What AJ Espensa peers say about facing him...

[Alphadawg7]

I already posted this in the AJ draft pick thread, but that thing is a beast and I think this deserves more eye balls as its quite telling.  Its their opinion on AJ Espensa, and its quite impressive and high praise from some pretty good college players.  

 

FROM HIS PEERS:

 

That's what we saw. But what we heard during interviews with the offensive players who faced him was a very different story.

Michigan left tackle Jon Runyan, who provides deeply technical insights into his opponents, said Epenesa was tied with Ohio State's Chase Young as the two toughest defenders he ever faced.

 

"A.J. exploits the weakness of what I play," Runyan said. "I'm a vertical setter, and the weakness of a vertical set is what A.J. loves to do: bull rush with a one-armed stab. He's able to catch me leaning a lot, catch me off guard. Early in the [2019 Michigan vs. Iowa] game, the first three or four drives, I wasn't really keying on his shoulders. He started running downhill, and I wasn't able to get my hips down and react to the bull rush."

 

Purdue tight end Brycen Hopkins also singled out Epenesa as one of the toughest defenders he ever faced, adding a most unusual compliment to his scouting report: "I thought he was a great player. He was physical, but at the same time he's a cool guy. He wasn't a jerk out there. ... So I thought he was a great player, great guy. He came off the ball with an explosive power."

 

And then there's teammate Tristan Wirfs, one of the stars of Friday night's offensive line workouts. Wirfs didn't hesitate to name Epenesa as the toughest defender he ever faced. Sure, he may be a teensy bit biased, but players rarely single out teammates when answering "toughest opponent" questions. 

 

"We had some battles," Wirfs said. "When I met with the Broncos, they said a scout was there [at Iowa practice] and I didn't lose to A.J. So I said, 'I'm glad you were there on that day.'"

 

"It goes back and forth, me and him," Wirfs added. "He was one of my best friends on the team. We will try to help each other get better. If he sees something that he beat me on, he'll tell me what he saw. And when I beat him, I tell him what I saw."

 

So Epenesa earned glowing endorsements from a first-round-caliber teammate and two of the guys who had to block him, and those were just the remarks we heard while making the interview rounds. If you don't believe Runyan, Hopkins and Wirfs, there's also the production across two seasons against major competition.

 

And also there's the tape, which shows opponents redesigning their offenses to corral him. At one point against Minnesota, for example, Epenesa was chipped by the tight end before a route, and then chipped by a running back before a route, with the left tackle backing up to engage Epenesa after he worked his way through that whole bag of chips. (It's at the 2:09 mark on this cutup.)

[Bob in STL]

Thanks for the info.  This kid might play like a first rounder.  McD will get him going.  

[Penfield45]

just hope that power translates to the NFL 

 

won't be long until he is a captain on that defense along with White, Edmunds and Oliver. 

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

im on board

[Jerome007]

Well he is a Bills now. I thus hope he is a superstar. But yeah, spring brings hope eternal

[Logic]

I just watched all the AJ Epenesa highlights I could find. 

He reminded me of someone, but it wasn't JJ Watt. I realized it was another #94, Justin Smith. Smith was a 5T, but truthfully, one could argue that that's Epenesa's best position, anyway. Besides, McDermott's defense often has his DEs aligned at 5T anyway.

But that's AJ...a classic strong, tall, powerful 5T, base end that can kick inside on passing downs.

Justin Smith made 5 Pro Bowls and was a two time 1st team All Pro and two time 2nd team All Pro .... all without ever having 10 sacks in a single season.

If bending the edge and tallying sacks is the measure, he may never be elite. But in terms of defending the run, taking on double teams, collapsing the pocket, controlling the edge, and pitching in 6-10 sacks a season...I think he's going to be dominant.

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by Logic

[Coach Tuesday]

Justin Smith or maybe Aaron Smith.

 

I wonder if AJ has trained in ju jitsu - he seems to use martial arts-based leverage concepts in his attack strategy.  Looking forward to watching him.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Coach Tuesday

[BurpleBull]

*Epenesa*

 

Finally have a top notch rotational lineup on the D-line.

[Gugny]

This kid's gonna be great as long as they fit him up.

[Augie]

42 minutes ago, Logic said:

I just watched all the AJ Epenesa highlights I could find. 

He reminded me of someone, but it wasn't JJ Watt. I realized it was another #94, Justin Smith. Smith was a 5T, but truthfully, one could argue that that's Epenesa's best position, anyway. Besides, McDermott's defense often has his DEs aligned at 5T anyway.

But that's AJ...a classic strong, tall, powerful 5T, base end that can kick inside on passing downs.

Justin Smith made 5 Pro Bowls and was a two time 1st team All Pro and two time 2nd team All Pro .... all without ever having 10 sacks in a single season.

If bending the edge and tallying sacks is the measure, he may never be elite. But in terms of defending the run, taking on double teams, collapsing the pocket, controlling the edge, and pitching in 6-10 sacks a season...I think he's going to be dominant.

 

 

I trust McD to know what he needs in his defense. If we have a better, cheaper, younger Shaq we filled a need. We need youth at DE in a big way. Maybe not “flashy”, but sometimes you need “solid”. 

[ALLEN1QB]

Dude will have 5 sacks against the Pat's alone.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Logic said:

I just watched all the AJ Epenesa highlights I could find. 

He reminded me of someone, but it wasn't JJ Watt. I realized it was another #94, Justin Smith. Smith was a 5T, but truthfully, one could argue that that's Epenesa's best position, anyway. Besides, McDermott's defense often has his DEs aligned at 5T anyway.

But that's AJ...a classic strong, tall, powerful 5T, base end that can kick inside on passing downs.

Justin Smith made 5 Pro Bowls and was a two time 1st team All Pro and two time 2nd team All Pro .... all without ever having 10 sacks in a single season.

If bending the edge and tallying sacks is the measure, he may never be elite. But in terms of defending the run, taking on double teams, collapsing the pocket, controlling the edge, and pitching in 6-10 sacks a season...I think he's going to be dominant.

 

Dude that is a really good comparison IMO, spot on

[Buffalo Junction]

48 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Justin Smith or maybe Aaron Smith.

 

I wonder if AJ has trained in ju jitsu - he seems to use martial arts-based leverage concepts in his attack strategy.  Looking forward to watching him.

“My dad taught us from a young age to get our hands on people and throw them to get off blocks. I was pretty lucky to have a mentor like him in the house all the time, someone who knows the game of football and played the same position.”
 

His old man played DL at Iowa as well. 

Forgot to link for quote.....

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latimes.com/sports/story/2020-04-16/nfl-draft-aj-epenesa%3f_amp=true

[FeelingOnYouboty]

We’re so lucky to have this player. Get him with our training staff and I think they’ll get him to shed 5-10 pounds.

 

I’m elated man! Got this dude at #54. Unreal!

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, Logic said:

I just watched all the AJ Epenesa highlights I could find. 

He reminded me of someone, but it wasn't JJ Watt. I realized it was another #94, Justin Smith. Smith was a 5T, but truthfully, one could argue that that's Epenesa's best position, anyway. Besides, McDermott's defense often has his DEs aligned at 5T anyway.

But that's AJ...a classic strong, tall, powerful 5T, base end that can kick inside on passing downs.

Justin Smith made 5 Pro Bowls and was a two time 1st team All Pro and two time 2nd team All Pro .... all without ever having 10 sacks in a single season.

If bending the edge and tallying sacks is the measure, he may never be elite. But in terms of defending the run, taking on double teams, collapsing the pocket, controlling the edge, and pitching in 6-10 sacks a season...I think he's going to be dominant.
 

 

I can see Justin Smith. Michael Bennett was the other guy I threw out there that I saw. I think he only reached 10 sacks once and averaged 6/7 per year over a 12 year career and went to multiple pro bowls. Now personality wise I doubt AJ is quite as much of a diva as Bennett who ended up on 5 teams and wore out his welcome on certainly 3 of them but if you got that level of production out of Epenesa over that period of time and the flexibility Bennett gave in terms of inside and outside rush (I remember in the Malcolm Butler Superbowl it got to the point where the Patriots blocking scheme just became "wherever he lines up... double Michael Bennett and we will live with everyone else 1v1") that would be one hell of an output. 

[MarlinTheMagician]

Love the player's character from all I have gathered.  I trust that he is a good player now, and I trust the Bills will make him better.

[BruceVilanch]

I was legitimately shocked that he made it to us in the second round. Great for us, two years in a row we have an elite player at a position of need falling to us (Oliver being the first). 

[TL30]

I watched every game this kid played in his college career.  This kid was robbed like no other.  I think it's absolutely BS that the NFL scouts will disregard years of video footage dominating in one of colleges elite conferences for a few hours of working out.  Inexcusable..  Bills.....  Y'all one and I'm willing to bet his numbers will be better than Chase's.  AJ and Chase played the same teams and 2 of the 3 years AJ out performed him.  And AJ only started one of those years.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

14 hours ago, Logic said:

I just watched all the AJ Epenesa highlights I could find. 

He reminded me of someone, but it wasn't JJ Watt. I realized it was another #94, Justin Smith. Smith was a 5T, but truthfully, one could argue that that's Epenesa's best position, anyway. Besides, McDermott's defense often has his DEs aligned at 5T anyway.

But that's AJ...a classic strong, tall, powerful 5T, base end that can kick inside on passing downs.

Justin Smith made 5 Pro Bowls and was a two time 1st team All Pro and two time 2nd team All Pro .... all without ever having 10 sacks in a single season.

If bending the edge and tallying sacks is the measure, he may never be elite. But in terms of defending the run, taking on double teams, collapsing the pocket, controlling the edge, and pitching in 6-10 sacks a season...I think he's going to be dominant.

 

exactly... Defense was good last year with Shaq filling this role. AJE looks like he should be able to step in and at least do the same. 
 

Doesn’t look like speed issues in the highlight reel

Edited April 29, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[Logic]

1 minute ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

exactly... Defense was good last year with Shaw filling this role. AJE looks like he should be able to step in and at least do the same. 

I think Epenesa will even wind up being an upgrade over Shaq.

I liked Lawson, but he was 6'3", 260 lbs. Epenesa is 6'6", 280 lbs. He's just a larger -- and based on the film, stronger -- human being. 

You're right that even if he winds up just filling Shaq's role at about the same level of production, it's still a win for the Bills, because we got him on a cheap rookie deal for four years instead of paying $10mil+/year to Shaq. But I think AJ will represent an upgrade.

[C.Biscuit97]

I really like AJ but with all due respect, these puff pieces don’t really do much for me.  Of course, a high draft pick was to play against.  He is a strong dude.  But he won’t be that strong in nfl and his lack of explosiveness will keep him from becoming an elite sack guy (I hope I’m wrong).

 

but he will be at worst a very solid starter for a long time.  And anything that means less Murphy makes me happy.  

[yungmack]

First three picks - I'm including Diggs because they used the pick to get him - are home runs. Outta the park.

[Iverwig]

The more I see on this kid the more he is growing on me.  I really think the Bills got a steal and a future all pro defensive player.

[Alphadawg7]

55 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I really like AJ but with all due respect, these puff pieces don’t really do much for me.  Of course, a high draft pick was to play against.  He is a strong dude.  But he won’t be that strong in nfl and his lack of explosiveness will keep him from becoming an elite sack guy (I hope I’m wrong).

 

but he will be at worst a very solid starter for a long time.  And anything that means less Murphy makes me happy.  

 

I am not worried about his strength, and not sure why you say he is a strong dude but wont be in the NFL.  I mean the guys talking about his elite strength are all now in the NFL.  Its not like once you get to the NFL people become 10 times stronger.  If he was that strong against NFL level players, including first round picks, then he will be plenty strong in the NFL too.  I think the bigger question mark will be can he develop enough moves and be athletic enough to be a consistent disruptor to go along with his strength.  If he has to rely only on his strength, he can be neutralized much easier. 

 

I really do think he is going to be a good to great starter for the Bills personally.  But thats just an opinion, so we will see what he can do on the field soon enough.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[whatdrought]

I just expect him to blow up and be a force. Maybe not a double digit guy, but someone who forces teams to double and look at extra hard in game planning. He and Ed are such a great young combo. If Harry comes back healthy, next year we can snag a more pure speed guy and our DL will be set for years!

[Alphadawg7]

1 minute ago, whatdrought said:

I just expect him to blow up and be a force. Maybe not a double digit guy, but someone who forces teams to double and look at extra hard in game planning. He and Ed are such a great young combo. If Harry comes back healthy, next year we can snag a more pure speed guy and our DL will be set for years!

 

Well until FA breaks them up HA.  If all 3 of those guys and another speed guy all become studs, we wont be able to afford to keep all 4 ha

[C.Biscuit97]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I am not worried about his strength, and not sure why you say he is a strong dude but wont be in the NFL.  I mean the guys talking about his elite strength are all now in the NFL.  Its not like once you get to the NFL people become 10 times stronger.  If he was that strong against NFL level players, including first round picks, then he will be plenty strong in the NFL too.  I think the bigger question mark will be can he develop enough moves and be athletic enough to be a consistent disruptor to go along with his strength.  If he has to rely only on his strength, he can be neutralized much easier. 

 

I really do think he is going to be a good to great starter for the Bills personally.  But thats just an opinion, so we will see what he can do on the field soon enough.

I meant that he will  it be so much physically more dominant in the nfl like he was in college.

 

and trust me, I’m very happy with the pick.  I though our biggest needs were pass rusher and big receiver.  I do worry that the lack of explosiveness will hold him back a bit.  He was talked about as a #1 overall pick before the season (which shows how stupid those are).  But imo, he is a very safe pick.  At worst, I think he is a 5-7 sack guy who is good against the run.  At best, he could possibly get to double digits.  But he will fit very nice on our defense.

6 minutes ago, whatdrought said:

I just expect him to blow up and be a force. Maybe not a double digit guy, but someone who forces teams to double and look at extra hard in game planning. He and Ed are such a great young combo. If Harry comes back healthy, next year we can snag a more pure speed guy and our DL will be set for years!

Agreed.  That really good speed rusher is the only thing they are missing.  

[Big Turk]

15 hours ago, Logic said:

I just watched all the AJ Epenesa highlights I could find. 

He reminded me of someone, but it wasn't JJ Watt. I realized it was another #94, Justin Smith. Smith was a 5T, but truthfully, one could argue that that's Epenesa's best position, anyway. Besides, McDermott's defense often has his DEs aligned at 5T anyway.

But that's AJ...a classic strong, tall, powerful 5T, base end that can kick inside on passing downs.

Justin Smith made 5 Pro Bowls and was a two time 1st team All Pro and two time 2nd team All Pro .... all without ever having 10 sacks in a single season.

If bending the edge and tallying sacks is the measure, he may never be elite. But in terms of defending the run, taking on double teams, collapsing the pocket, controlling the edge, and pitching in 6-10 sacks a season...I think he's going to be dominant.

 

 

Every team would be much better with a player like that on it regardless of what the "numbers" say. 

[Rockinon]

Speed rushers are over rated. What gets you to a QB faster? Running all the way around the tackle or running through the tackle? There are different ways to rush a a passer and a speed rushers isn't necessarily going to get there faster. So we have an undersized DT in Oliver and now an over sized DE in Epenesa. Being good at football isn't all about size. Oliver is good because of his speed. Epenesa is good because of his strength. Both are explosive but for different reasons.

[Poleshifter]

@Alphadawg7 Thank you for breaking this out of the huge AJ thread. This is some great stuff!

 

I love hearing from the OL who faced him. Cool that Runyan Jr is so analytical about it.

 

Great thread!

[Mojo44]

4 hours ago, Rockinon said:

Speed rushers are over rated. What gets you to a QB faster? Running all the way around the tackle or running through the tackle? There are different ways to rush a a passer and a speed rushers isn't necessarily going to get there faster. So we have an undersized DT in Oliver and now an over sized DE in Epenesa. Being good at football isn't all about size. Oliver is good because of his speed. Epenesa is good because of his strength. Both are explosive but for different reasons.

I completely agree. Speed rushers are often one trick ponys and don’t play the run well. Besides, he did have 22 sacks the past 2 years against  Big Ten competition.

 

Another thing. The position is “edge”.  It looks like this guy can really set the edge which is as important as any skill set of the position. It forces plays inside.

[3rdand12]

4 hours ago, Iverwig said:

The more I see on this kid the more he is growing on me.  I really think the Bills got a steal and a future all pro defensive player.

me too . 

 Go Bills !!

4 hours ago, Rockinon said:

Speed rushers are over rated. What gets you to a QB faster? Running all the way around the tackle or running through the tackle? There are different ways to rush a a passer and a speed rushers isn't necessarily going to get there faster. So we have an undersized DT in Oliver and now an over sized DE in Epenesa. Being good at football isn't all about size. Oliver is good because of his speed. Epenesa is good because of his strength. Both are explosive but for different reasons.

running outside the tackle does not do well to protect to passing / running lanes.. This kid is strong enough to push off his  blocker and move inside or out when the play breaks down. 

[Alphadawg7]

4 hours ago, Poleshifter said:

@Alphadawg7 Thank you for breaking this out of the huge AJ thread. This is some great stuff!

 

I love hearing from the OL who faced him. Cool that Runyan Jr is so analytical about it.

 

Great thread!

 

No problem   

 

I wouldn't normally start a thread about a topic already going, but just felt this was a different take and was buried in that beast of a thread and was worthy of its own dialogue.  Glad you liked it too!

 

Comments from his peers who had to go up against him, especially guys so highly regarded in their own right, are IMO a good source of quality and insightful analysis on him.  Obviously scouts were high on him too as many had him going round 1 and Beane had a first round grade on him too he said.  But as usual, there were quite a few people here upset over this pick, which was quite surprising given the combo of the need and great value at where we got him.  

[Alphadawg7]

9 hours ago, Rockinon said:

Speed rushers are over rated. What gets you to a QB faster? Running all the way around the tackle or running through the tackle? There are different ways to rush a a passer and a speed rushers isn't necessarily going to get there faster. So we have an undersized DT in Oliver and now an over sized DE in Epenesa. Being good at football isn't all about size. Oliver is good because of his speed. Epenesa is good because of his strength. Both are explosive but for different reasons.

 

I agree totally with this...and TBH, speed rushers are more often less complete EDGE players as the are far too often all finesse.  They can struggle with containing the edge in stopping the run or are easily neutralized if they dont get past their blocker.  

 

Im not saying a dominate speed rusher cant be great, but too much emphasis is put on the sack total.  I mean at the end of the day, if a guy gets 14 sacks in a season, thats not even 1 a game.  And almost certainly didnt even likely get one in 14 different games, as they more thank likely had one or more multi-sack games too.  People way over value those 14 total plays on a season.  For me, the question is what he is doing the rest of the snaps and games?  I care more about that than double digit sack totals.  

 

You show me a guy with 8 sacks but also is good tackler and good against the run...and you show me a finesse guy who gets 12-14 sacks but isnt strong in run stopping or tackling...and I would take that 8 sack guy every single time who is a more complete player and will make a bigger and more consistent impact on that defense.  

 

And thats not to say AJE cant get more than 8 sacks...but people are hung up on that number because that moron Booger said it and someone else on draft coverage said he would probably be an 8-10 sack guy.  Especially on this defense, once he starts each week I think he potential is not limited in the kind of impact he could make.  

Edited April 30, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[boater]

On 4/28/2020 at 9:19 PM, Alphadawg7 said:

He wasn't a jerk out there

For some reason, this resonates with me.

[26TrapDraw]

On 4/28/2020 at 6:32 PM, Penfield45 said:

just hope that power translates to the NFL 

 

won't be long until he is a captain on that defense along with White, Edmunds and Oliver. 

I get that college weight programs are good but he will have the best strength coaches in the NFL in Buffalo and he will add even more strength. He's only 22. He already has great technique in his rushes. Put more strength on that frame and he could become elite.

[Freddie's Dead]

Espensa? 

[soflabillsfan1]

I like AJ.  Still feel like he would be better as a 3-4 DE but we'll see.

[Green Lightning]

1 hour ago, soflabillsfan1 said:

I like AJ.  Still feel like he would be better as a 3-4 DE but we'll see.

That's my first thought as well. He's Phil Hansen size (Like was 6'5" 278) and while not the same game, likely will have similar results. Set the edge, great run defender, reliable and about 6 - 7 sacks a year. Phil's on the Wall of Fame, so I hope AJ can have a similar career from a 4-3 front. I think kicking AJ inside on passing downs will be effective. 

[TigerJ]

The interesting thing about Epenesa, is that not only did he have a poor 40 at the combine, he also tied for the worst results in the D-line group in the bench (17 reps).  Yet he's always seen as a power end.  The film, and the comments of his opponents don't lie.  He's obviously a handful for opponents to deal with.  I'm assuming that he understands how he can use his attributes (length and mass) to gain a leverage advantage.  Then it's all about technique - hand fighting, balance etc.   I'm assuming he's pretty polished as far as his technique is concerned, though I'm sure ever rookie has things he can learn.  I think, however, that he probably has a lot of room to grow in terms of strength and explosion.  He's never going to run a 4.5 40, but neither did Kyle Williams.  Williams was explosive because he worked on his first step.  He was explosive in spite of his physical limitations.  I think Epenesa can do some of that too.