billsfan89 Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 16 minutes ago, starrymessenger said: Turned things around in 2019. Otherwise I doubt they would have pursued him. 2019 was a contract year for him however. But the contract the Bills have him on is essentially a prove it type deal since the guarantee on year two is so low. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 15 minutes ago, billsfan89 said: 2019 was a contract year for him however. But the contract the Bills have him on is essentially a prove it type deal since the guarantee on year two is so low. or was it a Small School DT needed some time to really grow into the NFL and last year was that light going on??? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 27 minutes ago, billsfan89 said: 2019 was a contract year for him however. But the contract the Bills have him on is essentially a prove it type deal since the guarantee on year two is so low. That's a recurring theme ? I like this kind of Player management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockinon Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 22 hours ago, DJB said: This move puts Star on the bench!!! Maybe Star is traded for a Draft pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLFan Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 1 hour ago, MAJBobby said: or was it a Small School DT needed some time to really grow into the NFL and last year was that light going on??? Could be that or contract, but I would not underestimate the potential positive influence of Eric Washington on boosting his play, perhaps through motivation, or perhaps through putting him in a better position to succeed. Whatever the reason for his improvement, Washington clearly thinks highly of him, or he would not be here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 18, 2020 Share Posted March 18, 2020 So Butler is basically this year's Jordan Phillips? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 On 3/17/2020 at 6:46 PM, whatdrought said: Murphy may be in trouble... Also, would anyone else be unsurprised to see them try to move Hughes? Shocked really. They've added some very nice pieces and DL depth is a great asset, but who's gonna get to the QB, especially from the edge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrtonHearsaWho Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 The more I am reading up about Jefferson, the more I am absolutely LOVING the signing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 14 hours ago, John from Riverside said: So Butler is basically this year's Jordan Phillips? Probably not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turk71 Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 17 hours ago, starrymessenger said: Turned things around in 2019. Otherwise I doubt they would have pursued him. They pursued Norman and Klein and they were terrible last year. Aside from his 6 sacks Butler wasn't very good last year either. It's a Carolina connection thing. I hope it works out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 56 minutes ago, Turk71 said: They pursued Norman and Klein and they were terrible last year. Aside from his 6 sacks Butler wasn't very good last year either. It's a Carolina connection thing. I hope it works out. Butler is coming off his best season and the Bills did not pay him a big multiple year deal (it's essentially a one year deal with an option for a second season as year two is only one million in dead cap if cut in 2021) so I look at it as more so trying to tap the potential he flashes at times. I don't hate the deal as Butler is going to be a rotational DT a role that might tap into his ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExWNYer Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 On 3/18/2020 at 10:23 AM, DCbillsfan said: A legit question. Will Horrible Harry be a full go come September or will he need more time? No lateral movement in this short video, just straight line running, but it certainly looks like he's on track. "Defensive tackle Harrison Phillips continues his rehabilitation from an ACL injury back in September of 2019." https://www.buffalobills.com/video/harrison-phillips-on-field-rehab-work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turk71 Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 47 minutes ago, billsfan89 said: Butler is coming off his best season and the Bills did not pay him a big multiple year deal (it's essentially a one year deal with an option for a second season as year two is only one million in dead cap if cut in 2021) so I look at it as more so trying to tap the potential he flashes at times. I don't hate the deal as Butler is going to be a rotational DT a role that might tap into his ability. I don't hate the Butler signing, they overpaid a little perhaps but whatever. They obviously like his potential and hopefully they can bring out the best in him. With Norman and Klein who are coming off poor seasons they must feel that they know how to get them back on track in their system. I hope they are right, we will see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 I'm late to this party, but gonna throw my two cents in anyways... This is the first move that has me turning skeptical on Magic Beane. For everyone afraid of re-signing Shaq or JP because they only performed in contract years, this signing is even worse since Butler has been a BUST and barely even performed in his contract year. Sure, he did "better" than previous seasons, but it still wasn't that good. Plus, he already has off-field issues. So not sure how this is better. Especially given that we're paying him on par with what Shaq and JP got. It's not like we brought Butler in at $4M/year. We're paying him Shaq/JP/Star money. And to pile on, he plays a position where our roster is already full. With Addison replacing Shaq at DE, and Jefferson replacing JP at 3-tech DT, Butler will be battling to get into rotation with Star and Harry at 1-tech DT. I guess this means we'll see one of those 1-tech DTs traded as Beane likes to do. That is the only part of this deal that I can get behind. But right now, it seems like we're just throwing lots of money at Beane's Carolina guys. Which, btw, it's not like Carolina has had the best D in the league (or even close to being as good as ours has been), so I'm officially sick of the Carolina signings. Time to find talent elsewhere. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 1 hour ago, DrDawkinstein said: I'm late to this party, but gonna throw my two cents in anyways... This is the first move that has me turning skeptical on Magic Beane. For everyone afraid of re-signing Shaq or JP because they only performed in contract years, this signing is even worse since Butler has been a BUST and barely even performed in his contract year. Sure, he did "better" than previous seasons, but it still wasn't that good. Plus, he already has off-field issues. So not sure how this is better. Especially given that we're paying him on par with what Shaq and JP got. It's not like we brought Butler in at $4M/year. We're paying him Shaq/JP/Star money. And to pile on, he plays a position where our roster is already full. With Addison replacing Shaq at DE, and Jefferson replacing JP at 3-tech DT, Butler will be battling to get into rotation with Star and Harry at 1-tech DT. I guess this means we'll see one of those 1-tech DTs traded as Beane likes to do. That is the only part of this deal that I can get behind. But right now, it seems like we're just throwing lots of money at Beane's Carolina guys. Which, btw, it's not like Carolina has had the best D in the league (or even close to being as good as ours has been), so I'm officially sick of the Carolina signings. Time to find talent elsewhere. Butler actually has the physical traits to play 3 tech. He is a athletically very good and sometimes DTackles take time Phillips was cut because he wasn't performing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 1 hour ago, DrDawkinstein said: I'm late to this party, but gonna throw my two cents in anyways... This is the first move that has me turning skeptical on Magic Beane. For everyone afraid of re-signing Shaq or JP because they only performed in contract years, this signing is even worse since Butler has been a BUST and barely even performed in his contract year. Sure, he did "better" than previous seasons, but it still wasn't that good. Plus, he already has off-field issues. So not sure how this is better. Especially given that we're paying him on par with what Shaq and JP got. It's not like we brought Butler in at $4M/year. We're paying him Shaq/JP/Star money. And to pile on, he plays a position where our roster is already full. With Addison replacing Shaq at DE, and Jefferson replacing JP at 3-tech DT, Butler will be battling to get into rotation with Star and Harry at 1-tech DT. I guess this means we'll see one of those 1-tech DTs traded as Beane likes to do. That is the only part of this deal that I can get behind. But right now, it seems like we're just throwing lots of money at Beane's Carolina guys. Which, btw, it's not like Carolina has had the best D in the league (or even close to being as good as ours has been), so I'm officially sick of the Carolina signings. Time to find talent elsewhere. Just a comment that the report is "up to" $18M. We offered Shaq $27M/3 yrs, he turned it down - so apparently even what he turned down is less than the maximum here. Shaq actually got $10M/3 yrs. I would say wait to see what the details are before concluding it's Shaq money. I do feel that for the money they got, we could have re-signed at least Shaq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Just a comment that the report is "up to" $18M. We offered Shaq $27M/3 yrs, he turned it down - so apparently even what he turned down is less than the maximum here. Shaq actually got $10M/3 yrs. I would say wait to see what the details are before concluding it's Shaq money. I do feel that for the money they got, we could have re-signed at least Shaq His contract is already in. His cap hit for 2020 is $7.1 million. $1 million Dead cap in 2021. Not anywhere near Shaq's. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/vernon-butler-18978/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 7 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: His contract is already in. His cap hit for 2020 is $7.1 million. $1 million Dead cap in 2021. Not anywhere near Shaq's. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/vernon-butler-18978/ So this is 2 years/$15M There must be a $3M incentive somewhere, or else the initial report was wrong Nothing guaranteed past this season We could cut him next year with $1M dead cap 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: So this is 2 years/$15M There must be a $3M incentive somewhere, or else the initial report was wrong Nothing guaranteed past this season We could cut him next year with $1M dead cap No incentives in contract other than a small active games bonus. Lots of these initial reports are off some once the contracts come in. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 38 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Butler actually has the physical traits to play 3 tech. He is a athletically very good and sometimes DTackles take time Phillips was cut because he wasn't performing Jordan Phillips. Wasnt cut, and was performing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 4 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: Jordan Phillips. Wasnt cut, and was performing. Jordan Phillips was cut from the dolphins because he didn't perform. Sometimes a change of scenery is needed 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 5 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Jordan Phillips was cut from the dolphins because he didn't perform. Sometimes a change of scenery is needed Ah, fair enough. But was it just for performance? https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/armando-salguero/article222300710.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said: Ah, fair enough. But was it just for performance? https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/armando-salguero/article222300710.html I'm sure it was a host of problems but he was not performing and not happy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locomark Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 On 3/18/2020 at 6:53 AM, SCBills said: Sal is on the radio talking about the number of DL we brought to camp last year, but I think this is a little different... Are we going to keep 5 DT’s active every week, who all get meaningful snaps?... because we have 5 DT’s with legitimate investments in. Oliver is a high pick. Phillips a relatively high pick. Butler, Jefferson and Star all have decent contracts. These aren’t “Mike Love” type players that are making peanuts and are long shots to make the roster. Leads me to believe Quinton Jefferson will be a moveable chess piece at DT & DE on game days, with Butler, Star, Ed and Harry as the DT’s. 1 Thing to keep in mind is now you can dress more on gameday due to the new CBA. I bet that will mean we will be dressing an extra DL many games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMaster Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 5 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said: I'm late to this party, but gonna throw my two cents in anyways... This is the first move that has me turning skeptical on Magic Beane. For everyone afraid of re-signing Shaq or JP because they only performed in contract years, this signing is even worse since Butler has been a BUST and barely even performed in his contract year. Sure, he did "better" than previous seasons, but it still wasn't that good. Plus, he already has off-field issues. So not sure how this is better. Especially given that we're paying him on par with what Shaq and JP got. It's not like we brought Butler in at $4M/year. We're paying him Shaq/JP/Star money. And to pile on, he plays a position where our roster is already full. With Addison replacing Shaq at DE, and Jefferson replacing JP at 3-tech DT, Butler will be battling to get into rotation with Star and Harry at 1-tech DT. I guess this means we'll see one of those 1-tech DTs traded as Beane likes to do. That is the only part of this deal that I can get behind. But right now, it seems like we're just throwing lots of money at Beane's Carolina guys. Which, btw, it's not like Carolina has had the best D in the league (or even close to being as good as ours has been), so I'm officially sick of the Carolina signings. Time to find talent elsewhere. I understand where this post is coming from, and I also have some reservations about this signing. I also see the possible positives. I think they are gonna show them what they did with Phillip's and tell him they can get the best out of him as well. He has the tools, and they had a chance to evaluate him his rookie season, so they must like him as a fit for what they wanna do. Now I also see another Carolina defensive linemen getting paid more than what he appears to have shown he deserves, and he was a bust in Carolina...that is a concern. I am choosing to believe in McDermott, Beane, and our Dline coach that they will get him to play to his potential, but it could definitely be another Star situation where he doesn't live up to his contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 So Shaq wouldnt take a small discount to stay with us even though the team waited for him to actually get healthy? I hope our OL buries him on every play 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 4 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: So Shaq wouldnt take a small discount to stay with us even though the team waited for him to actually get healthy? I hope our OL buries him on every play would be playing over or Off Cody Ford mostly. we should watch for that match up : ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 5 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Just a comment that the report is "up to" $18M. We offered Shaq $27M/3 yrs, he turned it down - so apparently even what he turned down is less than the maximum here. Shaq actually got $10M/3 yrs. I would say wait to see what the details are before concluding it's Shaq money. I do feel that for the money they got, we could have re-signed at least Shaq You'd have to surmise that perhaps Shaq wanted to go to Miami. If we're talking about a difference of one mil per year over 3 years, I'm sure something would have been worked out if he wanted to stay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEpsYtown Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 1 hour ago, John from Riverside said: So Shaq wouldnt take a small discount to stay with us even though the team waited for him to actually get healthy? I hope our OL buries him on every play I read somewhere he wanted to go to Miami to be closer to family. I still hope the Line buries him on every play, plus he can fight Connor McGovern again, twice a year now that he is with the Jets. But I don’t think there was animosity out the door. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 11 hours ago, John from Riverside said: So Shaq wouldnt take a small discount to stay with us even though the team waited for him to actually get healthy? I hope our OL buries him on every play Don’t ignore tax difference, playing closer to home, and living in Miami. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMaster Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 21 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: Don’t ignore tax difference, playing closer to home, and living in Miami. Also don't ignore the Miami life becoming the undoing of a career Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock'em Sock'em Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 22 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said: skeptical Agree. On this flip side, the brass must really like Butler, because based on production alone, this is the type of guy you can wait on and get at a better price. So I guess I need to wait and see what unfolds in order to judge the brilliance of this move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathja Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 New D line coach must have “banged the table” for this guy. It is a lot of dough based on production. He was a 1st rounder... obviously has talent. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndirish1978 Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 I don't see why this guy was worth that type of coin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 4 hours ago, ndirish1978 said: I don't see why this guy was worth that type of coin It's a pretty modest contract and it's only 2 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 5 hours ago, ndirish1978 said: I don't see why this guy was worth that type of coin They think he's a fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 On 3/19/2020 at 10:52 AM, DrDawkinstein said: I'm late to this party, but gonna throw my two cents in anyways... This is the first move that has me turning skeptical on Magic Beane. For everyone afraid of re-signing Shaq or JP because they only performed in contract years, this signing is even worse since Butler has been a BUST and barely even performed in his contract year. Sure, he did "better" than previous seasons, but it still wasn't that good. Plus, he already has off-field issues. So not sure how this is better. Especially given that we're paying him on par with what Shaq and JP got. It's not like we brought Butler in at $4M/year. We're paying him Shaq/JP/Star money. And to pile on, he plays a position where our roster is already full. With Addison replacing Shaq at DE, and Jefferson replacing JP at 3-tech DT, Butler will be battling to get into rotation with Star and Harry at 1-tech DT. I guess this means we'll see one of those 1-tech DTs traded as Beane likes to do. That is the only part of this deal that I can get behind. But right now, it seems like we're just throwing lots of money at Beane's Carolina guys. Which, btw, it's not like Carolina has had the best D in the league (or even close to being as good as ours has been), so I'm officially sick of the Carolina signings. Time to find talent elsewhere. This is just my opinion I wonder if Beane is taking a chance here that he might have Star's replacement next year.......thinking that a change of scenery brings out the talent in this player Other then that? I got nothing.....I do think the rest of his pickups on their face are solid 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted March 20, 2020 Share Posted March 20, 2020 (edited) Lets envision he will find his groove here in Buffalo. Not like it doesn't happen under McBeanes. No wonder J Phillips and S Lawson walked away rather amicably . They were able to elevate their game and go get paid. and some like Spain, stayed. Bills have a fine program and it is showing in the players improvement while here. I could mention Poyer and Hyde as very good examples. No reason Butler will not grade up next year. Better system all around. 12 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: They think he's a fit. same vibe here. 7 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: This is just my opinion I wonder if Beane is taking a chance here that he might have Star's replacement next year.......thinking that a change of scenery brings out the talent in this player Other then that? I got nothing.....I do think the rest of his pickups on their face are solid Bills and Star are certainly aware he will be phased out , respectfully. They paid him well enough for him to be grateful : ) and am sure he is. But everyone knows this is likely his last, and Bills want to upgrade and infuse talent and youth both. I wanted DJ Reader quite strongly to be that guy. I think Butler gives them something different than Star can. He is taller right ? .. Edited March 20, 2020 by 3rdand12 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 (edited) For some reason I find Butler he most interesting signing we've made so far. Probably because I don't know much about him. Hopefully hes solid in the run game. Edit: I studied his film and to me he's going to play a similar role that Oliver plays. He's an attacking disruptor trying to get after the QB Edited March 21, 2020 by DJB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capco Posted March 21, 2020 Share Posted March 21, 2020 On 3/17/2020 at 8:50 PM, gobills404 said: Beane is making sure we don't have a repeat of what the Eagles did to us Good. That game legitimately felt like the only one we didn't stand a chance of winning. Every other game was a contest. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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