Article on Josh Allen's state of mind

[Buffalo_Stampede]

32 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Can’t believe how coaching is ruining the best QB we’ve ever had. Just madness. 

He had these coaches last year and he was running through people.

 

It’s not the coaches. It’s Josh.

[Dubie54]

Daboll's impact on Josh's development was significant and I think Josh does not have that solid voice of experience to help him right now. I question what kind of relationship he really has with Dorsey and to what degree his struggles can be attributed to a lack of confidence in Dorsey's offensive system.  

[4merper4mer]

34 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Can’t believe how coaching is ruining the best QB we’ve ever had. Just madness. 

I don’t know if the article is true or not but it paints Allen as a weak minded, tentative, unsure player seeking nirvana like some freak hippy from 1968.  And your take is that coaching is ruining him?  

1 minute ago, Dubie54 said:

Daboll's impact on Josh's development was significant and I think Josh does not have that solid voice of experience to help him right now. I question what kind of relationship he really has with Dorsey and to what degree his struggles can be attributed to a lack of confidence in Dorsey's offensive system.  

It definitely can’t be anything Allen is doing wrong because he is perfect.

[Success]

I think a lot of this comes down to the running thing.

 

All last year, the fans, media, et al. - Allen is running too much. He's taking too many risks. It will shorten his career.

 

And over the summer, Allen and the coaches were asked about it a few times.  They made it clear that it was something that was being addressed and discussed. And I think that just went way overboard.  The main impression I have had watching these games, and trying to figure out why JA's demeanor is so different, is just that he's thinking too much.  There are too many conflicting signals going on in his head.

 

He needs to go back to his instincts.

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Yeah, his interview yesterday was WEIRD. 

 

He chooses to stay low positive, but then 30-seconds later he says he might have to crank it up more.

 

John Warrow right away with the "you don't look like you're having fun" blast. 

 

Our media just pounces on these emotional/feelings type stories like a cat on catnip. 

 

Buffalo has always been uncomfortable with talent. 

 

 

 

[Dubie54]

11 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

I don’t know if the article is true or not but it paints Allen as a weak minded, tentative, unsure player seeking nirvana like some freak hippy from 1968.  And your take is that coaching is ruining him?  

It definitely can’t be anything Allen is doing wrong because he is perfect.

Of course he's not perfect, that's not the point.

[RunTheBall]

There are a lot bigger problems than Josh right now but since he's the QB it has a huge impact on the rest of the team. 

 

You can't turn your emotions on and off like a light switch. 

 

Josh has lost his mojo, I hope he gets it back. I think over coaching got into his head. 

 

I always thought once Josh took off and lowered a shoulder that his competitive juices started flowing and he played better. 

 

I know that's taboo around here. 

[Big Blitz]

2 hours ago, Drew21PA said:

I sure hope Josh Allen is not turning into Aaron Rodgers and becoming a head case

 

someone just speak wisdom to the kid please

 

https://www.outkick.com/bills-qb-josh-allen-gives-peek-into-whats-wrong-and-its-as-simple-as-the-uncertainty-in-his-head/

 

This was just a “he needs a new head coach” piece:

 

 

 

..”In that postseason (2022), I’m quite certain Allen was not searching for the right mental state or approach. Because his coach, Brian Daboll, told Allen what he needed to think about and Allen got it and just played.”

[SWATeam]

12 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

I don’t know if the article is true or not but it paints Allen as a weak minded, tentative, unsure player seeking nirvana like some freak hippy from 1968.  And your take is that coaching is ruining him?  

He's a whisker away from a darkness retreat.

 

Or, turn the light on and pop in some ***** film

[Bobby Hooks]

Josh was already kind of a head case. This was the last thing I wanted to read about him.

 

 The more he starts trying to fine tune his thinking the more he’ll be, well… thinking. 
 

We want Josh to think, but not be so in his head about it it starts him overthinking. Once you get caught in that cycle, things slow down, and start to take away from the things that made you special to begin with. 
 

The next cycle will be him trying to get back to not thinking so much, that will lead to mistakes and more overthinking and he’ll try to think more. Oof… this is not good. 
 

I believe he and the coaching staff need to start considering this is a bit of a lost season. Let him go out there and just doing it until he finds himself again. He needs a hard reboot. 

Edited October 25, 2023 by Bobby Hooks

[billybob71]

gummies and Floyd

[Roundybout]

22 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

He had these coaches last year and he was running through people.

 

It’s not the coaches. It’s Josh.

Coaching has specifically told him to stop running like that. It’s been widely reported.

[HamSandwhich]

3 hours ago, Drew21PA said:

I sure hope Josh Allen is not turning into Aaron Rodgers and becoming a head case

 

someone just speak wisdom to the kid please

 

https://www.outkick.com/bills-qb-josh-allen-gives-peek-into-whats-wrong-and-its-as-simple-as-the-uncertainty-in-his-head/

Aaron Rodgers is the man, you’re crazy 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Just now, Roundybout said:

Coaching has specifically told him to stop running like that. It’s been widely reported.

They’ve been telling him this for 6 years.

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

He needs to hurdle the next opportunity he gets. That’s when we’ll know the old Josh is back and that he is thinking less and just reacting.

 

 

[HamSandwhich]

They need to stop putting the governors on him and let him be Josh. I’ve always hated this talk of reining him in, that’s terrible idea. He wins when he’s doing him. 

[PBF81]

2 hours ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

There’s no room for “low positive” when you are blessed with high “arm arrogance.” 🧐.
 

He says he thinks he plays better with his emotions in check—but I think we need to still sometimes see the fired up Josh that gets his team to run through walls for him! 

 

That's true, but "fired up" doesn't always mean running like a maniac. 

 

I rewatched parts of the New England game and what stood out to me was the creativity with the play calling, on both sides.  It's as if Belichick properly did all of his homework before the game but questions remain as to whether McD & Co. did any.  And if they did, which surely they did, then they were not good if not outright awful at it.  

 

 

[Low Positive]

I don't understand how we got here from the Miami game. I really don't.

[without a drought]

Josh, if you're not worked up enough to puke before the game, you might not be ready. 

[4merper4mer]

3 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Coaching has specifically told him to stop running like that. It’s been widely reported.

He’s so dreamy I just don’t see how anyone could ever think he ever did anything wrong.  Obviously it all all someone else’s fault.

4 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

That's true, but "fired up" doesn't always mean running like a maniac. 

 

I rewatched parts of the New England game and what stood out to me was the creativity with the play calling, on both sides.  It's as if Belichick properly did all of his homework before the game but questions remain as to whether McD & Co. did any.  And if they did, which surely they did, then they were not good if not outright awful at it.  

 

 

Dorsey dialed up a wide open bomb to Diggs.  Does that count?

[LABILLBACKER]

26 minutes ago, Success said:

I think a lot of this comes down to the running thing.

 

All last year, the fans, media, et al. - Allen is running too much. He's taking too many risks. It will shorten his career.

 

And over the summer, Allen and the coaches were asked about it a few times.  They made it clear that it was something that was being addressed and discussed. And I think that just went way overboard.  The main impression I have had watching these games, and trying to figure out why JA's demeanor is so different, is just that he's thinking too much.  There are too many conflicting signals going on in his head.

 

He needs to go back to his instincts.

 

After that reckless Jets game, Josh over corrected and it seemed to work.  But in order for him to be happy, he's still gotta continue with what's in his DNA.  The true challenge for him is to settle into a version that reduces risk yet still allows him the occasional "wow" play.  He is currently struggling mentally finding that middle ground.  And you can see it in his somewhat detached demeanor. 

[Bob Jones]

1 hour ago, MJS said:

Funny, because the mental aspects of QB have been what he is struggling with. So, if that is the result of "low positive", he needs to change it.

Not so sure if it's "mental" or just inferior coaching, such as when he repeatedly doesn’t recognize a blitz, and doesn't get rid of the ball quickly to the uncovered receiver.  OTOH, as people have said in here all week, the latter is football basics 101, and HS QBs know that you should do that, so it's mind boggling that JA17 doesn't know it.

[BCAS Baritone]

I also wonder if his teammates were aware that he was trying to be "low positive".  If they weren't, then they would be thinking, like most of us, "wow, Josh is just sitting there like a doofus.  What's wrong?"  If they didn't understand his approach before, but now they do, that will help immensely.

 

1 minute ago, Bob Jones said:

Not so sure if it's "mental" or just inferior coaching, such as when he repeatedly doesn’t recognize a blitz, and doesn't get rid of the ball quickly to the uncovered receiver.  OTOH, as people have said in here all week, the latter is football basics 101, and HS QBs know that you should do that, so it's mind boggling that JA17 doesn't know it.

Could also be related to the point Diggs made, that they are coming to the line too late due to all the substitutions, so Josh doesn't have time to adjust the play to the late switch that the defense is making.

 

[PBF81]

5 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

He’s so dreamy I just don’t see how anyone could ever think he ever did anything wrong.  Obviously it all all someone else’s fault.

Dorsey dialed up a wide open bomb to Diggs.  Does that count?

 

Diggs' long catch was 25, but sure.  I'd have swapped our offensive plan for New Englands any day.  

 

But wait, I'm not sure we could actually run theirs without the superlative skills of Rhamondre Stevenson, Demario Douglas, Kendrick Bourne, or TE Pharoah Brown.  

 

So yeah, since we don't have a bona fide #2 there's no way we can compete with the likes of them.  Maybe we can trade Davis for Dougless, Kincaid or Knox for Brown.  Maybe then we could pull it off.  But yeah, you're right, it's a tall order for us given the shabby talent we have.  

 

Maybe we can get Jefferson and Kelce in the offseason via trade.  Maybe then we can be consistently good.  

 

Oh well, poor McD.  

 

That what you wanna hear?     

 

 

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Interesting. And confirms some suspicions/issues I've been having.

 

For the first few years of his career, Josh was a dedicated, laser-focused work horse during each offseason. It seemed every year he would come back having worked on one specific area (footwork, upper body mechanics, etc) that really helped him dial in and show up with at least a 33% improvement in his game (which is huge).

 

By the end of 2021, he had his mechanics figured out and imo really only had one last hole in his game to address: his mindset.

 

After the 13s KC game, I thought he had enough inspiration to figure it out. He needs to be the fierce, almost angry competitor that we saw that the end of that KC game. It reminded me very much of how Brady plays every game. I was hoping he'd come into 2022 with a focused, killer mindset. And in the Rams opener, it kinda looked like he might have figured it out.

 

Unfortunately, by the Packers game it was apparent that mindset wouldnt stick, or was never really there to begin with.

 

And now, this new "low positive" sounds like the opposite of where I want him to be.

 

I love that Josh is a lovable goofball at heart, but I need a cold-blooded killer and fierce competitor.

It’s a major difference between Josh and Burrow. And was a major difference between Brady and the QB’s of his era.

[BuffaloRebound]

this season looks destined for the dumpster.  

[julian]

Dude is on pace for 45+ TDs 4500+ yards and top 10 in most relevant offensive categories.

 

 I feel like I’m living in some alternate universe where up is down and left is right. Hopefully when the “team” wins a title, all these silly takes while simply fall away.

[4merper4mer]

Just now, PBF81 said:

 

Diggs' long catch was 25, but sure.  

 

 

Now do the walk in TD that the 17th rail overthrew by 8 yards.

[LABILLBACKER]

4 minutes ago, Bob Jones said:

Not so sure if it's "mental" or just inferior coaching, such as when he repeatedly doesn’t recognize a blitz, and doesn't get rid of the ball quickly to the uncovered receiver.  OTOH, as people have said in here all week, the latter is football basics 101, and HS QBs know that you should do that, so it's mind boggling that JA17 doesn't know it.

That's the part of his game I too cannot figure out.  Maybe Daboll did a better job of hammering this issue into Josh's head.  But you're right, he's a 6 year veteran who has to understand this concept of hot reads. It's like he's still looking deep with a full blitz coming.  Makes no sense.

[PBF81]

Just now, 4merper4mer said:

Now do the walk in TD that the 17th rail overthrew by 8 yards.

 

I'd still swap NE's offensive play-calling in that game for ours.  Not sure what two plays have to do with the overall game.  

 

It was simply better.  Quite outstanding actually.  

 

Also, everyone's also complaining about the D, but in one of the pieces linked on the homepage, the writer mentions that we're ranked 30th in missed tackles.  That's not an injury thing, that's a poor fundamentals thing and it's also not the first time under this staff that it's been an issue.  

 

 

[4merper4mer]

1 minute ago, PBF81 said:

 

I'd still swap NE's offensive play-calling in that game for ours.  Not sure what two plays have to do with the overall game.  

 

It was simply better.  Quite outstanding actually.  

 

Also, everyone's also complaining about the D, but in one of the pieces linked on the homepage, the writer mentions that we're ranked 30th in missed tackles.  That's not an injury thing, that's a poor fundamentals thing and it's also not the first time under this staff that it's been an issue.  

 

 

If Josh Allen left practice and crashed his car into a school bus would you blame Ken Dorsey for keeping him 5 minutes late meaning the bus would have never been there?

[MJS]

10 minutes ago, Bob Jones said:

Not so sure if it's "mental" or just inferior coaching, such as when he repeatedly doesn’t recognize a blitz, and doesn't get rid of the ball quickly to the uncovered receiver.  OTOH, as people have said in here all week, the latter is football basics 101, and HS QBs know that you should do that, so it's mind boggling that JA17 doesn't know it.

You don't think coaches are telling him those basic things? Of course they are. Josh needs to own it and fix it. He is supposed to be an elite QB. Take your improvement into your own hands.

[UKBillFan]

7 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

If Josh Allen left practice and crashed his car into a school bus would you blame Ken Dorsey for keeping him 5 minutes late meaning the bus would have never been there?

 

You do realise the majority of takes on here are Josh is an issue, but isn't the sole problem? Just as Dorsey isn't the sole problem, McDermott isn't a sole problem, receivers dropping the ball isn't the sole problem, other players showing ill-discipline by gifting opponents penalties isn't the sole problem. But put them all together and we are where we are.

 

If Josh had played better the Bills would have beaten the Pats. If the defense hadn't let the abysmal Pats defense put up 29, the Bills would have beaten the Pats. If Murray hadn't driven into Pats defender on the Knox TD, the Bills would have won. The issue is everything is a mess at the moment - it goes beyond one player or one area.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

25 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

I don't understand how we got here from the Miami game. I really don't.

Well, the Jets game was just a gut punch. 

 

Seeing Allen turn the ball over brought those same "he's reckless" stories right back up again. 

 

In that game he was hurdling and diving. Losing to Zach Wilson. 

 

Our media was still bringing up the Jets game after the Washington game. It took weeks for the media to let that go. 

 

And Miami it was just on fire. The playmaking from both sides of the ball. 

 

 

The first odd comment to me was the entire plan to go to London, and when Josh Allen was talking about being "caffeined out" trying to stay awake. I had a bad feeling about that game right then. 

 

I've been to Europe 6 times, and I've never had this gigantic struggle with jet lag. Just sleep when you can sleep and you're fine. 

 

But that was the start of the first half slow starts, and the hand wringing about the offense. 

 

But the defensive injuries also added gloom to the mood. 

 

 

On Sunday, the play by play shows they moved the ball well. It was going forward for the most part. I would need another perspective on how Josh Allen played - Marino said he was bad. 

 

They really need a 30-point effort on Thursday. 

 

 

 

 

[Milanos Milano]

Allen needs to sit down and consult with Brady. Find out everything Brady did to hone his craft and work on the details. He’s overthinking because he doesn’t understand the finer parts of the game. Brady understood them better than anyone. 

[PBF81]

26 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

If Josh Allen left practice and crashed his car into a school bus would you blame Ken Dorsey for keeping him 5 minutes late meaning the bus would have never been there?

 

You're right.  Dorsey's got this offense humming along on all cylinders.  

 

Not sure what I was thinking.  

 

 

[WideNine]

4 hours ago, Last Guy on the Bench said:

Idiotic take (not you, the article). Clearly Josh is working on the mental side of his game and always has been. But the idea that reflection, experimentation, trying to grow and evolve (which of course will come with ups and downs) is somehow weak or confused or unhelpful is absurd. Sure overthinking things can be a problem in any area of life, but if that's happening, continued reflection will help him see that too. The article could have been interesting; the topic is interesting. But it's such a knee-jerk and/or clickbait angle. 

 

Journalism is just about dead for news in general and certainly trending that way in sports reporting. Not sure who to blame as many folks have the attention span of a gnat and want "drive-by" reporting or what passes for reporting. Sober, well thought out and researched reporting is not as market driven. 

Ad-click revenue has driven the demand for less news and more sensational and/or divisive headlines that can get people to click on them.

And yes, I agree that Allen reflecting about his mental space and approach is not earth-shattering or worthy of that much conjecture.

 

I honestly would be more concerned if he wasn't processing those things.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 25, 2023 by WideNine

[PBF81]

2 hours ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Sounds like something Aaron Rodgers would say to be honest. Next thing we know Josh is going to want to head off to a dark retreat to feel more at "zen".

 

Seriously, if anyone hears Josh if headed to golf with Rodgers next off season...someone steal his clubs, please.

 

Oddly, it's been reported that they are friends.  Maybe that side of Rodgers is getting into Allen.  

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

[Logic]

This has been my concern about Ken Dorsey as offensive coordinator.

I'm actually NOT too worried about his gameplanning or playcalls. I don't always love his personnel usage and I don't always feel he maximizes the talent on his roster, but even THAT isn't my biggest concern.

No, my biggest concern has always been -- and remains -- that he doesn't actually know how to coach Josh Allen. He doesn't know what buttons to push, and when. He doesn't know the things to be in his ear about, to emphasize and de-emphasize. He doesn't know how to hype him up when he's too low or calm him down when he's too high.

Brian Daboll had a great relationship with Josh. He seemed to know how to do all of these things. I don't actually think Daboll was worlds better as a PLAYCALLER than Dorsey is. I just think he was way better at coaching Josh Allen. 

The way that Josh's decision-making and his seeing of open targets in the middle of the field seem to have regressed, his funky rollercoaster of mindsets from game to game...all of this seems like coachable stuff, and I fear no one is doing it, or at least doing it effectively. Not Dorsey, not Brady, no one.

Nothing I've seen this season has changed my mind on this, and in fact, this season has only reinforced this notion.

[Roundybout]

55 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

He’s so dreamy I just don’t see how anyone could ever think he ever did anything wrong.  Obviously it all all someone else’s fault.

Dorsey dialed up a wide open bomb to Diggs.  Does that count?

 
we get it, you hate Allen for some reason. you don’t have to keep posting the exact same thing over and over.