Bills at Browns Post Game Post Mortem

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

2 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

DON’T say it! He’s been kicked to the curb. No need fo you to follow him.

 

WILCO; thanks.

[Chandler#81]

9 hours ago, zonabb said:

Exactly as I predicted. A loss. I said Chubb would run over this team, he did. I said that would open up the passing game, it did. 

 

In the end, this isn't on the kicker, as every homer and excuse maker here wants to make. A 52 yarder to tie the game, on grass, for a kicker who kicks on turf, isn't a gimme. Allen sucked today. He's slow and indecisive. And the coaching didn't help. Singletary had as many touches as that pile of human excrement for the Browns that hasn't played in a year. And the FO's fingerprints are all over this as well. The drafted a raw, real f'in raw, QB. They went out and grabbed a bunch of mediocre smurfs to play WR. They signed a lot of mediocre FA OL who aren't good. What they did n FA was depth moves teams make but for this team, they're starters.

So keep up the homer talk, but this team is what I and many others have said while being accused of being anti-fans. They have 6 wins against garbage teams. 

 

This one is on Allen's suckitude and Daboll's garbage offense. To win you need to outscore the opponent and this team wins close games against bad teams and can never win a game on their own. Every win is a squeaker thanks to the D. Relying on that gets you what you got today. When you hear the Raven's threw out their playbooks and redesigned their entire offense around Jackson and Daboll runs the same predictable 3 and 5 slants week after week, you should understand this team will be rebuilding in 2021-2022 after the failed Allen experiment ends on 2020.

 

I won my bet today, took the Browns -2.5. Easiest pick of the week. Bills haven't beat anyone and the Browns have been beaten by good teams. If you couldn't see that, you're staring through your rose colored glasses.

 

This team ends 9-7 and outside the playoffs. Losses to the Ravens, Cowboys, Steelers, and Pats and it's over. I wouldn't be shocked if they finish 8-8 and also lose against the Broncos at home. 

 

 

 

 

CTFD. Far from the easiest pick, you and your cohorts nearly lost this game and most would say you should have. 

Alit from your high horse.

[iinii]

5 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

CTFD. Far from the easiest pick, you and your cohorts nearly lost this game and most would say you should have. 

Alit from your high horse.

Betting nugget: This is the seventh time in the past 25 seasons that a team with a .250 or lower winning percentage is favored over a team with a .750 or better winning percentage in Week 6 or later. The favorite is 6-0 ATS in the previous six games. And it's just the third time in the Super Bowl era it's happened in Week 10 or later (2-0 ATS previously). Read more.

 

The streak is alive.

[Chandler#81]

5 hours ago, TwistofFate said:

Again, are you this asinine?  Allen didn't throw for 300, he wasn't close to 300 yards, and barely completed 50% of his passes.  There is NO growth, period.  You're dealing in the hypothetical to prop up your straw man fallacy.

Pay no attention to this sanitary napkin. He won’t be heard from again. I’ve deleted 20 of his posts and still have 7 more pages here to read.

[John from Riverside]

55 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

I think you are more likely to see a switch at OC before that happens if Daboll keeps shooting himself in the foot.

 

But you are right in that you should see steady progress after 26 games with an expectation that there will be few bad games sprinkled in the mix.

 

That is not really the way it works

you should see progress and you have 

[Aireskoi]

The game never felt right to me, it seemed like the plan was to throw for 300 yards and hit the deep ball a few times to show fans they could.

 

I could be totally wrong about that, it's just a feeling I had watching.  I didn't understand the timing of the deep balls, like on on 3rd down.

 

Tough game to lose for some reason.

 

I didn't like that the Browns RB's touched the ball 33 times (24 carries and 9 rec) vs. the Bills RB's only 17 touches (13 carries 4 rec).

 

Singletary is listed as 7 targets with 3 catches for 8 yards, they need to take a hard look at that.

[Frez]

Somebody mentioned the deep ball? Yes, that is a huge problem for our strong armed QB. It's a real issue. 

 

[JaCrispy]

2 hours ago, Frez said:

Somebody mentioned the deep ball? Yes, that is a huge problem for our strong armed QB. It's a real issue. 

 

I feel JA has no idea where he is throwing those deep passes, almost like he just launches them up and hopes they come down in the general vicinity...ive never seen anything like it...

[ALF]

#97 Jordan Phillips  DT  impressed me. He is on a 1 year contract , hope they re-sign the big guy.

[Teddy KGB]

5 hours ago, london_bills said:

The very best thing the bills can do is follow their plan but draft a QB high again. 

 

Do you drive a dodge crusader ? 

[Nitro]

Bills run a vanilla offense and get vanilla results.  Watching other games it makes one wonder why the Bills refuse to shake things up.  Other young QBs make mistakes but that is the part of growing into the job.  Allen has his issues but take off the brakes.  Watching the offense does not inspire.

[Nextmanup]

54 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

I feel JA has no idea where he is throwing those deep passes, almost like he just launches them up and hopes they come down in the general vicinity...ive never seen anything like it...

This is a fair observation IMO.   

 

IMO McD deliberately killed clock on our last possession because they do not trust Allen to move down the field and score a TD for the win.  They were playing for a FG, tie, and OT.

 

I genuinely wonder, for the first time ever, if they are thinking about moving on from him.  

5 minutes ago, Nitro said:

Bills run a vanilla offense and get vanilla results.  Watching other games it makes one wonder why the Bills refuse to shake things up.  Other young QBs make mistakes but that is the part of growing into the job.  Allen has his issues but take off the brakes.  Watching the offense does not inspire.

They are afraid to ask Josh to put his foot on the gas b/c when he does that, he turns the ball over.

 

[Tcali]

1 hour ago, JaCrispy said:

I feel JA has no idea where he is throwing those deep passes, almost like he just launches them up and hopes they come down in the general vicinity...ive never seen anything like it...

You would think he would get lucky once in a while and a throw or two would be in the right place.Then the delusional people on here would keep showing the replay to show that their JA is accurate.

--Kinda like the wind aided 47 yd poof ball Fitzy threw to Terrell Owens for the 90 yd TD several years ago.-People on here actually show the link to that to prove that Fitzy doesnt  have a weak arm.

--JA needs to not throw deep at all...and needs to use his skills as a RB slash QB slash winner(i think he is a winner) in order to maximize his talents.

If that doesnt happen the Bills are going nowhere until he is replaced .No draft is gonna fix that.

 

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

5 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

Please tell us we won’t be hearing from you again til next year. If so, the loss was worth it.

If we were going 0-16 I’m still watching every snap of every game. I’m here no matter what and I’m still going to live and die with every play. I just can also separate reality and see what’s coming with the schedule. I felt like yesterday was a must win of sorts and unfortunately we didn’t get it done. I’m not going anywhere. Just because I don’t think we are making the playoffs now, doesn’t mean I’m going to stop being there. Couldn’t be further from who I am.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

The Bills are what their record says they are. 6-3.

Was I disappointed?  Sure.  Am I going to whine and cry for days?  Hell no. 

 

It's Miami week.

[Cripple Creek]

13 hours ago, Chemical said:

I'll be calling for McDermott's head from here on out. I didn't trust him with game management since his first season, but that final drive was disgusting an inexcusable. 

Thanks. We consider ourselves warned.

 

 

13 hours ago, BananaB said:

Defense has been together for 2.5 years, offense has been together 9 games.  
 

Missed FGs cost us today. We should of won that game. 

Daboll cost us the game yesterday. Everyone, aside from him, knew the formula to scoring on the Browns.  He is, in a word, suckitude, personified. 

[Warren Zevon]

7 hours ago, BananaB said:

He has started 18 games so far. ?

 

How many did EJ start before he was ran out of town?

 

I think Allen should start next year. I also think it's smart to draft a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round next year in case Allen can't make the year 3 jump. 

[Cripple Creek]

5 hours ago, Chandler#81 said:

CTFD. Far from the easiest pick, you and your cohorts nearly lost this game and most would say you should have. 

Alit from your high horse.

When someone uses "I" three times in his opening line as @zonabb did I think that the high horse is permanent.

[Wayne Arnold]

8 hours ago, WideNine said:

 

So Wayne.

 

I hear your complaints, what solutions do you propose?

 

Draft another quarterback. One who can hit the broad side of a barn 40 yards+ downfield. Keep drafting one until you hit.

 

Allen ain’t it.

[Cripple Creek]

30 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Draft another quarterback. One who can hit the broad side of a barn 40 yards+ downfield. Keep drafting one until you hit.

 

Allen ain’t it.

So, winning in the NFL is dependent on what is a low percentage throw to begin with?  

 

Allen does decent (I believe) in the 15-25 yard throws so I have to assume you're talking about those 40+ yarders.

 

21+ yards and the completion % is only 43.  The drop to the passes you're talking about would be precipitous. Maybe somewhere in the 25-30% range, perhaps lower, yet you are grasping at this one thin straw as being the thing you want your QB to be good at?

 

What Bills receivers would you be sending long? I have, unfortunately, only two options: Brown, Foster.  Beasley and McKittrick are most definitely not the option of choice for a deep ball.  I would love to know how many times Allen has practiced those throws to those two specific receivers. 

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2019/2018-19-deep-ball-project

[BananaB]

47 minutes ago, Gary Busey said:

 

How many did EJ start before he was ran out of town?

 

I think Allen should start next year. I also think it's smart to draft a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round next year in case Allen can't make the year 3 jump. 

Totally agree with you, but I think ya wait until the end of the season before you start talking about drafting another QB. Just see how this plays out

[PromoTheRobot]

All in all this was a brutal sports weekend in WNY, with the Sabres limp Sweden performances, UB basketball losing to a crappy Ivy, and the Bills.

[simpleman]

There were receivers getting open deep, Allen just does not have a consistent accurate deep ball.

DaBoll fails to use Singletary enough even though he is getting it done whenever he is called upon.

Hause Money chokes on a short easy FG.

Allen still has serious ball protection issues.

Beane has not helped enough by bringing in impact players during the season and our higher round rookie draft picks are yet again not “NFL” starter ready.

Lee Smith brings little to the team and his costly penalties keep hurting the team.

Ford may have future potential, but his premature learning on the field during the season in important situations is hurting the team's present.

Playoff winning teams need to build an offense that can score more than 20 points per game.

There is just not enough talent in this team's offense, and that is all on Beane.

As a fan it feels like management is again sacrificing the current season for the nebulous promise of a better “future” that never comes, yet again for almost the 20^th year. How many more years am I expected to accept the “we are building for the future” excuse for another futile season.

Edited November 11, 2019 by simpleman

[Billsatlastin2018]

Takes from yesterday.

 

* Allen is merely an adequate QB. His strength (Running) can be his undoing, as once again- he fumbled in a critical situation-albeit being bailed out. His Passing ability (the reason Beane Boy went down to get him) is very, average. He obviously lacks the ability to EVER be within five yards of any intended Receiver on a long Go route and he lacks consistency on the short stuff! THAT is a deal breaker. In addition, he simply cannot read open Receivers after the primary one. If progress is not seen, the Bills need to get back to the Draft Board!

 

* The WRs are Smurfs. As I’ve said for a Millenium, Buffalo needs huge men for targets- especially in the cold, rain and snow of the back half of the Season. These are not good enough.

 

* The OC is once again- substandard. Can anyone point to more than 1-2 of the nine and say- Daboll nailed the game plan? It is boring and inept- a killer in the NFL.

 

* When that buffoon Hitchens outcoaches McD, that is a real cause for concern. McD is good, but by good, I mean in the 2nd. Tier of NFL HCs. Again... not good enough.

 

* The idiot kicker? Can anyone explain why he is still here? If you can’t kick from 50 yards in the NFL, you are a liability. If you can’t make them from 30, you need to be out the door!

 

* The D is sound, but not even close to being a monstah. It will effectively handle the stiffs, but anyone with talent- NO chance. 
 

* My realistic and just slightly optimistic 10-6 record is more likely 9-7, with a loss to the far superior Ravens. If they banana skin on one of the stiffs, it’s the same old, Millenium siren song of mediocrity & ineptitude!

THAT IS NEITHER PROGRESS OR PROCESS!

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

1 hour ago, Cripple Creek said:

Thanks. We consider ourselves warned.

 

 

Daboll cost us the game yesterday. Everyone, aside from him, knew the formula to scoring on the Browns.  He is, in a word, suckitude, personified. 

 

They had a timeout and instead let 30 seconds run off. They kicked that final field goal with a timeout in their pocket. Whose fault is that?

 

Allen is 0-16 on passes 30 yards or more in the air.

Edited November 11, 2019 by Chemical

[Wayne Arnold]

18 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said:

So, winning in the NFL is dependent on what is a low percentage throw to begin with?  

 

Allen does decent (I believe) in the 15-25 yard throws so I have to assume you're talking about those 40+ yarders.

 

21+ yards and the completion % is only 43.  The drop to the passes you're talking about would be precipitous. Maybe somewhere in the 25-30% range, perhaps lower, yet you are grasping at this one thin straw as being the thing you want your QB to be good at?

 

What Bills receivers would you be sending long? I have, unfortunately, only two options: Brown, Foster.  Beasley and McKittrick are most definitely not the option of choice for a deep ball.  I would love to know how many times Allen has practiced those throws to those two specific receivers. 

 

https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2019/2018-19-deep-ball-project

 

It’s not a thin straw. Allen’s complete inability to come close to his receivers on the deep ball is severely hurting this offense. There is no big play ability. 

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

1 minute ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

It’s not a thin straw. Allen’s complete inability to come close to his receivers on the deep ball is severely hurting this offense. There is no big play ability. 

 

He completed 5 passes yesterday for 20+ yards. Those are big plays. 

[Billsatlastin2018]

2 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

It’s not a thin straw. Allen’s complete inability to come close to his receivers on the deep ball is severely hurting this offense. There is no big play ability. 

What it means, is that if he can’t even throw ONE deep one, he’s never, ever gonna achieve the present day, modest marker for NFL QB success- 300 yards! Why? Because, only superlative QBs can throw for at least 20 completions of 15 or more or 25 of slightly shorter variety.
Allen is not that guy! Waaaaaay to inconsistent and lacking the ability to find open receivers.

[Cripple Creek]

16 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

It’s not a thin straw. Allen’s complete inability to come close to his receivers on the deep ball is severely hurting this offense. There is no big play ability. 

So, you are putting all your chips on the table for the low percentage play. Thanks.

24 minutes ago, Chemical said:

 

They had a timeout and instead let 30 seconds run off. They kicked that final field goal with a timeout in their pocket. Whose fault is that?

 

Allen is 0-16 on passes 30 yards or more in the air.

and you want to replace the QB? What about the guy who keeps calling for those long balls? What about the guy who sent Beasley long? What about the guy who sent MCKittrick long? What about the guy who twice called for passes on third and 3-4 knowing that we would go for it on fourth down?

 

Allen may or may not be the guy.  Daboll is most definitely not the OC and my concerns about McDermott grow as he continues to tolerte this BS for the sake of The Process.

[DuckyBoys]

Game plan on offense stunk and McDermott coached timid at the end.  Putting the game on a struggling kicker probably not the best idea. Maybe McDermott still pictures Hauschka of 2017 kicking 50 yarders like they were xps.  More troubling is the vaunted Buffalo D allowed the Browns to march 80 yards for a td with the game on the line in the 4th quarter. 

[Blank Stare]

Not trying to hot take this thing, but serious question. Why does this staff constantly over value special teams at the offenses expense? Not saying he’s a game breaker, but there is no way a guy like Senorise Perry should be active on game day over TJ Yeldon or Duke Williams. I’m not saying the result would’ve been different, but if you know the game plan is to throw the ball 40 times and ignore the run, then why not make all your best pass catchers available?  Perry is invisible at the job he’s asked (which I guess is a good thing) and the special teams is largely average. I’d rather give up a little yardage in the kicking game to buoy the offense with everything we have at our disposal. 

[row_33]

Just now, TheProcess said:

Not trying to hot take this thing, but serious question. Why does this staff constantly over value special teams at the offenses expense? Not saying he’s a game breaker, but there is no way a guy like Senorise Perry should be active on game day over TJ Yeldon or Duke Williams. I’m not saying the result would’ve been different, but if you know the game plan is to throw the ball 40 times and ignore the run, then why not make all your best pass catchers available?  Perry is invisible at the job he’s asked (which I guess is a good thing) and the special teams is largely average. I’d rather give up a little yardage in the kicking game to buoy the offense with everything we have at our disposal. 

 

ST have been a joke for the Bills for decades, aside from ace punter Moorman

 

 

[Blank Stare]

6 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

ST have been a joke for the Bills for decades, aside from ace punter Moorman

 

 

That’s my point. No matter how many people we roll out there (DiMarco included), the ST is always pretty bad. And that’s ok if your offense is humming and you aren’t giving up big returns for TDs. They need to Stop taking away from the offense to help a unit that is average and offers little to the outcome. Again, Yeldon and Duke inactive yesterday isn’t the reason we lost. This is more of a broader point. But you can’t tell me Yeldon and Duke can’t be coached to run down the field and make a dang tackle on ST. 

Edited November 11, 2019 by TheProcess

[WideNine]

6 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

That is not really the way it works

you should see progress and you have 

 

Was thinking about progress overall for the offense.

 

I have some concerns based on Daboll's offensive system success at his other NFL stops over his career.

 

 

[row_33]

18 minutes ago, TheProcess said:

That’s my point. No matter how many people we roll out there (DiMarco included), the ST is always pretty bad. And that’s ok if your offense is humming and you aren’t giving up big returns for TDs. They need to Stop taking away from the offense to help a unit that is average and offers little to the outcome. Again, Yeldon and Duke inactive yesterday isn’t the reason we lost. This is more of a broader point. But you can’t tell me Yeldon and Duke can’t be coached to run down the field and make a dang tackle on ST. 

 

ST is the one that teams figure they can let slide by when the O and D have such obvious problems

 

trouble is the Pats see ST as a major priority, figures it helps with a handful of wins every season....

 

[Wayne Arnold]

2 hours ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

 

He completed 5 passes yesterday for 20+ yards. Those are big plays. 

 

Those were big plays in 1979. Maybe.

[Cripple Creek]

2 hours ago, TheProcess said:

Not trying to hot take this thing, but serious question. Why does this staff constantly over value special teams at the offenses expense? Not saying he’s a game breaker, but there is no way a guy like Senorise Perry should be active on game day over TJ Yeldon or Duke Williams. I’m not saying the result would’ve been different, but if you know the game plan is to throw the ball 40 times and ignore the run, then why not make all your best pass catchers available?  Perry is invisible at the job he’s asked (which I guess is a good thing) and the special teams is largely average. I’d rather give up a little yardage in the kicking game to buoy the offense with everything we have at our disposal. 

The Process dictates actives/inactives.

[Wayne Arnold]

2 hours ago, Cripple Creek said:

So, you are putting all your chips on the table for the low percentage play. Thanks.

and you want to replace the QB? What about the guy who keeps calling for those long balls? What about the guy who sent Beasley long? What about the guy who sent MCKittrick long? What about the guy who twice called for passes on third and 3-4 knowing that we would go for it on fourth down?

 

Allen may or may not be the guy.  Daboll is most definitely not the OC and my concerns about McDermott grow as he continues to tolerte this BS for the sake of The Process.

 

That “low percentage play” has extremely high rewards and completely changes how opposing teams defend the offense. 

 

I don’t “want” to replace the quarterback. But when the quarterback is holding the franchise back, you have no choice.

 

I don’t think Daboll or McDermott are worth hanging onto either. Daboll is in over his head and McDermott chose him - his second failed OC. He doesn’t get a third choice.

 

I’m on the fence with Beane. Maybe he can get one more HC/QB chance.

[Nextmanup]

1 minute ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

That “low percentage play” has extremely high rewards and completely changes how opposing teams defend the offense. 

 

I don’t “want” to replace the quarterback. But when the quarterback is holding the franchise back, you have no choice.

 

I don’t think Daboll or McDermott are worth hanging onto either. Daboll is in over his head and McDermott chose him - his second failed OC. He doesn’t get a third choice.

 

I’m on the fence with Beane. Maybe he can get one more HC/QB chance.

I think McDermott does a good job of motivating the team and gets them fired up to compete at a high level every game.  That is a big part of an NFL HC's duties, and he does that well.

 

All other aspects of being a HC he does poorly.

In word, he is what I would call "replaceable."

 

 

[Wayne Arnold]

5 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

I think McDermott does a good job of motivating the team and gets them fired up to compete at a high level every game.  That is a big part of an NFL HC's duties, and he does that well.

 

All other aspects of being a HC he does poorly.

In word, he is what I would call "replaceable."

 

Did the team look fired up at any point yesterday? Defense gave up a touchdown to begin the game and another to end the game. Offense are walking zombies. I don’t see it.