Beane's construction of this roster

[DuckyBoys]

13 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

Two 1st round players, who were supposed to be cornerstones, are holding the team back by not living up to their draft status...fingers crossed they can become game changers...

Ford's nothing special at G and a bust at T  Epenesa I'll give a pass but not even being on the game day actives isnt a great look   They havent exactly landed difference makers lately

[atlbillsfan1975]

1 minute ago, Rc2catch said:

That part doesn’t fit the agenda. 

Oliver looked like he played with some fire today. I hope this means the knee is healed up finally. 

[Rc2catch]

2 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

Oliver looked like he played with some fire today. I hope this means the knee is healed up finally. 

I thought the whole D played with fire the first half. Which was promising they’ve seemed like they’re just going through the motions this year. Second half, well we all watched. Oliver has a ton of potential, he’s just not ready or might never dominate on an Aaron Donald level which has always been unfair to ask of him. 

[flmike]

44 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

how many more years does Edmunds need to develop ?     

 

At least one at OLB, I think. Several of the guys mentioned are really playing out of their best positions.

 

Get a couple solid interior DLs and a monster MLB and we good to go.

[y2zipper]

23 minutes ago, High Football IQ said:

 

I see people keep saying this but 2 things:

 

1) He played roughly 40% of the defensive snaps when in the lineup

2) We still had plenty of bad outings with him

 

Therefore the bigger issue here is the bad drafting and FA signings by Beane on the defensive side which have come full circle this past offseason with the likes of Norman, Klein, Butler, Jefferson, etc. Throw in huge first round misses in Oliver and Edmunds and it's not a bright future at all given the investments and commitments we've made.

 

The counterpoint here is that Buffalo has been a top three defense in the league for the past two years so there haven't been too many bad outings with him so you're completely wrong. 

 

I think the issues on defense largely stem from the line, which hasn't been good, but it's because of change going into the year with no TC or preseason. The only starter on the team this year on the line that was around last year is Hughes and they don't have a 1-tech. Injuries have also forced some of those newer guys in.

 

This offseason, they prioritized the offense.  The early draft capital was Diggs, AJ, Moss and Davis. Oh and they got Bass, who's the youngest kicker in the league and who's won 2 games for Buffalo so far. Next time around, they'll prioritize defense. 

 

Every acquisition on the offensive side of the ball except maybe Knox has contributed to some degree. The entire receiver room, Allen, Morse, Williams, Feliciano, and Ford are all Beane acquisitions as is the running backs.

[TN Bills Fan]

Cody Ford can't find a position.  AJ is a project taken with a second round pick.  Edmunds is awful.  Oliver has regressed.  I know it will be unpopular but I think Allen is still a question mark.  Beat a top team on the road and you are "the man."  Not taking Mahomes is a historic mistake.  As bad as the Nets taking Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan.  Beane is a mess.

[VW82]

I assume most fans are probably fine with the state of the offense and this is really just about the defense. Maybe I've just forgotten but where were all the off season threads predicting doom and gloom for our defense? If it's such a horrible roster devoid of talent we must have all seen it coming right? 

 

I agree McBeane deserve criticism for how this has played out but I doubt anyone saw this level of drop off coming. It's still too early to call Edmunds and Oliver busts.

[dgrochester55]

1 minute ago, TN Bills Fan said:

Cody Ford can't find a position.  AJ is a project taken with a second round pick.  Edmunds is awful.  Oliver has regressed.  I know it will be unpopular but I think Allen is still a question mark.  Beat a top team on the road and you are "the man."  Not taking Mahomes is a historic mistake.  As bad as the Nets taking Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan.  Beane is a mess.

 

 

What team are you really a fan of?

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

49 minutes ago, All I Need is Hope said:

I'll join the "pile on" party this evening...

 

Overall, Beane's drafting and FA handling are starting to show cracks... probable misses on high picks like Ford, Edmunds, Phillips, Joseph, maybe Knox.  Many good FA adds like Feliciano, Morse, Beasley, Brown; but several misses or marginal upgrades like Klein, potentially Norman, Spain, Murphy (jury's out on this year's crop - Butler, Addison).

 

Part of the results of the middle-of-the-pack GM performance is a linebacking group and dline that are bad, with terrible depth and few play makers/game changers on defense (other than Milano and Tre); and plays soft.  

 

Beane, by all accounts is a very bright and hard working GM, however, if I look closely at the roster and results, it's not as positive as I've been thinking for the last year plus.

 

 

Hard to take someone seriously when you mention Joseph a six round pick.  By year 3 only about 35% of six rounders are even still in the league.  You do remember Phillips was out last year with an ACL?

 

The LB group excluding Alexander who retired is the same as what finished 2nd was it overalll last year on defense??

 

One of the things that I thought was going to help the Bills this year was they brought back 18 1/2 starters from last year.  only changes were Diggs, Lorax and give them a 1/2 for Lawson and J Phillips as they weren't starters, but they did play a lot.

 

Overall they didn't sign that many FA, but many they did sign were all concentrated within one position group and they did change alot on the def line depth wise and that was before they lost Star.  They have 4 new players from last year plus Phillips who barely played last year.  Without any off season workouts, then no normal training camp and pre-season think it's made it hard for them to jell.  It may take awhile.

 

I do wonder in hindsight if Beane knew how the off-season was going to go, would he have instead tried to re-sign Lawson and/or Phillips mainly for continuity.  Though likely every GM would say the same.

[Motor26]

1 minute ago, TN Bills Fan said:

Cody Ford can't find a position.  AJ is a project taken with a second round pick.  Edmunds is awful.  Oliver has regressed.  I know it will be unpopular but I think Allen is still a question mark.  Beat a top team on the road and you are "the man."  Not taking Mahomes is a historic mistake.  As bad as the Nets taking Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan.  Beane is a mess.

Yeah cuz Mahomes would have been a stud under McDermott the same as he is under one of the most creative offensive minds in the NFL the past 20 years. 

[billsfan89]

13 minutes ago, Motor26 said:

Did people miss all the pressure Oliver was bringing on Cam today? 

 

The issue isn't pressure the issue is Ed is getting run over in the ground game because he is playing out of position most of the time. I think he can be an impactful player at the 3 tech but he isn't doing anyone favors at the 1.

3 minutes ago, TN Bills Fan said:

Cody Ford can't find a position.  AJ is a project taken with a second round pick.  Edmunds is awful.  Oliver has regressed.  I know it will be unpopular but I think Allen is still a question mark.  Beat a top team on the road and you are "the man."  Not taking Mahomes is a historic mistake.  As bad as the Nets taking Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan.  Beane is a mess.

 

The Trail Blazers took Sam Bowie...

[HOUSE]

I just glad we passed on DK Metcalf. The guy has bust written all over him....

[TN Bills Fan]

Just now, Motor26 said:

Yeah cuz Mahomes would have been a stud under McDermott the same as he is under one of the most creative offensive minds in the NFL the past 20 years. 

Good point.  We'll never know.

[Matt_In_NH]

We can make a long list of “missed” draft picks from amy gm.   Is the team winning?   Maybe judge based on that?

[TN Bills Fan]

2 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

The issue isn't pressure the issue is Ed is getting run over in the ground game because he is playing out of position most of the time. I think he can be an impactful player at the 3 tech but he isn't doing anyone favors at the 1.

 

The Trail Blazers took Sam Bowie...

Thanks.  OOOps

 

[mjt328]

The main thing a GM should be judged on is how he drafts.  I'm a believer that it takes about 3 years to properly judge a pick, and we should get at least 3 starting quality players in a normal draft class.  That number would need to be higher in a year with extra Day 1-2 picks.

 

It's hard for many Bills fans to criticize Brandon Beane, because he's the man behind our most successful run in over 20 years.  

But with the moment of truth coming for the 2018 class, the results are sadly starting to look less than thrilling. 

 

Yes, we were able to land a franchise QB in Josh Allen thanks to an extra pick from the previous year's draft, and trading away players like Cordy Glenn and Tyrod Taylor.  But our other prize pick from that class, Tremaine Edmunds, is quickly becoming a massive liability.  You can always recognize a failed pick when they don't get the 5th Year Option, and at this point I would be shocked if we activate his.  Harrison Phillips looked promising as a rookie, but hasn't contributed anything positive this year.  Taron Johnson and Levi Wallace have been awful this year.  Nobody else has even cracked the starting lineup.

 

Beane gets one more offseason before he will be forced to give Josh Allen $30 million+ per year (this year he only counts $5.8 million towards the cap for comparison).  Once that happens, our ability to re-sign talent and address holes in Free Agency will be significantly decreased.  The only way the Bills keep winning is by getting significant contributions from guys on rookie contracts.  There will be a time when we can't just trade/sign someone like Darryl Williams to start when a high pick like Cody Ford busts.  You actually have to get production out of Ford.

 

Edited November 2, 2020 by mjt328

[nedboy7]

6 minutes ago, TN Bills Fan said:

Cody Ford can't find a position.  AJ is a project taken with a second round pick.  Edmunds is awful.  Oliver has regressed.  I know it will be unpopular but I think Allen is still a question mark.  Beat a top team on the road and you are "the man."  Not taking Mahomes is a historic mistake.  As bad as the Nets taking Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan.  Beane is a mess.

 

You are a Bills fan?  You might want to change your name on here. 

You also forgot the part where they made the playoffs 2x now under Beane and are 6-2 this year.

But I do appreciate the incessant negative take from fans like you. 

 

 

[BobChalmers]

1 hour ago, Process said:

Edmunds and Oliver were big, costly misses

 

Early but not looking good.

[nedboy7]

My favorite part of the game was when the fan base imploded during the second half and declared a loss that never materialized.  Talk about weak mental stamina. 

[BobChalmers]

13 minutes ago, flmike said:

 

At least one at OLB, I think. Several of the guys mentioned are really playing out of their best positions.

 

Get a couple solid interior DLs and a monster MLB and we good to go.

 

Might be true.  It seems like there are 1-2 elite MLB available mid 1st every year.

 

Milano just seems too small to keep at a big number - the fact that he's frequently hurt shouldn't be a surprise.  Maybe move Edmunds to his spot and find a better run stuffer for MLB?

 

In fairness Edmunds isn't getting much help out there in front of him - an actual 1-technique DT could make all the difference by himself.  I'm kind of surprised they haven't taken a stab at one of the available ones.

 

Klein is an absolute disaster out there - he's not even acceptable depth.

[TN Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

 

You are a Bills fan?  You might want to change your name on here. 

You also forgot the part where they made the playoffs 2x now under Beane and are 6-2 this year.

But I do appreciate the incessant negative take from fans like you. 

 

 

I love when people tell fans how to be fans.  We don't all wave pow pow during the game.  Some people enjoy looking at the team with a critical eye.  You don't have to.

 

[Hampton Josh fan]

1 hour ago, All I Need is Hope said:

I'll join the "pile on" party this evening...

 

Overall, Beane's drafting and FA handling are starting to show cracks... probable misses on high picks like Ford, Edmunds, Phillips, Joseph, maybe Knox.  Many good FA adds like Feliciano, Morse, Beasley, Brown; but several misses or marginal upgrades like Klein, potentially Norman, Spain, Murphy (jury's out on this year's crop - Butler, Addison).

 

Part of the results of the middle-of-the-pack GM performance is a linebacking group and dline that are bad, with terrible depth and few play makers/game changers on defense (other than Milano and Tre); and plays soft.  

 

Beane, by all accounts is a very bright and hard working GM, however, if I look closely at the roster and results, it's not as positive as I've been thinking for the last year plus.

 

Perfect assessment. I couldn't agree more. The question now is will he go against his form and make a move to shore up this porous defense. The offense is becoming really good. 

[TPS]

21 minutes ago, TN Bills Fan said:

Cody Ford can't find a position.  AJ is a project taken with a second round pick.  Edmunds is awful.  Oliver has regressed.  I know it will be unpopular but I think Allen is still a question mark.  Beat a top team on the road and you are "the man."  Not taking Mahomes is a historic mistake.  As bad as the Nets taking Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan.  Beane is a mess.

Can you explain how not taking Mahomes is Beane's fault...?

[Mr. WEO]

47 minutes ago, Rad Likes The Bills said:

Well all 11 on that side since he is winning games for them...

that makes no sense

[Trogdor]

1 hour ago, All I Need is Hope said:

I'll join the "pile on" party this evening...

 

Overall, Beane's drafting and FA handling are starting to show cracks... probable misses on high picks like Ford, Edmunds, Phillips, Joseph, maybe Knox.  Many good FA adds like Feliciano, Morse, Beasley, Brown; but several misses or marginal upgrades like Klein, potentially Norman, Spain, Murphy (jury's out on this year's crop - Butler, Addison).

 

Part of the results of the middle-of-the-pack GM performance is a linebacking group and dline that are bad, with terrible depth and few play makers/game changers on defense (other than Milano and Tre); and plays soft.  

 

Beane, by all accounts is a very bright and hard working GM, however, if I look closely at the roster and results, it's not as positive as I've been thinking for the last year plus.

 

Milano looked like he couldn't wait to get out of Cams way and Tre is a shell of himself. Last year they were much better, but right now they are no better than the rest of the defense. 

[Bob in STL]

1 hour ago, Teddy KGB said:

how many more years does Edmunds need to develop ?     

Two. 

[Trogdor]

47 minutes ago, TN Bills Fan said:

Cody Ford can't find a position.  AJ is a project taken with a second round pick.  Edmunds is awful.  Oliver has regressed.  I know it will be unpopular but I think Allen is still a question mark.  Beat a top team on the road and you are "the man."  Not taking Mahomes is a historic mistake.  As bad as the Nets taking Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan.  Beane is a mess.

Olive is out of position. It's not really a regression, but they have him in the worst place he could be. 

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

He’s definitely made mistakes, as do ALL general managers, but I feel like the majority of his contracts to free agents don’t lock us in to long terms or big dollars. As for his drafting? Again, a fair share of misses like every GM, but the future development of high picks like Edmunds and Oliver will go a long way towards determining his legacy. At this point, there’s reason for concern but there’s also time. 

[fansince88]

1 hour ago, All I Need is Hope said:

I'll join the "pile on" party this evening...

 

Overall, Beane's drafting and FA handling are starting to show cracks... probable misses on high picks like Ford, Edmunds, Phillips, Joseph, maybe Knox.  Many good FA adds like Feliciano, Morse, Beasley, Brown; but several misses or marginal upgrades like Klein, potentially Norman, Spain, Murphy (jury's out on this year's crop - Butler, Addison).

 

Part of the results of the middle-of-the-pack GM performance is a linebacking group and dline that are bad, with terrible depth and few play makers/game changers on defense (other than Milano and Tre); and plays soft.  

 

Beane, by all accounts is a very bright and hard working GM, however, if I look closely at the roster and results, it's not as positive as I've been thinking for the last year plus.

 

So....you have no hope? Ironic 

[ProcessTruster]

1 hour ago, All I Need is Hope said:

I'll join the "pile on" party this evening...

 

Overall, Beane's drafting and FA handling are starting to show cracks... probable misses on high picks like Ford, Edmunds, Phillips, Joseph, maybe Knox.  Many good FA adds like Feliciano, Morse, Beasley, Brown; but several misses or marginal upgrades like Klein, potentially Norman, Spain, Murphy (jury's out on this year's crop - Butler, Addison).

 

Part of the results of the middle-of-the-pack GM performance is a linebacking group and dline that are bad, with terrible depth and few play makers/game changers on defense (other than Milano and Tre); and plays soft.  

 

Beane, by all accounts is a very bright and hard working GM, however, if I look closely at the roster and results, it's not as positive as I've been thinking for the last year plus.

 

6 - 2 .  nuf said 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

51 minutes ago, TN Bills Fan said:

Cody Ford can't find a position.  AJ is a project taken with a second round pick.  Edmunds is awful.  Oliver has regressed.  I know it will be unpopular but I think Allen is still a question mark.  Beat a top team on the road and you are "the man."  Not taking Mahomes is a historic mistake.  As bad as the Nets taking Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan.  Beane is a mess.

Beane wasn’t our GM when Mahomes was drafted. 

[Bob in STL]

1 hour ago, High Football IQ said:

 

His drafting has been horrible and for all the credit some folks gave him for cleaning up the previous regime's mess and he pretty much put them back into the same situation especially after what appears to be a very premature extension to Tre White.

 

He's certainly hit on some trades and FA signings but overall there's nothing impressive about what he's done and the insistence on focusing on the Carolina franchise will prove to be his downfall.

nothing impressive- like ending a 17 year playoff drought with 2 playoffs in 3 years while in the middle of a rebuild.   Like helping to changethe way the team is perceived by veteran players.  Like having us sitting at 6-2 with strong chance of winning a division title for the first time in 20 years. 
 

That is impressive and the best is yet to come. 

[billsfan89]

Just now, Bob in STL said:

nothing impressive- like ending a 17 year playoff drought with 2 playoffs in 3 years while in the middle of a rebuild.   Like helping to changethe way the team is perceived by veteran players.  Like having us sitting at 6-2 with strong chance of winning a division title for the first time in 20 years. 
 

That is impressive and the best is yet to come. 

 

Also the Bills have a franchise QB for the first time since the 1990's. McD and Beane have made mistakes but to not act like they haven't been successful is silly.

[Bob in STL]

1 hour ago, All I Need is Hope said:

I'm always comparing our progress to teams that are currently competitive to win the Super Bowl, and it seems like we could become stuck in the "we're a play-off team with limiting flaws"

 

I agree that Beane is better than previous regimes, top to bottom, and heck, by Buffalo standards, he might be great... however, I want us to make the next jump and I'm skeptical regarding his ability to get us there. 

Ok.  Fair. You can be skeptical.  He is not perfect. 

[TwistofFate]

1 hour ago, Rad Likes The Bills said:

In all honesty it doesn’t matter because he drafted Josh Allen. 
 

Josh is infinitely more important than all of those guys... he can elevate the play of marginal players (hence how we are 6-2 despite all the whining and complaining from the fan base)

Josh in the second 4 weeks looks a lot like Josh last year and nothing like Josh the first 4 weeks of the season. 

 

He is still a question mark in my opinion. 

 

Consistent Qb play is the most important thing on offense. Since his struggles reappeared, this offense has been pretty dismal. 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

1 hour ago, All I Need is Hope said:

I'll join the "pile on" party this evening...

 

Overall, Beane's drafting and FA handling are starting to show cracks... probable misses on high picks like Ford, Edmunds, Phillips, Joseph, maybe Knox.  Many good FA adds like Feliciano, Morse, Beasley, Brown; but several misses or marginal upgrades like Klein, potentially Norman, Spain, Murphy (jury's out on this year's crop - Butler, Addison).

 

Part of the results of the middle-of-the-pack GM performance is a linebacking group and dline that are bad, with terrible depth and few play makers/game changers on defense (other than Milano and Tre); and plays soft.  

 

Beane, by all accounts is a very bright and hard working GM, however, if I look closely at the roster and results, it's not as positive as I've been thinking for the last year plus.

 

I have got to think any shortcomings re defensive personnel are shared by McDermott and Beane. Seems like McDermott probably has a huge say on how they get on D. 

[klos63]

1 hour ago, BillsEnthusiast said:

 

Oliver was playing out of his mind today, he almost gored Cam on multiple plays and was constantly in the backfield. 

Probably his most effective game all year. First half was very strong, not as much in the 2nd.

[Steptide]

No team hits on all their draft picks. Beane has done a darn good job in free agency and trades (Diggs, poyer, Hyde, Jordan Phillips etc). While knox hasent been spectacular, he's our best tight end and Imo it shows when he's not playing. I get the Edmunds argument, he hasent lived up to where he was drafted, but Milano definitely has. Obviously the defense has to get some things figured out, but this team as a whole has gotten better every year since beane and McDermott got here 

[Bob in STL]

3 hours ago, Penfield45 said:

His drafting has been decent but cmon man

 

how can you say his FA pickups have been good? We have one of the worst front 7’s in the NFL right now. A front 7 almost entirely made up of Beanes players. Only guy that isn’t his is Hughes and he’s been the best player on defense this season 

Actually I said the free agent pickups improved us without hurting the cap.  This past season not so much.  
 

I agree the front 7 is not good enough.  Star out, Lorenzo not adequately replaced, Phillips struggling after the ACL, Edmunds and Milano playing hurt.  He missed on the LB depth.  

Edited November 2, 2020 by Bob in STL

[dgrochester55]

46 minutes ago, BobChalmers said:

Klein is an absolute disaster out there - he's not even acceptable depth.

 

Agreed, he is bad.   Not "should not be starting" bad, but, "should not be playing" bad.  It is at the point that I would be see any free agent, waiver wire or practice squad player as a likely upgrade.

 

If you came up with an all time bad Bills defense, I think that Klein would join the likes of Aaron Maybin, Justin Rogers and Chris Watson

Edited November 2, 2020 by dgrochester55