Peace Frog Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 (edited) Finally, one of our own O-linemen (kudos to D. Williams) recognized and reacted to a defender jumping offside due to Josh's hard count by moving out of his stance and creating the encroachment penalty in today's game. I realize it's only a 5 yard penalty but they certainly help, especially on a 3rd long situation. I couldn't tell you how many times this season I've seen defenders cross the neutral zone before the snap and our O-linemen stay in their stance. I applaud their discipline but 5 yards is 5 yards; why wouldn't you try to get that every time? Edited November 2, 2020 by Peace Frog 10 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 I actually like them running the play right at the end of the third quarter more so than the hard count. Bills have been showing that hard count attempt to get them to jump Offside all year and then they decided to snap it. First it was a good call for today but it will make the hard count a bit more effective down the stretch. Good move by Daboll/Allen 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said: I actually like them running the play right at the end of the third quarter more so than the hard count. Bills have been showing that hard count attempt to get them to jump Offside all year and then they decided to snap it. First it was a good call for today but it will make the hard count a bit more effective down the stretch. Good move by Daboll/Allen I think part of it is to prevent defenders from timing the snap and getting up field for easy pressure. They have to wait and be diligent and react rather than time the snap. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextmanup Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 The hard count was EJ Manuel's special trick, remember? Only it never worked. Josh truly does have an effective hard count that seems to throw defenses off consistently. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 3 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said: I actually like them running the play right at the end of the third quarter more so than the hard count. Bills have been showing that hard count attempt to get them to jump Offside all year and then they decided to snap it. First it was a good call for today but it will make the hard count a bit more effective down the stretch. Good move by Daboll/Allen Agreed. I HATE the hard count BS at the end of quarters where they so obviously never intended to snap it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Frog Posted November 2, 2020 Author Share Posted November 2, 2020 8 minutes ago, Nextmanup said: The hard count was EJ Manuel's special trick, remember? Only it never worked. Josh truly does have an effective hard count that seems to throw defenses off consistently. I specifically remember KC's defenders jumping offside at least 3 times because of Josh's hard count (let's just call it JHC, for short) that could've resulted in 15 easy yards had our own offense reacted to it. I'm glad we generally don't jump when Josh is barking but when they see a defender in the neutral zone, they should move as well and draw the easy 5 yarder. It could turn a 3rd & 7 into a more manageable 3rd & 2. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie's Dead Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Peace Frog said: Finally, one of our own O-linemen (kudos to D. Williams) recognized and reacted to a defender jumping offside due to Josh's hard count by moving out of his stance and creating the encroachment penalty in today's game. I realize it's only a 5 yard penalty but they certainly help, especially on a 3rd long situation. I couldn't tell you how many times this season I've seen defenders cross the neutral zone before the snap and our O-linemen stay in their stance. I applaud their discipline but 5 yards is 5 yards; why wouldn't you try to get that every time? I thought it was more like John Brown 10 yards downfield.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan Huff Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 2 hours ago, Nextmanup said: The hard count was EJ Manuel's special trick, remember? Only it never worked. Josh truly does have an effective hard count that seems to throw defenses off consistently. That was so embarrassing for EJ. Rex would trot him out on 4th and short and everybody in the building knew what was going on. Never worked. Rex Ryan was such an awful coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBBills Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Brennan Huff said: That was so embarrassing for EJ. Rex would trot him out on 4th and short and everybody in the building knew what was going on. Never worked. Rex Ryan was such an awful coach Why EJ got paid good money to go "Hut, Hut!" Not like he was good for much else anyway Edited November 2, 2020 by TBBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 I wish josh wouldn’t hold his hands up on the hard count. I think it was Peyton Manning that saw it first. A very large majority of the time when josh is doing a hard count he has his hands up like he’s gonna get the ball but when he actually gets the ball snapped to him he has his hands at his side and only lifts them when the ball is coming. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlbillsfan1975 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 I hope they are setting up the hard count before the two minute warning for a one time when they actually snap it and catch the d asleep. Otherwise, that is getting old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fasteddie Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 5 hours ago, Nextmanup said: The hard count was EJ Manuel's special trick, remember? Only it never worked. Josh truly does have an effective hard count that seems to throw defenses off consistently. I just got the ACC network and I saw EJ as an In studio analyst. He almost sounded like he knew what he was talking about. How he could be so bad on the field is beyond me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Not at the table Karlos said: I wish josh wouldn’t hold his hands up on the hard count. I think it was Peyton Manning that saw it first. A very large majority of the time when josh is doing a hard count he has his hands up like he’s gonna get the ball but when he actually gets the ball snapped to him he has his hands at his side and only lifts them when the ball is coming. This Idk what other people are watching, but Josh's hard count is not effective because he tips his hand every time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwai San Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 25 minutes ago, fasteddie said: I just got the ACC network and I saw EJ as an In studio analyst. He almost sounded like he knew what he was talking about. How he could be so bad on the field is beyond me. Coaching - crappy crappy coaching. That and he sucked at putting the rubber to the road so to speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmur66 Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Not only did Williams react, he took off like a reciever. He's pretty quick for a big guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rc2catch Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 While I’m also happy to see it work out, id hope it gets to the point where the center can see it and snap the ball for the free play downfield. That’s next level stuff there and Aaron Rodgers has made a living off of it at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First Round Bust Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 vary things a bit more like walk up and have an immediate snap instead of slow-walking and then the usual long, drawn-out usual hard-count where the D knows he doesnt get the snap until the play clock is down to 1-0 then maybe snap it on the first count this way the O keeps the D more honest its like playing poker, you dont want to show your hand until the end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 7 hours ago, Big C said: Agreed. I HATE the hard count BS at the end of quarters where they so obviously never intended to snap it. Except they did snap at the end of the third yesterday and got a ten yard gain to the NE 5-yard line. NE thought they wouldn’t snap it and were caught off guard when the play began with one second left in the quarter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessTruster Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 1 hour ago, fasteddie said: I just got the ACC network and I saw EJ as an In studio analyst. He almost sounded like he knew what he was talking about. How he could be so bad on the field is beyond me. He was actually pretty good until that scramble/knee injury in that Browns (?) Thursday nighter. He was never the same after that for some reason. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, Peace Frog said: Finally, one of our own O-linemen (kudos to D. Williams) recognized and reacted to a defender jumping offside due to Josh's hard count by moving out of his stance and creating the encroachment penalty in today's game. I realize it's only a 5 yard penalty but they certainly help, especially on a 3rd long situation. I couldn't tell you how many times this season I've seen defenders cross the neutral zone before the snap and our O-linemen stay in their stance. I applaud their discipline but 5 yards is 5 yards; why wouldn't you try to get that every time? Agree. Don't understand why lineman aren't taught to automatically jump. I suppose the risk is if they move too late and the D lineman is already back, or they think the guy jumped, but he didn't go far enough or the ref didn't see it. But overall agree jump up and down. Maybe it's one of these things that's much easier to see from up high on TV than when you're in the trenches, so that's why they don't do it more often. Edited November 2, 2020 by Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 On 11/2/2020 at 5:19 AM, dave mcbride said: Except they did snap at the end of the third yesterday and got a ten yard gain to the NE 5-yard line. NE thought they wouldn’t snap it and were caught off guard when the play began with one second left in the quarter. RIght. And that made me happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 On 11/2/2020 at 1:08 AM, Nextmanup said: The hard count was EJ Manuel's special trick, remember? Only it never worked. Josh truly does have an effective hard count that seems to throw defenses off consistently. Wrecks.... mastermind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 On 11/2/2020 at 1:08 AM, Nextmanup said: The hard count was EJ Manuel's special trick, remember? Only it never worked. Josh truly does have an effective hard count that seems to throw defenses off consistently. I clearly remember EJ coming into a game specifically to do a hard count once and I believe he got them to jump...think it was a 4th down and short and they would have had to punt... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 On 11/2/2020 at 6:45 AM, fasteddie said: I just got the ACC network and I saw EJ as an In studio analyst. He almost sounded like he knew what he was talking about. How he could be so bad on the field is beyond me. Coaches ruined him. They told him not to take so many chances and he regressed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlgarsh Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 On 11/2/2020 at 1:08 AM, Nextmanup said: The hard count was EJ Manuel's special trick, remember? Only it never worked. Josh truly does have an effective hard count that seems to throw defenses off consistently. Peyton was the best at it, but Josh is pretty good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCofNC Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 On 11/2/2020 at 6:45 AM, fasteddie said: I just got the ACC network and I saw EJ as an In studio analyst. He almost sounded like he knew what he was talking about. How he could be so bad on the field is beyond me. knowing and executing are totally different. I remember watching him in TC, he literally threw a sideline pass into the VIP tent, no pressure, no reason, just completely whiffed. He’s got a ton of physical potential, but he was absolutely horrrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Frog Posted November 4, 2020 Author Share Posted November 4, 2020 On 11/3/2020 at 1:00 PM, DCofNC said: knowing and executing are totally different. I remember watching him in TC, he literally threw a sideline pass into the VIP tent, no pressure, no reason, just completely whiffed. He’s got a ton of physical potential, but he was absolutely horrrible. You know something is bad when it's called horrible with three 'r's. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfanmiamioh Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 On 11/2/2020 at 4:04 AM, Brennan Huff said: That was so embarrassing for EJ. Rex would trot him out on 4th and short and everybody in the building knew what was going on. Never worked. Rex Ryan was such an awful coach I actually remember it working a time or two. I think once it maybe even sealed a game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokebball Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 On 11/1/2020 at 11:08 PM, Big C said: Agreed. I HATE the hard count BS at the end of quarters where they so obviously never intended to snap it. Got to snap the ball every now and again to make it effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wiz Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 On 11/2/2020 at 2:28 AM, Freddie's Dead said: I thought it was more like John Brown 10 yards downfield.... That was my favorite part of the play watching him go full speed. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan Huff Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 3 hours ago, billsfanmiamioh said: I actually remember it working a time or two. I think once it maybe even sealed a game? I really don’t recall it ever working 🤔 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfanmiamioh Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 17 hours ago, Brennan Huff said: I really don’t recall it ever working 🤔 https://buffalonews.com/sports/bills/second-quarter-analysis-ej-manuels-hard-count-keeps-a-drive-alive/article_24fa2bd1-71ce-500a-bba8-ccf6107ca45c.html The stuff legends are made of! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan Huff Posted November 6, 2020 Share Posted November 6, 2020 4 hours ago, billsfanmiamioh said: https://buffalonews.com/sports/bills/second-quarter-analysis-ej-manuels-hard-count-keeps-a-drive-alive/article_24fa2bd1-71ce-500a-bba8-ccf6107ca45c.html The stuff legends are made of! Wow well I stand corrected! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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