Khalil Shakir's 500 yard season

[BADOLBILZ]

4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I was slightly surprised when I saw it this morning but Shakir's 39 yards yesterday took him over 500 for the season to 506. Fair jump from 161 as a rook. He has definitely developed. He is more physical, he has learnt the nuance of NFL spacing and his hands have been much better: two drops in 20 targets last year; 0 in 39 targets this year. He is definitely someone who can contribute here on a very cheap deal the next two years as a 5th round pick. 

 

 

Yeah he's effectively filled the role as WR4 that Gabe had in his first couple seasons.

 

He does it differently,   with YAC instead of getting over top of the defense like Gabe.........but effectively similar results........he stacks up yards when defense's lose track of him.

 

Problem is the WR2 Gabe continues to be a disappointment and Stef Diggs is playing like a shadow of his former self...........and the 3rd option is either Cook or Kincaid and a RB and possession receiving(at this stage) TE aren't as impactful in those roles if the 2 main ingredients aren't excellent.

 

It's why, despite some promising young talent they have their worst WR corps since 2019.   

 

[DJB]

Shakir is a suitable number 3 inside . 
 

A young #2 outside WR with potential to be a #1 is a HUGE need. Diggs won’t be around forever 

[EmotionallyUnstable]

4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I was slightly surprised when I saw it this morning but Shakir's 39 yards yesterday took him over 500 for the season to 506. Fair jump from 161 as a rook. He has definitely developed. He is more physical, he has learnt the nuance of NFL spacing and his hands have been much better: two drops in 20 targets last year; 0 in 39 targets this year. He is definitely someone who can contribute here on a very cheap deal the next two years as a 5th round pick. 

I get Tyler Boyd vibes from this guy.

19 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

He’s basically a Tyler Boyd. He’s a good, solid WR3 but not a game-wrecker. He seems to run good routes and has nice hands, but not a ton of speed or shiftiness. 

Wow great minds think alike! I think he has a bit more of that than you’re giving him credit. He also can get dirty in the ground game and isn’t afraid to block.

[EmotionallyUnstable]

7 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yeah he's effectively filled the role as WR4 that Gabe had in his first couple seasons.

 

He does it differently,   with YAC instead of getting over top of the defense like Gabe.........but effectively similar results........he stacks up yards when defense's lose track of him.

 

Problem is the WR2 Gabe continues to be a disappointment and Stef Diggs is playing like a shadow of his former self...........and the 3rd option is either Cook or Kincaid and a RB and possession receiving(at this stage) TE aren't as impactful in those roles if the 2 main ingredients aren't excellent.

 

It's why, despite some promising young talent they have their worst WR corps since 2019.   

 

I think Beane would admit that they needed to do more the past few seasons. IMO they instead chose to upgrade the OL and took some shorts at some low tier FAs, he missed. Cant fix it all at once. The OL is intact at least through next season. Next year HAS to be the year, and they should double down and grab two 

[BADOLBILZ]

4 minutes ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

I get Tyler Boyd vibes from this guy.

Wow great minds think alike! I think he has a bit more of that than you’re giving him credit. He also can get dirty in the ground game and isn’t afraid to block.

 

 

Nah, c'mon.

 

Boyd is a big rangy, long armed possession receiver.   6'2" with 32" arms.

 

Shakir is a small target.   He is about 6' tall but with arms the same length as the 5'6" Deonte Harty at 28".    

 

Not really an option outside because of that lack of length and when they've tried to use him on deep throws he's had trouble tracking the ball.    So he is going to be a slot guy only.  

 

They've done a good job of keeping his throws short and intermediate this season and letting him do what he does best........run after the catch.   He's like a RB with the ball in his hands.

 

He's an unusual type.........it's hard to draw a reasonable comparison.

 

 

[EmotionallyUnstable]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Nah, c'mon.

 

Boyd is a big rangy, long armed possession receiver.   6'2" with 32" arms.

 

Shakir is a small target.   He is about 6' tall but with arms the same length as the 5'6" Deonte Harty at 28".    

 

Not really an option outside because of that lack of length and when they've tried to use him on deep throws he's had trouble tracking the ball.    So he is going to be a slot guy only.  

 

They've done a good job of keeping his throws short and intermediate this season and letting him do what he does best........run after the catch.   He's like a RB with the ball in his hands.

 

He's an unusual type.........it's hard to draw a reasonable comparison.

 

 

I suppose I meant more about his nature as a player than his measurables. WR3 reliably moving the chains. Does well with the ball in his hands. Nagging for defenses. Blocks. 

[Solomon Grundy]

2 hours ago, mannc said:

Just curious…is signing Tee Higgins a possibility (from a cap perspective) for the Bills?  As our number of wins goes up, our odds of getting an immediate impact WR2/future WR1 in the draft goes down…Higgins seems like he would be a nice fit here.

I would rather draft a young talented WR that can contribute and develop on a cheaper contract. I'm on the Xavier Legette/Adonai Mitchell train

[Warcodered]

6 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

I would rather draft a young talented WR that can contribute and develop on a cheaper contract. I'm on the Xavier Legette/Adonai Mitchell train

I wouldn't mind doing both, and or having more flexibility in the draft.

[BADOLBILZ]

11 minutes ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

I think Beane would admit that they needed to do more the past few seasons. IMO they instead chose to upgrade the OL and took some shorts at some low tier FAs, he missed. Cant fix it all at once. The OL is intact at least through next season. Next year HAS to be the year, and they should double down and grab two 

 

 

I think they got a bit too fixated on defense at the expense of WR talent.    I didn't hate the Von Miller contract and still think Elam will become a very good NFL starting CB...........but defensive talent wasn't the biggest area of concern for me going into that post-13-seconds offseason.   It was WR.   Job #1 is to make your QB look good.   Putting their biggest chips into the defense was a gamble, IMO.   They should have come out of that offseason with their future WR1........whether it were via trade or draft.   

 

What's frustrating is that they had already made this mistake in 2019 when they passed on a bunch of WR's in the draft in favor of trading up for Cody Ford.......then had to turn around and deal their #1 pick in an elite 2020 WR class to get a veteran WR1 because they'd fallen behind by passing on guys like Metcalf and AJ Brown.    That should have told them in their mind that they were going to have to go back to the well at WR in round 1 in the next couple drafts........but they did not.    

 

Beane has been a step too slow at the position..........and because he was so terrible with the cap early in his tenure it's kept them a step behind.   

[JaCrispy]

Liking what Shakir is becoming…we will still need a top WR target in the offseason 

[BADOLBILZ]

16 minutes ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

I suppose I meant more about his nature as a player than his measurables. WR3 reliably moving the chains. Does well with the ball in his hands. Nagging for defenses. Blocks. 

 

 

Yeah and the other thing.........this year........is that he's catching the ball like Boyd.    In 2021 Boyd did not drop a pass all regular season.   Shakir has had that distinction in 2023 so far(after an awful, drop plagued camp and preseason). 

 

Boyd was a poor man's WR1 on a bad offense prior to Higgins and Chase arriving........I don't think Shakir is capable of that due to his physical limitations............but top WR1 and WR1B talent did allow the Bengals to use Boyd for more simple work in the slot like Shakir is getting now.  

 

The big-boy football at WR is played outside........if your offense is good out there it opens up the middle.    Doesn't really work the same the other way around.   So that's where some of the people like @SWATeamwho try to tally the individual value of guys like Shakir, Kincaid, Knox and Cook lose perspective. 

 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

It took McDermott a year and a half to trust who he is as a person, but we finally got there. 

[SWATeam]

5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yeah and the other thing.........this year........is that he's catching the ball like Boyd.    In 2021 Boyd did not drop a pass all regular season.   Shakir has had that distinction in 2023 so far(after an awful, drop plagued camp and preseason). 

 

Boyd was a poor man's WR1 on a bad offense prior to Higgins and Chase arriving........I don't think Shakir is capable of that due to his physical limitations............but top WR1 and WR1B talent did allow the Bengals to use Boyd for more simple work in the slot like Shakir is getting now.  

 

The big-boy football at WR is played outside........if your offense is good out there it opens up the middle.    Doesn't really work the same the other way around.   So that's where some of the people like @SWATeamwho try to tally the individual value of guys like Shakir, Kincaid, Knox and Cook lose perspective. 

 

 

Yeah, it would be nice if we also had a top option on the outside…

[Mike in Horseheads]

1 minute ago, SWATeam said:

Yeah, it would be nice if we also had a top option on the outside…

Glad you haven't "lost perspective"

[SWATeam]

5 minutes ago, Mike in Horseheads said:

Glad you haven't "lost perspective"

Careful.  You're dangerously close to getting this discussion tied into Orioles ownership!

[RyanC883]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea one of them breaking out into a star (and Cook is close IMO) would be huge. But they still need another weapon with some speed outside. 

 

I’d draft top route runner in round 1 (eventual Diggs replacement) and physical specimen in Rd. 2 (big/fast).  Not sure who these guys are though 🤷‍♂️

[BarleyNY]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I was slightly surprised when I saw it this morning but Shakir's 39 yards yesterday took him over 500 for the season to 506. Fair jump from 161 as a rook. He has definitely developed. He is more physical, he has learnt the nuance of NFL spacing and his hands have been much better: two drops in 20 targets last year; 0 in 39 targets this year. He is definitely someone who can contribute here on a very cheap deal the next two years as a 5th round pick. 

Yup. He may never be a #1 or #2 WR, but he can contribute to the success of this team and he has a place on our roster. 

[BADOLBILZ]

26 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

Yeah, it would be nice if we also had a top option on the outside…

 

It would be nice if they had 2.........but yeah they haven't even had one with Diggs struggling lately.    That's why the weekly passing yardage stats are resembling the Tyrod Taylor days despite the Bills having a stud QB now.

 

Even more concerning is that they don't even have a single young boundary WR of note in development either.    Both of their primary boundary WR's in 2025 might not be on this roster now and both could very well be in their first 2 seasons in the NFL.   

 

So yeah, it's a huge concern now and going forward.

 

 

 

Edited January 1 by BADOLBILZ

[Alphadawg7]

6 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I was slightly surprised when I saw it this morning but Shakir's 39 yards yesterday took him over 500 for the season to 506. Fair jump from 161 as a rook. He has definitely developed. He is more physical, he has learnt the nuance of NFL spacing and his hands have been much better: two drops in 20 targets last year; 0 in 39 targets this year. He is definitely someone who can contribute here on a very cheap deal the next two years as a 5th round pick. 

 

I was banging the drum on him all offseason and all season long and really since the moment he was drafted.  He should have gotten more opportunities last year, but Dorsey just wasn't good at utilizing the talent on the roster.  He continued to ignore him for the first part of this season too, and had he not, Shakir might be closer to 700-800 yards.  

 

He just keeps making plays, and I would like to see them still get him more involved, I think he is capable of playing a Beasley role here and could deliver that level of production if he had the target share to do so.  

[MiracleAtRich1393]

38 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

I’d draft top route runner in round 1 (eventual Diggs replacement) and physical specimen in Rd. 2 (big/fast).  Not sure who these guys are though 🤷‍♂️

 

My guy Malik Nabers gives you a lot from both buckets, might as well trade up if he's falling, wouldn't mind sending next year's day 1 or day 2 pick along with several this year if needed 

[Augie]

1 hour ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

I think Beane would admit that they needed to do more the past few seasons. IMO they instead chose to upgrade the OL and took some shorts at some low tier FAs, he missed. Cant fix it all at once. The OL is intact at least through next season. Next year HAS to be the year, and they should double down and grab two 

 

Beane chose to address the guard position last offseason. I’m OK with building lines first. I keep hearing this is a deep WR draft, because we need a stud. We have a bunch of nice options, but we need a guy who scares everybody on every play.  Diggs, for whatever reason, is not that guy right now. We seriously need to nail a WR draft pick this year! 

[bouds]

Love this dude, but he just doesn't get enough targets.  Think he's going to hit 1k next year if he's given the opportunities.

[GunnerBill]

25 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

I was banging the drum on him all offseason and all season long and really since the moment he was drafted.  He should have gotten more opportunities last year, but Dorsey just wasn't good at utilizing the talent on the roster.  He continued to ignore him for the first part of this season too, and had he not, Shakir might be closer to 700-800 yards.  

 

He just keeps making plays, and I would like to see them still get him more involved, I think he is capable of playing a Beasley role here and could deliver that level of production if he had the target share to do so.  

 

I like Shakir coming out too. I had a 3rd round grade on him in that draft. But at the same time the tape told the story last year. He was struggling. I don't think it was just a case of usage. He wasn't ready. Which isn't a huge surprise. He came from a very gimmicky system at Boise and last year he was in the wrong place, ran the wrong routes, struggled to understand spacing vs zone and (I think because his head was swimming) had concentration issues catching the ball. Possibly this season Dorsey could have used him more, but the key thing is he is a considerably better player now than he was as a rookie.

[Maine-iac]

6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I like Shakir coming out too. I had a 3rd round grade on him in that draft. But at the same time the tape told the story last year. He was struggling. I don't think it was just a case of usage. He wasn't ready. Which isn't a huge surprise. He came from a very gimmicky system at Boise and last year he was in the wrong place, ran the wrong routes, struggled to understand spacing vs zone and (I think because his head was swimming) had concentration issues catching the ball. Possibly this season Dorsey could have used him more, but the key thing is he is a considerably better player now than he was as a rookie.

Seeing the ball less than Cook I guess it makes sense that he took a little longer to come around.  He started showing up in the playoffs last year and luckily it carried over.  Hopefully he keeps making plays.  The more the better.

[Alphadawg7]

8 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I like Shakir coming out too. I had a 3rd round grade on him in that draft. But at the same time the tape told the story last year. He was struggling. I don't think it was just a case of usage. He wasn't ready. Which isn't a huge surprise. He came from a very gimmicky system at Boise and last year he was in the wrong place, ran the wrong routes, struggled to understand spacing vs zone and (I think because his head was swimming) had concentration issues catching the ball. Possibly this season Dorsey could have used him more, but the key thing is he is a considerably better player now than he was as a rookie.

 

But with the trainwreck we had at the slot last year, getting him more reps to help his development should have been a no brainer.  Either way, he is more involved now, and he earned that on the field, and hope he continues to see increased targets and becomes more of a player they look to get the ball too like Beasley was.

[WotAGuy]

Sherfield needs to be on the next rocket to Mars.  That guy pisses me off every damn game. 

[Eastport bills]

This guy is a star in the making. He has become the receiver that is always open and when Josh gets flushed he knows just where to be. He’s just like Beasley 3 years ago. If we can get a talented young #2, with Shakir and Kincaid (who looks like a TE who can spread the field), we will be a load to deal with.

[BananaB]

He’s been the most reliable pass catcher we have. Considering where he was behind Beanes two FAs at the start of the season I have been pretty impressed how he handled it. Took advantage of very little opportunities and eventually got in a spot to be a consistent contributor. You gotta like that. 

[BADOLBILZ]

2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

But with the trainwreck we had at the slot last year, getting him more reps to help his development should have been a no brainer.  Either way, he is more involved now, and he earned that on the field, and hope he continues to see increased targets and becomes more of a player they look to get the ball too like Beasley was.

 

 

If Shakir could play effectively on the boundary he'd get more chances.    But if teams felt he had that potential he wouldn't have gone in round 5.   With Kincaid basically serving as a slot receiver as well there is going to be a limiting overlap of snaps to some extent there.    If Jordan Addison had fallen to the Bills in round 1 as they seemingly hoped........then maybe Shakir would have had a mid-career Beasley type season or something.

[GunnerBill]

14 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

But with the trainwreck we had at the slot last year, getting him more reps to help his development should have been a no brainer.  Either way, he is more involved now, and he earned that on the field, and hope he continues to see increased targets and becomes more of a player they look to get the ball too like Beasley was.

 

He was out there 30% of snaps last year. For a struggling 5th round rookie that felt pretty much right to me.

[nedboy7]

Diggs will be dominant again once he is 100%. 

[Bookie Man]

Does he have WR1 DNA? 

 

Still think we need to invest in the position. 

[John from Riverside]

7 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea one of them breaking out into a star (and Cook is close IMO) would be huge. But they still need another weapon with some speed outside. 

Hopefully we take care of that with our first pic

[Aussie Joe]

30 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

Diggs will be dominant again once he is 100%. 

when’s that Ned?

 

Next season? 

[nedboy7]

Just now, Aussie Joe said:

when’s that Ned?

 

Next season? 

 

I hope not.  Hopefully he is ready for playoffs.  But if it is doesn't mean we draft his replacement. 

[Aussie Joe]

Just now, nedboy7 said:

 

I hope not.  Hopefully he is ready for playoffs.  But if it is doesn't mean we draft his replacement. 

I think they should try and draft another receiver next season … doubt he “replaces” Diggs in 2024 … but Diggs time in Buffalo is limited 

[pennstate10]

6 hours ago, SectionC3 said:

Gator arms.  Too short.  He’s a slot.  Agreed. 

I’m curious if you have any proof to support this gator arms insult. 
 

Like a video clip. 
 

Or are you just making ish up?

[Maine-iac]

9 minutes ago, pennstate10 said:

I’m curious if you have any proof to support this gator arms insult. 
 

Like a video clip. 
 

Or are you just making ish up?

It's combine measurements.  His 40 and vertical are better than Diggs, Addison, and a lot of other guys.  His arms on the other hand are 2 inches shorter.  Closest I've found was Addison at 30 7/8th.  Shakir measured 29.  That said he has a 5 inch vertical advantage.  

 

Most combine measurements are on their wiki pages

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalil_Shakir

Edited January 1 by Maine-iac

[SectionC3]

1 hour ago, pennstate10 said:

I’m curious if you have any proof to support this gator arms insult. 
 

Like a video clip. 
 

Or are you just making ish up?

It's his body type.  He has short arms and it's difficult for him to beat press coverage.  I have deduced as much by doing such things as watching the game.  He's a slot. 

[Big Turk]

2 hours ago, bouds said:

Love this dude, but he just doesn't get enough targets.  Think he's going to hit 1k next year if he's given the opportunities.

 

Me too...he has increasingly been making plays more and more even in key situations meaning Allen is starting to really trust him now.

16 minutes ago, SectionC3 said:

It's his body type.  He has short arms and it's difficult for him to beat press coverage.  I have deduced as much by doing such things as watching the game.  He's a slot. 

 

I'm perfectly fine with him in the slot. Not sure his year but he had the most yards of separation against man coverage of any WR last year per route run.