Hodgins must stay

[hemma]

 

28 minutes ago, Airseven said:

I just did a quick sketch of my 53. Rather straight forward actually. My last roster spot came down to Hodgins over Bryant. (I have Kumerow safely on the roster and Lawson cut.) I also have Ford on the roster, but if they can dump him for a 7th, then Hodgins and Bryant would both make it.

 

Yeah, I thought Lawson looked slow and out of position too often.  I agree, unless he steps it up, I don’t think he makes it.

[ColoradoBills]

7 hours ago, DCbillsfan said:

I just looked up the Bills contracts on Spotrac.  For 2023, Allen has a base salary of $27.5M which a large amount could be converted to a signing bonus to help create cap space.  Dawkins, Milano, and White could be done too.  Beane will figure it out.  I don't believe they'll do any major signings next off-season but I also didn't think they would sign Von Miller either.  So I'm not concerned about it.  Just going to watch Beane do his thing and out maneuver most of his colleagues once again.

 

All GMs (especially teams paying an elite QB) use restructuring and void years as a tool.  But it's only a tool and not sustainable method of cap management.

If it was KC would have never moved on from Hill.  Mahomes has $34.4M of roster bonus this year that could have been restructured.

 

I think @hemmais trying to point out a rational fact.  As an example, the Bills have 17 players above $3M cap this year.

LA Rams have 10.  The more high-cost elite players a team signs the less money for mid-level players they can pay.

Beane will do his best to balance the 2, but he will be letting some talent go that he wishes he could keep.

[YoloinOhio]

Welcome to the NYG, Isaiah Hodgins 

 

 

[Don Otreply]

4 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

Welcome to the NYG, Isaiah Hodgins 

 

 

Smoke screen,

[Warriorspikes51]

4 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

Welcome to the NYG, Isaiah Hodgins 

 

 

He could be traded to the Giants when OBJ signs 

[Stokes84]

It would be annoying to keep Kumerow over Hodgins, and to a lesser degree, Crowder.  If we cut him, it would not surprise me if the Giants scoop him up and he’s an immediate starter for them. 

[ganesh]

On 8/16/2022 at 4:00 PM, Pete said:

Austin and Crowder are slots, and we have slot WRs.  Hodgin can win jump balls.  Josh could throw ball up high for Hodgins, he will go get it.  Red zone threat.  A big WR scores TDs, catches everything, wins jump balls, never drops....thats a dimension the Bills are lacking

The Bills have that in Knox and Howard

On 8/19/2022 at 1:25 AM, ColoradoBills said:

 

All GMs (especially teams paying an elite QB) use restructuring and void years as a tool.  But it's only a tool and not sustainable method of cap management.

If it was KC would have never moved on from Hill.  Mahomes has $34.4M of roster bonus this year that could have been restructured.

 

I think @hemmais trying to point out a rational fact.  As an example, the Bills have 17 players above $3M cap this year.

LA Rams have 10.  The more high-cost elite players a team signs the less money for mid-level players they can pay.

Beane will do his best to balance the 2, but he will be letting some talent go that he wishes he could keep.

A secondary issue is that the owner also needs to have the cash to make the payments.  

5 hours ago, Stokes84 said:

It would be annoying to keep Kumerow over Hodgins, and to a lesser degree, Crowder.  If we cut him, it would not surprise me if the Giants scoop him up and he’s an immediate starter for them. 

We are sweating over the 6th WR !

[Pete]

21 hours ago, ganesh said:

The Bills have that in Knox and Howard

 

Hodgins makes plays for Bills.  Has OJ?

 

[Arkady Renko]

Reminds me of how mad I was that they cut Brandon Riley.  

25 minutes ago, Pete said:

Hodgins makes plays for Bills.  Has OJ?

 

Not in the regular season. 

[Beast]

On 8/23/2022 at 5:03 PM, Stokes84 said:

It would be annoying to keep Kumerow over Hodgins, and to a lesser degree, Crowder.  If we cut him, it would not surprise me if the Giants scoop him up and he’s an immediate starter for them. 

 

No, actually it wouldn't. Your low depth chart receivers better be able to play special teams.

[Malazan]

11 minutes ago, Beast said:

No, actually it wouldn't. Your low depth chart receivers better be able to play special teams.

 

Hodgins *can* play special teams and has been taking snaps there. The question is whether the difference between Hodgins and Kumerow's ability on specials is worth keeping Kumerow who seems to offer less at WR. 

 

Then to a question of whether you want to keep 7 WRs or keep a guy like Cam Lewis.

[Beast]

9 hours ago, Malazan said:

 

Hodgins *can* play special teams and has been taking snaps there. The question is whether the difference between Hodgins and Kumerow's ability on specials is worth keeping Kumerow who seems to offer less at WR. 

 

Then to a question of whether you want to keep 7 WRs or keep a guy like Cam Lewis.

I’m keeping Cam Lewis all day long.

 

Much like great QB’s do, Josh Allen is going to make WR’s look good.

[atlbillsfan1975]

If it’s close for Beane and McD, I think they go with the younger, cheaper, more upside player. 

[Manther]

I agree Hodgins must stay.  I think he is way above solid and has a high ceiling.  Just thinking, I believe we could get a 2nd round pick for him, 3rd for sure.

 

I still would keep him over a 2nd round pick, I think he is that good.

 

Probably a controversial opinion.  But, have never thought about his trade value.  The Bills have stashed him nicely for 2 years.

 

Go Bills!

[Warriorspikes51]

Let's just assume OBJ is added.  That means you have a tough decision with Crowder, Hodgins and Kumerow
 

What if the Giants offer a 4th or 3rd for Hodgins?  
 

or do you see if someone will offer a 6th for Crowder and take that instead.

I doubt Kumerow gets cut because of ST

18 minutes ago, Manther said:

I agree Hodgins must stay.  I think he is way above solid and has a high ceiling.  Just thinking, I believe we could get a 2nd round pick for him, 3rd for sure.

 

I still would keep him over a 2nd round pick, I think he is that good.

 

Probably a controversial opinion.  But, have never thought about his trade value.  The Bills have stashed him nicely for 2 years.

 

Go Bills!

He's played like he could step in at Outside WR if God forbid Diggs or Davis went down 

[Robert Paulson]

21 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Let's just assume OBJ is added.  That means you have a tough decision with Crowder, Hodgins and Kumerow
 

What if the Giants offer a 4th or 3rd for Hodgins?  
 

or do you see if someone will offer a 6th for Crowder and take that instead.

I doubt Kumerow gets cut because of ST

He's played like he could step in at Outside WR if God forbid Diggs or Davis went down 

OMFG: Hodgins is a JAG- nice player but no one is giving up a 2nd or 3rd for this guy

 

between him-JAG; Stevenson, who can't hold onto the ball when he isn't hurt-JAG and Blackshear -JAG you would think we are talking about Thurman, Reed and Lofton.

 

These guys are the David Nelson's of the league- sh!tty players that sh!tty teams keep- god bless em for making some good money for a few years : let them all go the NYG because guess what- they are a sh!tty team and they would all fit in well there

[Beast]

Hodgins hasn't played a down of real NFL football and he is now in his third year. He was drafted in the sixth round. I am reading posters saying he has 2nd, 3rd or 4th round value.

 

Based on what?

 

I'd also like to add that am rooting for him. He's a Bill. You just have to be realistic especially with the players that are also at his position. He's very much a bubble guy.

Edited August 25, 2022 by Beast

[djp14150]

Can he punt?

[QLBillsFan]

13 hours ago, Manther said:

I agree Hodgins must stay.  I think he is way above solid and has a high ceiling.  Just thinking, I believe we could get a 2nd round pick for him, 3rd for sure.

 

I still would keep him over a 2nd round pick, I think he is that good.

 

Probably a controversial opinion.  But, have never thought about his trade value.  The Bills have stashed him nicely for 2 years.

 

Go Bills!

Yikes. Nobody is trading a high draft pick for Hodgins. A 3rd? Wow not happening. If he’s put on PS or waivers likely a team will scoop him. But that’s it. 

[Pete]

On 8/23/2022 at 11:33 AM, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

 

Beane is saying exactly how he is making final cut decisions-special teams.  Ive been trying to find a list of special teams preseason snaps.  Cover 1 said Quintin Morris was #2 in special team snaps.  Im curious how Blackshear, Hodgins, and who else played ST snaps and played well.

Special Teams (24 snaps)

This game seemed to be a bit more about getting the actual roster to sync up than Week 1 was, so a few players who might find themselves on the 53 for special teams value might have been revealed.

While Tommy Sweeney was on the field 50% of the time for special teams, he was once again passed by Quintin Morris at 62%, who led the team on special teams time. Joe Giles-Harris saw 42% of snaps, as did Baylon Spector. Finally, Mike Love saw 50%.

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2022/8/22/23315733/preseason-snap-count-notes-buffalo-bills-vs-denver-broncos

 

ST will be deciding factor for last spots.  Quintin Morris plays STs.  So does Sweeney.  OJ has never played ST.

 

Whos been gunner this preseason?  Does anyone have a link for Bills special teams preseason snaps total for Carolina?

[YoloinOhio]

Hold everything! 53% of ST snaps last night vs 18% for Kumerow 

 

 

[BuffBillsForLife]

40 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Hold everything! 53% of ST snaps last night vs 18% for Kumerow 

 

 

I definitely want Hodgins to make it over Kumerow, but I'm pretty sure Hodgins getting all of the snaps on special teams last night was so they would have more film of him on special teams snaps, not evidence that he's making the team over Kumerow.  There is already a ton of tape of Kumerow on special teams snaps, they needed something to compare them.  

 

I do think making the effort to give Hodgins the snaps there is a good sign for him, since (to me) it means they want a reason to keep him over Kumerow.

[FLFan]

25 minutes ago, BuffBillsForLife said:

I definitely want Hodgins to make it over Kumerow, but I'm pretty sure Hodgins getting all of the snaps on special teams last night was so they would have more film of him on special teams snaps, not evidence that he's making the team over Kumerow.  There is already a ton of tape of Kumerow on special teams snaps, they needed something to compare them.  

 

I do think making the effort to give Hodgins the snaps there is a good sign for him, since (to me) it means they want a reason to keep him over Kumerow.

Same thing with Morris vs. Sweeney.

[benderbender]

24 minutes ago, BuffBillsForLife said:

I definitely want Hodgins to make it over Kumerow, but I'm pretty sure Hodgins getting all of the snaps on special teams last night was so they would have more film of him on special teams snaps, not evidence that he's making the team over Kumerow.  There is already a ton of tape of Kumerow on special teams snaps, they needed something to compare them.  

 

I do think making the effort to give Hodgins the snaps there is a good sign for him, since (to me) it means they want a reason to keep him over Kumerow.

Only seemed to notice Kumerow when he low efforted passes or didn't block well. Last night wasn't his best showing. On the other hand Hodgins had two 4th down catches in a row. Not sure if it was enough to swing the coaches opinions. Maybe Kumerow is one of those players we have complete confidence not getting poached and Hodgins isn't. 

[BillsShredder83]

On 8/25/2022 at 10:39 PM, QLBillsFan said:

Yikes. Nobody is trading a high draft pick for Hodgins. A 3rd? Wow not happening. If he’s put on PS or waivers likely a team will scoop him. But that’s it. 

Lol right! Think of the caliber of wrs coming out in these rounds, this is insane

[nosejob]

2 minutes ago, FLFan said:

Same thing with Morris vs. Sweeney.

I agree with this, but that's just IMO. A far as Hodgins goes, I can see them going with 7 wrs. I believe they've done it before.

 

Diggs, Davis, Crowder, Isaiah, Shakir, Jake and Hodgins. Done deal

[gordong]

sorry but he really hasn't done enough to warrant making this team IMHO. he not fast enough and doesn't get much separation.   he can stay or go.  if we were to keep one boundary guy I would vote for the rookie RB

[BillsShredder83]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

Hold everything! 53% of ST snaps last night vs 18% for Kumerow 

 

 

Was this an indication of where they're at or evidence of evaluation. Tough to say, but reallyyyyyy hoping we keep him around

[boyst]

Notes from last night:

 

Saw crowders family, read the body language, even shared a few words (nothing significant)...

Crowder and his family were "all-in buffalo."  His mom, his wife, his two daughters - in mini bills cheerleader outfits "lil miss crowder" on the back. Just this makes me think they like Buffalo and he wants to be here. 

 

Lawson had his family there and they came to the front before the game. He seemed focus before and during the game.

 

The OL starters worked with Bobby Hart during the game on the sidelines. Morse and Dawkins doing a lot of technique stuff with others, also. They seemed to like Hart as a team member. Quesenberry seemed to keep to himself then just started working with a bunch of backups late in the game. 

 

Keenum was standing alone for various parts of the game while Barkley played - opposite the offense to see a very backside angle of the D. No headset, no helmet - so not hearing the info for the game. 

 

Barkley was very relaxed for the game. Bass didn't do any warmups or anything on the sidelines. Ferguson did some warmup snaps with a coach on the sidelines from time to time. Both will make the team. 

[SCBills]

I was all in on keeping Hodgins.. but I may have started coming back to reality that we keep 6 and WR6 should be a top notch ST’s guy in Kumerow. 
 

Hopefully Hodgins makes it to the PS, but this staff clearly knows how to scout mid-late round WR’s and DB’s.   I’m confident they’ll find another WR in the draft next year to replace Crowder in the WR room. 

[Rc2catch]

I’m still on the give Allen as many weapons as possible. Hodgins is a weapon cause he can catch anything thrown his way. He made back to back phenomenal catches last night on two badly thrown balls. 
I think they have given a lot of guys a fair shot to win jobs from our core special teamers. We’ll find out soon if they were able to beat them out. 
I’m rooting for Hodgins to stay healthy and get on the 53 this year though. 

[FLFan]

Hodgins has certainly made this a tough decision for the Bills.  He seems to be a more reliable receiver than Kumerow, but really does not get separation down the field.  Their evaluation of his ST performance will be a key factor.  Frankly, if either of these guys ends up playing significant snaps at WR the Bills are in trouble.  My guess is still that they keep Kumerow and IR or PUP Stevenson who has more WR and ST upside due to his speed.  

[Alphadawg7]

I am rooting for Hodgins too, but ultimately he is averaging under 9 yards per catch through 3 games while leading the team in targets and receptions and facing backups and guys who won't make rosters.  

 

Yeah, some of his catches have been pretty, but a WR avg under 9 yards per catch isn't exactly making a case to be kept above all other factors.  He certainly has a chance to make this team, but if he does, it will because they feel good about what he can contribute on ST because that will absolutely be his primary role.  

 

Like I have said in other threads/posts...no one past WR 4 on the depth chart has had any relevant production the past 2 seasons while fielding the #1 offense in the AFC.  So WR6 better be able to play ST or they won't make the team.  

 

I like Hodgins, so I hope he showed enough on ST, otherwise he won't make the final 53...and Beane has not only recently stated that, but also had that stance (as do all coaches) about the deeper bench players.  Its why its a well known fact that young players stuck behind guys on the roster need to win a role on ST if they want to assure themselves a roster spot.  

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2 hours ago, BuffBillsForLife said:

I definitely want Hodgins to make it over Kumerow, but I'm pretty sure Hodgins getting all of the snaps on special teams last night was so they would have more film of him on special teams snaps, not evidence that he's making the team over Kumerow.  There is already a ton of tape of Kumerow on special teams snaps, they needed something to compare them.  

 

I do think making the effort to give Hodgins the snaps there is a good sign for him, since (to me) it means they want a reason to keep him over Kumerow.

Seems he has more upside as WR… made a couple really nice grabs. 

[ColoradoBills]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I am rooting for Hodgins too, but ultimately he is averaging under 9 yards per catch through 3 games while leading the team in targets and receptions and facing backups and guys who won't make rosters.

 

I agree with his results being low yardage.  One thing that caused a lot of it was the routes he was called to run.  A lot of short 1st down throws

and a bunch of short sideline catches.  He had a couple of mid-level catches.  Not sure if it's his inability to go deeper or just what was

available for him to catch.  He lined up both outside and in the slot.

 

The thing that was positive is he seems to have some good hands and can box out DBs.

[hemma]

I think he has made the most of his opportunity.

Hope he makes it, but with all that’s going on, who knows ….

 

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

Hold everything! 53% of ST snaps last night vs 18% for Kumerow 

 

 

 

I wouldn't read too much into that as a sheer numbers game. 

The Bills had a full regular season to look at what Kumerow contributed on ST, he's "first team" there.

 

I think it's pretty clear that the Bills are looking hard at whether Morris and Hodgins can fill a role on ST.  And if the answer is "yes" for Hodgins, that would pave his way to the roster.  But they have to have someone in mind to fill Kumerow's "gunner" role, because he not only logged a faster 40 time pre-draft (4.54 vs 4.61), he (to my eyes) plays faster than Hodgins.

 

Morris might be a candidate.  He's sort of in between them on speed and looked faster than I thought he was.  He played 82% of the snaps.

 

I would have to say that OJ Howard's position is not looking secure.  He, Sweeney, and Morris took almost the same # of offensive snaps.  Howard took very few ST snaps which is not a good sign that they see him as a contributor, because Howard does not have a prior history of being an ace ST'er at his previous gig.

 

 

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

Morris might be a candidate.  He's sort of in between them on speed and looked faster than I thought he was.  He played 82% of the snaps.

 

I would have to say that OJ Howard's position is not looking secure.  He, Sweeney, and Morris took almost the same # of offensive snaps.  Howard took very few ST snaps which is not a good sign that they see him as a contributor, because Howard does not have a prior history of being an ace ST'er at his previous gig.

 

Yep.  If you took his cap hit away, he doesn't make the team IMO.  It sad but I think all his injuries has affected his game way too much.

Beane has some extra $s so is cutting him out of the question?  I'm not sure either way.

[BullBuchanan]

Hodgins is doing a very nice job, but I don't really care much if they keep or cut him because he shouldn't ever play meaningful snaps for the Buffalo Bills. Best case scenario, he's our #6 WR and 9th receiving option (behind Knox, Singletary and Cook). It should take at least three significant injuries to our WR group for him to see meaningful snaps there, and maybe even 4 if they decide to make Cook more of a WR in that event.

Even if he does all the right things, next year he would be no higher than 4th. It's not worth losing sleep over.

[BillsShredder83]

4 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

I’m still on the give Allen as many weapons as possible. Hodgins is a weapon cause he can catch anything thrown his way. He made back to back phenomenal catches last night on two badly thrown balls. 
I think they have given a lot of guys a fair shot to win jobs from our core special teamers. We’ll find out soon if they were able to beat them out. 
I’m rooting for Hodgins to stay healthy and get on the 53 this year though. 

Was hoping Howard could be RZ target... nope. I think hodgins is a skill set we don't have. Stef can highpoint a contested, but that's diff thsn asking him to be that guy in red zone. Would love to see hodgins backup, earn some regular playing time and see some situational RZ