Albany,n.y. Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 https://buffalonews.com/sports/bills/bills-to-sell-personal-seat-licenses-to-help-pay-for-private-portion-of-new-stadium/article_c16caec0-1be5-11ec-967c-1fdcafe359cf.html Not only are ticket prices bound to increase for NFL games at the Buffalo Bills’ proposed new stadium in Orchard Park, but season ticket holders will likely first have to pay $1,000 or more for the privilege to buy them. Bills owners Kim and Terry Pegula plan to pay for a portion of their share of any “public/private partnership” struck with New York State and Erie County to construct a new stadium by selling personal seat licenses, a revenue source used to help pay for more than half the stadiums in the league. “We will definitely have PSLs as part of a new stadium,” said Ron Raccuia, the executive vice president and lead negotiator for Pegula Sports and Entertainment, during an interview this week with The Buffalo News. “Every new stadium that’s opened since 2009 have utilized PSLs.” Bills to sell about 50,000 PSLs, season tickets The Bills’ least expensive PSLs in their proposed new stadium are expected to begin around $1,000, Raccuia said, and the requirement to buy a PSL will apply to every season ticket holder. A price range has not been determined. Raccuia said the PSLs will be perpetual and transferrable, meaning they will not need to be renewed and can be resold to a third party. 1 2 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ManRaid Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Well there goes my hope of getting season tickets. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Welcome to the NFL. 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Is anyone surprised by this? At least it's only a one-time charge and transferable. 21 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 And this surprises who? 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southtown Tommy Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 A PSL is a one-time charge, right? If so, it's reasonable based on ~$1,000 for the least expensive license. Price of doing business and having an NFL team in your backyard. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, 1ManRaid said: Well there goes my hope of getting season tickets. Why? It's very likely that PSL's can be spread over a few seasons. So the impact will be blunted. It will be an extra bump of $10-20 per ticket. Personally I've been expecting this. But they better make this stadium worth it. Edited September 24, 2021 by PromoTheRobot 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stgm1993 Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Best part if it is one time fee as it states and then can be resold to a third party your could make your money back or even profit on selling your psl when you decide you no longer want tickets 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillies Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 What a business. I would love to see the skid marks in front of me if I told my clients, "Yes, I want your business, but you first need to pay me in order for me to take your business." 1 1 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wiz Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 16 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: Is anyone surprised by this? At least it's only a one-time charge and transferable. Although I agree, at the same time, depending on how much a good seat license cost, you could be spending, ill venture to guess, up to 8k for 4 seats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 1 minute ago, The Wiz said: Although I agree, at the same time, depending on how much a good seat license cost, you could be spending, ill venture to guess, up to 8k for 4 seats. Thems the breaks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfanmiamioh Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, The Wiz said: Although I agree, at the same time, depending on how much a good seat license cost, you could be spending, ill venture to guess, up to 8k for 4 seats. Im in section 109 and I kind of had in my head that $2500 a seat would be in the ballpark. I bet the primo seats might command something like 4-5k each. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuseBill Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, The Wiz said: Although I agree, at the same time, depending on how much a good seat license cost, you could be spending, ill venture to guess, up to 8k for 4 seats. If you do the math, it's unlikely very many seats would have PSL's in the $1,000-2,000 range. They need a lot more money up front to finance the amount they are likely going to be asked to contribute. If 60,000 seats averaged $2,000 per PSL, that's only $120 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ticketssince61 Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Not unexpected, but the problem is that not only do you pay for the PSL but you still have to pay for your tickets which I am sure prices will go up. I have 8 lower level seats between the yard lines. I don't think I would want to pay $20,000 to $40,000 for the right to buy my season tickets where the price will go up from 135 a ticket to probably 200 a ticket (and those seats were $90 just a few years ago) I had great Rams seats when they first came back to LA, but it was around $50K to buy a PSL so I gave them up when they moved to SOFI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 How much money could this actually raise? If it's just a couple of million (yes, I know that sounds odd) it doesn't seem worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfanmiamioh Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 10 minutes ago, ticketssince61 said: Not unexpected, but the problem is that not only do you pay for the PSL but you still have to pay for your tickets which I am sure prices will go up. I have 8 lower level seats between the yard lines. I don't think I would want to pay $20,000 to $40,000 for the right to buy my season tickets where the price will go up from 135 a ticket to probably 200 a ticket (and those seats were $90 just a few years ago) I had great Rams seats when they first came back to LA, but it was around $50K to buy a PSL so I gave them up when they moved to SOFI This is exactly why I have reduced my number of seats down to 4 in the lower level. And also the reason I haven’t gone with Kelly club. I’m prepared to pony up for a PSL on my current 4, but was worried if I had switched to Kelly club at some point I’d be priced out of a new stadium and have to go back to the bottom seniority wise for regular seats. I think they kind of treat seniority for club seats and the rest as separate entities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 This is not news. News would be if they stated they were NOT going to do that. In fact, that would be huge news. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiotAct Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Not TOO bad considering it’s a one-time charge. Obviously some STH’ers will balk, but I’m guessing very few will. Even if we’re a middling team again (God forbid) when the time comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 (edited) 25 minutes ago, CuseBill said: If you do the math, it's unlikely very many seats would have PSL's in the $1,000-2,000 range. They need a lot more money up front to finance the amount they are likely going to be asked to contribute. If 60,000 seats averaged $2,000 per PSL, that's only $120 million. If they're going to pony up roughly $1B, then that's at least a nice 10% discount. If it's a 50/50 split of $1.2B, then that's a 20% discount off their $600M. Not bad. Edited September 24, 2021 by DrDawkinstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 I don’t care how many teams do it. This is the definition of greed 1 1 3 3 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Just now, Virgil said: I don’t care how many teams do it. This is the definition of greed Similar to airlines charging for luggage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wppete Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 34 minutes ago, BuffaloBillies said: What a business. I would love to see the skid marks in front of me if I told my clients, "Yes, I want your business, but you first need to pay me in order for me to take your business." It really is amazing. Greed is off the charts. I thought the Pegulas were good for Buffalo but appears they are full on sharks. Losing a lot of respect learning about how they do business. Unfortunate. 1 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Just now, Virgil said: I don’t care how many teams do it. This is the definition of greed If people want your business's products and services so badly that there is a waiting list to simply buy it from you, and you can charge a premium for the privilege of doing business... that's just good ol American capitalism, my man. 3 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuseBill Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Just now, DrDawkinstein said: If they're going to pony up roughly $1B, then that's at least a nice 10% discount. That's a fair point if we're talking about a discount on most things. But that's not the way rich people think and that's why they're rich and the rest of us are not. Also, I'd be surprised if their share of the cost approaches $1 billion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 1 minute ago, CuseBill said: That's a fair point if we're talking about a discount on most things. But that's not the way rich people think and that's why they're rich and the rest of us are not. Also, I'd be surprised if their share of the cost approaches $1 billion. Yeah, see my edit on the lower cost. It makes their discount even higher. I'd say this is right in line with the way rich people operate. They'll milk any penny they can, no matter how trivial it seems, in order to hang onto their own pennies. If it's $120M, then so be it. They'll take it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patience Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, RiotAct said: Not TOO bad considering it’s a one-time charge. Obviously some STH’ers will balk, but I’m guessing very few will. Even if we’re a middling team again (God forbid) when the time comes. I agree that very few STHs will walk because of it. I'm presuming that the team did quite a bit of market research on how best to price PSLs to both retain season ticket holders and effectively implement a system like this. The lower-capacity stadium also makes quite a bit more sense now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ticketssince61 Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, Patience said: I'm presuming that the team did quite a bit of market research on how best to price PSLs to both retain season ticket holders and effectively implement a system like this. I had Rams season tickets and was sent a detailed survey on my views on pricing and options on PSL's. I have 8 Bills tix and was not sent any info. Did any season tix holders receive a survey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 44 minutes ago, BuffaloBillies said: What a business. I would love to see the skid marks in front of me if I told my clients, "Yes, I want your business, but you first need to pay me in order for me to take your business." Good news! , you only need to pay me a lot of money once to have the right to pay me a lot more money on a recurring basis! 10 minutes ago, wppete said: It really is amazing. Greed is off the charts. I thought the Pegulas were good for Buffalo but appears they are full on sharks. Losing a lot of respect learning about how they do business. Unfortunate. it’s not solely Pegula’s it’s the league. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 1 minute ago, ticketssince61 said: I had Rams season tickets and was sent a detailed survey on my views on pricing and options on PSL's. I have 8 Bills tix and was not sent any info. Did any season tix holders receive a survey? Not that I know of, but I feel the Pegulas took a much lower profile on all their research. And rightfully so with what a "small town" Buffalo is, and how difficult enough it is to control leaks and rumors. Whereas everyone knew the Rams were looking to build a new stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 I wonder if the PSL will allow them to open up season tickets to people outside the 716. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalftimeAdjustment Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 10 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: Yeah, see my edit on the lower cost. It makes their discount even higher. I'd say this is right in line with the way rich people operate. They'll milk any penny they can, no matter how trivial it seems, in order to hang onto their own pennies. If it's $120M, then so be it. They'll take it. An acquisitive nature is part of how the rich got that way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiotAct Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Will be interesting to see the PSL price for the premium sections (111/112/133/134). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: it’s not solely Pegula’s it’s the league. Correct, but it's even beyond the NFL. PSLs have been a part of almost all pro sports. Even auto racing. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shane nelson Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Clearly not a shocker, hopefully they offer an installment plan and the average fan can afford the cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhoTom Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 23 minutes ago, Virgil said: I don’t care how many teams do it. This is the definition of greed 21 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: that's just good ol American capitalism, my man. You're both correct. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 The thought of paying an organization just for the ability to pay the same organization for a product disgusts me. How this became acceptable to fans completely blows my mind. It's nothing I would ever do; that's for sure. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetermansRedemption Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 (edited) I’ve never understood why PSL’s ever became a thing. Why not just raise season tickets prices the equivalent amount? I just don’t see how creating a separate charge ever became preferable for the team or the buyers. Edited September 24, 2021 by PetermansRedemption Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Ticket prices will go up, but IMO there is more pricing power in this market than the team has been trying to tap. If a ticket costs an extra $25 that isn't going to dissuade many people from going, especially now when the team is good. This is actually the perfect time for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 1 hour ago, BuffaloBillies said: What a business. I would love to see the skid marks in front of me if I told my clients, "Yes, I want your business, but you first need to pay me in order for me to take your business." Or, the cost of doing business with me will now cost you $1,000 more. It’s a free market and we are free to participate in that market or not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 30 minutes ago, Virgil said: I don’t care how many teams do it. This is the definition of greed How so? You are charging the stadium user part of the cost of building a new stadium. 2 minutes ago, PetermansRedemption said: I’ve never understood why PSL’s ever became a thing. Why not just raise season tickets prices the equivalent amount? I just don’t see how creating a separate charge ever became preferable for the team or the buyers. Ticket revenue is shared with the visiting team. PSL's are not. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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