change I might want to make one. That isn't to say there are no circumstances where I'd move on after this year. There are. Missing the playoffs is a fireable offense (unless Josh gets hurt) and I said that when we were 6-6 too. 

[BuffaloBillyG]

10 minutes ago, Virgil said:

This is tough for me.  Normally, I would say they should make the change this offseason.  But then again, what are we really asking for here?  We are looking for someone to do what no one else can.  I'd argue that McD plays Reid better than any other coach.  We scored more points against the Chiefs than anyone else did in the playoffs, same in prior years.  

 

With that being said, you're asking do we drop the #2 coach for a hopeful coach that can do what no one else has.  

 

I'm not sure how to answer that honestly.  

And that's a great point.

 

Look at it another way. Shannahan has been denied a Super Bowl now twice by Andy and Mahomes. Both times the 49ers had double digit leads in the game. So, should he be fired? 

 

I get it, it's frustrating to lose to the same team year after year in the playoffs. Right now we have the unfortunate luck of being in the same conference as the NFL's best HC/QB duo. Put the Bills in the NFC and I could see them having 2 or 3 SB appearances over the same timeframe.

[MJS]

I guess I have infinite patience, because I'm going to watch the team each year regardless.

 

What are you going to do, stop supporting the team? Put up a billboard? I don't really get it.

[GoBills808]

7 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

And that's a great point.

 

Look at it another way. Shannahan has been denied a Super Bowl now twice by Andy and Mahomes. Both times the 49ers had double digit leads in the game. So, should he be fired? 

 

I get it, it's frustrating to lose to the same team year after year in the playoffs. Right now we have the unfortunate luck of being in the same conference as the NFL's best HC/QB duo. Put the Bills in the NFC and I could see them having 2 or 3 SB appearances over the same timeframe.

Shanahan is doing it w out a QB is the very obvious difference

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Very patient with how things are going. 

[FireChans]

5 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Shanahan is doing it w out a QB is the very obvious difference

Doing what? Losing?

[LABILLBACKER]

34 minutes ago, Westside said:

I don’t personally care for answering questions with a limited amount of answers to choose from. 
If not winning championships all the time  ruins your ability to enjoy the game, maybe, just maybe you shouldn’t watch anymore?

All the time? We haven't even had 1 in 60 years. If we're setting the bar low to lessen our pain that's one argument. I see so many recent fans drifting toward "let's just enjoy our regular season success". And there's nothing wrong with that. But not everyone is wired the same. The goal in any sport is a championship,  not just it's participation.

 

I voted 1 more year even though I wanted a change after 13 sec.  I know McDermott has his diehard fans who are hanging on in the hope that he breaks through like Reid finally did 20 years later.  I just can't wait anymore.  I see more Schottenheimer or Lewis in Sean than I do the others that at least got to a SB.  But the greater problem with this team is the lack of playoff energy, focus and motivation around Josh. When will his players step up and execute like he does?

[Gregg]

In my meaningless opinion I would have made the change after 13 seconds. That was a fire able offense IMHO. The only thing that matters is Terry's patience. If I had to guess I would say McDermott gets 2024 and 2025. But Terry is going to want a good team going into the new stadium in 2026 so if 2025 is another disappointment then that is my guess for a coaching change going into the new stadium.

[BuffaloBillyG]

4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Shanahan is doing it w out a QB is the very obvious difference

Here's the thing about that narrative. It's a crap reason.

 

By every metric Brock Purdy was a top 8 last year. I don't care where he was picked. He's a perfect fit for what they do there. Shannahan also has a much better set of weapons on offense to surround Purdy with to make plays. And if you've watched the 49ers Purdy has made plays. It's almost comical to watch people jump through hoops to explain why Purdy is a nothing at QB. 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Doing what? Losing?

'divisional losses w Josh Allen>Super Bowl losses w Purdy/JimmyG'

 

McDermott Beane 2024

Just now, BuffaloBillyG said:

Here's the thing about that narrative. It's a crap reason.

 

By every metric Brock Purdy was a top 8 last year. I don't care where he was picked. He's a perfect fit for what they do there. Shannahan also has a much better set of weapons on offense to surround Purdy with to make plays. And if you've watched the 49ers Purdy has made plays. It's almost comical to watch people jump through hoops to explain why Purdy is a nothing at QB. 

lol

 

i certainly never said he was a 'nothing', he's just not very good.

[strive_for_five_guy]

46 minutes ago, SoMAn said:

this makes no sense.

 

No, patience I would already have made a change    What does that even mean?

 

1, 2, or 3 more seasons.....

or what? Take up Pickleball on Sunday afternoons?

 

 

 

 

The, importance of placing commas in the correct spot.

[Virgil]

19 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Shanahan is doing it w out a QB is the very obvious difference

 

I'd argue they wouldn't have made it to the SB if Lance was their QB.  They got lucky with Purdy, both with his abilities and salary.  Once they have to pay him, or anyone at the position, other positions will suffer.  

[GoBills808]

Just now, Virgil said:

 

I'd argue they wouldn't have made it to the SB if Lance was their QB.  They got lucky with Purdy, both with his abilities and salary.  Once they have to pay him, or anyone at the position, other positions will suffer.  

they got to a Super Bowl with Garoppolo

 

i think they would have been ok

[HOUSE]

I lost my patience in 1968

[PBF81]

The whole thing is just disappointing.  We had it in '21 before Allen & Davis' historic effort was undermined and with Allen outplaying Mahomes in regulation.  Then this season's disappointment.  

 

Disappointing is the word I'd use.  We can't do anything as fans, but it definitely dampens the outlook on our prospects going into each season.  Everyone's different, but speaking for myself, it's a little difficult going into the season realizing that we may win the regular season but then choke in the playoffs as has been the trend.  Regular season wins & record are nice, as are divisional titles, but much as in the early '90s, simply winning divisional round playoff games wasn't enough.  I'd rather miss the playoffs once or twice then win it all than do what we've done.  This team, with any coach, would be underachieving if we did not even make the playoffs, particularly in our division, with Allen as our QB.  

 

Pegula makes about the same amount of money either way, so there's little reason for him to care.  

 

We're left to bicker about it.  LOL  

 

 

Edited February 16 by PBF81

[BuffaloBillyG]

17 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

'divisional losses w Josh Allen>Super Bowl losses w Purdy/JimmyG'

 

McDermott Beane 2024

lol

 

i certainly never said he was a 'nothing', he's just not very good.

Completed 69% of his passes. Over 4200 yards. 31TDs to 11INTs.

 

Yeah...that's "not very good"🙄

[Fleezoid]

I never knew I have no virtue. Bummer. 

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Westside said:

I don’t personally care for answering questions with a limited amount of answers to choose from. 
If not winning championships all the time  ruins your ability to enjoy the game, maybe, just maybe you shouldn’t watch anymore?

 

It’s impossible to answer without context. Are we losing in OT in the Championship game every year? Or are we going winless? As long as I continue to be entertained, I’ll be focused on the Bills. If they revert back to a garbage team, I’ll still watch (I always have) but they will have less of my attention. 

 

I don’t need a Super Bowl trophy to make my life complete. 

[Virgil]

14 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

they got to a Super Bowl with Garoppolo

 

i think they would have been ok

 

Another game manager who wasn't really getting paid.  I'm not saying it's not impressive and he doesn't deserve credit for making it to the SB, I'm just saying they allocate their resources very differently

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Virgil said:

 

Another game manager who wasn't really getting paid.  I'm not saying it's not impressive and he doesn't deserve credit for making it to the SB, I'm just saying they allocate their resources very differently

I think it's more out of necessity than by design tbh

 

like all things being equal I'm sure the Niners would like to have a great QB, they've just been making do w out like 90% of the rest of the league...the difference is they're still contending for championships. That's why I give them so much credit

[SoTier]

24 minutes ago, Westside said:

I don’t personally care for answering questions with a limited amount of answers to choose from. 
If not winning championships all the time  ruins your ability to enjoy the game, maybe, just maybe you shouldn’t watch anymore?

 

I totally agree, which is why I didn't participate in the poll.

 

Having the Bills always being a serious contender for the Super Bowl is infinitely preferable to having them struggling to win even half their games.  Losing in the playoffs hurts terribly for a little while, but it's not the soul-crushing misery that came from watching the Bills regularly miss the playoffs season after season because the ownership and front office didn't make winning football games their highest priority.  Been there, done that too much in my 60+ years as a Bills fan, so I will continue to enjoy the ride for as long as it lasts, even if it each season eventually ends in disappointment.

[Jauronimo]

If we aren't playing in the super bowl by March then I'm so F@#$ing done with this team.

[BillMafia716ix]

This isn’t high school or college. Getting to the SB is hard. Winning it even harder.  Being in contention for the SB every year is a position a lot of team would love to be in. Shoot we went 17 straight seasons not even making the playoffs. I never want to be in that position again. 

[SoMAn]

35 minutes ago, strive_for_five_guy said:

The, importance of placing commas in the correct spot.

 

Q: What is your level of patience on not advancing to the Super Bowl?  

A: No patience, I would already have made a change.

And yet, even moving the comma, (it should actually be a period) it still doesn't make sense in the context of the question. The first part and second part seem to contradict each other. 

Excuse me while I go bang my head against the wall.

Edited February 16 by SoMAn

[Eastport bills]

Level of patience? Either you’re a fan or you’re looking for an excuse to bounce. The team is right there every year and they give fans a fun, exciting ride. It’s entertainment with the chance of having a feeling of incredible joy and fulfillment. If the frustration is too much not getting there, perhaps you might consider an antidepressant.

[Yobogoya!]

22 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I think it's more out of necessity than by design tbh

 

like all things being equal I'm sure the Niners would like to have a great QB, they've just been making do w out like 90% of the rest of the league...the difference is they're still contending for championships. That's why I give them so much credit

 

It's true that Shanahan deserves a lot of credit for that, I certainly can't imagine many coaches (ours included) taking Brock Purdy or Jimmy G anywhere near a super bowl. Of course when it came down to it, he seemed to put a bit too much confidence in those QB's, so you probably have to deduct a few points for that.

 

But I also think it should go without saying the 9'ers are benefiting from not having a truly elite QB in the NFC right now.

[GoBills808]

I would have made a change already

 

McDermott is already the 4th longest tenured HC in the league and out of the top 10 (certainly the top5) has the least to show for it

[Gugny]

4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I would have made a change already

 

McDermott is already the 4th longest tenured HC in the league and out of the top 10 (certainly the top5) has the least to show for it

Continuity is great. But there comes a time when it’s not enough. 
 

I chose “one more season” but I would not have been heartbroken if a move was made after this past season. 

[PBF81]

12 minutes ago, Gugny said:

Continuity is great. But there comes a time when it’s not enough. 
 

I chose “one more season” but I would not have been heartbroken if a move was made after this past season. 

 

Also, isn't it a bit of a reach that this team wouldn't make the playoffs with Allen at QB, in the division that we're in.  The Pats and Jets suck for the foreseeable future and have been mediocre at best otherwise after Brady left the division four seasons ago.  Miami has no D and chokes in the playoffs.  

 

This isn't a difficult division, 5-1 should be the standard every season, not 4-2 each of the past two seasons with 3 losses to teams led by Zach Wilson and Mac Jones.  

 

 

[PBF81]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I think there does come a point when even if you don't think Sean McDermott is problem (and I don't with the exception of 13 seconds) you have to try something different just for the sake of a new voice. 

 

That's kind of like saying he only made one mistake, unfortunately it was driving head long into a brick wall as if not using cruise-control or turn-signals was a problem.  

 

"13 Seconds" isn't simply a "wide right" thing.  It was a fundamental systemic failure.  

 

Just sayin'.  

 

 

2 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

All the time? We haven't even had 1 in 60 years. If we're setting the bar low to lessen our pain that's one argument. I see so many recent fans drifting toward "let's just enjoy our regular season success". And there's nothing wrong with that. But not everyone is wired the same. The goal in any sport is a championship,  not just it's participation.

 

I voted 1 more year even though I wanted a change after 13 sec.  I know McDermott has his diehard fans who are hanging on in the hope that he breaks through like Reid finally did 20 years later.  I just can't wait anymore.  I see more Schottenheimer or Lewis in Sean than I do the others that at least got to a SB.  But the greater problem with this team is the lack of playoff energy, focus and motivation around Josh. When will his players step up and execute like he does?

 

Agree, and it's not as if it's cheap tickets and free beer at games.  

 

It's a business.  The only time that it isn't is when fans tell other fans to simply enjoy the season.  

 

 

Edited February 16 by PBF81

[Ethan in Cleveland]

2 hours ago, SoMAn said:

this makes no sense.

 

No, patience I would already have made a change    What does that even mean?

 

1, 2, or 3 more seasons.....

or what? Take up Pickleball on Sunday afternoons?

 

 

 

 

It means that more than 50% of this board would have gotten rid of McDermott and gone with the new coach for 2024.

[Gregg]

27 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

Also, isn't it a bit of a reach that this team wouldn't make the playoffs with Allen at QB, in the division that we're in.  The Pats and Jets suck for the foreseeable future and have been mediocre at best otherwise after Brady left the division four seasons ago.  Miami has no D and chokes in the playoffs.  

 

This isn't a difficult division, 5-1 should be the standard every season, not 4-2 each of the past two seasons with 3 losses to teams led by Zach Wilson and Mac Jones.  

 

 

 

Jets are a bit of a wild card here. We have to see how the off-season plays out but if they can improve their OL then they could be tough if they keep Rodgers healthy. Their D is pretty good. They just got worn out at the end of the year being on the field too much and getting no help from the offense. Rodgers would change that.

[34-78-83]

The results will not reflect the reality of Bills fans, just the reality of TBD.

 

The "fire everyone" or "everyone either sucks or is great" crowd is far and away most vocal and present on message boards, twitter and other social media venues.

 

I know probably 50 Bills fans outside of TBD, and who don't bother to post about football on social media platforms, and I'd say about 5 of them think the coach should be fired.