A Lot of Bills stars Were at OTA's But 1 Star Was Not .

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Just for perspective, list of players not seen on field by media:

 

The player missing that I'm actually most surprised by is Devin Singletary.

 

Notable that another DT and two vet DEs aren't there either.  Considering they were supposedly all eager to work with our new DE draftees that's a bit disappointing to me.

[TBBills]

3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Just for perspective, list of players not seen on field by media:

 

The player missing that I'm actually most surprised by is Devin Singletary.

 

Notable that another DT and two vet DEs aren't there either.  Considering they were supposedly all eager to work with our new DE draftees that's a bit disappointing to me.

So basically like most teams vets they weren't needed to be here.  Bucs Bruce Arians said it best to the vets "don't not be here"

Edited May 26, 2021 by TBBills

[Jauronimo]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Don't you roll your eyes at him.  I spent ten minutes watching some vapid chick boil a tennis ball, glue googly eyes to it, and shove her car keys into it because you shared it on facebook and 24 hours later I am still furious!  You are in no position to judge.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

 

 

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

17 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

Don't you roll your eyes at him.  I spent ten minutes watching some vapid chick boil a tennis ball, glue googly eyes to it, and shove her car keys into it because you shared it on facebook and 24 hours later I am still furious!  You are in no position to judge.

 

What the?  I just wrote "weird" in the comments section...it shared it?  Do you have Zuckerberg's contact info?

[Boxcar]

56 minutes ago, wppete said:

Time to give Star his permanent walking papers. Would like to see some of the Younger guys get an opportunity.

Can't. His contract is so bad that the Bills take a bigger cap hit if he retires or gets cut than if he plays. And no one is trading for him.

[wppete]

1 minute ago, Boxcar said:

Can't. His contract is so bad that the Bills take a bigger cap hit if he retires or gets cut than if he plays. And no one is trading for him.

That sucks. I thought this was the year we could get out of that contract. 

[Jauronimo]

8 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

What the?  I just wrote "weird" in the comments section...it shared it?  Do you have Zuckerberg's contact info?

Maybe it wasn't a share but you are the reason it popped up on my feed and I watched it and now I am worse for having seen it.

[atlbillsfan1975]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

"cardiac issue" is a pretty broad definition.   I think virtually every older OL and interior DL player has underlying medical conditions.    Almost all of them played thru them.  

 

I'm not saying that Star isn't one cheeseburger away from a heart attack but having his salary fully guaranteed whether he played or not AND then getting an extra free $350K to stay home would financially motivate A LOT of older players that have just been forced to take a pay cut to stay home.    The writing was on the wall.   This was probably his last NFL paycheck.

 

Also, fwiw I really don't think him not being here for volunataries is a sign of anything.    I suspect he will suck or not play for the Bills at all this season,  but 10 year vets often don't show for these things.   He has the least complex job on the entire defense and this isn't a new install...........even if he didn't suck he wouldn't need to be at this OTA.   

This made me laugh and impressed me for the way you straddle the fence while getting in jabs and also logically reasoning. Kudos. 

[first_and_ten]

2 hours ago, Patrick_Duffy said:

Yes, I believe there was a thread about this earlier that said ,"cut his fat ass" .

 

This wish may come true

[Might Rather]

2 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

You’re either of the mindset to get back to work/school/normal or not. 

The word lazy comes to mind for the people who are not.

[BillsfaninSB]

I wish Star was there.  It would have made for better optics.  Even if he just stretched and rode a stationary bicycle from time to time.  But lots of vets skip these things all across the league so I’m not too worried about it. 

[Motorin']

5 minutes ago, BillsfaninSB said:

I wish Star was there.  It would have made for better optics.  Even if he just stretched and rode a stationary bicycle from time to time.  But lots of vets skip these things all across the league so I’m not too worried about it. 

 

I'll start worrying when he shows up to camp vastly out of playing shape. Or doesn't show up to camp at all. 

[BarleyNY]

Star threw it in neutral and has coasted since he signed that big contract with the Bills in 2018.  $27M for poor play and effort so far.  He has another $4.5M in salary this season and $2.5M next - all fully guaranteed.  He also could get up to $250k this season in active roster bonuses and would be getting an additional $250k if he’d bothered to show up to the voluntary workouts going on now.  Similar bonuses are available next season but I doubt he’s here then.  SMDH 

[Inigo Montoya]

Here is Star's contract summary. 

 

https://overthecap.com/player/star-lotulelei/2282/

 

I don't pretend to be an expert on reading these things but a couple things stand out to me.  The first is that the Bills take a huge cap hit if they cut Star this year.  If they cut him during the next two years of his contract the cap hit is manageable.  The second thing that strikes me about his contract is that this season is the last year he is owed any guaranteed salary.  After this year he is not guaranteed any salary.  He does get a part of his prorated signing bonus.  I'm not sure how that signing bonus would be effected if this ended up being his last year in Buffalo.

 

My take away is that there is a good chance that this is Star's last year on the Bills. His salary of $4.5 million is fully guaranteed this year whether he steps foot on the field or not.  Star could show up out of shape and never play a single snap this season and it won't cost him a dime.  I think that is what the Bills are worried about and I think they would like to see Star and get a sense of where his mind is.   I think that is why McDermott seemed irked about the Star no show.

 

I may be wrong on my contract interpretation, if some of you money ball guys get a different sense, please share.

 

 

Edited May 26, 2021 by Inigo Montoya

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

16 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Here is Star's contract summary. 

 

https://overthecap.com/player/star-lotulelei/2282/

 

I don't pretend to be an expert on reading these things but a couple things stand out to me.  The first is that the Bills take a huge cap hit if they cut Star this year.  If they cut him during the next two years of his contract the cap hit is manageable.  The second thing that strikes me about his contract is that this season is the last year he is owed any guaranteed salary.  After this year he is not guaranteed any salary.  He does get a part of his prorated signing bonus.  I'm not sure how that signing bonus would be effected if this ended up being his last year in Buffalo.

 

My take away is that there is a good chance that this is Star's last year on the Bills. His salary of $4.5 million is fully guaranteed this year whether he steps foot on the field or not.  Star could show up out of shape and never play a single snap this season and it won't cost him a dime.  I think that is what the Bills are worried about and I think they would like to see Star and get a sense of where his mind is.   I think that is why McDermott seemed irked about the Star no show.

 

I may be wrong on my contract interpretation, if some of you money ball guys get a different sense, please share.

 

 

 

Basically we spread salary into guarantee's to 2021 and 2022.  Then he opted out of 2020, so everything essentially pushes back.  

 

He'll be here this year, and honestly I'm not super worried about it because the team needs him on early downs.

[Putin]

2 hours ago, uninja said:

I love how Star has literally done nothing this year so far and he's already the whipping post on this board. Man just can't catch a break 🤣

Are you kidding we haven’t even started with his fat ass 

[Shaw66]

I, too, would have thought he would show up, but I'm not worried about.  

 

McDermott isn't keeping score on such things, at least not yet.   He has a football team to run, and besides all the usual things he has to do, he has to manage the ongoing COVID rules.  

 

When mandatory training starts, the scorecard comes out.  Star not there for mandatory work would be a real issue. 

[first_and_ten]

39 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

I'll start worrying when he shows up to camp vastly out of playing shape. Or doesn't show up to camp at all. 

 

Then he gets cut

[Inigo Montoya]

2 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

Basically we spread salary into guarantee's to 2021 and 2022.  Then he opted out of 2020, so everything essentially pushes back.  

 

He'll be here this year, and honestly I'm not super worried about it because the team needs him on early downs.

 

Thanks for the interpretation.

 

I know the Bills want him, I think the worry is that Star may not want to play football anymore after taking a year off.  His money is guaranteed this year whether he plays or not, and he wouldn't lose very much money if he decides to hang up his cleats after this year.  He can show up at training camp out of game shape and never play a single snap all season and the Bills are still going to pay him $4.5 million.  With his cap numbers the Bills are not going to cut him. This year's guaranteed salary of $4.5 million is the last big chunk of money he is going to make in his career. 

 

I suspect the Bills have reached out to him about how he is doing and he either hasn't responded, or he has responded and the Bills have some reason to worry about his state of mind, and that is why they want him in OTAs to get a sense of where he is at.

 

 

[msw2112]

I'm surprised that Sanders didn't show up.  You'd think he'd be anxious to meet his new teammates and start learning the offense.

[first_and_ten]

28 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Here is Star's contract summary. 

 

https://overthecap.com/player/star-lotulelei/2282/

 

I don't pretend to be an expert on reading these things but a couple things stand out to me.  The first is that the Bills take a huge cap hit if they cut Star this year.  If they cut him during the next two years of his contract the cap hit is manageable.  The second thing that strikes me about his contract is that this season is the last year he is owed any guaranteed salary.  After this year he is not guaranteed any salary.  He does get a part of his prorated signing bonus.  I'm not sure how that signing bonus would be effected if this ended up being his last year in Buffalo.

 

My take away is that there is a good chance that this is Star's last year on the Bills. His salary of $4.5 million is fully guaranteed this year whether he steps foot on the field or not.  Star could show up out of shape and never play a single snap this season and it won't cost him a dime.  I think that is what the Bills are worried about and I think they would like to see Star and get a sense of where his mind is.   I think that is why McDermott seemed irked about the Star no show.

 

I may be wrong on my contract interpretation, if some of you money ball guys get a different sense, please share.

 

28 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

 

29 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Here is Star's contract summary. 

 

https://overthecap.com/player/star-lotulelei/2282/

 

I don't pretend to be an expert on reading these things but a couple things stand out to me.  The first is that the Bills take a huge cap hit if they cut Star this year.  If they cut him during the next two years of his contract the cap hit is manageable.  The second thing that strikes me about his contract is that this season is the last year he is owed any guaranteed salary.  After this year he is not guaranteed any salary.  He does get a part of his prorated signing bonus.  I'm not sure how that signing bonus would be effected if this ended up being his last year in Buffalo.

 

My take away is that there is a good chance that this is Star's last year on the Bills. His salary of $4.5 million is fully guaranteed this year whether he steps foot on the field or not.  Star could show up out of shape and never play a single snap this season and it won't cost him a dime.  I think that is what the Bills are worried about and I think they would like to see Star and get a sense of where his mind is.   I think that is why McDermott seemed irked about the Star no show.

 

I may be wrong on my contract interpretation, if some of you money ball guys get a different sense, please share.

 

 

 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

4 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

Thanks for the interpretation.

 

I know the Bills want him, I think the worry is that Star may not want to play football anymore after taking a year off.  His money is guaranteed this year whether he plays or not, and he wouldn't lose very much money if he decides to hang up his cleats after this year.  He can show up at training camp out of game shape and never play a single snap all season and the Bills are still going to pay him $4.5 million.  With his cap numbers the Bills are not going to cut him. This year's guaranteed salary of $4.5 million is the last big chunk of money he is going to make in his career. 

 

I suspect the Bills have reached out to him about how he is doing and he either hasn't responded, or he has responded and the Bills have some reason to worry about his state of mind, and that is why they want him in OTAs to get a sense of where he is at.

 

 

 

If he hangs them up they can get the bonus money back.  He's not going to just show up and play bad on purpose - he's either in or out.  These are professional football players.

[H2o]

This is Star's last year in Buffalo, maybe even football altogether. Hopefully he shows up ready to contribute. He will not be cut this year though because of his cap number. Nothing to see here unless he dips out on mandatory mini camp. 

[BarleyNY]

32 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Here is Star's contract summary. 

 

https://overthecap.com/player/star-lotulelei/2282/

 

I don't pretend to be an expert on reading these things but a couple things stand out to me.  The first is that the Bills take a huge cap hit if they cut Star this year.  If they cut him during the next two years of his contract the cap hit is manageable.  The second thing that strikes me about his contract is that this season is the last year he is owed any guaranteed salary.  After this year he is not guaranteed any salary.  He does get a part of his prorated signing bonus.  I'm not sure how that signing bonus would be effected if this ended up being his last year in Buffalo.

 

My take away is that there is a good chance that this is Star's last year on the Bills. His salary of $4.5 million is fully guaranteed this year whether he steps foot on the field or not.  Star could show up out of shape and never play a single snap this season and it won't cost him a dime.  I think that is what the Bills are worried about and I think they would like to see Star and get a sense of where his mind is.   I think that is why McDermott seemed irked about the Star no show.

 

I may be wrong on my contract interpretation, if some of you money ball guys get a different sense, please share.

 

 

That’s pretty much it.  This year’s salary of $4.5M and a portion of his salary in 2022 ($2.5M of $6.15M) are guaranteed.  The only way he gets cut this offseason is if he brings nothing at all to the table and they don’t want him around.  In that case he would be a post June 1st cut (or designated as such).  Much more likely is what you stated - he gets cut next offseason.

[BADOLBILZ]

 

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

You just can't resist taking a personal shot at me, can you?

 

 

Yeah,  that was a REAL low blow making light of you shutting down a thread that everyone knew was going to get shut down by someone.

 

Either that or a missed opportunity for you to have a sense of humor about a situation with a controversial player that everyone knew was going to come to a head at some point.

 

People make excuses for a player based often on faith in them..........and then when it starts looking like that faith wasn't warranted........THEN they get upset.    

 

This is the beginning of THEN.

 

13 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

The only way he gets cut this offseason is if he brings nothing at all to the table and they don’t want him around.  In that case he would be a post June 1st cut (or designated as such).  Much more likely is what you stated - he gets cut next offseason.

 

Based on McD actually addressing the situation with a negative...........I'd say not wanting him around is an option.

 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yeah,  that was a REAL low blow making light of you shutting down a thread that everyone knew was going to get shut down by someone.

 

Either that or a missed opportunity for you to have a sense of humor about a situation with a controversial player that everyone knew was going to come to a head at some point.

 

People make excuses for a player based often on faith in them..........and then when it starts looking like that faith wasn't warranted........THEN they get upset.    

 

This is the beginning of THEN.

 

The point is more that your opinion of Lotulelei is well known. 

[Punching Bag]

2 hours ago, wppete said:

Yea I wouldn’t mind that either. Move that $$$ to more productive players. 

 

Same thing you were told in other thread - when he restructured contract with cut at request of OBD he received guarantees. 

 

Some need this as their avatar for they keep opening threads based on false premises like swapping getting another player by cutting Star to get the money.

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/28681240/source-bills-rework-final-three-years-star-lotulelei-contract

Quote

Originally signed to a five-year, $50 million contract in 2018, Lotulelei will now earn a fully guaranteed base salary of $4.5 million in 2020 with up to $1 million in roster and workout bonuses.

He will receive a $6.15 million base salary in 2021 with up to $600,000 in bonuses and a $4.6 million base salary with up to $1.75 million in bonuses in 2022.

 

[Rochesterfan]

On 5/26/2021 at 8:39 AM, T master said:

I read a piece today on those that didn't show up for voluntary OTA's and i realize it is "Voluntary" and in some instances i get it once the team activities start these guys have to spend time away from their family and get at the grind of the season, some are healing from off season surgeries or just clearing their heads getting ready for the season .

 

But I'm wondering about those like the Bills Star L. that has had a entire year off why wouldn't he be back just to get back in a flow ? In some small way it makes me question his motivation .

 

I also wonder did those that opted out last season still get paid ? I believe there must have been some compensation ( but making the cash they do we all could take a yr off & it wouldn't hurt the old checking acct.) wasn't their cap hit moved to this year and what were some of the other things with opting out i'm definitely not p on all that stuff .

 

But after sitting all last season watching the Bills Kick A** & take names being AFC east champs but not participating i for one would think that Star would be chomping at the bit to get back with the team but actions speak louder than words !!

 

I could see Diggs taking some time he played injured towards the end of the season and i in no way do i doubt he will be ready & all in when he is fully recovered from the surgery he had this off season so i will give him a pass along with Hughes and some others but just from the outside looking in i would think Star would be one that would want to get back with his mates to play some ball again .

 

Look - it is fun and easy to bash his decision, but has anyone heard why he made his decision?  
 

The fact that based upon some Bills reporters - the Bills are currently at 10% vaccination rate maybe drove part of his decision?  I don’t know, but if you were concerned enough to sit out because of the health risks and potential effect and you do a little bit of research and see that even vaccinated people with high risk (especially those with slightly suppressed immune responses) can get infected/re-infected and then you research the impact on healthy athletes in your sport - guys like Cam, Garrett, Tommy Sweeney, and Miller that all missed time and some had severe complications - maybe you still take a more cautious approach.

 

Maybe he is waiting for further guidance and a higher compliance rate before returning.  Maybe he is waiting to see if the NFLPA will provide additional guidance or maybe he is following the NFLPA guidance he has been given - which was for all athletes was to not attend OTAs due to COVID risk.

 

Maybe he is just a fat tub and wants his money without doing anything?

 

I don’t know his reasoning and you don’t know his reasoning and it is really unfair and in totally bad taste to single him out and say he does not want to be here or question his motivation.  
 

He was given a stipend last year to sit out and it was a tiny fraction of his salary and a portion must be paid back with his salary this year.

 

I don’t know what is driving his motivation and I don’t know what discussions he has had with the NFLPA and or team, but those are his decisions and he is within his rights to not attend until he is comfortable.

Edited May 30, 2021 by Rochesterfan

[Punching Bag]

26 minutes ago, msw2112 said:

I'm surprised that Sanders didn't show up.  You'd think he'd be anxious to meet his new teammates and start learning the offense.

 

For some players it is possible they have other things scheduled prior to when Bills OTAs were scheduled.

[wppete]

2 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

Same thing you were told in other thread - when he restructured contract with cut at request of OBD he received guarantees. 

 

Some need this as their avatar for they keep opening threads based on false premises like swapping getting another player by cutting Star to get the money.

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/28681240/source-bills-rework-final-three-years-star-lotulelei-contract

 

[BADOLBILZ]

5 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

The point is more that your opinion of Lotulelei is well known. 

 

 

No...........in fact, nothing in @Hapless Bills Fan response said anything about that.

 

However.........you should join the "open a thread about a subject and complain about that subject matter being discussed again in that thread club" with @NewEra.  (I kid NewEra, I kid)

[first_and_ten]

Maybe Star is thinking about retirement?

[Malazan]

It's amazing how much less interest there is in ejecting Tremaine Edmunds from the team at all costs now that Star is back. 

Edited May 26, 2021 by jeremy2020

[first_and_ten]

1 minute ago, jeremy2020 said:

It's amazing how much less interest there is in ejecting Tremaine Edmunds from the team at all costs now that Star is back. 

 

Was there ever interest in ejecting Edmunds from the team?

[Malazan]

Just now, first_and_ten said:

Was there ever interest in ejecting Edmunds from the team?

 

You must not have been around the last several months. 

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Not true.  He had an ECHO before the draft that showed a transient drop to 44%.  A repeat ECHO showed normal EF.   In fact he had no symptoms of heart failure/disease at the time---it was a screening ECHO.  They assumed a viral infection.   It is certainly possible that his initial ECHO result was erroneous (not uncommon in transthoracic studies on people that big) and that he had no cardiac disease at all.

 

This guy has no good reason not to be at these workouts, unless he's done with football.

 

 

 

 

Why are you immune to the wrath of @Royale with Cheese?

 

He's frickin' demanding I provide data that proves fat people are more at risk for heart disease.............if he asks me to prove that water is wet I might need your help.

[first_and_ten]

17 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said:

 

You must not have been around the last several months. 

 

I know you're being sarcastic, but the fact is,  I have not been due to illness. Why would anyone think the Bills are better off without Edmunds?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

52 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

I know the Bills want him, I think the worry is that Star may not want to play football anymore after taking a year off.  His money is guaranteed this year whether he plays or not

 

I don't think that's true. 

The contract does hold that players need to show up for certain things - mandatory workouts, mandatory training camp, meetings, games.  He can lose salary and be fined.  He can be asked to return amortized signing bonus for the games he doesn't play.

 

As far as I know.  Contracts are guaranteed for injury and sometimes skill, but not for "I ain't gonna show up, and pay me regardless".  That would be nuts.

 

This is regarding Watson, but would seem to apply to any player:

Quote

If Watson doesn’t show up -- to either format -- he would be fined $95,877 for missing Houston’s mandatory minicamp, according to ESPN’s Adam Schefter.

Quote

The Texans could fine Watson up to $50,000 for each day of training camp missed, plus one week's salary -- $620,000 -- for each preseason game he misses.
 

What’s different about this than in past years is under the new CBA fines cannot be forgiven. If Watson missed mandatory minicamp ($95,877), 28 days of training camp ($1.4 million) and three preseason games ($1.86 million), he could be looking at being fined more than $3.3 million, and that’s before we get to the regular season.

If Watson sits out the entire season, his contract would essentially freeze and he obviously would not be paid for the season.

If Watson retires, the guaranteed money in Watson’s salary would count against the cap, but Houston could also choose to go after the money. For example, when quarterback Andrew Luck retired in 2019, he and the Indianapolis Colts reached a settlement, where the team chose not to recoup $24.8 million from its former quarterback

 

 

[BarleyNY]

5 minutes ago, first_and_ten said:

 

I know you're being sarcastic, but the fact is,  I have not been due to illness. Why would anyone think the Bills are better off without Edmunds?

He was overstating people questioning whether or not Edmunds was deserving of having his $12.7M fifth year option picked up. 
Sorry to hear that you were ill. Hope all is well now. 

Edited May 26, 2021 by BarleyNY