Schein - Nine Make-or-Break players for 2021 (Ed Oliver)

[wppete]

https://www.nfl.com/news/daniel-jones-ezekiel-elliott-odell-beckham-jr-among-nfl-s-make-or-break-players-
 

6. Ed Oliver - Buffalo Bills · DT

 

I'm not giving up on Oliver, but he took a step back in 2020 after a solid rookie season. And the Bills need the No. 9 overall pick from the 2019 draft to take a gigantic step forward in 2021.

 

As proven by last year's 13-3 regular season and ensuing trip to the AFC title game, the Bills are legit. They are ready for prime time. But they need Oliver to become the monster he's capable of being, the kind of game wrecker up front who can disrupt someone like Patrick Mahomes in the playoffs.

 

 

Edited April 9, 2021 by wppete

[Royale with Cheese]

Fair.

[Nester]

Truth

[Boxcar]

Not entirely fair, Oliver was out of position quite a bit. We really need a true 1T for him to shine.

[IgotBILLStopay]

He did have a turbulent offseason last year. That being said, he played out of position a fair bit because of Star's opt out. Together, they make his 2021 performance potentially tantalizing. So I agree with him being on the list. Another quality Dlineman from the draft should only improve Oliver's performance.

[DJB]

He definitely needs to step up and in large part hasn't met expectations. That being said we haven't exactly put him in a position to succeed certainly last year. 

 

This year is huge. 

[TheBeaneBandit]

At some point he's gotta get more disruptive on passing downs. Aaron Donald don't need no stinkin 1tech lol, yeah I know there's only one AD.

[Don Otreply]

As said, EOs performance has been a result of our lack of an effective 1 tech  on the D line, we as fans can only hope that with the return of Star, and the possible acquisition of a drafted 1 tech we may be in a better situation this up coming season.  I am quite sure SM & BB have a clear understanding of this. 

[mannc]

14 minutes ago, Boxcar said:

Not entirely fair, Oliver was out of position quite a bit. We really need a true 1T for him to shine.

You may be right, but the 9th overall pick (in a very good draft) shouldn’t need help from another defensive player in order to “shine”.  

[Frat-Train]

Gross...

 

 

[Boxcar]

2 minutes ago, mannc said:

You may be right, but the 9th overall pick (in a very good draft) shouldn’t need help from another defensive player in order to “shine”.  

Not sure I agree with that. It's a team game. One of the reasons I think Mitch Morse gets pooped on so much is because he has to make up for the inadequacies at guard. Hopefully Feliciano plays better and Ford is solid to show some proof. Other Bills players are the same: Edmunds is way better with Milano on the field (and I still can't get over how it's not widespread thought that Milano is an amazing LB), and Poyer and Hyde are better together than they would be individually. Unless you're Aaron Donald, or TJ Watt or Joey/Nick Bosa, you definitely need a supporting cast to perform at your best and I don't think it's wrong just because Oliver went 9th overall. There are a tiny number of players who can carry a defense on their backs.

[mannc]

2 minutes ago, Boxcar said:

Not sure I agree with that. It's a team game. One of the reasons I think Mitch Morse gets pooped on so much is because he has to make up for the inadequacies at guard. Hopefully Feliciano plays better and Ford is solid to show some proof. Other Bills players are the same: Edmunds is way better with Milano on the field (and I still can't get over how it's not widespread thought that Milano is an amazing LB), and Poyer and Hyde are better together than they would be individually. Unless you're Aaron Donald, or TJ Watt or Joey/Nick Bosa, you definitely need a supporting cast to perform at your best and I don't think it's wrong just because Oliver went 9th overall. There are a tiny number of players who can carry a defense on their backs.

No one’s asking Oliver to “carry a defense on his back”.  It would be nice if he made a game-changing play every now and then though.  Or maybe even got a sack.  Or even a pressure.  We were told he was the kind of interior defender who was going to collapse the pocket and get after the passer.  So far, he’s JAG.

[Sherlock Holmes]

6 minutes ago, Boxcar said:

Not sure I agree with that. It's a team game. One of the reasons I think Mitch Morse gets pooped on so much is because he has to make up for the inadequacies at guard. Hopefully Feliciano plays better and Ford is solid to show some proof. Other Bills players are the same: Edmunds is way better with Milano on the field (and I still can't get over how it's not widespread thought that Milano is an amazing LB), and Poyer and Hyde are better together than they would be individually. Unless you're Aaron Donald, or TJ Watt or Joey/Nick Bosa, you definitely need a supporting cast to perform at your best and I don't think it's wrong just because Oliver went 9th overall. There are a tiny number of players who can carry a defense on their backs.

I love you 

 

You also forgot JJ Watt🧐

[Boxcar]

2 minutes ago, Sherlock Holmes said:

I love you 

 

You also forgot JJ Watt🧐

I was being current. And I love you too, I think.

[HOUSE]

4 minutes ago, Sherlock Holmes said:

I love you 

 

You also forgot JJ Watt🧐

Please wear a mask

[Boxcar]

6 minutes ago, mannc said:

No one’s asking Oliver to “carry a defense on his back”.  It would be nice if he made a game-changing play every now and then though.  Or maybe even got a sack.  Or even a pressure.  We were told he was the kind of interior defender who was going to collapse the pocket and get after the passer.  So far, he’s JAG.

You can't guarantee anything for any draftee. Trevor Lawrence could be an average QB. Kyle Pitts could be a mediocre TE. Given where he was drafted, should Oliver be able to do more on his own? Sure. It is what it is, though, make the best of it.

[Sherlock Holmes]

5 minutes ago, Boxcar said:

I was being current. And I love you too, I think.

That's why I wanted us to get him so badly, he can still wreak havoc solo.

3 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

Please wear a mask

I always use protection House💩

[mannc]

3 minutes ago, Boxcar said:

You can't guarantee anything for any draftee. Trevor Lawrence could be an average QB. Kyle Pitts could be a mediocre TE. Given where he was drafted, should Oliver be able to do more on his own? Sure. It is what it is, though, make the best of it.

You're right.  I'm just bitter about the Oliver pick because I thought he was terribly over-rated coming out of Houston.  I watched a few of their games his last year and he was pretty much invisible.  I never understood the hype.

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

#facts

[ganesh]

1 hour ago, Boxcar said:

Not entirely fair, Oliver was out of position quite a bit. We really need a true 1T for him to shine.

blame for iit then should go to the coaching staff

[Brennan Huff]

I would have put him higher on the list

[Doc]

I’ll be very disappointed if the Bills don’t draft a 1-tech this year.  Since they don’t go high, they should be able to get the best one. 

[dpberr]

The Bills do not ask him to rush the passer every down and he's being asked to complete several different assignments during any one game.  I think there have been many posts, pages and podcasts that show that.  The Bills are not allowing him to go Warren Sapp out there. 

 

I find fault with the Bills in a way - if they wanted an all-around DT talent, Ed Oliver probably wasn't the best choice for that and there were other DTs in that draft that could have provided that.  If they wanted a pure pass rushing talent, Ed Oliver is the player.  

 

 

[JustWinPlease]

1 hour ago, mannc said:

You may be right, but the 9th overall pick (in a very good draft) shouldn’t need help from another defensive player in order to “shine”.  

Josh Allen needed help from other players in order to "shine."

Every player does, that's why it's the ultimate team sport.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

1 hour ago, mannc said:

You may be right, but the 9th overall pick (in a very good draft) shouldn’t need help from another defensive player in order to “shine”.  

 

I'd at least have him line up where he fits.  I know he was playing 1T a fair amount especially early on with Phillips and Jefferson struggling.  

[Malazan]

the whole defense, especially the front 7 sucked last season. Not an excuse for any individual guy, but also there were obvious factors involved that went beyond his own play that affected him. 

 

That being said, it's year 3 now. There's no more excuses. You either show you can play at a high level regardless of circumstances around you or you put your house on the market.

 

I do hope the coaches make it easier for him though.

Edited April 9, 2021 by jeremy2020

[Jay_Fixit]

1 hour ago, Boxcar said:

Not entirely fair, Oliver was out of position quite a bit. We really need a true 1T for him to shine.

He’s the 9th overall pick. These are excuses made for a 5th round pick.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

😄

[Southern_Bills]

Fair statements, it was not an ideal setup for him last season no doubt, but we live in a results based world. Plenty of defensive players make it work in less than ideal situations. 

[Logic]

As was pointed out to me:

 

Kyle Williams never needed a great 1T next to him in order to shine. He was paired with nothing but crap for much of his career. He still made plays. And he was a fifth rounder!

 

I’d love a great 1T, too, but it’s not a valid excuse for Oliver to not wreak the havoc he’s capable of.

 

2021 is a HUGE year for Oliver. If he (and Epenesa, for that matter) take big steps, it could be enough to fix our pass rush issues.

[mannc]

43 minutes ago, JustWinPlease said:

Josh Allen needed help from other players in order to "shine."

Every player does, that's why it's the ultimate team sport.

Ridiculous.  Josh Allen shined very early on, despite his weak supporting cast.  This past year his supporting cast was much better, but he also raised their games.  Diggs and Beasley, for example, never before had seasons like they had in 2020. 

[babulator]

2 hours ago, Boxcar said:

Not entirely fair, Oliver was out of position quite a bit. We really need a true 1T for him to shine.

What other player gets the luxury of saying "if he had a better player next to him" he'd shine.

 

This is the NFL, players move around and get asked to play out of position at times. I don't remember saying this about KW. If you're selected #9 overall, you need to find a way to contribute more. On and off the stat sheet.

 

I'm not hating on Ed, but saying I'm disappointed doesn't quite cut it either.  We need more from Ed or he won't be around much longer.

[Boxcar]

37 minutes ago, babulator said:

What other player gets the luxury of saying "if he had a better player next to him" he'd shine.

 

This is the NFL, players move around and get asked to play out of position at times. I don't remember saying this about KW. If you're selected #9 overall, you need to find a way to contribute more. On and off the stat sheet.

 

I'm not hating on Ed, but saying I'm disappointed doesn't quite cut it either.  We need more from Ed or he won't be around much longer.

Ok, but the reality is that he isn't what a 9th overall pick is "supposed" to be, so we either make the best of the situation or do nothing and complain about it.

[LeviF]

2 hours ago, mannc said:

You may be right, but the 9th overall pick (in a very good draft) shouldn’t need help from another defensive player in order to “shine”.  

 

Then that's on Beane, not Oliver.

[mannc]

Just now, LeviF91 said:

 

Then that's on Beane, not Oliver.

Both, actually.

[LeviF]

4 minutes ago, mannc said:

Both, actually.

 

Not really.  If we assume, possibly correctly, that Oliver's ceiling is that of a very good 3T when he has a 1T that can eat blocks then he had no business being the 9th overall pick to begin with. 

 

Some guys just aren't ever going to be elite football players no matter the effort and time put in.  The failure by a GM to recognize that doesn't rest on the player's shoulders.

[H2o]

Oliver does need to step up, but he's under contract for at least two more years so it's not really all or nothing. He was also played at the 1-Tech a lot last season with Zimmer or Jefferson playing the 3-Tech. Getting Star back will help, but we need to draft a true 1-tech as well. I keep bringing up the name, but Bobby Brown III (Texas A&M) would look GREAT in a Bills uniform and I think coupled with Oliver on the DL would be dangerous for opposing offenses. 

[HappyDays]

1 hour ago, Logic said:

Kyle Williams never needed a great 1T next to him in order to shine. He was paired with nothing but crap for much of his career. He still made plays. And he was a fifth rounder!

 

I’d love a great 1T, too, but it’s not a valid excuse for Oliver to not wreak the havoc he’s capable of.

 

The argument isn't that Oliver didn't have a 1T next to him, it's that he was forced to play 1T himself which is not his natural position in the NFL. When he's asked to penetrate the line that's when he makes plays. It would be like if Kyle Williams had been asked to play 1T... In fact the player comparisons coming out of college are quite similar between them. Williams was also an undersized DT with a high motor and quick first step. Oliver needs to be kept in his natural position for his skill set to shine.

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

The argument isn't that Oliver didn't have a 1T next to him, it's that he was forced to play 1T himself which is not his natural position in the NFL. When he's asked to penetrate the line that's when he makes plays. It would be like if Kyle Williams had been asked to play 1T... In fact the player comparisons coming out of college are quite similar between them. Williams was also an undersized DT with a high motor and quick first step. Oliver needs to be kept in his natural position for his skill set to shine.

 

Agree. His rookie season was by rookie 3 tech in the NFL standards a roaring success. I do agree with those that say he needs to be more consistent in his play at 3T than he was in 2020. That is definitely true. Those who say there were no game changing plays are wrong, he had a few, but the criticism that at times he goes missing for periods in games is fair. 

 

However, I will not criticise him at all for his play at 1T in 2020. He played far too many snaps at that spot which he is ill suited for and that is on the staff not on him. 

[Logic]

21 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

The argument isn't that Oliver didn't have a 1T next to him, it's that he was forced to play 1T himself which is not his natural position in the NFL. When he's asked to penetrate the line that's when he makes plays. It would be like if Kyle Williams had been asked to play 1T... In fact the player comparisons coming out of college are quite similar between them. Williams was also an undersized DT with a high motor and quick first step. Oliver needs to be kept in his natural position for his skill set to shine.

Agreed. However, two things:

 

1.) Several people were, in fact, making the argument that he needs a good 1T next to him, right here in this thread.

 

2.) Even when he HAS had the chance to play 3T — because, let’s be honest, it’s not like he didn’t get the chance to do it a decent amount in 2020 — he has been inconsistent and hasn’t had the game-wrecking impact his talent would suggest he can. 
 

In any case, the three biggest potential improvements to our defense  would all come from young, highly drafted players making big leaps: Oliver, Epenesa, Edmunds. I view this coming season as a referendum on Oliver and Edmunds, in particular. If they make the jump, it transforms our defense. If they don’t, then the Bills will have tough decisions to make regarding contract extensions.