AJ McCarron's Arm Strength

[Mickey]

2 hours ago, Luxy312 said:

 

Why don't you just go ahead and list some of the other starters in the NFL while you're at it?  Trubisky (51), Watson (45), Prescott (54).  It's a nice cherry pick, but I would bet you that there isn't a single Bills fan that wouldn't take the latter of those two.  Trubisky is a TBD.

A weak arm is a weak arm, the fact that others are able to be successful with a weak arm doesn't change the fact that his arm is weak.  There are many variables at play that make comparisons difficult. Prescott has the best offensive line in football in front of him and an excellent running back. Watson had some great games before he was hurt but so did Griffin. His long term success is an open question. And if I was cherry picking, how many abject failures with arm strength similar to AJ's did you leave out? I made it clear in my post that arm strength is a questionable measure of a QB's worth and that AJ's other talents will hopefully be enough. All that being said, his arm strength is barely even average. There is a reason he wasn't at the top of any team's list of must have FA's.

[26TrapDraw]

2 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Arm strength is old news.

 

Now a days it’s all about arm arrogance 

Allen's arm must be a self centered ego maniacal prick.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2 minutes ago, BeefCurtns said:

Allen's arm must be a self centered ego maniacal prick.

Let’s hope so!

[LABILLBACKER]

3 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

 

Allen is off the charts. I never heard anyone question EJ’s atm strength, so it’s odd that it has come up with McCarron.

 

If can get some protection, I think he will be fine until Allen is ready to play.

....the concerns for Allen were the same with EJ....poor accuracy, footwork and slow eyes...the only advantage with 62 is throwing thru the wind in Buffalo...please God don't let Josh turn out to be EJ?

[Fadingpain]

4 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

Here are QB ball velocity numbers from 2008 - 2017.

 

http://blogs.ourlads.com/2017/03/16/quarterback-ball-velocity-at-nfl-combine-2008-2015/

 

EJ Manual, who was generally recognized as having a big arm, threw 54 mph at the combine. AJ McCarron threw 53 mph.

 

Arm strength is not as issue for AJ.

We already knew that.

 

Show me meaningful data that indicates throwing velocity translates to success in the NFL at the QB position.

 

Keep in mind 80% of all passes are 20 yards or less.

 

I note that past "velocity champions" include such great Quarterbacks as Logan Thomas, Tyler Bray, Brandon Weeden, Levi Brown, and everyone's favorite passer: Colin Kaepernick.

 

 

3 hours ago, BUFFALOBART said:

Odd, since EJ threw a very  soft ball with a big arc to the trajectory 

I think he was so conscious of his power that it screwed with his head and he held off deliberately when he threw. 

 

Kind of like the weird mental glitch some pitchers have when they field a ball and throw to first base.  

 

They are so aware that they have the power to throw the ball through the glove of the first baseman, it screws with their head, they hold off on their natural throwing motion/velocity, and end up throwing inaccurately to the bag.

 

 

[Sky Diver]

6 hours ago, BUFFALOBART said:

Odd, since EJ threw a very  soft ball with a big arc to the trajectory 

 

Ball velocity has nothing to do with trajectory. It’s distance per time.

2 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

....the concerns for Allen were the same with EJ....poor accuracy, footwork and slow eyes...the only advantage with 62 is throwing thru the wind in Buffalo...please God don't let Josh turn out to be EJ?

 

I don’t think Allen had anything to do with EJ.

[Eric Moulds on my A**]

7 hours ago, Ramza86 said:

Being an NFL level starting QB is currently his issue. 

 

 

It may end up that way but as far as we know now.. he has a chance to start. That's more than what he had in Cincy. If he ends up being very good, we have a nice problem on our hands.

[fansince88]

5 hours ago, musichunch said:

Looking at college tape, AJ is a very steady and calm QB who has enough arm strength in the NFL to be a good starting game manager. Surround him with a good team and he can take you to the playoffs. Makes great intermediate throws in tight spots, can move around the pocket, and is pretty decisive. His ceiling is higher than Andy Dalton in my opinion. Does not use his feet as much though.

 

Peterman is undersized and jittery. Does not have good arm strength but his release is very fast and he has great zip and accuracy on his balls. I see what McDermott sees in him, but I don't believe he can be a good starter in this league. I think his ceiling is smart and surprisingly good backup QB. He will be a backup on this team as long as McDermott is here. Can surprise you with some 300 yard games. 

 

AJ is going to win the job this offseason. Would be very surprised if he doesn't. Should get us anywhere from 8-8 to 10-6 depending on how everyone else plays. Next year we can start talking about AJ vs. Allen. Allen's ceiling is top 3-5 superstar QB, in case anybody was wondering. Allen can probably start this year, but AJ is too steady a QB in general to take that risk. No need to rush things. 

I hope you are 100% spot on.

[rolltiderx2]

5 hours ago, Teddy KGB said:

Brodie Croyle and Greg McElroy were better 

AJ was better than both. Brodie was a good QB with a zippy cannon for an arm and would have had a solid NFL career if not for knee injuries. McElroy had the head but not the physical tools and made the most of it. AJ is the best pro QB prospect to come out of Bama in....well, I can't think that far back....ever.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

5 hours ago, musichunch said:

Looking at college tape, AJ is a very steady and calm QB who has enough arm strength in the NFL to be a good starting game manager. Surround him with a good team and he can take you to the playoffs. Makes great intermediate throws in tight spots, can move around the pocket, and is pretty decisive. His ceiling is higher than Andy Dalton in my opinion. Does not use his feet as much though.

 

Peterman is undersized and jittery. Does not have good arm strength but his release is very fast and he has great zip and accuracy on his balls. I see what McDermott sees in him, but I don't believe he can be a good starter in this league. I think his ceiling is smart and surprisingly good backup QB. He will be a backup on this team as long as McDermott is here. Can surprise you with some 300 yard games. 

 

AJ is going to win the job this offseason. Would be very surprised if he doesn't. Should get us anywhere from 8-8 to 10-6 depending on how everyone else plays. Next year we can start talking about AJ vs. Allen. Allen's ceiling is top 3-5 superstar QB, in case anybody was wondering. Allen can probably start this year, but AJ is too steady a QB in general to take that risk. No need to rush things. 

 

 

...overall solid assessment and nicely done bud....too many new parts, moving parts, new OC/scheme, etc to put the onus on Allen who needs to be brought along slowly...if AJ can be the Steady Eddie, cerebral game manager he was at 'Bama, he can allow the other peices to gradually fall into place while keeping this club competitive IMO.....

[Domdab99]

I couldn't give a **** if AJ McCarron throws the ball with his left foot while blindfolded. He's a placeholder. Nothing more. 

[K-9]

1 hour ago, rolltiderx2 said:

AJ was better than both. Brodie was a good QB with a zippy cannon for an arm and would have had a solid NFL career if not for knee injuries. McElroy had the head but not the physical tools and made the most of it. AJ is the best pro QB prospect to come out of Bama in....well, I can't think that far back....ever.

Namath and Stabler are the standard bearers for Alabama QBs and McCarran shouldn’t even be mentioned in the same sentence...unless it’s a sentence that says he shouldn’t be mentioned in the same sentence.

[Buffalo716]

1 hour ago, rolltiderx2 said:

AJ was better than both. Brodie was a good QB with a zippy cannon for an arm and would have had a solid NFL career if not for knee injuries. McElroy had the head but not the physical tools and made the most of it. AJ is the best pro QB prospect to come out of Bama in....well, I can't think that far back....ever.

 

Joe Namath and Ken Stabler?

[DC Tom]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

Joe Namath and Ken Stabler?

 

No, Richard Namath and Oliver Wendell Stabler.  You've never heard of them?

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, DC Tom said:

 

No, Richard Namath and Oliver Wendell Stabler.  You've never heard of them?

 

Yes of course the great Dick Namath 

[DC Tom]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

Yes of course the great Dick Namath 

 

That's what Suzy Kobler calls him...

[YoloinOhio]

He will start this year due to lack of better options but “arm strength” or lack thereof doesn’t matter as much as “arm talent.” 

[Mr. WEO]

9 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

Here are QB ball velocity numbers from 2008 - 2017.

 

http://blogs.ourlads.com/2017/03/16/quarterback-ball-velocity-at-nfl-combine-2008-2015/

 

EJ Manual, who was generally recognized as having a big arm, threw 54 mph at the combine. AJ McCarron threw 53 mph.

 

Arm strength is not as issue for AJ.

 

 

No it certainly won't be...

[Hapless Bills Fan]

12 hours ago, transient said:

Regardless of the actual number rewatch the pick at the end of the Jacksonville playoff game and ask yourself if you don’t have concerns about his arm strength. 

 

I have concerns about both Peterman and AJ's arm strength.  Probably more about Peterman.  Neither seem able to put enough "zip" on those sideline throws.

[billsfan89]

53 seems like a solid score, McCarron seems like he has enough arm strength to get it done but not an elite arm either. McCarron will need good touch and decision making to be successful as his arm can get it done but it won't bail him out of mistake much either. That's my take based off of his scouting reports coming out of college and the takes people have on him after his limited starts in Cincy. 

[bills11]

EJ manuel had a big arm during the combine when he was coached up...if you watched him at fla state..or during bills game despite having the ability to put zip on the ball his ball always floated..i still remember Jim kelly being in the booth with tasker etc as a guest and hes watching ej and hes like just rip the ball..cus ej wud float comeback routes cus his mechanics were so robotic

[Hapless Bills Fan]

12 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

 

Allen is off the charts. I never heard anyone question EJ’s atm strength, so it’s odd that it has come up with McCarron.

 

If can get some protection, I think he will be fine until Allen is ready to play.

 

Arm strength was one of the questions in McCarron's pre-draft assessments.  Stuff like "does not have a big time arm" "average arm" etc. 

I'm still looking for that one video clip for you though - televised game, announcers are droning on about how McCarron doesn't have enough arm to drive the ball downfield - while meanwhile, on the screen behind them, McCarron is doing just that, for a TD.  BURN!  It's funny as heck.

It's the "if AJ can get some protection" bit that's concerning me (for all of our QB).  People tell me it's not as bad as I think....

[H2o]

AJ has enough arm strength and the guy is pretty accurate. I still think Allen beats him out in camp, but he will get a fair shake here and he's better than Peterman.

 

[NoSaint]

12 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

It is more of a unknown then a issue

 

And given the low odds for even perfect specimens, being an unknown isn’t thaaaat great a quality for a day 3 guy. A long shot is better than no shot but it’s still an issue

[Thrivefourfive]

I couldn’t believe he’s 6’4” when I looked it up. He plays like he’s 6’0”.

[ALF]

Deshaun Watson, Clemson, 45 (Left), 45 (Right)  yikes , did not know that , put me down for drafting Mahomes  in 2017. 

[Paul Costa]

21 hours ago, jr1 said:

my man Logan Thomas hit 60

Unfortunately that’s the only thing he could hit ?

[RoyBatty is alive]

21 hours ago, BBills88 said:

He measured better than Tyrod Taylor & DeShaun Watson

I find it hard to believe Deshaun Watson only had a 45.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, ALF said:

Deshaun Watson, Clemson, 45 (Left), 45 (Right)  yikes , did not know that , put me down for drafting Mahomes  in 2017. 

 

FWIW if these are the OurLads numbers, it's been said that they differ substantively from the official combine numbers.

[RoyBatty is alive]

9 hours ago, H2o said:

AJ has enough arm strength and the guy is pretty accurate. I still think Allen beats him out in camp, but he will get a fair shake here and he's better than Peterman.

 

This high light reel is instructive for a few things, he was hardly ever under pressure, his receivers usually had got separation/had their man beat and had ibncredible YAC.  I give AJ credit, he did slide in the pocket nicely twice and had nice placement on the ball but this is more a testimony that he was as much the product of a great team as anything.

[ALF]

9 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

FWIW if these are the OurLads numbers, it's been said that they differ substantively from the official combine numbers.

 

You are correct, thanks

 

Dane Brugler
✔
@dpbrugler

 Ball velocity numbers (MPH) from the Combine:

 

60 - Mahomes
59 - Webb
56 - Kizer
55 - Trubisky, Evans
53 - Peterman, Kaaya
49 - Watson

6:54 PM - Mar 10, 2017

https://www.dawgsbynature.com/2017/3/10/14890754/cleveland-browns-2017-nfl-scouting-combine-qb-velocity

Edited May 10, 2018 by ALF

[billsfan_34]

22 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

My mental image of McCarron is one of a well-coached, dedicated all around athlete who achieves very well if he's in the right college environment.   The right environment is where there's good talent on the team and good coaching, where the QB is expected to execute the plays but not be a playmaker.  Frankly, that's what I think Dalton looks like.   

 

In that sense, he's good for McDermott, for whom ideal player is one who does his job as well as he can every play.  I think Dalton will be solid starter for the Bills, until Allen takes over.   When will Allen take over?   When he can execute the offense nearly as well as McCarron can.   Why will he take over?   Because the quality of his arm and his physical talents generally will allow Allen to be a playmaker as well as a field general.    So when Allen's field generalship approaches McCarron's, in 2018 or 2019, Allen's athletic superiority will be enough to get him on the field.  

Dalton? 

[Cynical]

10 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Arm strength was one of the questions in McCarron's pre-draft assessments.  Stuff like "does not have a big time arm" "average arm" etc. 

I'm still looking for that one video clip for you though - televised game, announcers are droning on about how McCarron doesn't have enough arm to drive the ball downfield - while meanwhile, on the screen behind them, McCarron is doing just that, for a TD.  BURN!  It's funny as heck.

It's the "if AJ can get some protection" bit that's concerning me (for all of our QB).  People tell me it's not as bad as I think....

 

Ah, yes. One of my favorites:

 

 

[auburnbillsbacker]

Remember when everyone on here didn't want to draft D. Watson because of the low velocity of his passes?  I do, even though most people on here now claim to have wanted Watson.  I no longer care too much about how many MPHs a pass goes.   

[T master]

On 5/9/2018 at 9:12 AM, Ramza86 said:

Being an NFL level starting QB is currently his issue. 

 

 

 

Actually it's Bills fans issue they don't even want to give the guy a chance & he hasn't even thrown a ball in a Bills Uni yet !! 

 

I can't wait to see how many jump on the band wagon 

[Rock'em Sock'em]

21 hours ago, H2o said:

AJ has enough arm strength and the guy is pretty accurate. I still think Allen beats him out in camp, but he will get a fair shake here and he's better than Peterman.

 

I was not super impressed with the video of AJ's top 10 plays at Alabama.  A couple were under thrown and most we fairly simple lob passes to a streaking wide receiver.  In Cincinnati he played with Eifert, Green, Sanu, Jones, and Bernard.  Peterman likely could have impressed with that squad. All three QBs have a reasonable chance to start week one.

Edited May 11, 2018 by Rock'em Sock'em

[3rdand12]

On 5/9/2018 at 11:40 AM, ddaryl said:

 

 

Ì don't know much about dancin', that's why I got this song
One of my legs is shorter than the other and both my feet's too long
'Course now right along with 'em, I got no natural rhythm
But I go dancin' every night, hopin' one day I might get it right

if this is Mothers of Invention i will rustle  up my zircon encrusted tweezers and saddle up my pygmy pony

On 5/9/2018 at 1:35 PM, I'm Spartacus said:

 

You are either referring to a "Dancin' Fool" or somebody is Moving to Montana?

Dancin fool. knew i heard that decades ago.  well done I'm   !!

[ddaryl]

11 hours ago, 3rdand12 said:

if this is Mothers of Invention i will rustle  up my zircon encrusted tweezers and saddle up my pygmy pony

Dancin fool. knew i heard that decades ago.  well done I'm   !!

 

 

Mothers of invention were pre Moving to Montana days. I beleive Zappa busted the Mothers up in about 1970 and then formed his more popular band that brought us most of th more popular known Zappa music.

[Mr. WEO]

is it strong enough to lift this?