The Bills need to keep Duke Williams

[HappyDays]

3 hours ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

I was thinking the same thing about Roberts that maybe McKenzie is good enough for that role 

 

Every time McKenzie is back there for a return I'm worried he'll fumble it. Roberts is way more reliable. He's a lock to make the team.

[Alphadawg7]

2 minutes ago, ganesh said:

I agree.  that is the problem.   Brown, Beasley, Jones, Roberts will be dressing up.  I just don't see Williams suiting up.  But then when we do have injuries to WRs he could step in

 

They will dress more than 4 WRs on game day and especially since one primarily returns kicks.

[Stank_Nasty]

4 hours ago, Boca BIlls said:

The only trolls are people that think they can take ANYTHING away from preseason.

lets use some sense here..... if a guy has hands he just has hands... preseason has little to do with that. come on man. 

Edited August 24, 2019 by Stank_Nasty

[T master]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I honestly think Foster is in trouble. He has hardly played on offense through three games and yet was out there on Special Teams. 

 

I think they want to keep foster around because he is a gamer & that is why they are using him on ST's to give them more of a reason to keep him around due to his versatility, his speed is not only a weapon on offense but on teams too !! 

 

Cuts this year will be extremely hard because there is a lot of talent on this team worthy of developing !!

Edited August 24, 2019 by T master

[GG]

Bills have 3 WRs that can do exactly the same thing - Roberts, McKittrick and Ray Ray.   They only have one who does what Duke does. 

 

Do the math.  

[Stank_Nasty]

3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Why do people keep saying they will keep someone else “better suited for Dabolls offense”?  

 

I mean, if anyone was paying attention, Daboll called plays in back to back weeks specifically in the end zone and specifically for Duke and not only did he make the TD catch both times, there isn’t anyone else on the team who would be a better option to throw it to over Duke.  Sure seems to fit Dabolls offense just fine, and would appear Daboll would agree.

 

Another example...Zay in the first quarter should have had that first down catch who barely even looked for the ball on the back shoulder throw.  Duke catches that ball easily IMO.  These are all plays in dabolls system where a guy like Duke is an asset.

 

Bottom line:  All coaches systems have slants, curls, and fade routes...and all coaches systems need guys who can use their body to be in position and actually catch the ball.

 

Duke fits his system just fine.  I don’t know he will make the team or not, it’s a tight race with limited spots and several worthy players...but he’s certainly made a case for himself and would fit just fine if they chose him.

screw the system in general for this case.... Allen needs at least one wr that can go get the "area code" catch for him. HANDS are good in any system.... big ben and AB made a career and won a ton of games off adlibbing and making the area code grab. 

[Chandler#81]

1 hour ago, Don Otreply said:

Duke just catches passes, something another receiver we have has trouble with. If its my decision, he makes the team.

 

Go Bills!!!

TOUCHDOWN!

[starrymessenger]

The Bills wanted Boldin. It didn't work out. The Bills signed Benjamin. It didn't work out. The Bills looked north of the border to sign  Duke. I don't know if he makes the team or not but it looks to me like someone in the organization feels the need for a big physical receiver (maybe Beano).

[SmokinES3]

Keep 6, cut McCloud and/or Mackenzie. 

[VW82]

I started to come around to the idea we might cut Zay after that first play to start the game but there are too many iffy guys on the bubble. Foster has four total targets in three games (all came in the same game, one catch). Duke over Foster seems reasonable to me. Do we like him over someone like Wade?

 

I also think we have to consider Dawson Knox when debating how many receivers we'll keep. Surely McD/Dabol has plans to eventually split that kid out wide.  

Edited August 24, 2019 by VW82

[Peace Frog]

We need to keep Duke for the simple fact that this team won't have any Williams on it if he is cut.  Reason enough for me!

[GG]

From the team's QB (courtesy of The Athletic)

 

“I love the kid,” Josh Allen said. “He’s one of the guys that you gravitate towards, just his mindset. He had the opportunity to speak in front of us as a team, and he’s just one of those guys that you absolutely pull for. You want one of those guys on your team. He’s gone out the last couple games and made some really big plays for us. It speaks volumes on his character and why he does that. It’s no surprise to me

[Victory Formation]

I think we need to move on from Zay and I think he equally needs to move on from us. He can be a good player but I think a change of scene is desperately needed for him. I wonder if there is a WR desperate team that would be willing to trade a mid rounder for him. I think we keep: Beasley, Brown, Duke, Foster, Roberts and McKenzie. McCloud to the practice squad.

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

3 games, 6 catches for 53 yards, what am I missing? Maybe a good redzone target, but outside of the redzone he's not getting open against 3rd & 4th string players. Take last night for example, he had a great 16 yard TD catch over a much smaller defender, his other 2 catches netted -1 yards. He's had 2 good catches in 3 games and people are blown away by that performance, I don't get it.

[bmur66]

Zay continues to make routine NFL catches look difficult. I’m liking what Duke brings to the table. Strong hands

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

13 minutes ago, Sunshower said:

I think we need to move on from Zay and I think he equally needs to move on from us. He can be a good player but I think a change of scene is desperately needed for him. I wonder if there is a WR desperate team that would be willing to trade a mid rounder for him. I think we keep: Beasley, Brown, Duke, Foster, Roberts and McKenzie. McCloud to the practice squad.

With a really bad cast of QBs Zay was 16th in the league for TD receptions. With a cap hit of 1.8 million this year and 2.15 million next year why would you get rid of a player producing as much as he has with really bad QBing and counting that little towards the cap. Keep Zay at least until the end of his rookie contract(Thruogh 2020).

 

[Bills Oil Company]

7 receivers make the team.  Williams will make the roster, but another receiver will not be sacrificed to do so (Foster and McKenzie make it too).  It will come from another position.  

 

Example: I see them only keeping 3 running backs.   McCoy, Gore, & Singletary.     Wade to PS.   All others will be cut.   Dimarco is a wild card too and i didn't count him in the RB category.   

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 24, 2019 by Bills Oil Company

[qwksilver]

3 minutes ago, Bills Oil Company said:

7 receivers make the team.  Williams will make the roster, but another receiver will not be sacrificed to do so (Foster and McKenzie make it too).  It will come from another position.  

 

Example: I see them only keeping 3 running backs. 

 

 

 

 

 

Agree it will be competition from other positions I think they keep 4 rbs. Yeldon has looked good the last 2 games. 

Edited August 24, 2019 by qwksilver

[wppete]

I think he is a lock to make this team. He has played well and deserves to be on this team. Red Zone threat and active willing blocker in the run game. We don’t have any other receiver in this roster with that skill set. Plus he is a hungry player with a chip on his shoulder ready to prove he belongs. 

[SCBills]

22 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

3 games, 6 catches for 53 yards, what am I missing? Maybe a good redzone target, but outside of the redzone he's not getting open against 3rd & 4th string players. Take last night for example, he had a great 16 yard TD catch over a much smaller defender, his other 2 catches netted -1 yards. He's had 2 good catches in 3 games and people are blown away by that performance, I don't get it.

 

How do you know he hasn’t been getting open?  Game 2 was all about the short passing game, and he had a TD.  Game 3 was all about the running game, and he had a TD.  

 

Guys like Alshon Jeffery don’t typically leave their man in the dust, they’re just open even when they’re not. 

[benderbender]

5 hours ago, Boca BIlls said:

The only trolls are people that think they can take ANYTHING away from preseason.

McD is not a troll. He claps too much. It would give him away when he hides under bridges or caves. If he was a mythical creature, I’d go with centaur. He could clap and run simultaneously. 

[Alphadawg7]

 

 

This was interesting to read today.  Some or my thoughts and opinions after seeing this:

1. Duke - Clearly they felt he deserved more time on the field and even got in with the ones and obviously with the twos.  This is quite the climb in what was supposed to be a dress rehearsal, and he didnt disappoint.  
   1. My Opinion:  They liked what they saw of Duke and are seriously considering keeping him and Duke only helped those chances.  I think he is going to make this team, and wouldn't surprise if he was in the conversation to start opposite John Brown which make the WRs difficult to cover...Cole slashing the short and middle, Brown taking the top off, Duke as the sure handed possession guy and our TE's pressing the seams.  
2. Zay - While Zay started with the ones, it seems like they aren't clear on what to do with him and I think they are really pondering both his role, and maybe place on this team.  You don't risk a sure "starter" on the field in the 2nd half of a preseason game, especially when you have other guys to evaluate for the roster.  
   1. My Opinion:  Zay's "presumed" starter role is in serious jeopardy and may have already slipped out of his hands like a Josh Allen TD strike.  And if he does officially fall out of the starter conversation, then his role and place on the team gets more shaky.  And its possible they ran him in the 2nd half to try and get him involved to maybe try and boost some potential trade value too considering he had done mostly nothing in the first 2 games other than dropping a TD strike from Josh.
3. McKenzie vs Ray Ray - I think this is a CLEAR indication that McKenzie has stepped out in front of Ray Ray with a nice lead.  If they were still wavering on him, they would have given him more snaps in this battle.  I don't see Ray Ray making this team right now as McKenzie has outplayed him in the games after Ray Ray had the more impressive camp.
   1. My Opinion:  McKenzie makes the 53 over Ray Ray, assuming they keep enough WR's to merit keeping either.
4. Robert Foster - For all the bubble talk for him, I think the snap count actually lends itself to possibly suggesting he's safer than some think.  If he was fighting for a roster spot I just don't see them only giving him 2 snaps in the 3rd preseason game.  For a guy that was a gamer last year, if they were starting to waver on him, I would think they would give him a lot of snaps for 2 reasons:  To better evaluate him and also potentially showcase him for a trade as he would have trade value (rather than just cut him).  
   1. My Opinion:  Foster isn't in as much jeopardy as Zay, but his role is still up in the air for sure.  
5. Everyone else:  None of the other guys will be on this roster week 1.  Cam Phillips had a strong camp, but Duke was the one moving up the depth charts the last 2 weeks and getting runs in with the 1's and 2's.  Several of the WR's will be legit PS candidates though and I expect at least 2 make it there, maybe more.  
   1. My Opinion:  Cam, Sills and Easley would be guys I would keep an eye out for the PS.  

Edited August 24, 2019 by Alphadawg7

[Mister Defense]

44 minutes ago, Bills Oil Company said:

7 receivers make the team.  Williams will make the roster, but another receiver will not be sacrificed to do so (Foster and McKenzie make it too).  It will come from another position.  

 

Example: I see them only keeping 3 running backs.   McCoy, Gore, & Singletary.     Wade to PS.   All others will be cut.   Dimarco is a wild card too and i didn't count him in the RB category.   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree, with both Williams and McKenzie making the team.  Look at the off season focus on offense.  Hard to imagine the Bills risk losing 1-2 receivers who could make a difference this year as these two might.

 

Nice to see the Bills this year having to make so many of these tough decisions on their final roster, a good sign of a much improved front office and organization.

[Logic]

Brian Daboll recently said that the first ingredient to being a good receiver is getting separation. It's the one thing that Williams struggles with.

He blocks well, he catches well, but he doesn't get much separation. Josh Allen has showed thus far in his career that he's more likely/willing to throw to a receiver who has separated from his defender. If you notice, all of Williams' success so far has come with Barkley at QB. 

If Williams makes the team, it will because he is a great blocker and because they know they need at least ONE big target in the passing game. He could be a red zone specialist, that sort of thing. On the other hand, if he DOESN'T make the team, it will be because he can't separate from starting level cornerbacks worth a darn.

I can't help but wonder if he'd be better off at tight end, though it's obviously too late in the offseason to start THAT conversion, and we wouldn't have room on our TE depth chart any way.

[transplantbillsfan]

9 hours ago, ganesh said:

It will  now come to between McKenzie and Foster.   Williams has earned a roster spot.

 

I believe Foster is on the team. Roberts and McKenzie are interchangeable to me. Keep one.

[dubs]

In my humble opinion, I’d keep The Duke. 

 

Rationale: he definitely brings a skill set this team doesn’t have. I could seen him having a couple key plays throughout the season. In the red zone, you’ll have to account for him on fades and back shoulder passes, which could also open up the middle a little more. 

 

Conclusion:

The Abolitionist

The shifty, sure handed, white slot guy

Reuben Foster

Andre the not so Giant

Mckittrick

The black Duke

 

Thanks, I’ll be here all week, please make sure to tip your waitress!

Edited August 24, 2019 by dubs

[HappyDays]

 

It's pretty weird that Zay was playing special teams yesterday. That's not what a "roster lock" would be stuck doing. It really did feel like Zay and Duke were competing last night.

[transplantbillsfan]

9 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I honestly think Foster is in trouble. He has hardly played on offense through three games and yet was out there on Special Teams. 

 

Still really think they're playing the long game with Foster. He clearly has some maturity issues and it looks like OBD is in "shape up or ship out" mode but I really don't think they want to cut him.

 

We find out a week from today. If they cut him I probably won't be shocked, but It'll be surprised.

6 hours ago, KRT88 said:

Will Duke Williams ever be on the game day roster?

who is he high pointing these TD catches against? Are these guys NFL roster players? 

 

Evety ty year I hear about this guy and that guy has to make the roster. Simply put, when can he make an impact on a real game?  Does the teams 6th WR really matter? 

 

Robert Foster did last year.

[Buffalo716]

3 hours ago, VW82 said:

I started to come around to the idea we might cut Zay after that first play to start the game but there are too many iffy guys on the bubble. Foster has four total targets in three games (all came in the same game, one catch). Duke over Foster seems reasonable to me. Do we like him over someone like Wade?

 

I also think we have to consider Dawson Knox when debating how many receivers we'll keep. Surely McD/Dabol has plans to eventually split that kid out wide.  

There is 0% chance that Wade makes the active roster this season

 

He is too green despite the physical gifts

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

There’s only 1 receiver of the final group where I wouldn’t miss anything about him—- that’s Zay Jones. Every other receiver offers something special. Zay seems like he has a low ceiling.

[transplantbillsfan]

5 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

I'd cut Zay before I'd cut Foster.

 

Me too. But Beane loves him for some weird reason, so he stays.

[MakeBuffaloGreatAgain]

8 hours ago, Boca BIlls said:

Hahahahaha

 

What an insult to Alshon...

both are 6'3" 220... both can out jump/high point the football. Both can block. Both have a very difficult time creating space when they run routes. I would say the comparison is decent

[Don Otreply]

7 hours ago, Boca BIlls said:

The only trolls are people that think they can take ANYTHING away from preseason.

That’s right, I forgot, the entire league goes through preseason for no reason whatsoever, thanks for clearing that up for all of us. Your a bloody genius. ?

 

Go Bills!!!

[Gray Beard]

Reminds me of the Kamar Aiken situation.  Good in pre season, the consensus was that he would make the roster, got cut, ended up having a respectable tenure with another team (the Ravens).  Time will tell.

[transplantbillsfan]

3 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

Every time McKenzie is back there for a return I'm worried he'll fumble it. Roberts is way more reliable. He's a lock to make the team.

 

Was it McKenzie with the fumble problems last year or Ray Ray?

 

I think I permanently blocked out the game one of them basically lost us on that fumbled punt.

3 hours ago, GG said:

Bills have 3 WRs that can do exactly the same thing - Roberts, McKittrick and Ray Ray.   They only have one who does what Duke does. 

 

Do the math.  

 

Completely agree.

 

I prefer keeping either Roberts or McKenzie, not both.

[GreggTX]

Foster is gone, I'd guess. McCloud is probably gone too. As far as Williams goes, he's had a decent preseason, but he's had several shots at the NFL and did not impress. I don't expect anything from him this year, but I'll hope to be pleasantly surprised.

[Putin]

7 hours ago, KRT88 said:

Will Duke Williams ever be on the game day roster?

who is he high pointing these TD catches against? Are these guys NFL roster players? 

 

Evety ty year I hear about this guy and that guy has to make the roster. Simply put, when can he make an impact on a real game?  Does the teams 6th WR really matter? 

You know drugs are bad right ??

[transplantbillsfan]

2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

 

This was interesting to read today.  Some or my thoughts and opinions after seeing this:

1. Duke - Clearly they felt he deserved more time on the field and even got in with the ones and obviously with the twos.  This is quite the climb in what was supposed to be a dress rehearsal, and he didnt disappoint.  
   1. My Opinion:  They liked what they saw of Duke and are seriously considering keeping him and Duke only helped those chances.  I think he is going to make this team, and wouldn't surprise if he was in the conversation to start opposite John Brown which make the WRs difficult to cover...Cole slashing the short and middle, Brown taking the top off, Duke as the sure handed possession guy and our TE's pressing the seams.  
2. Zay - While Zay started with the ones, it seems like they aren't clear on what to do with him and I think they are really pondering both his role, and maybe place on this team.  You don't risk a sure "starter" on the field in the 2nd half of a preseason game, especially when you have other guys to evaluate for the roster.  
   1. My Opinion:  Zay's "presumed" starter role is in serious jeopardy and may have already slipped out of his hands like a Josh Allen TD strike.  And if he does officially fall out of the starter conversation, then his role and place on the team gets more shaky.  And its possible they ran him in the 2nd half to try and get him involved to maybe try and boost some potential trade value too considering he had done mostly nothing in the first 2 games other than dropping a TD strike from Josh.
3. McKenzie vs Ray Ray - I think this is a CLEAR indication that McKenzie has stepped out in front of Ray Ray with a nice lead.  If they were still wavering on him, they would have given him more snaps in this battle.  I don't see Ray Ray making this team right now as McKenzie has outplayed him in the games after Ray Ray had the more impressive camp.
   1. My Opinion:  McKenzie makes the 53 over Ray Ray, assuming they keep enough WR's to merit keeping either.
4. Robert Foster - For all the bubble talk for him, I think the snap count actually lends itself to possibly suggesting he's safer than some think.  If he was fighting for a roster spot I just don't see them only giving him 2 snaps in the 3rd preseason game.  For a guy that was a gamer last year, if they were starting to waver on him, I would think they would give him a lot of snaps for 2 reasons:  To better evaluate him and also potentially showcase him for a trade as he would have trade value (rather than just cut him).  
   1. My Opinion:  Foster isn't in as much jeopardy as Zay, but his role is still up in the air for sure.  
5. Everyone else:  None of the other guys will be on this roster week 1.  Cam Phillips had a strong camp, but Duke was the one moving up the depth charts the last 2 weeks and getting runs in with the 1's and 2's.  Several of the WR's will be legit PS candidates though and I expect at least 2 make it there, maybe more.  
   1. My Opinion:  Cam, Sills and Easley would be guys I would keep an eye out for the PS.  

 

Gotta bump this.

 

Interesting take on Foster. I think it's the correct one.

[Alphadawg7]

9 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Gotta bump this.

 

Interesting take on Foster. I think it's the correct one.

 

I also created that post into its own thread too

[Patrick Duffy]

2 hours ago, Logic said:

Brian Daboll recently said that the first ingredient to being a good receiver is getting separation. It's the one thing that Williams struggles with.

He blocks well, he catches well, but he doesn't get much separation. Josh Allen has showed thus far in his career that he's more likely/willing to throw to a receiver who has separated from his defender. If you notice, all of Williams' success so far has come with Barkley at QB. 

If Williams makes the team, it will because he is a great blocker and because they know they need at least ONE big target in the passing game. He could be a red zone specialist, that sort of thing. On the other hand, if he DOESN'T make the team, it will be because he can't separate from starting level cornerbacks worth a darn.

I can't help but wonder if he'd be better off at tight end, though it's obviously too late in the offseason to start THAT conversion, and we wouldn't have room on our TE depth chart any way.

I would say Zay also doesn't get separation very well either though, anyway I'd still keep Duke over Zay.