Ed Oliver doesn't look very good

[Buffalo Boy]

   Anyone remember what a terrible pick Edmunds was last year? Remember how he sucked as he missed all those tackles and we shouldn’t have started him as a rookie?

   Rookies, high first round picks still have work to do and things to learn. FACT 

 

[Niagara Dude]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

He has struggled to get off blocks throughout the preseason. The D around him has been good but to me he shouldn't be starting. I'm nervous about this pick.

It looks like a bust pick,  rather than grab a WR or TE to help out young QB they go defensive side of the ball and reach for undersized guy.

Edited August 25, 2019 by Niagara Dude
changed

[BuffAlone]

Just now, Niagara Dude said:

It is a bust pick,  rather than grab a WR or TE to help out young QB they go defensive side of the ball and reach for undersized guy.

a bust pick? after 3 preseason games? Good Lord...what is wrong with you people??

[Alaska Darin]

You know what's valuable about preseason football games?  Guys not getting injured.

 

There isn't one other thing that should be taken as gospel.

[BuffAlone]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo Boy said:

   Anyone remember what a terrible pick Edmunds was last year? Remember how he sucked as he missed all those tackles and we shouldn’t have started him as a rookie?

   Rookies, high first round picks still have work to do and things to learn. FACT 

 

a 1st rd WR gets a 3 year grace period. nobody else tho. people make me laugh with nonsense that he's a bust. I can't even say Shaq has been a bust. disappointment maybe, not a bust. jmo

[Niagara Dude]

Not bust but a reach yes

[Logic]

8 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

It looks like a bust pick,  rather than grab a WR or TE to help out young QB they go defensive side of the ball and reach for undersized guy.

[Pbomb]

I knew it was just a matter of time for a thread like this, dude hasn’t even played a single down yet

[K-9]

19 minutes ago, Bad Things said:

We're doomed again!

DOOMED!!!

[Pbomb]

4 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

Not bust but a reach yes

Reach? Every mock and rankings I seen had him as top ten, we should have took dk instead right 

[MJS]

I'll trust the evaluation of the professionals.

[Green Lightning]

Agree with OP. I expected Aaron Donald immediately. Donald sacks the QB every snap, right?

[Nextmanup]

28 minutes ago, Nester said:

He has never even played an NFL game yet.

 

This thread is stupid.

It's stupid?  You might disagree with the premise, but why would it be "stupid?"  

 

You mean because it offers an opinion that might be detrimental to the team?

 

It's bizarre how the haters come out in these threads and viciously attack the OP for daring to suggest something that might be detrimental to the team.

 

There is a huge cult/follower mentality around this place.  

 

As someone who values critical, independent thinking, it's scary as hell.

 

 

 

 

[Meatloaf63]

Just now, Nextmanup said:

It's stupid?  You might disagree with the premise, but why would it be "stupid?"  

 

You mean because it offers an opinion that might be detrimental to the team?

 

It's bizarre how the haters come out in these threads and viciously attack the OP for daring to suggest something that might be detrimental to the team.

 

There is a huge cult/follower mentality around this place.  

 

As someone who values critical, independent thinking, it's scary as hell.

 

 

 

 

It’s stupid because he’s a rookie who hasn’t played a single game where we were game planing to stop an opposition. There is no way to come to any educated conclusion. So yes, it’s stupid...

[TPS]

Yeah, reminds me of how awful Edmunds a year ago.  Two R1 busts in a row Beane!

[ComradeKayAdams]

54 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I don't know what his responsibilities are each play, but what I see is a player that is tough to move but lacks the hands to disengage from blocks. 

 

 

Honestly to me Oliver may be best suited as a NT, which is what Houston ultimately had him doing and was criticized for it. McDermott may use Oliver the same way. He's very difficult to move even at his size. 

 

You are the only person on the planet who is thinking this. Everyone else on the planet believes his skill set at the NFL level is optimally utilized as a 3 technique 4-3 DT.

[Da webster guy]

If an interior D lineman is doubled his job is to hold his ground and slide in the direction of the play on a run, or contain/occupy a passing lane to disrupt timing.  Once in awhile they can split and penetrate but this isn't college ball, they're the best in the world.

 

Don't worry about big Ed yet.  He's got a long way to go before he's going to be a star, but he sure looks like he has great instincts, power and hustle to me.

[billsbackto81]

42 minutes ago, GreggTX said:

The OP is correct that Oliver hasn't performed nearly as well as some seem to think. He's a rookie and he has a long way to go yet. He must greatly improve the use of his hands to be effective. I support this pick, but of course I wish he were ready now. Just leave him in there and let him gain more experience and pray he becomes elite.

Was watching the Jets last night and Q. Williams has looked beastly. I think Oliver will do just fine but the Jets picked the right DT. He is a plug and play talent in any scheme. 

 

Oliver has shown flashes and once he's really let loose he may shine. I've seen him in the backfield a few times and I've seen him whiff on some plays as well. We really need another pass rusher opposite Jerry. Murphy is underwhelming and Shaq is not a pass rusher.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

He has struggled to get off blocks throughout the preseason. The D around him has been good but to me he shouldn't be starting. I'm nervous about this pick.

 

The only thing more shocking than this bad take is that one other person hit the like button on it.  

[njbuff]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Bust no. Just not going to impact like we thought. 

 

How the hell do you know what kind of impact he may or may not make?

 

He hasn’t played one REAL snap yet.

[VW82]

Remember Edmunds vs Rivers last year? There are going to be growing pains with Oliver. He’s undersized and is going to get pushed around some until he figures some things out. Thankfully we have a very deep dline rotation which should be motivating for Oliver to do that sooner rather than later.

[Phil The Thrill]

He really hasn’t played a ton.  Maybe 4 full quarters or so and even then he’s been in on a rotation.  So it’s hard to evaluate him after such a limited body of work.  He should have had a sack of Brisset versus Indy and he made some very good penetrations and QB pressures.  I think that overall he’s been good which is all you can ask at this point.  It’s good to know he’s not getting outplayed for his spot

[Don Otreply]

41 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

It looks like a bust pick,  rather than grab a WR or TE to help out young QB they go defensive side of the ball and reach for undersized guy.

Sarcasm one would hope.....

 

Go Bills!!!

[Estro]

I'm slightly concerned myself.  I think he can do damage in clear passing downs, but his inability to anchor in the run game will be exposed if it doesn't get a lot better.  You can expect a coach like Bill B. to run right at him until he proves he can get off a block and make a tackle in the run game.  His tackling is a little sloppy too, backs have slipped out of a few of his tackles this preseason.  I like DT that can generate immediate pressure up the middle, which can destroy a play.......and he can do that......but he will have to be at least avg. against the run for the staff to trust him to be out there on 3rd and mediums and 3rd and shorts.  Like I said earlier, I think smart coaches are going to run right at him, until he proves otherwise.

[akcash]

I gotta admit I was thinking the same thing.

 He's been handled by about 70 percent of the (pass rush) one on one's he's gone up against. I think he definitely has room to grow but he's got a long way to go. I have been happy with his stoutness in the running game. 

Edited August 26, 2019 by akcash

[GreggTX]

15 minutes ago, Meatloaf63 said:

It’s stupid because he’s a rookie who hasn’t played a single game where we were game planing to stop an opposition. There is no way to come to any educated conclusion. So yes, it’s stupid...

 

Coaches evaluate players in the preseason. If a coach is too "stupid" to make necessary evaluations of his rookies, he has no business being a football coach at any level. Evaluating players is both continuous and necessary. It's not like he's saying Oliver won't ever play well. The OP is saying that he's not playing well right now and that is correct. He needs more work and experience. You are correct that we shouldn't make a final determination yet, but I think "stupid" was a poor choice of words.

[K-9]

31 minutes ago, Green Lightning said:

Agree with OP. I expected Aaron Donald immediately. Donald sacks the QB every snap, right?

This got me thinking about how AD did in his first three preseason games as a rookie. Well, he had a grand total of 2 tackles through three preseason games. No sacks, no TFLs. 

 

So much for the predictive properties of a rookie defensive tackles’s preseason performance.

[mellaman101]

Remember when you told me about the first time you tasted your pee?  Yesterday, right?

[Don Otreply]

41 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

Not bust but a reach yes

But you just said he’s a bust pick, your so fickle, make up your mind already. 

 

Go Bills!!!

[K-9]

4 minutes ago, akcash said:

I gotta admit I was thinking the same thing

 He's been handled by about 70 percent of the one on one's he's gone up against. I think he definitely has room to grow but he's got a long way to go.

How do you define “handled?”

[akcash]

Just now, K-9 said:

How do you define “handled?”

Being blocked without much push and having no effect on the quarterback. (I was referring to pass rush one on ones).

[thebandit27]

5 minutes ago, K-9 said:

This got me thinking about how AD did in his first three preseason games as a rookie. Well, he had a grand total of 2 tackles through three preseason games. No sacks, no TFLs. 

 

So much for the predictive properties of a rookie defensive tackles’s preseason performance.

 

You are hereby awarded 2 points for content; 5 points for alliteration 

[pennstate10]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I’ve seen him penetrate multiple times.

 

?

[The Bills Blog]

38 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

It's stupid?  You might disagree with the premise, but why would it be "stupid?"  

 

You mean because it offers an opinion that might be detrimental to the team?

 

It's bizarre how the haters come out in these threads and viciously attack the OP for daring to suggest something that might be detrimental to the team.

 

There is a huge cult/follower mentality around this place.  

 

As someone who values critical, independent thinking, it's scary as hell.

 

 

 

 

Thank you. Keep saying things like this. You couldn't be more right. There really shouldn't be any confused/meh/laughing reactions on the OP's post.

[GreggTX]

27 minutes ago, billsbackto81 said:

Was watching the Jets last night and Q. Williams has looked beastly. I think Oliver will do just fine but the Jets picked the right DT. He is a plug and play talent in any scheme. 

 

Oliver has shown flashes and once he's really let loose he may shine. I've seen him in the backfield a few times and I've seen him whiff on some plays as well. We really need another pass rusher opposite Jerry. Murphy is underwhelming and Shaq is not a pass rusher.

 

QW is the odds on favorite for DROY at this point. That 1st Jets game will include a lot of EO/QW comparisons. I just hope he progresses quickly and that he and Edmunds become great because if their ceilings are just "average"  we are in trouble. I'm still hopeful, but I havent seen either one of them truly excel yet. I'll keep my fingers crossed.

[GreggTX]

9 minutes ago, K-9 said:

How do you define “handled?”

Bested, outperformed, looks like a rookie, overmatched. Now if your looking for more specifics here are some areas of growth he would do well to focus on -- Size, strength and handwork. I think those are things he will need to improve. I'm sure the coaches can tell much more, but they won't criticise him in public nor should they.

[Mrbojanglezs]

I don't agree but I will say he has seemed to struggle to get free on doubles. He will be dangerous on stunts though. 

[K-9]

13 minutes ago, akcash said:

Being blocked without much push and having no effect on the quarterback. (I was referring to pass rush one on ones).

I appreciate the clarification. I agree he’s been stymied on pass rush the last two games,  but I’m not gonna worry until I see how he does when we start scheming our pass rush. He’s more than held his own vs. the run. Like I said earlier,  by my count he’s lost leverage just twice all preseason. He’s been very good, actually.

 

 

7 minutes ago, GreggTX said:

Bested, outperformed, looks like a rookie, overmatched. Now if your looking for more specifics here are some areas of growth he would do well to focus on -- Size, strength and handwork. I think those are things he will need to improve. I'm sure the coaches can tell much more, but they won't criticise him in public nor should they.

He’s been stymied on the pass rush the last two games after doing well in game one. 

 

On all his run snaps, he’s lost leverage twice in the three games. Twice. In that regard, he’s been anything but “bested, outperformed, or overmatched.” Maybe we’re not watching the same games.

[K-9]

25 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

You are hereby awarded 2 points for content; 5 points for alliteration 

This is the result of growing up in Buffalo watching Irv Weinstein on Eyewitness News.

[GreggTX]

5 minutes ago, K-9 said:

I appreciate the clarification. I agree he’s been stymied on pass rush the last two games,  but I’m not gonna worry until I see how he does when we start scheming our pass rush. He’s more than held his own vs. the run. Like I said earlier,  by my count he’s lost leverage just twice all preseason. He’s been very good, actually.

 

 

He’s been stymied on the pass rush the last two games after doing well in game one. 

 

On all his run snaps, he’s lost leverage twice in the three games. Twice. In that regard, he’s been anything but “bested, outperformed, or overmatched.” Maybe we’re not watching the same games.

 

Not to be argumentative, but he has been so-so at best. AGAIN, this is not to say he will NEVER be any good, but that he'll need time to get up to speed.