The Athletic: Erik Turner Breaks Down the Bengals' Five Sacks of Josh Allen

[Starr Almighty]

3 hours ago, Jauronimo said:

The Bills have not been able to execute or stop a screen play since Megamind Chan Gailey was coaching the team.

No greater truth has ever been spoken

Edited August 28, 2018 by Starr Almighty

[Fadingpain]

Sack #3 is a good example of Allen not getting the ball out.

 

Coleman was open for the majority of his route and probably the guy he should have thrown the ball to.  Would have been a short gain, but better than a sack.  The guy making the video writes a caption on the screen that Coleman is covered.  Not really.

Watch it again.

 

 

[jrober38]

Sack 1 there's nothing he can do.

 

Sack 2, the hitch at the top of the field is open if he throws with anticipation. It's 2nd and 2, he's got an empty set, and the Bengals are showing the same blitz package they sacked him on previously. Allen has to recognize he has no help, and needs to read the D pre snap to know that he's got to throw the ball to Kerley and get the ball out of his hands quickly. He appears to lock on to Clay, which doesn't make any sense considering that the D is showing pressure and he doesn't have a RB in to help chip.

 

Sack 3 he need to pull the trigger and throw it to Coleman. The DE is nearly on his back, and the DT is right in his face. He has to pull the trigger and throw it even if it's at the receivers feet and avoid the sack. Instead he pats the ball and tries to move onto his next read and gets swallowed up by the defense. The blocking is terrible, but Allen easily could have thrown a pass where only Coleman could dive for it and avoided the sack.

 

Sack 4 - as shown, Allen doesn't throw with anticipation to an open Kerley, tries to leave the pocket and gets sacked. 

 

Sack 5 - again he doesn't pull the trigger for some reason. At this point he looked like a deer in the headlights and was pretty clearly shaken. 

 

Overall the blocking was bad, but Allen was responsible for 3 of the sacks, and possibly a 4th if he'd had the awareness to know he was going to get sacked and dunk a simply ball at his receiver's feet to avoid the loss of 8 yards. 

11 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

Sack #3 is a good example of Allen not getting the ball out.

 

Coleman was open for the majority of his route and probably the guy he should have thrown the ball to.  Would have been a short gain, but better than a sack.  The guy making the video writes a caption on the screen that Coleman is covered.  Not really.

Watch it again.

 

 

 

Even if Coleman is "covered", it's still a pass he can throw to avoid the sack. It's a crossing route with the defender behind the receiver. The chances of it getting picked are slim to none and a sack should have been avoided here. 

[Doc]

12 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

Sack #3 is a good example of Allen not getting the ball out.

 

Coleman was open for the majority of his route and probably the guy he should have thrown the ball to.  Would have been a short gain, but better than a sack.  The guy making the video writes a caption on the screen that Coleman is covered.  Not really.

Watch it again.

 

Not only was Coleman covered, he was short of the sticks  Josh was looking towards Benjamin who was open behind the 2 other WR's and would have gotten the 1st down, but Benjamin never looked back for the ball.

[GoBills808]

He was to blame for #s 4 and 5. Needs to pull the trigger regardless of the pressure and trust his read. Although #5 was 3rd and 29 so I give him a bit of a pass.

 

Anyone trying to say Allen is at fault for a sack where Groy literally sashays out of the way and lets his man free up the middle or where Ducasse gets lifted up and driven into Allen's lap like he's on roller skates...that's literally, unequivocally, textbook the line failing at performing their job. Has nothing to do with the QB. Joe Montana would have taken those sacks.

[The Jokeman]

5 hours ago, Starr Almighty said:

Why is it that the Bills hardly run screen plays to slow down the rush. They used it all the time with Thurman.

Maybe Daboll isn't showing his full playbook in the preseason and/or doesn't trust his Oline is good enough to run the screen. Time will tell.

[CEN-CAL17]

Gotta hit the 2-3 yd routes. Like the Pats. The ball is usually out under 2 seconds.

 

Those 2-3 completions always lead to 2nd and 5, 2nd and 3.... Shougun, turn and throw.

[K-9]

5 minutes ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said:

Gotta hit the 2-3 yd routes. Like the Pats. The ball is usually out under 2 seconds.

 

Those 2-3 completions always lead to 2nd and 5, 2nd and 3.... Shougun, turn and throw.

This will be the philosophy of Daboll's offense. Chunk plays have their place, but they are most effectively set up by a series of chain moving, smaller gains for first downs that keep drives alive and the defense on the field. Chunk plays occur most often when defenses get frustrated and start cheating up on the shorter routes. 

 

I also think Daboll will utilize tempo changes very frequently, especially when he gets favorable matchups. 

[frostbitmic]

To put it simply ...

 

Sack #1 - Defense unblocked

Sack #2 - Defense unblocked

Sack #3 - Defense unblocked

Sack #4 - Defense laughs at those attempting to block

Sack #5 - Offensive line just plain and simple should never play football again

[Augie]

9 hours ago, Da webster guy said:

 I have always thought Ducasse had blackmail pictures of Juan Castillo.  Never understood the love that Juan has had for the guy, I can only assume he pushed for Beane to acquire him and feels he has a stake in the guy.

 

Why doesn't Terry pick up a McNally type guy as a consultant for the Oline to help us make sense of all this?

 

Who does Castillo have pictures of? 

[PlayoffsPlease]

9 hours ago, cd1 said:

 

That is some twisted thinking right there!

 

"Hey, let's hang the baby out the window to see if he will cry..."

 

The rookie needs an opportunity to test his wings a succeed - not be thrust to the ground.  There is not much to be learned from looking in the rear view mirror while running for your life and spitting dirt from your mouth all day.

Allen isn't hyper sensitive EJ Manuel. Allen wants the ball, has total confidence that he is the best QB on the Bills. And he is the best QB on the Bills. He is timex, takes a licking keeps on ticking. 

[HappyDays]

4 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Joe Montana would have taken those sacks.

 

This is way off topic but it hit me that Josh Allen's nickname should be Joe Wyoming

[NewEraBills]

9 hours ago, Starr Almighty said:

Why is it that the Bills hardly run screen plays to slow down the rush. They used it all the time with Thurman.

Are these guys good at blocking on screens though that's the question.  I wouldn't trust Ducasse on ANYTHING

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

17 minutes ago, frostbitmic said:

To put it simply ...

 

Sack #1 - Defense unblocked

Sack #2 - Defense unblocked

Sack #3 - Defense unblocked

Sack #4 - Defense laughs at those attempting to block

Sack #5 - Offensive line just plain and simple should never play football again

Looks like the Chargers game

[The Process]

I'm good with Allen's performance...well compared to Tuh anyway.

I'm good with Allen's performance...well compared to Tuh anyway.

 

Hard to believe there was no penalty on throwing him to the ground. Cinci has had a thug culture on D for years now.

[Trogdor]

9 hours ago, Starr Almighty said:

Why is it that the Bills hardly run screen plays to slow down the rush. They used it all the time with Thurman.

I could never understand this with Sammy either. That guy dominated with the screen in college, and I think I saw it to him once.

18 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

Looks like the Chargers game

At least they touched them this time lol

[The Process]

25 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

This is way off topic but it hit me that Josh Allen's nickname should be Joe Wyoming

Backed up by AJ Bama and Nate Pa

[26CornerBlitz]

Film Study: Buffalo Bills rookie quarterback Josh Allen vs. Cincinnati Bengals (1:45)

[transplantbillsfan]

10 hours ago, Fadingpain said:

Sack #3 is a good example of Allen not getting the ball out.

 

Coleman was open for the majority of his route and probably the guy he should have thrown the ball to.  Would have been a short gain, but better than a sack.  The guy making the video writes a caption on the screen that Coleman is covered.  Not really.

Watch it again.

 

 

 

Watched sack 3 a ton of times.

 

You fail to account for the fact that a QB has 2 eyes and a progression of reads to go through and, clearly, Benjamin was his 1st read on that play.

 

There's the possibility he could have gotten it to Coleman, but you're talking milliseconds here. Pulling that ball down and not throwing it on that play may have made the difference between a sack and an INT.

10 hours ago, jrober38 said:

Even if Coleman is "covered", it's still a pass he can throw to avoid the sack. It's a crossing route with the defender behind the receiver. The chances of it getting picked are slim to none and a sack should have been avoided here. 

 

Whoa.

 

This is a really ignorant statement.

 

No, here you're just flat out wrong. Take the sack over throwing to a covered defender crossing the middle.

 

Coaches across the NFL widely disagree with you...

 

Sack >>>>>> INT

 

And you absolutely risk an INT throwing to a covered WR across the middle.

[ColdFront_USAF]

21 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Putting this here for those who missed it the post game thread.

 

Here is an article about Tom Brady's release time in the 2016 season. His season average was 2.57 seconds, which is correctly regarded as lightning fast. If one of the greatest to ever play the game takes 2.57 seconds to release the ball, I have no idea how anybody could expect a rookie in his first start to properly deal with a line that only gives him 2.1 on average. Brady's fastest average release time during the game they discuss in the article was 1.99 seconds, which was an average of 4 snaps in which the Steelers sent a 5 man rush. Even that, which is pretty incredible, would have barely cut it with our lines average protection time, and that includes plays with 4 or less rushers. 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Will Josh Allen ever live this down?  

 

 

I kid I kid .....   no humor in some people 

[Captain_Quint]

12 hours ago, K-9 said:

This will be the philosophy of Daboll's offense. Chunk plays have their place, but they are most effectively set up by a series of chain moving, smaller gains for first downs that keep drives alive and the defense on the field. Chunk plays occur most often when defenses get frustrated and start cheating up on the shorter routes. 

 

I also think Daboll will utilize tempo changes very frequently, especially when he gets favorable matchups. 

Yes, I think so too. Which is why I think Peterman gets the day 1 start, even if it's only for a few weeks. 

[BuffaloHokie13]

11 hours ago, The Process said:

Backed up by AJ Bama and Nate Pa

Nate Pitt(ofMisery)

[jrober38]

6 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

This is a really ignorant statement.

 

No, here you're just flat out wrong. Take the sack over throwing to a covered defender crossing the middle.

 

Coaches across the NFL widely disagree with you...

 

Sack >>>>>> INT

 

And you absolutely risk an INT throwing to a covered WR across the middle.

 

How on Earth is that pass getting intercepted?

 

The defender is behind the receiver, and it's a short pass. The odds of him breaking in front to intercept the pass are practically non existent.

 

Allen needs to feel the pressure, and throw the ball down and away where only his guy has a chance of catching it and avoid the sack for a loss of 8 yards. 

[Julio Hopkins]

Huh, people are complaining about the offensive scheme/playcalling in a preseason game.

[Ralonzo]

13 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

This is way off topic but it hit me that Josh Allen's nickname should be Joe Wyoming

 

I would like to have seen Wyoming.

[Warcodered]

11 minutes ago, Ralonzo said:

 

I would like to have seen Wyoming.

If that's Red October wasn't he talking about Montana? Where he'd go on to be a paleontologist until one day he was invited to a certain island.

[ddaryl]

10 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

Film Study: Buffalo Bills rookie quarterback Josh Allen vs. Cincinnati Bengals (1:45)

 

Its safe to say if Allen makes those throws in the video he's our starting QB.. It was a clear example of why he needs a little more time 

14 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

This is way off topic but it hit me that Josh Allen's nickname should be Joe Wyoming

Is that a play on Johnny Utah

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, ddaryl said:

 

Its safe to say if Allen makes those throws in the video he's our starting QB.. It was a clear example of why he needs a little more time 

 

It was definitely a set back after the week 2 Browns' game where he has making those types of throws. 

[Bray Wyatt]

10 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

Film Study: Buffalo Bills rookie quarterback Josh Allen vs. Cincinnati Bengals (1:45)

 

I feel like on the first one he was looking for a bigger play on 2nd and 2 which is why he didnt take the 3 yarder. Going forward hopefully he realizes to take a first down if its given to him, esp on that side of the field.

 

The second play you can see he cocks his arm but for some reason didnt throw it. Going forward I think he needs to just trust himself a bit more, as he looked to have made the right read.

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[jrober38]

6 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 

Completely agree.

 

Bills fans need to grow some thick skin with Allen as our QB. There are going to be some major growing pains over the next couple years as he tries to figure out how to play quarterback. If people are expecting a smooth ride for a guy who pretty much everyone said was a 2-3 year project then they're going to be extremely disappointed. 

 

I don't think this is bad long term, but I completely agree that Allen isn't ready to play, and as Carter said, "there's nothing wrong with that." He's got the tools, he just needs time to figure out how to use them properly. 

 

The Bills had a bad offense last year (29th in yards, 22nd in points) and they got worse at QB and on the OL. It's hard to imagine them winning many games with that should be one of the 3-4 lowest scoring offenses in the league this year. 

Edited August 29, 2018 by jrober38

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 hours ago, Julio Hopkins said:

Huh, people are complaining about the offensive scheme/playcalling in a preseason game.

 

....old news...complaining actually started in OTA's......busts and cuts projected.............

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Jenna Wolf   damn haven't seen her on TV in a while 

 

  

Edited August 29, 2018 by ShadyBillsFan

[Doc]

11 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

Film Study: Buffalo Bills rookie quarterback Josh Allen vs. Cincinnati Bengals (1:45)

 

Allen played against the Bengals' 1st string in the all-important 3rd pre-season game whereas Rosen played against the Saints' 2nd and 3rd string in the 2nd pre-season game.  Great "study." 

[Jay_Fixit]

17 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

This is way off topic but it hit me that Josh Allen's nickname should be Joe Wyoming

Dude.

[LABILLBACKER]

2 seconds is not enough time for a Rookie qb to survey the field.  Replace Miller with Teller. Groy has to step up!

[jrober38]

53 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

A lot extremely sensitive Bills fans in regards to Allen.

 

He may suck, he may be awesome. Right now we have no clue.

 

The last 20 years of first round QBs picked in the first round tells us he's probably going to suck. 

 

Nothing about his preseason suggested he's ready to lead an NFL offense in regular season games. He did a few nice things, and there's stuff the build on, but the notion that we need to see what he can do immediately makes hardly any sense when you consider how big a project he was coming out of Wyoming. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

On 8/28/2018 at 10:41 AM, whatdrought said:

This is very illuminating. Josh definitely missed some things, but had very little to work with and even when he had time, he had pressure in his grill. 

 

I think the thing that bothers me is that the D-line was making the O-line its you know what all game and we didn't adjust at all. We didn't go to short dumps, or keeping a blocking end in, or chipping with the running backs. 

 

Our biggest pet peeve last year was a game plan that had no fluidity... I really hope we don't see that this year. 

 

I also don't like the last video where he said "failed to pull trigger" but didn't show us the downfield perspective. I could be missing it by not reading the article, but definitely need context on that. 

 

Last years OC looked to be a stubborn stubborn man, 

 

He forced one of the all time great shotgun pocket passes to run playaction in Denver (unless that was kubiak....)

 

then forced an incredibly mobile,  marginal pocket passer who threw outside the hashes best, into WCO (unless someone else was actually pulling the strings there too.) 

 

It may be impossible that Daboll is less dynamic than rico

 

 

20 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

2 seconds is not enough time for a Rookie qb to survey the field.  Replace Miller with Teller. Groy has to step up!

 

2 seconds isn’t enough for Brady, Brees or Rodgers. 

 

Anyone who who thinks Peterman will handle it is kidding themselves. 

[26CornerBlitz]

FWIW