What's Wrong With The Passing O?

[Nuncha]

Diggs is toast.

[NickelCity]

As others have noted, it's a lack of separation across the board and an inability when necessary to "scheme someone open" on specific play designs.

 

It's hard to imagine us going the distance with these pass catchers but I'll bellieve nonetheless.

[thenorthremembers]

32 minutes ago, RunTheBall said:

Josh’s mechanics have regressed this year. His footwork sucks, he throws off his back foot all the time, he’s not seeing the field and his accuracy blows.

 

I love him. Ride or die. He’s also the reason we’ve won 10 games.

 

It doesn’t help that his o-line is letting free rushers regularly, his receivers don’t separate, when they do they drop the ball,  his #1 has been MIA for 5 weeks, and most importantly his OC had 2 good games and now can’t pull a game plan out of his ass.

 

I have no idea what the plan is going forward. Become a run first team with Cook/Josh and play the short game? Go 5 wide and let Josh loose and start chucking it all over? 

 

Still think we crush Miami

 

 

 

 

Couldnt have said it better.   Throws off back foot.   Uses all arm to throw the ball instead of letting his hips help.  Doesnt reset outside the pocket.   He is all over the place.    He has also been incredibly indecisive.   Really need him to get it together next week.      

Edited January 1 by thenorthremembers

[Ralonzo]

1 hour ago, Aimee75 said:

Yeah, I get that Diggs is double covered, but he has been shockingly dropping some catches or not coming up with the ones in years past that he was always good for. It has been tossed around that he might be hurt? I don't think NOW is the right time for him to start the cryptic stuff that he is doing right now on SM. He also needs to take some accountability. Really don't want to roll into Miami with him pouting.

 

I blame Harty for bringing Dance Dance Revolution into the locker room. Here's an approximation of a Diggs Run-After-Catch, performed by a cat:

 

[The 9 Isles]

I think the YAC issue is mainly to do with Allen’s ball placement. He rarely hits a receiver in stride and leads a lot of throws out of bounds. I understand that some of that is designed to prevent turnovers but at the same time there are receivers on occasion open and either have to slow down or adjust or get over thrown. 

[BADOLBILZ]

17 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Remember Woods playing with a torn groin and Hogan playing with torn ligaments in his wrist in their contract years, and both injuries clearly affected their play in retrospect (ie, the one year in his entire career that Hogan had the drops). Yet the injuries were never reported, and both had surgery immediately after the season.

 

Also, Diggs is pulling himself out constantly, which is so against type that I believe it HAS to be an injury.

 

 

I believe it's a back injury for Diggs.   I think it was reported that he had  a back injury earlier in the season.   But also,  Brady has killed the pass game in general.    Everybody but Cook looks worse in the pass game with Brady than they had with Dorsey.   The sample size is just small enough and people are still feeling sated about the Dorsey firing that they haven't gotten around to their pitchforks just yet.     

[balln]

47 minutes ago, DapperCam said:

I think this is the biggest difference between this year and last year. Last year Diggs was playing at an all-pro type level. This year on the whole he’s playing as a middle of the pack #1 WR. Recently he has not even been that. Drops, not getting separation, not fighting for contested balls. Wouldn’t surprise me at all if we find out he’s injured and playing through it.

 

Gabe Davis is also somehow worse. I think Allen has stopped throwing it his way because bad things happen.

30 year old wall. Was bound to happen

[dollars 2 donuts]

1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

We came into the season knowing that we didn't have a #2 WR on the roster. Now it turns out we don't have a true #1 either. We have no speed, no YAC ability, below average separation and catch ability from our WR corps. That's why our passing offense has looked so inconsistent, there is zero margin for error.

 

And all of the above, Hap, is going on in real time and is happening in their heads.

 

Just thinking about the passing game has the whole offense in fetal positions on the floor in their minds with their fingers in the ears going “na-na-na-na-na-na-na.”
 

They need to shake it the hell off, do something different through the air or go slump busting.

 

and soon.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 1 by dollars 2 donuts

[BADOLBILZ]

Just now, The 9 Isles said:

I think the YAC issue is mainly to do with Allen’s ball placement. He rarely hits a receiver in stride and leads a lot of throws out of bounds. I understand that some of that is designed to prevent turnovers but at the same time there are receivers on occasion open and either have to slow down or adjust or get over thrown. 

 

 

Josh needs a lot less golf and a lot more work on his mechanics and chemistry with his receivers this coming offseason.   He talked about getting back to his offseason mechanics training in the postgame today........but he's clearly not putting in the work he was prior to the 2021 season.    After 13 seconds I think he thought he had neared the pinnacle of his profession but he's regressed back closer to Cam Newton 2.0 than the passer he was then.   Time for him to get serious about winning before his own talent regresses back to the pack.

[BRH]

1 hour ago, Aimee75 said:

Cryptic IG story. I might not have thought too much about it if he didn't look so pissed in the Bills "big dubs" post. I do like that he doesn't tolerate losing or even playing bad, but if you get the win, it helps, and going into a massive game next week, we don't need drama. I just feel like this season he has been teetering on boiling over.

 

What cryptic IG story?

 

I just looked at his account and his last post was on the 18th and his story, which didn't seem cryptic at all, was posted this morning.

 

You keep bringing this up.  Not sure what your agenda is here.

[SoonerBillsFan]

5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I believe it's a back injury for Diggs.   I think it was reported that he had  a back injury earlier in the season.   But also,  Brady has killed the pass game in general.    Everybody but Cook looks worse in the pass game with Brady than they had with Dorsey.   The sample size is just small enough and people are still feeling sated about the Dorsey firing that they haven't gotten around to their pitchforks just yet.     

Dorsey isn't the answer.  I still want an offensive HC that brings a WCO approach.

[TFBillsfan]

Wouldn’t the Bills get significantly fined for not reporting an injury to Diggs?  I’d be surprised if he’s hurt. 

[The 9 Isles]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Josh needs a lot less golf and a lot more work on his mechanics and chemistry with his receivers this coming offseason.   He talked about getting back to his offseason mechanics training in the postgame today........but he's clearly not putting in the work he was prior to the 2021 season.    After 13 seconds I think he thought he had neared the pinnacle of his profession but he's regressed back closer to Cam Newton 2.0 than the passer he was then.   Time for him to get serious about winning before his own talent regresses back to the pack.

You see the way some of the most successful QBs in history prepare, get proper nutrition, specialized coach or mentors and as much as I love the guy I sure doesn’t appear he has that type of work ethic. 

[Don Otreply]

53 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

I think this is probably right, but I'm not confident they know how to scheme receivers open.

Brady can do it but he will have to learn by doing, jmo. 

[Drew21PA]

1 hour ago, Success said:

 

That Murray one stands out - soft pass, right on the hands, would have been a 1st down at mid-field. 

 

They scored after that. Had we kept going that drive & gotten even a FG - it's a whole different game.

 

That one was huge

 

a couple other first down receptions Josh our right on the hands in the right soot

 

but that Murray one was annoying 

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

We came into the season knowing that we didn't have a #2 WR on the roster. Now it turns out we don't have a true #1 either. We have no speed, no YAC ability, below average separation and catch ability from our WR corps. That's why our passing offense has looked so inconsistent, there is zero margin for error.

All 100% true.  This team needs an injection of new young receivers.  I like the prospect of Shakir & Kincaid but Stef & Gabe are becoming non factors.  And Josh was an inaccurate mess today. 

[BananaB]

Lmao. Back to it being about mechanics and off-season. I watched 3 games this weekend and I see WRs on 5 teams all getting  separation making easy throws for the QB except the Bills. I’m not sure why, is it the WRs or the OC. I don’t get why sometimes it looks so easy for everyone else but us. Sure Josh might be off but he shouldn’t have to be perfect on every pass. 

[JoshAllin]

Quote

I believe it's a back injury for Diggs.   I think it was reported that he had  a back injury earlier in the season.  

Don't think it's an injury for Diggs, I mean Metcalf had a lower back injury and still balled out with 100+ yrds

Edited January 1 by motorj

[dave mcbride]

14 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I believe it's a back injury for Diggs.   I think it was reported that he had  a back injury earlier in the season.   But also,  Brady has killed the pass game in general.    Everybody but Cook looks worse in the pass game with Brady than they had with Dorsey.   The sample size is just small enough and people are still feeling sated about the Dorsey firing that they haven't gotten around to their pitchforks just yet.     

I think they need to do a real interview process next year for OC. I worry that Brady is riding his Cowboys game high still. 

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

Pass protection was pretty bad today. The O-line is much improved this season and has been good overall, but this game was a bad one. 

 

Drops. Been a problem all year.

 

Deep throws. Do none of our WR understand that you have to fight back through the defender on an underthrown ball? It's an easy DPI call and our guys tend to just keep running forward and let the throw fall near them rather than make a play on it. 

 

 

[dave mcbride]

Just now, motorj said:

Don't think it's an injury for Diggs, I mean Metcalf had a lower back injury and still balled out with 100+ yrds

None of us knows the injury situation with any of these players because teams for excellent reasons don’t tell.

[Ya Digg?]

1 hour ago, Aimee75 said:

Cryptic IG story. I might not have thought too much about it if he didn't look so pissed in the Bills "big dubs" post. I do like that he doesn't tolerate losing or even playing bad, but if you get the win, it helps, and going into a massive game next week, we don't need drama. I just feel like this season he has been teetering on boiling over.

Wait, you’re basing your post off of “I think he looked pissed in the big dubs” post that the Bills put out?

 

Am I missing something? So many people want to drive him out of Buffalo? People on the postgame show calling up saying all he does is complain about not getting touches, complains about Josh, bla blah blah…has HE ever actually said anything? Why do so many want him gone?

[BuffaninSarasota]

41 minutes ago, BRH said:

 

What cryptic IG story?

 

I just looked at his account and his last post was on the 18th and his story, which didn't seem cryptic at all, was posted this morning.

 

You keep bringing this up.  Not sure what your agenda is here.

there is no cryptic IG story nor has he been pouting. He looks a bit unhappy either bc he's playing hurt (probably) or he is not meeting his own very high expectations. A guy like Diggs has a lot of pride. His interviews/press conferences are always insightful without cliches. You can tell he wants to be part of the solution and it pains him to fall short.

 

I'm with you - not sure what the agenda is here.

 

 

Edited January 1 by BuffaninSarasota
add

[Aimee75]

1 minute ago, Ya Digg? said:

Wait, you’re basing your post off of “I think he looked pissed in the big dubs” post that the Bills put out?

 

Am I missing something? So many people want to drive him out of Buffalo? People on the postgame show calling up saying all he does is complain about not getting touches, complains about Josh, bla blah blah…has HE ever actually said anything? Why do so many want him gone?

I don't want to drive him out of Buffalo, nor do I think that is possible. I do always feel like he is boiling under, and do think we may have an even worse off season this year vs last if we don't make the playoffs, or have an early exit. I still like Diggs, and think he is our best receiver, but he barely contained his feelings in the off season, going into this season, and at times during this season. There are times I love him lots and see the good in him, and think he has a huge heart, and other times I feel like he comes off like a diva. Regardless what I think, I am not going to drive him out of town, nor will any other fans. If he truly, truly wants out(which I don't know if that could possibly happen) it won't be because of fans on message boards.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Peter said:

I was under the impression from some people on this board, Cover 1, and WGR that Dorsey was responsible anything wrong with the offense, the economy, the Ukraine, and the Middle East.

He was.  

[Peter]

1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

He was.  

 

In your mind.

[Big Blitz]

2 hours ago, HappyDays said:

We came into the season knowing that we didn't have a #2 WR on the roster. Now it turns out we don't have a true #1 either. We have no speed, no YAC ability, below average separation and catch ability from our WR corps. That's why our passing offense has looked so inconsistent, there is zero margin for error.

 

This.  

[Alphadawg7]

Just now, Peter said:

 

In your mind.

And on the scoreboard and the win column.  

[Peter]

Just now, Alphadawg7 said:

And on the scoreboard and the win column.  

 

Not really, but believe what you believe to push your agenda.

[EmotionallyUnstable]

So many facets at play here: 

 

- Beane and Personnel (talent deficiency)

-Coaching (play design, calls and personnel usage)

- Allen (Misfires, turnovers, misreads)

- Execution (drops, lack of YAC, contested catches)

- Offensive Line (poor protection at times)

 

Our best play is, and will continue to be, Allen making magic out of structure on broken plays or scramble drills. 
 

Hell, I’m starting to think we should design these up!

[RyanC883]

Bean has blundered the WR group with awful FA last year.  Need 2 next draft. 

[Alphadawg7]

4 minutes ago, Peter said:

 

Not really, but believe what you believe to push your agenda.

Not really?  Push an agenda over a fired guy? Lmao c’mon dude.

 

Dorseys last 6 games against the weakest part of our schedule our offense averaged 20 PPG and we went 2-4 with both wins getting lucky on last play not to lose.

 

In Brady’s first 6 games offense is avg 28 PPG against the toughest part of our schedule and we are 5-1. 
 

The only one “believing what they want to push an agenda” is you.
 

Ohhhh those pesky facts right lol

 

 

Edited January 1 by Alphadawg7

[BADOLBILZ]

12 minutes ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

Pass protection was pretty bad today. The O-line is much improved this season and has been good overall, but this game was a bad one. 

 

Drops. Been a problem all year.

 

Deep throws. Do none of our WR understand that you have to fight back through the defender on an underthrown ball? It's an easy DPI call and our guys tend to just keep running forward and let the throw fall near them rather than make a play on it. 

 

 

 

 

Yeah the first deep throw to Diggs was an easy opportunity for Diggs to stop and take the PI with the DB running with his back to the ball.   There has been a lot of that with our receivers this season.    Usually more Davis than Diggs but there has been a lack of awareness in the moment.    Perhaps Diggs thought the slight chance that the pass just barely got thru the defender was worth risking getting nothing out of the play............PI stats don't go under WR yardage you know.........but you gotta' take those big gimme yards by fighting back for the under thrown ball.

[Airseven]

Allen is careless and inaccurate and (seemingly) confused and unprepared. His best plays are improvised.
 

And rushing TDs don’t compensate for reoccurring flaws as a passer.

[Chugga]

For those of you that are married.  You ever have those times when you and your wife just aren’t clicking.  And you know that utter feeling of frustration you get….then magically one day things just click and you’re sitting there like “damn I don’t even know why we were bickering”.

 

Thats Allen and Diggs right now.  No one is saying anything dumb on social media and there isn’t drama in the locker room they just aren’t clicking.  And I’m sure that’s insanely frustrating (I know I’ve lived through it) and you might see it in some body language.  Imagine running a 60 yard route and the ball is 1 yard off.  Or imagine tossing a 50 yard bomb and your WR flattened his post route a degree of an angle shorter than you wanted.

 

These guys are missing by fractions on a 100 yard field.  That’s gotta kill them both.

 

But I firmly believe they’ll figure it out.  They just aren’t clicking.  And like I said in my previous post….even though they aren’t clicking in the 4th quarter when the game is hinging on a time killing drive who is somehow always there on that right sideline on 3rd down?

[Alphadawg7]

1 minute ago, Airseven said:

Allen is careless and inaccurate and (seemingly) confused and unprepared. His best plays are improvised.
 

And rushing TDs don’t compensate for reoccurring flaws as a passer.

He leads the NFL in total yards and total TDs…yeah he sucks.

[BADOLBILZ]

2 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

Bean has blundered the WR group with awful FA last year.  Need 2 next draft. 

 

I'd say they need to draft 3 they can roster from this class.   They probably aren't going to be able to bring in any upgrades in free agency.   Time to make moves on that market was when guys like Hill and AJ Brown were put on the market.    Now everybody is seeing how dead in the water your offense can look without at least 2 stud receiving targets............and how much better having a 3rd can make a roster look.

[BananaB]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

I'd say they need to draft 3 they can roster from this class.   They probably aren't going to be able to bring in any upgrades in free agency.   Time to make moves on that market was when guys like Hill and AJ Brown were put on the market.    Now everybody is seeing how dead in the water your offense can look without at least 2 stud receiving targets............and how much better having a 3rd can make a roster look.

Bills don’t need studs. They can’t wait unti the back of the draft to solve their WR problem. The amount of picks we spent on TEs and RBs on the first two days the past 5 years is absurd. 

[Peter]

Just now, Alphadawg7 said:

Not really?  Push an agenda over a fired guy? Lmao dude.

 

Dorseys last 6 games against the weakest part of our schedule our offense averaged 20 PPG and we went 2-4 with both wins getting lucky on last play not to lose.

 

In Brady’s first 6 games offense is avg 28 PPG against the toughest part of our schedule and we are 5-1. 
 

The only one “believing what they want to push an agenda is you”.  
 

Ohhhh those pesky facts right

 

Pesky facts:

 

 

Second Best Offense 2022

 

As for wins and losses this year, how many “game losing drives” did our defense give up this year when Dorsey was our OC?!? If our defense could protect the lead, we already would have qualified for the playoffs and could have or be fighting for the number one seed.

 

How many turnovers did the offense give up? (You probably would want to blame that on him as well)

 

You can have the last word on this. I know that is important to you. I am not going to respond because I have better things to do on New Year’s Eve than argue with someone who has a biased agenda.

 

Happy New Year.

 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, BananaB said:

Bills don’t need studs. They can’t wait unti the back of the draft to solve their WR problem. The amount of picks we spent on TEs and RBs on the first two days the past 5 years is absurd. 

 

 

They need stud WR's.    Fact.    This is a deep draft for WR but I think there will be a bunch of them taken in round 1.    They likely won't get multiple potential starters.........but that's what they need..........and it's a critical need.