Ralph Wilsons Legacy

[Mikie2times]

As I sit here in what I consider to be the arm pit of Ohio, Toledo, a city of 276k, packed with probably as many restaurants as it has citizens. Median household income of 37k. How is that even possible? Then I look at Buffalo and go figure, exact same population and exact same median income. I also understand like any city outlying suburbs have more money. About double the median income, again, no different than Toledo. I also understand the impacts of Buffalo having Rochester, Syracuse, and Toronto close by. Toledo is blocked by the Lions about an hour north, Cleveland an hour and half east, but you aren't getting near a pro football team anywhere inside an hours drive. Again, not all that different on distance compared to the outside populations that support the Bills. This is probably the biggest edge Buffalo has in a debate of why they should have a pro football team vs a city like Toledo that is so similar. 

 

I'm 30 years into this, like Ralph, from the Detroit area. I understand Ralph was a cheap and meddling owner and he drove us bat crazy. That said, I don't think I have read one positive post about Ralph Wilson since Terry grabbed the torch. I don't see Bills fans as thankful for what Ralph gave us and that's not what I have come to associate myself with in being a Bills fan. We are a die hard, loyal, appreciative group.

 

Can we start appreciating Ralph for what he did and not the things he failed at doing? If the NFL picked a location for each team starting anew, Buffalo isn't on the list. They aren't even on the 2nd list. Ralph put Buffalo on the list and he kept us there. I don't care about the ways he failed. What he did for WNY is special and it should always be considered special. 

Edited July 11, 2021 by KzooMike

[Don Otreply]

Ralph was Ralph, warts and all, some good some bad, much like all the other humans on this rock. 

[Chandler#81]

??😳 

I don’t know of anyone here who’s old enough to personally know the history of the team, that doesn’t appreciate Ralphs’ commitment to WNY. But the warts are plenty.

*Routinely threatened to move the team

*Consistent meddling in the team operation with disastrous results

*Put friends in high places with little to no experience-including Head Coach!

*Notoriously cheap in contract negotiations 

 

Ralph, more than any one person, was singularly responsible for at least 30 years of terrible, often embarrassing football. At the root of it all, he wanted to own the Lions. (See our original uniforms) Under the gun to name a host city by Lamar Hunt, his Miami preference fell through and we were his default position. He never called Buffalo home and never wanted to. Yes, he was charitable. He was instrumental ($$) in keeping the AFL afloat. He brought us The Bills! He made sure the team would stay here following his death. For these actions alone, he’s a positive part of the WNY story. But the ‘Good’ legacy ends there.

 

I don’t miss him.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

12 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

Ralph, more than any one person, was singularly responsible for at least 30 years of terrible, often embarrassing football. At the root of it all, he wanted to own the Lions. (See our original uniforms) Under the gun to name a host city by Lamar Hunt, his Miami preference fell through and we were his default position. He never called Buffalo home and never wanted to. Yes, he was charitable. He was instrumental ($$) in keeping the AFL afloat. He brought us The Bills! He made sure the team would stay here following his death. For these actions alone, he’s a positive part of the WNY story. But the ‘Good’ legacy ends there.

 

I don’t miss him.

I do.  But then I compensate for wind and bad sighting of the bow.  I wonder if Staples has printed up that ream of Ralph portraits yet? 

Edited July 11, 2021 by Ridgewaycynic2013

[machine gun kelly]

Kzoo, first very thoughtful to honor Ralph’s memory, and yes, you’ll read negative comments that are so common, it’s not worth repeating as everyone knows the talking points.

 

Where I politely disagree with you is the positive remarks which are just as common regarding Ralph.

 

First, historically he had such a love of football and history, he made a point of naming the team after the 1940’s Bills from that naming contest (Buffalo Bill).

 

Second, he was an integral part of the formation of the foolish 8, and when Al Davis was broke and may have needed to fold on the Raiders, Ralph bailed him out. (I think 50k, but Chand or one of the guys can confirm).

 

He also was a principal in pushing for integration of the AFL into the NFL, and played hard ball in the draft and plucking off what would’ve been NFL talent.

 

Next, he was a staunch advocate of the revenue sharing that now exists in the NFL keeping at bay the Dallas, NY’s of the world maintaining the NFL brand is better with a balance of small market teams and regionalizing.

 

Some of the guys can elaborate, but I believe he was part of the owners along with Modell for the inception of MNF.

 

He had multiple opportunities to move the team when others did move like the Baltimore Colts, first Browns team to Baltimore, and so on.  I believe he was offered to move the team to Jax.

 

There are a lot more examples, but he loved Buffalonians so much he made it all, but impossible to move the team with the sale of it to Pegulas.  He also in his will with Mrs. Wilson’s approval set up foundations in Detroit and Buffalo for the $1.4 bil. For the sale.  Tell me Jerrah or that tool in Washington would do that upon his death.

 

Youre probably going to read a lot

more as you have several historians on this board who know the great things tje Wilson’s did for Buffalo.

 

He was cheap and meddling and held us back in many ways, but to say Bills fans don’t know the history or don’t appreciate anything about the Bills is not accurate.

Edited July 11, 2021 by machine gun kelly

[eSJayDee]

1st, as a philanthropist, I think Ralph was worthy of acclaim & reverence.  As an owner, let's just say he was a good business man.

I'd further like to point out, that when the AFL was forming, the 1950 census had Buffalo as like the 11th largest city in the country.  So, short of predicting New Yorks general economic & population decline, of unoccupied choices, at the time, it seemed like a prudent choice.

[Beast]

Always thankful for Ralph. I cursed his name many times but I have a hometown football team to root for because of the man. (and the Pegula's)

Edited July 11, 2021 by Beast

[Rico]

1 hour ago, Chandler#81 said:

??😳 

I don’t know of anyone here who’s old enough to personally know the history of the team, that doesn’t appreciate Ralphs’ commitment to WNY. But the warts are plenty.

*Routinely threatened to move the team

*Consistent meddling in the team operation with disastrous results

*Put friends in high places with little to no experience-including Head Coach!

*Notoriously cheap in contract negotiations 

 

Ralph, more than any one person, was singularly responsible for at least 30 years of terrible, often embarrassing football. At the root of it all, he wanted to own the Lions. (See our original uniforms) Under the gun to name a host city by Lamar Hunt, his Miami preference fell through and we were his default position. He never called Buffalo home and never wanted to. Yes, he was charitable. He was instrumental ($$) in keeping the AFL afloat. He brought us The Bills! He made sure the team would stay here following his death. For these actions alone, he’s a positive part of the WNY story. But the ‘Good’ legacy ends there.

 

I don’t miss him.

Can you please pin this post to the top of this board? 

[WIDE LEFT]

I never understand the concept of giving thanks & praise to Wilson for “keeping” the Bills in Buffalo. His $25,000 investment in the Bills turned into  a billion dollar + financial bonanza for him. Isn’t that thanks enough. So many people have done so much more and received far far less in financial award for their efforts & sacrifice. One of the cheapest, most meddlesome owners in NFL history reaped much more than he deserved.

[TroutDog]

Any negativity isn’t a knock on the man, it’s a knock on the owner. The simple fact is, Ralph was not a very good owner. 
 

As mentioned, he did some great things for the game but for the Bills it was too few and far between. 

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

Sure lost a lot of football games

[Victory Formation]

I think he should be honored for keeping the team in Buffalo, but I think many folks had an axe to grind with him because he seemingly cared more about money and not winning. Most of us were simply grateful to have a team, regardless of whether we were contenders or not. It is true that we were perennial losers under him, but all in all, I do think Terry is a better owner, but I must also acknowledge that without Ralph there is no Bills. 

[SoCal Deek]

I’ve been a Bills fan since almost the very beginning. I can understand some of the Ralph frustration but I’ve always put it in perspective. He was extremely loyal to WNY, and that above all else is really all that matters. He started a tiny minor league club in a run down rust belt City with no idea that just ten years later he’d own an NFL franchise worth many millions. He loved football and loved the idea he could own a team. Unfortunately the financial aspect of an area like WNY is somewhat land locked and shifting demographics through the years made it much worse (thank god for revenue sharing). Just about any other owner picks the team up and moves to ‘greener’ pastures. If not for Ralph Wilson this team would no longer be the Buffalo Bills….period.

Edited July 11, 2021 by SoCal Deek

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

2 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

*Routinely threatened to move the team

*Consistent meddling in the team operation with disastrous results

*Put friends in high places with little to no experience-including Head Coach!

*Notoriously cheap in contract negotiations

—— Hoodwinker 

Brought in Doug Flutie to entice Canadians to fill the seat in OP. 
 

The Little Engine That Could! already had a solid “localized” fan base. 

—— what wasn’t there to be excited about?

 

Todd Collins, Billy Joe Hobert, Billy Joe Tolliver and Alex VanPelt and then there was Rob Johnson 
l liked Dough Boy AVP but he was a solid #2  at best. 

 

 

Long Live the Chroise!!!!

[Charles Romes]

The poison pill he created to save the team at a cost of half a $B to his family will not be forgotten. 

[Mr. WEO]

Ralph didn't want Buffalo.  He wanted to start an AFL team in Miami but Hunt turned him down.  Hunt wanted Pat McGroder, the guy who actually was trying to get an NFL team to Buffalo for years, to own an AFL franchise in Buffalo.  McGroder balked because he really wanted an NFL team and figured the threat of a rival league would convince the NFL to put a team in Buff.  The NFL didn't.  So McGroder and Ralph got together and formed the AFL Bills.

 

This sums it up:

 

"O. J. Simpson later noted of his contract negotiations with the Bills that when Simpson's agent told Wilson of Simpson's potential to make the team a championship contender, Wilson shot back "What good would a championship do me? All that means is everybody wants a raise."

 

 

[Patrick Duffy]

As I became a big fan in the mid-late 80's, A part of RW legacy to me will always be the 4 Super Bowl appearances I guess, then kinda jjust went down hill from there. Always thankful for him though for everything he did with putting the team in Buffalo.

Edited July 11, 2021 by Patrick_Duffy

[PromoTheRobot]

Stop at Tony Packo's and grab two Hungarians and a side of pierogis for me.

[WhoTom]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

"O. J. Simpson later noted of his contract negotiations with the Bills that when Simpson's agent told Wilson of Simpson's potential to make the team a championship contender, Wilson shot back "What good would a championship do me? All that means is everybody wants a raise."

 

I don't think of OJ as a reliable source.

 

 

[Patrick Duffy]

8 minutes ago, WhoTom said:

 

I don't think of OJ as a reliable source.

 

 

Lol, yeah but would it surprise you much if Ralph did say something like that? Or could you potentially see him possibly saying something like that?

[Virgil]

6 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

??😳 

I don’t know of anyone here who’s old enough to personally know the history of the team, that doesn’t appreciate Ralphs’ commitment to WNY. But the warts are plenty.

*Routinely threatened to move the team

*Consistent meddling in the team operation with disastrous results

*Put friends in high places with little to no experience-including Head Coach!

*Notoriously cheap in contract negotiations 

 

Ralph, more than any one person, was singularly responsible for at least 30 years of terrible, often embarrassing football. At the root of it all, he wanted to own the Lions. (See our original uniforms) Under the gun to name a host city by Lamar Hunt, his Miami preference fell through and we were his default position. He never called Buffalo home and never wanted to. Yes, he was charitable. He was instrumental ($$) in keeping the AFL afloat. He brought us The Bills! He made sure the team would stay here following his death. For these actions alone, he’s a positive part of the WNY story. But the ‘Good’ legacy ends there.

 

I don’t miss him.

I’ll have you know that I’m 173 years old. Please don’t assume my age.  
 

You kids are all the same with your Nintendo’s and sugar cereals 

[WhoTom]

10 minutes ago, Patrick_Duffy said:

Lol, yeah but would it surprise you much if Ralph did say something like that? Or could you potentially see him possibly saying something like that?

 

I suppose it's possible, but I'd believe it more if it came from a reliable source.

 

I also think the "Ralph was cheap" mantra is overblown. Unlike the owners who were uber-wealthy before buying their respective teams, most of Ralph's fortune was the team itself. He couldn't simply "drill another well" in order to pay top dollar for personnel.

 

 

 

[Patrick Duffy]

2 minutes ago, WhoTom said:

 

I suppose it's possible, but I'd believe it more if it came from a reliable source.

 

I also think the "Ralph was cheap" mantra is overblown. Unlike the owners who were uber-wealthy before buying their respective teams, most of Ralph's fortune was the team itself. He couldn't simply "drill another well" in order to pay top dollar for personnel.

 

 

 

Yeah I remember hearing the "Ralph is cheap" stuff the most I think during the early drought time when he was still around back then. Not sure how much was his doing, or the GM's, or even R. Brandon (heard his name a lot) at that time. I guess all of em had a part in one way or other. Whatever the case, it was clearly a very poorly ran franchise for a good while.

[BillnutinHouston]

4 hours ago, Charles Romes said:

The poison pill he created to save the team at a cost of half a $B to his family will not be forgotten. 

 

This, plus his foundation gifts were incredibly generous to WNY.

[Punching Bag]

6 hours ago, 2020 Our Year For Sure said:

Sure lost a lot of football games

 

Every one he played in, same as you.

1 hour ago, Patrick_Duffy said:

Lol, yeah but would it surprise you much if Ralph did say something like that? Or could you potentially see him possibly saying something like that?

 

Would not be surprised to see some posters and one reporter in particular to make such a thing up.

[Patrick Duffy]

11 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

Would not be surprised to see some posters and one reporter in particular to make such a thing up

Where did the "Ralph is cheap" come from anyway? I mean was it something that a few fans started to say and it spread from there? I guess it had to be because Hard for me to think the any reporter from the media would say something like that. 

[Mikie2times]

2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Stop at Tony Packo's and grab two Hungarians and a side of pierogis for me.

You got it!

[BillStime]

You take the good, you take the bad,
You take them both and there you have the facts of life, the facts of life.

 

Thanks Ralph

[longtimebillsfan]

9 hours ago, KzooMike said:

As I sit here in what I consider to be the arm pit of Ohio, Toledo, a city of 276k, packed with probably as many restaurants as it has citizens. Median household income of 37k. How is that even possible? Then I look at Buffalo and go figure, exact same population and exact same median income. I also understand like any city outlying suburbs have more money. About double the median income, again, no different than Toledo. I also understand the impacts of Buffalo having Rochester, Syracuse, and Toronto close by. Toledo is blocked by the Lions about an hour north, Cleveland an hour and half east, but you aren't getting near a pro football team anywhere inside an hours drive. Again, not all that different on distance compared to the outside populations that support the Bills. This is probably the biggest edge Buffalo has in a debate of why they should have a pro football team vs a city like Toledo that is so similar. 

 

I'm 30 years into this, like Ralph, from the Detroit area. I understand Ralph was a cheap and meddling owner and he drove us bat crazy. That said, I don't think I have read one positive post about Ralph Wilson since Terry grabbed the torch. I don't see Bills fans as thankful for what Ralph gave us and that's not what I have come to associate myself with in being a Bills fan. We are a die hard, loyal, appreciative group.

 

Can we start appreciating Ralph for what he did and not the things he failed at doing? If the NFL picked a location for each team starting anew, Buffalo isn't on the list. They aren't even on the 2nd list. Ralph put Buffalo on the list and he kept us there. I don't care about the ways he failed. What he did for WNY is special and it should always be considered special. 

Ralph took a chance on Buffalo back in 1960.  He is also very instrumental in the success of th e AFL and th we merger with the NFL.  He gave s lone to AL Davis to make his payroll in the early 1960s.

 

He could be frustrating, but under his ownership we went to four consecutive superbowls.

 

Thank you Ralph for giving us the opportunity have our own Professional Football team and exoerience a life long passion that is the Buffalo Bills!

[Mikie2times]

Some really good responses. I understand the polarizing nature of all of it. Some of you just know more about Ralph and the story than I do. All I know, even not being a WNY native, if the team ever left Buffalo it would be over for me. I'm just very thankful that we have our team. 

[Punching Bag]

15 minutes ago, Patrick_Duffy said:

Where did the "Ralph is cheap" come from anyway? I mean was it something that a few fans started to say and it spread from there? I guess it had to be because Hard for me to think the any reporter from the media would say something like that. 

 

First time I remember hearing it was from an agent as quote in news article.

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, WhoTom said:

 

I don't think of OJ as a reliable source.

 

 

Yeah.  No way Ralph would have said something like that right??

 

lol

36 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

Every one he played in, same as you.

 

Would not be surprised to see some posters and one reporter in particular to make such a thing up.

link?

[oldmanfan]

8 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

??😳 

I don’t know of anyone here who’s old enough to personally know the history of the team, that doesn’t appreciate Ralphs’ commitment to WNY. But the warts are plenty.

*Routinely threatened to move the team

*Consistent meddling in the team operation with disastrous results

*Put friends in high places with little to no experience-including Head Coach!

*Notoriously cheap in contract negotiations 

 

Ralph, more than any one person, was singularly responsible for at least 30 years of terrible, often embarrassing football. At the root of it all, he wanted to own the Lions. (See our original uniforms) Under the gun to name a host city by Lamar Hunt, his Miami preference fell through and we were his default position. He never called Buffalo home and never wanted to. Yes, he was charitable. He was instrumental ($$) in keeping the AFL afloat. He brought us The Bills! He made sure the team would stay here following his death. For these actions alone, he’s a positive part of the WNY story. But the ‘Good’ legacy ends there.

 

I don’t miss him.

I am.  Yes, Ralph had warts as an owner.  Later in life it was because he let Litman have too much say.  But Buffalo is a major league city because of him.  As you say, he kept the AFL afloat, and the number of charities in WNY that benefitted and continue to benefit from him are many.  And  without Ralph negotiating the merger may not have occurred, and for sure the lucrative TV deals that ultimately over the years have made both owners and players rich would not have happened without Ralph.

 

No, he did not choose to live full time in WNY, but he is in the top three most important individuals in the history of the region.  God bless his memory.

[NoHuddleKelly12]

28 minutes ago, Patrick_Duffy said:

Where did the "Ralph is cheap" come from anyway? I mean was it something that a few fans started to say and it spread from there? I guess it had to be because Hard for me to think the any reporter from the media would say something like that. 

Despite his cheapness, somehow Kelly became the highest paid QB/player in the league when he finally signed his deal in ‘86…

 

“Mr. Wilson alluded to the fact that he’s sometimes called cheap and he’s sometimes castigated for not doing what he can to build a championship team,” General Manager Bill Polian said. “The fact that Jim is sitting here to my left is an enduring monument to Ralph Wilson’s commitment to building a winner for the city of Buffalo.”
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1986-08-19-sp-16974-story.html

[BADOLBILZ]

 

Ralph doesn't need anymore props..........he stashed away $20M-$30M per year at the expense of the roster during most of the drought to fund his expected inheritance tax for his family.    He couldn't get good help in the front office or in the coaching staff for the last decade because of the LONG record of bad treatment and meddling with the likes of Knox, Polian, Butler and Phillips in the past.    He was always mercurial but he and Littman basically stole from a generation of Bills fans and our kids during that drought.......and then the value of the franchise exploded and thanks to Pegula paying top dollar all those ill-gotten gains from the drought could be put into his charitable foundation to make him look like a saint.    The foundation does great work,  that's where he gets his props and it will likely be operating long after everyone whose expense it was funded at is long gone.    But Ralph deserves props from Bills fans in the same way that Bills fans deserve to be listed as co-founders of his foundation.      

[clearwater cadet]

9 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

??😳 

I don’t know of anyone here who’s old enough to personally know the history of the team, that doesn’t appreciate Ralphs’ commitment to WNY. But the warts are plenty.

*Routinely threatened to move the team

*Consistent meddling in the team operation with disastrous results

*Put friends in high places with little to no experience-including Head Coach!

*Notoriously cheap in contract negotiations 

 

Ralph, more than any one person, was singularly responsible for at least 30 years of terrible, often embarrassing football. At the root of it all, he wanted to own the Lions. (See our original uniforms) Under the gun to name a host city by Lamar Hunt, his Miami preference fell through and we were his default position. He never called Buffalo home and never wanted to. Yes, he was charitable. He was instrumental ($$) in keeping the AFL afloat. He brought us The Bills! He made sure the team would stay here following his death. For these actions alone, he’s a positive part of the WNY story. But the ‘Good’ legacy ends there.

 

I 

I agree with you, but I believe he was planning to sell the team to Ted Rodgers and move them to Toronto at the time of his death, the only thing that stopped that is Ted died before Ralph at a much younger age.  I don't miss Ralph either and this constant reminders of the competitive disadvantage that come with owning a team in WNY.

[Buffalo716]

47 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

Despite his cheapness, somehow Kelly became the highest paid QB/player in the league when he finally signed his deal in ‘86…

 

“Mr. Wilson alluded to the fact that he’s sometimes called cheap and he’s sometimes castigated for not doing what he can to build a championship team,” General Manager Bill Polian said. “The fact that Jim is sitting here to my left is an enduring monument to Ralph Wilson’s commitment to building a winner for the city of Buffalo.”
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1986-08-19-sp-16974-story.html

Mr Wilson made OJ Simpson the highest player in the NFL. Jim Kelly the highest paid player in the NFL

 

The '90s bills were called the million dollar bills

 

He gave Mario Williams the largest defensive contract in NFL history

 

He gave Marcel Darius a hundred million dollars

 

he wasn't cheap.  He just spent his money on the wrong people over 40 years for the most part

[BADOLBILZ]

34 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Mr Wilson made OJ Simpson the highest player in the NFL. Jim Kelly the highest paid player in the NFL

 

The '90s bills were called the million dollar bills

 

He gave Mario Williams the largest defensive contract in NFL history

 

He gave Marcel Darius a hundred million dollars

 

he wasn't cheap.  He just spent his money on the wrong people over 40 years for the most part

 

 

Pegula gave Dareus the big contract.    Dareus' agent Todd France was a former Pegula-owned company employee.........which is how Marcel got the sweet terms that didn't penalize him for misconduct.    

 

I gotta' make a point on that because there is no way Wilson's shrewed lieutenant J. Littman leaves Ralph that exposed.  

 

 

[Buffalo716]

Just now, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Pegula gave Dareus the big contract.    Dareus' agent Todd France was a former Pegula-owned company employee.........which is how Marcel got the sweet terms that didn't penalize him for misconduct.    

 

I gotta' make a point on that because there is no way Wilson's shrewed lieutenant J. Littman leaves Ralph that exposed.  

 

 

At this point it's literally been like over half a decade, and it was right on the cusp so I forgot who was the owner at that time 

 

I'll do one replacement 

 

In the early 2000s Ralph Wilson made Derek dockery the highest paid guard in the NFL

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

At this point it's literally been like over half a decade, and it was right on the cusp so I forgot who was the owner at that time 

 

I'll do one replacement 

 

In the early 2000s Ralph Wilson made Derek dockery the highest paid guard in the NFL

 

Yeah,  the Dareus mistake was egregious though.........he had earned that big contract.........the problem with that deal was solely not having strong punitive clauses for misconduct for a repeat offender.    NO WAY Ralph and Littman let that contract happen.    That was a careless rookie owner mistake.

 

Ralph wasn't "cheap" by nature he was "mercurial" by nature..........which periodically included penny pinching tactics like "cash to the cap" as an excuse to horde cash during the drought.