BuffaloBaumer Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Other than the obvious concern of Allen panning out over the next 2 years, I think these two players are what could really bring a lot of hate towards the new regime. If both of these guys don't contribute in a big way to the defense, it is going to bring the whole squad down in a hurry. Time will tell but if these two flame out, a lot of "what ifs" will surface about that $$ going to Oline and receivers instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bray Wyatt Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 I think they can get out of both of these contracts pretty easily if im not mistaken 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 And if you'd given $$ to WRs and O linemen they'd get criticized for doing nothing on the D line. Take the long view. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Season hasn't even started yet. For heaven's sake. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 I don't think either was brought here thinking they'd be All-Pro. Placeholders, at best. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBaumer Posted August 27, 2018 Author Share Posted August 27, 2018 Just now, oldmanfan said: And if you'd given $$ to WRs and O linemen they'd get criticized for doing nothing on the D line. Take the long view. Yes, but I think it was much more important to help you star player that you took at #7 and focus on the defense next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricojes Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Bray Wyatt said: I think they can get out of both of these contracts pretty easily if im not mistaken That's the key. If they can get out of contract's and it didn't work out...buh-bye. They need to stay out of the dead money hell from the previous regime's. Edited August 27, 2018 by ricojes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBaumer Posted August 27, 2018 Author Share Posted August 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, Bray Wyatt said: I think they can get out of both of these contracts pretty easily if im not mistaken Well that's a different story then...hopefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bray Wyatt Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Just now, BuffaloBaumer said: Well that's a different story then...hopefully. I thought I heard murphys was the easiest with us being able to save cap next year if needed and I think Stars we save 1 mil next year and more the year after if cut, I am sure someone will clarify though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 1 minute ago, BuffaloBaumer said: Yes, but I think it was much more important to help you star player that you took at #7 and focus on the defense next year. I see that. I suspect they felt Groy steps in for Wood. I don't know that anyone expected Richie to go off the rails like that. But I agree they could have drafted another G in addition to Teller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 7 minutes ago, Bray Wyatt said: I think they can get out of both of these contracts pretty easily if im not mistaken Lotulelei is fine after year 2. Murphy after year 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 6 minutes ago, BuffaloBaumer said: Yes, but I think it was much more important to help you star player that you took at #7 and focus on the defense next year. You should always reach for players to theoretically help your 'star' player who isn't going to play this year barring injury... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalScotts Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 well one is huge in the run defense and pass rush..the other huge in the pas rush and they havent played in the preseason. Star very little- they are proven good players calm down its preseason. This regime i fairly certain didnt get them to help in preseason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in STL Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 32 minutes ago, BuffaloBaumer said: Other than the obvious concern of Allen panning out over the next 2 years, I think these two players are what could really bring a lot of hate towards the new regime. If both of these guys don't contribute in a big way to the defense, it is going to bring the whole squad down in a hurry. Time will tell but if these two flame out, a lot of "what ifs" will surface about that $$ going to Oline and receivers instead. “Bring the whole squad down in a hurry” ... LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Star is never going to be a stat king for this team, and I am fine with that. He is there principaly to eat up space and free up LBs. As long as he does that I am fine. He is different from Ted "Theodore the Slender" Washington, because he ate up space and could make plays. However, and again to be clear, they didn't sign him expecting him to be like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msw2112 Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 The starting defense looks terrible and the starting O-line looks worse than that. In addition to seeing nothing positive so far out of Murphy or Star, Vonte Davis looks pretty bad too and no doubt much worse than EJ Gaines looked last year (when he was healthy enough to play). It's only pre-season, so I am willing to give the front office the benefit of the doubt, but there are some things to be concerned about. As other threads have pointed out, and anyone who has watched the last two games will attest to, the starting OL is probably cause for increased concern.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 (edited) 2 minutes ago, msw2112 said: The starting defense looks terrible and the starting O-line looks worse than that. In addition to seeing nothing positive so far out of Murphy or Star, Vonte Davis looks pretty bad too and no doubt much worse than EJ Gaines looked last year (when he was healthy enough to play). It's only pre-season, so I am willing to give the front office the benefit of the doubt, but there are some things to be concerned about. As other threads have pointed out, and anyone who has watched the last two games will attest to, the starting OL is probably cause for increased concern.... Unfortunately, this scares the crap out of me. Considering how low the price tag got on EJ (4 million or so) I still would have signed him to hedge our bets at CB this year. Edited August 27, 2018 by dollars 2 donuts 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Hope it’s just pre season and these guys get in gear the next few weeks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Star is going to go down as way overpaid. However gonna take three years to really be able to move on from his contract. Trent Murphy on the other hand is really a year by year contract and easily can move on any year after this on for little dead money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 What an original thread.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacklabel Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 I think both players will be alright and have decent seasons. It's been said umpteen bajillion times already but Lotulelei is here to eat up space, occupy multiple blockers and free up the linebackers. That was his role in Carolina, that'll be his role here. As described by McBeane, he's a selfless player that doesn't mind doing the dirty work. He's not gonna show up in a big way on the stat sheet each week but hopefully the work he is doing allows the guys behind him to make plays. And prior to Murphy's injury, he racked up 9.5 sacks and was second overall in the league in QB pressures. I know he's still coming back from the knee and now a groin but beyond his abilities as a player, he's here because he's 100% a process type of guy. His work ethic is off the charts and he wants to win which is exactly the type of guys McBeane want in their locker room. We know yesterday sucked, honestly, not just the OL, but most of the team looked unprepared and uninterested. I gotta think a little bit of that is on the coaching with the constant switching up and substitutions. I know they wanna get a look at certain guys in certain spots but sooner rather than later they need to construct the starting lineups on either side of the ball and let those guys start gaining chemistry together. Name your center, name your QB, etc. Let these dudes start working together exclusively during practices and see if they can get it going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 1 hour ago, Bray Wyatt said: I think they can get out of both of these contracts pretty easily if im not mistaken These 2 guys are a classic example of why NFL contracts aren't 100% guaranteed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Star will be fine as they are not game planning, and he is providing a push up the middle so the QB can’t step up so it is easier for our DE to get around and grab opposing QB’s. If Murphy is not looking better by next Saturday, they’ll drop him as they don’t want to pay his salary after Saturday. He knows it so he’ll probably do everything possible TR night to prove he is full speed. It’s his only chance to make the team. After Saturday, those contracts are not guaranteed in his base, so teams would pick him up after game 1if they think he can play. We could also do the same thing as we can cut him anytime we want after week1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 2 hours ago, Bray Wyatt said: I think they can get out of both of these contracts pretty easily if im not mistaken Star's contact is a nightmare if he sucks. Lots of dead cap for the first 3 years. Cap hits are: $6.7, $11.5, $10.1 Dead cap if cut early is: $18.6 ('18) $12.4 ('19) $7.8 ('20) Earliest potential out according to sportrac is after 2020 and would leave $5.2 in dead cap for 2021. We are stuck with him at least 3 years. Murphy is a $4.5 mil hit this year with $7.9 of dead cap He's a $9 mil hit each of the next two years if we keep him If we cut him after this year it's only a $3.5 dead cap hit His is a much better contract if he sucks. Star's is a mess if he sucks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 2 hours ago, Bray Wyatt said: I think they can get out of both of these contracts pretty easily if im not mistaken ...hope so...another "Spent Trent" coming off major injury AND PED suspension makes zero sense to me......despite looking fairly decent in pre-season..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 The Process needs to unf*** this or The Process will be out of a job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 They needed to do something on the d line. Kyle is 107 bless him and Adolphus Washington was the worst defensive tackle I had the misfortune to watch during 2017 across the whole league. Then the pass rush was poor. Shaq who by everyone's agreement is not a pass rush specialist and missed the last 7 games injured led the team in sacks with 4. I am worried about Star though. There was a noticeable lack of effort at Cleveland and that was a known knock on him in Carolina - he gets lazy. I am worried about Murphy too. I actually think he will have an impact if he can get on the field but at the moment that looks a big, big if. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 13 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: They needed to do something on the d line. Kyle is 107 bless him and Adolphus Washington was the worst defensive tackle I had the misfortune to watch during 2017 across the whole league. Then the pass rush was poor. Shaq who by everyone's agreement is not a pass rush specialist and missed the last 7 games injured led the team in sacks with 4. I am worried about Star though. There was a noticeable lack of effort at Cleveland and that was a known knock on him in Carolina - he gets lazy. I am worried about Murphy too. I actually think he will have an impact if he can get on the field but at the moment that looks a big, big if. Star got that big contract now he's living large. The lack of hustle is a real concern with him. Murphy at least is only one year that's a waste on his deal, we can cut him for minimal (3.5) dead cap after this year. Star is a nightmare contract if he is anything but borderline probowl or better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YattaOkasan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 34 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said: Star's contact is a nightmare if he sucks. Lots of dead cap for the first 3 years. Cap hits are: $6.7, $11.5, $10.1 Dead cap if cut early is: $18.6 ('18) $12.4 ('19) $7.8 ('20) Earliest potential out according to sportrac is after 2020 and would leave $5.2 in dead cap for 2021. We are stuck with him at least 3 years. Murphy is a $4.5 mil hit this year with $7.9 of dead cap He's a $9 mil hit each of the next two years if we keep him If we cut him after this year it's only a $3.5 dead cap hit His is a much better contract if he sucks. Star's is a mess if he sucks. You get savings cutting Star in 2020 so we are stuck with him for 2 years. The savings for Trent after this year are > 5 mil so thats a very easy contract to get out of. We also have a ton of cap space starting next year so Im not too worried about dead cap as I would other years because we can still afford a replacement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said: You get savings cutting Star in 2020 so we are stuck with him for 2 years. The savings for Trent after this year are > 5 mil so thats a very easy contract to get out of. We also have a ton of cap space starting next year so Im not too worried about dead cap as I would other years because we can still afford a replacement. Star savings is cutting him after 2020 and before the 2021 season for big savings He's still 8 mil of dead cap if you cut him after 19 So we are on the hook for 2 years minimum, more like 3, if he sucks. It's a bad contract that was panned universally when he as signed. Anyway, he looks terrible and lazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 23 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said: Star got that big contract now he's living large. The lack of hustle is a real concern with him. Murphy at least is only one year that's a waste on his deal, we can cut him for minimal (3.5) dead cap after this year. Star is a nightmare contract if he is anything but borderline probowl or better. Star doesnt have a nightmare contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 2 minutes ago, Bangarang said: Star doesnt have a nightmare contract. Try again. Cap hits are: $6.7, $11.5, $10.1 Dead cap if cut early is: $18.6 ('18) $12.4 ('19) $7.8 ('20) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
without a drought Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 1 hour ago, The_Dude said: The Process needs to unf*** this or The Process will be out of a job. You seem to untrust the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 11 minutes ago, The Drought said: You seem to untrust the process. The Process is unproven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frostbitmic Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Stupid question here, but ... Are the contracts of Star and Murphy guaranteed if they Don't make the team ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domdab99 Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Murphy Star Bodine Newhouse Davis Gaines Kerly Coleman These are not good pick ups, and the Bills will be hard-pressed to win 6 games this year if the players are getting a lot of snaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 Yup, 8/27/18, and the sky is falling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dadonkadonk Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 1 hour ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...hope so...another "Spent Trent" coming off major injury AND PED suspension makes zero sense to me......despite looking fairly decent in pre-season..... When did he look decent? Pretty sure he hasnt taken a snap in a game yet. Injured in camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Bills Fan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 3 hours ago, msw2112 said: The starting defense looks terrible and the starting O-line looks worse than that. In addition to seeing nothing positive so far out of Murphy or Star, Vonte Davis looks pretty bad too and no doubt much worse than EJ Gaines looked last year (when he was healthy enough to play). It's only pre-season, so I am willing to give the front office the benefit of the doubt, but there are some things to be concerned about. As other threads have pointed out, and anyone who has watched the last two games will attest to, the starting OL is probably cause for increased concern.... Gaines poor guy tons of injuries but hell of a good player. At times so worried one more injury puts him on IR 21 minutes ago, Domdab99 said: Murphy Star Bodine Newhouse Davis Gaines Kerly Coleman These are not good pick ups, and the Bills will be hard-pressed to win 6 games this year if the players are getting a lot of snaps. Limited cap space hurt so much to be honest, 43 minutes ago, The Drought said: You seem to untrust the process. He's been released! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 1 hour ago, SouthNYfan said: Try again. Cap hits are: $6.7, $11.5, $10.1 Dead cap if cut early is: $18.6 ('18) $12.4 ('19) $7.8 ('20) You’re looking at pre June 1st cut numbers. Cut after June 1st isn’t nearly as bad. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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