NFL Injury Problem

[Mango]

It feels like the NFL is starting to run into a huge injury problem the last few years. And not just a strain here or a sprain there. But full on spine, concussion, ACL, achilles etc. It seems almost weekly at this point. As an NFL lifer it is becoming a bit of turn off to have all these seasons and careers cut short/ruined. It isn't great for the product. 

I think there are a few problems/solutions: 
 

1. These guys are absolute freaks, who are barely required to be in team facilities outside of the season. Having all these guys out there more or less winging it is just becoming irresponsible. For reference, most injuries occur in the preseason and first 4 weeks of the year. Spiking in the first COVID season 2020-2021. I normally side with the players on most things CBA. But the league has to get these guys back in the facilities. They don't have to hit, or wear pads. But they can work on the sleds, running routes, weights, stretching, watching film. No reason guys can't be back in the facility 4 days per week May 1. 5 days June 1. Then run training camp like normal. I think practice time is probably the biggest contributor. 

2.. These guys are bigger, faster, stronger than ever. The body can only take so much. It can take even less when its artificially made. Steroids and HGH are likely at an all time high. For player safety and longevity they likely need to find a way to clamp down a bit. 

3. Switch to grass league wide. 

 

EDIT: 
 

Injuries significantly doubled from 2014-2018. Nearly doubled.

 

https://www.weisspaarz.com/nfl-injuries-over-five-seasons/

 

Injuries decrease as the season progresses. 

 

https://www.kaggle.com/code/jaseziv83/an-analysis-of-nfl-injuries

Edited November 3, 2023 by Mango
Data

[Beast]

I don’t know the answer.

 

I remember two seasons ago, the only significant injury the Bills suffered was Tre White’s ACL. The Bills training staff was being credited with keeping the players healthy.

 

Now, compare that to the past two seasons. Does the training staff deserve criticism for all the injuries we have suffered through?

 

I don’t know. Seems to me that training staff’s across the league are probably pretty comparable and injuries are just a good luck/bad luck sort of thing for the most part.

 

 

Edited November 3, 2023 by Beast

[RoyBatty is alive]

There should be analytics that mathematically can "prove" your claims of huge injury problems last few years or is this more a reflection of your gut instinct as magnified by the injury woes we have had this year.

 

I think the CBA and the NFL are acutely aware players are bigger , faster, stronger.  They continue to implement more and more rules to safeguard players so except more and more penalties and increasingly more benign football play and the equipment (as well as the treatment) .  Every player , more or less, understand the inherent risks as does the NFL but unless you want the NFL to turn into the pro bowl or glorified flag football, you have to accept the cost benefit analysis of the game.

 

Lets compare the average age of NFL players see how that has evolved over the last few years, if your assertion is correct the average age should be decreasing.

[Mango]

9 minutes ago, Beast said:

I don’t know the answer.

 

I remember two seasons ago, the only significant injury the Bills suffered was Tre White’s ACL. The Bills training staff was being credited with keeping the players healthy.

 

Now, compare that to the past two seasons. Does the training staff deserve criticism for all the injuries we have suffered through?

 

I don’t know. Seems to me that training staff’s across the league are probably pretty comparable and injuries are just a good luck/bad luck sort of thing for the most part.

 

 

 

I think it goes well beyond the Bills. Even if we are healthy, it feels like I am seeing a season ending injury in most games I turn on. 

[Warcodered]

Are we sure it's not just that we've been on the end of the bad injury stick here lately, feels like these have happened every year.

[mannc]

3 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

I think it goes well beyond the Bills. Even if we are healthy, it feels like I am seeing a season ending injury in most games I turn on. 

It seems like that to me, too, but are there really more injuries this year than in the past?  There has to be data on this...

[Donuts and Doritos]

Agree 100%. A number of friends have had the same concern. Wonder if there's a correlation to the pad-less preseason/training camps & the extended season extra game. The fields seem to be an issue as well. It's definitely effecting the product.

[zow2]

These players are throwing themselves around like missiles.  They tried to phase out crown of the helmet tackles, horse collars, falling hard on the QBs, and something called hip drop tackles, soon.  Not sure how far they will go.  In one article i read that NFL will be flag football within 20 years.  I don't believe that.

[Mango]

13 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

There should be analytics that mathematically can "prove" your claims of huge injury problems last few years or is this more a reflection of your gut instinct as magnified by the injury woes we have had this year.

 

I think the CBA and the NFL are acutely aware players are bigger , faster, stronger.  They continue to implement more and more rules to safeguard players so except more and more penalties and increasingly more benign football play and the equipment (as well as the treatment) .  Every player , more or less, understand the inherent risks as does the NFL but unless you want the NFL to turn into the pro bowl or glorified flag football, you have to accept the cost benefit analysis of the game.

 

Lets compare the average age of NFL players see how that has evolved over the last few years, if your assertion is correct the average age should be decreasing.

 

Injuries significantly doubled from 2014-2018. Nearly doubled.

 

https://www.weisspaarz.com/nfl-injuries-over-five-seasons/

 

Injuries decrease as the season progresses. 

 

https://www.kaggle.com/code/jaseziv83/an-analysis-of-nfl-injuries

[Gugny]

It's a violent game that I personally don't think humans are supposed to play.

[Mango]

9 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Are we sure it's not just that we've been on the end of the bad injury stick here lately, feels like these have happened every year.

 

It was actually last nights broken leg and spinal chord injury that got me thinking about it. 

The data also seems to check out. Injuries have been on the rise for quite a long time. I am tempted to go down the course of body maintenance. Not that these guys aren't working in the offseason. But that they are relying on too much improv early in the season. They aren't getting enough live reps against NFL competition. 

I am all for keeping padded/tackling in practice to a minimum. But I think there is a huge advantage to being in an NFL training room, running routes, getting stretched, and working in a complete cycle with your staff. 

[Warcodered]

1 minute ago, Mango said:

 

Injuries significantly doubled from 2014-2018. Nearly doubled.

 

https://www.weisspaarz.com/nfl-injuries-over-five-seasons/

 

Injuries decrease as the season progresses. 

 

https://www.kaggle.com/code/jaseziv83/an-analysis-of-nfl-injuries

I know it seems counterintuitive but maybe it's a practice thing? Practices have gotten away from as much contact and duration as they could in training camp leading into the season. So when they suddenly are in games where there's immediate full throttle impacts injuries start popping up?

[Mango]

4 minutes ago, zow2 said:

These players are throwing themselves around like missiles.  They tried to phase out crown of the helmet tackles, horse collars, falling hard on the QBs, and something called hip drop tackles, soon.  Not sure how far they will go.  In one article i read that NFL will be flag football within 20 years.  I don't believe that.

 

I truly believe the league can mitigate in a very measurable way by having these guys in house far more often. 

[4th&long]

Injuries happen regularly, it’s nothing new. 
 

but I was thinking about injuries today and it is starting to irritate me that by the time these big games come up our roster is depleted. I wish we could play the bengals at full strength, our best vs. their best. If they lose we will wonder what the turn out might have been had were not lost 3 all pros for the season?

 

 We don’t just get injuries like sprains where someone might miss 2-4 weeks. We get season ending injuries to some of our best players!

[Mango]

1 minute ago, Warcodered said:

I know it seems counterintuitive but maybe it's a practice thing? Practices have gotten away from as much contact and duration as they could in training camp leading into the season. So when they suddenly are in games where there's immediate full throttle impacts injuries start popping up?

 

This is where I am at. I don't even think they need to tackle in practice. But they can do a lot of 7 on 7. Get stretched daily. Watch film. 

[GunnerBill]

27 minutes ago, Beast said:

I don’t know the answer.

 

I remember two seasons ago, the only significant injury the Bills suffered was Tre White’s ACL. The Bills training staff was being credited with keeping the players healthy.

 

Now, compare that to the past two seasons. Does the training staff deserve criticism for all the injuries we have suffered through?

 

I don’t know. Seems to me that training staff’s across the league are probably pretty comparable and injuries are just a good luck/bad luck sort of thing for the most part.

 

 

 

Strength and conditioning can help with muscle injuries. Hamstrings, groins etc. The serious stuff sadly is mainly luck.

[The Wiz]

15 minutes ago, Gugny said:

It's a violent game that I personally don't think humans are supposed to play.

Next you're gonna tell me the key to winning is the players and winning.

[dave mcbride]

16 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

I know it seems counterintuitive but maybe it's a practice thing? Practices have gotten away from as much contact and duration as they could in training camp leading into the season. So when they suddenly are in games where there's immediate full throttle impacts injuries start popping up?

The reason there are fewer practices is because there were so many injuries in practice -- which doesn't get captured in these stats. It's an extremely violent game and it's always been such.

8 minutes ago, Buffalo619 said:

This is a problem. The NFL falsely claims the sport is getting safer while in fact it isn’t. Lack of practices and real game speed contributes to injuries but ultimately comes down to the trainers and players. 
 

 

Again, the decline in practices is because there were so many injuries in practice! 

[RyanC883]

55 minutes ago, Mango said:

It feels like the NFL is starting to run into a huge injury problem the last few years. And not just a strain here or a sprain there. But full on spine, concussion, ACL, achilles etc. It seems almost weekly at this point. As an NFL lifer it is becoming a bit of turn off to have all these seasons and careers cut short/ruined. It isn't great for the product. 

I think there are a few problems/solutions: 
 

1. These guys are absolute freaks, who are barely required to be in team facilities outside of the season. Having all these guys out there more or less winging it is just becoming irresponsible. For reference, most injuries occur in the preseason and first 4 weeks of the year. Spiking in the first COVID season 2020-2021. I normally side with the players on most things CBA. But the league has to get these guys back in the facilities. They don't have to hit, or wear pads. But they can work on the sleds, running routes, weights, stretching, watching film. No reason guys can't be back in the facility 4 days per week May 1. 5 days June 1. Then run training camp like normal. I think practice time is probably the biggest contributor. 

2.. These guys are bigger, faster, stronger than ever. The body can only take so much. It can take even less when its artificially made. Steroids and HGH are likely at an all time high. For player safety and longevity they likely need to find a way to clamp down a bit. 

3. Switch to grass league wide. 

Agree on getting them in the facilities, but the players association has made it clear they would rather “work out on their own”.  Really ridiculous for million dollar athletes.  Having them train as you recommend should cut down on the schedules, muscle, etc injuries.  
 

 

[RoyBatty is alive]

30 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

Injuries significantly doubled from 2014-2018. Nearly doubled.

 

https://www.weisspaarz.com/nfl-injuries-over-five-seasons/

 

Injuries decrease as the season progresses. 

 

https://www.kaggle.com/code/jaseziv83/an-analysis-of-nfl-injuries

Great find on the data but unfortunately, is is 5 year old data so doesn't address the current state of affairs' you were discussing.

 

Regardless,  it is also largely  what is reported by each team.

 

Teams are much more likely to report an injury for a) liability issues (note your data was supplied by a medical malpractice law firm)  and B) how much is driven by stashing players (is Kairr Elam really have a bad ankle?).

 

I think there were two major events to more readily propel teams to report injuries.  The fiasco with Tua and his concussions.  Note after the Miami "concussion "expert cleared Tua to play versus the Bills it wasn't long before he was fired and i noted a significant uptick and caution with concussions, especially on QBs.  And the Damar Hamlin incident. 

27 minutes ago, Gugny said:

It's a violent game that I personally don't think humans are supposed to play.

That is the cold hard truth.  If you play in the NFL today consider yourself a "modern gladiator" with all the associated long term negative physical and mental attributes.

Edited November 3, 2023 by RoyBatty is alive

[Royale with Cheese]

As the game gets faster, there will be more injuries.  Anything that moves fast and comes to a sudden halt with changes of direction or because they are hit puts a lot of strain the joint/muscle/ligaments.

[Punching Bag]

1 hour ago, Mango said:

It feels like the NFL is starting to run into a huge injury problem the last few years. And not just a strain here or a sprain there. But full on spine, concussion, ACL, achilles etc. It seems almost weekly at this point. As an NFL lifer it is becoming a bit of turn off to have all these seasons and careers cut short/ruined. It isn't great for the product. 

 

Now they know how I feel.

[T master]

I think some of it may have to do with what some of the old timers said to be in "Game Shape" ! 

 

It's like anything else you can train all you want & be in excellent physical conditioning but until you have another lets say 260 + lb human being pushing against you or you are running full speed then try to stop & make a cut repeatedly those parts in the body needed to respond to that aren't in that kind of shape .

 

Then when you add to that the extreme athletes that these guys today are that is even more force on those parts in the first part of the season that are not use to it as of yet which was what i thought pre season was good for to get their bodies more ready for the actual physicality of the game . 

 

But we know about all the whining that caused . Even this year with Josh not playing in what 1 pre season game he sure didn't look that sharp in the first game this year & most all of th injuries this season have came early . There is no way in this game that injuries won't be a part of it but some may be able to be avoided .

 

Turf should be the first to go !

[TheFunPolice]

I've had the same thoughts and wondered if it was just me.

 

So many star players out for the season before Thanksgiving even hits. Where it really hurts is the playoffs, where it's supposed to be stars vs stars. 

 

Like many here, I've watched way too many hours of football for decades, and it just SEEMS (although I haven't done in-depth research) like there are far more season-ending type injuries now than ever before. Especially achilles. It's like every week someone tears it and is done for the year. 

 

You know it's bad when they preview primetime games and show a picture of a star player for each team (almost always 2 QBs) and instead it's a WR and a DL. Nothing against those guys, but you know what I'm getting at. 

 

It's not Rodgers vs Tua, it's Tua vs Breece Hall. That type of thing.

 

All of those Brady vs Manning or Rodgers vs Manning games. Imagine if those guys missed and it was Brady vs Brissett or Manning vs whoever Rodgers backup used to be. It's just not the same games. Takes a lot of the enjoyment and intrigue out of it. 

 

It's interesting that injuries decrease as the year goes on. Then again, the number of achilles injuries is just odd. Is it not being flexible enough, or just plain bad luck? They almost never look bad at the time they happen, just routine tackles or non-contact injuries. 

 

 

 

 

[Punching Bag]

The action post whistle (i.e. Gronk on White) or blatantly injuring a player (Suh stomping on players) is contributing to it and NFL should impose rule that player who injures another player post whistle need to be suspended without pay for as long as player injured is not well enough to play.

[Lost]

Two points to make on this topic.

 

1.  Injuries have increased because the number of precautions have increased.  There was no concussion protocol back in the 90s and the game was more violent back then.   How many players probably had concussions and just played through them without ever reporting anything?  A lot of players in general were just meaner back in the day and didn't really care about their own well being or others.  They just went out there to annihilate people. 

 

2.  The league could go back to making players wearing slightly bulkier pads again to slow the game down a bit and maybe lessen some injuries that way.   

 

 

My opinion is players are getting injured at the same rate as they always have, just the amount of 'reported injuries' have gone up. 

[TheFunPolice]

7 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

The action post whistle (i.e. Gronk on White) or blatantly injuring a player (Suh stomping on players) is contributing to it and NFL should impose rule that player who injures another player post whistle need to be suspended without pay for as long as player injured is not well enough to play.

 

how about that Giants guy wiping out our starting RT with a blindside hit way after the whistle? 

4 minutes ago, Lost said:

Two points to make on this topic.

 

1.  Injuries have increased because the number of precautions have increased.  There was no concussion protocol back in the 90s and the game was more violent back then.   How many players probably had concussions and just played through them without ever reporting anything?  A lot of players in general were just meaner back in the day and didn't really care about their own well being or others.  They just went out there to annihilate people. 

 

2.  The league could go back to making players wearing slightly bulkier pads again to slow the game down a bit and maybe lessen some injuries that way.   

 

 

My opinion is players are getting injured at the same rate as they always have, just the amount of 'reported injuries' have gone up. 

 

I've wondered this too... There's tons of stories about past guys playing with torn or partially torn ACL's and just wearing braces. 

 

Guys used to be more reckless and gave zero F's whereas now they are a lot smarter and think longer term about keeping their bodies healthy for a longer career vs. just playing through anything. 

 

Either way, you're not playing with a torn achilles though. It seems those are suddenly a thing, but maybe it's bad luck. 

Edited November 3, 2023 by TheFunPolice

[Bob Jones]

34 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

Agree on getting them in the facilities, but the players association has made it clear they would rather “work out on their own”.  Really ridiculous for million dollar athletes.  Having them train as you recommend should cut down on the schedules, muscle, etc injuries.  
 

 

LMAO. Yeah, I'm certain that they're all out there, all off season, "working out on their own." Too funny, it really is. 

[Lost]

5 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

Either way, you're not playing with a torn achilles though. It seems those are suddenly a thing, but maybe it's bad luck. 

 

Has to be bad luck.  I mean most of them are non contact injuries I believe.  

[TheFunPolice]

1 minute ago, Lost said:

 

Has to be bad luck.  I mean most of them are non contact injuries I believe.  

 

Rodgers, Cousins and White all looked totally normal in terms of the play itself and how they were moving right before it happened. 

[WotAGuy]

The problem is speed. 
 

The answer is speed limits. 
 

Tyreek should get a penalty for going over 15 MPH. 

[Alphadawg7]

Listen to the players and get rid of Turf everywhere you can.  It won't make injuries go away, but it will reduce them significantly.  The teams and league make enough money to afford grass.

[BuffaloBillyG]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

As the game gets faster, there will be more injuries.  Anything that moves fast and comes to a sudden halt with changes of direction or because they are hit puts a lot of strain the joint/muscle/ligaments.

Honestly, I feel like the speed the game goes now has a LOT to do with blown officiating calls as well. Not all, mind you. But it definitely factors in IMO.

 

They use the same number of officials standing at the same points to monitor players now that are bigger and faster and stronger than 40 years ago. 

[Big Turk]

2 hours ago, Mango said:

It feels like the NFL is starting to run into a huge injury problem the last few years. And not just a strain here or a sprain there. But full on spine, concussion, ACL, achilles etc. It seems almost weekly at this point. As an NFL lifer it is becoming a bit of turn off to have all these seasons and careers cut short/ruined. It isn't great for the product. 

I think there are a few problems/solutions: 
 

1. These guys are absolute freaks, who are barely required to be in team facilities outside of the season. Having all these guys out there more or less winging it is just becoming irresponsible. For reference, most injuries occur in the preseason and first 4 weeks of the year. Spiking in the first COVID season 2020-2021. I normally side with the players on most things CBA. But the league has to get these guys back in the facilities. They don't have to hit, or wear pads. But they can work on the sleds, running routes, weights, stretching, watching film. No reason guys can't be back in the facility 4 days per week May 1. 5 days June 1. Then run training camp like normal. I think practice time is probably the biggest contributor. 

2.. These guys are bigger, faster, stronger than ever. The body can only take so much. It can take even less when its artificially made. Steroids and HGH are likely at an all time high. For player safety and longevity they likely need to find a way to clamp down a bit. 

3. Switch to grass league wide. 

 

EDIT: 
 

Injuries significantly doubled from 2014-2018. Nearly doubled.

 

https://www.weisspaarz.com/nfl-injuries-over-five-seasons/

 

Injuries decrease as the season progresses. 

 

https://www.kaggle.com/code/jaseziv83/an-analysis-of-nfl-injuries

 

 

I think the increase in players who train all year round and do drill after drill in the off-season likely greatly impacts this also...and the abundance of kids who grew up only playing one sport and training for it all year round which is a recent phenomena that we are only starting to see the results from(mostly bad in terms of injuries) since they just started entering the leagues within the last 8-10 years. Nobody did that when I was a kid...football season you played football, soccer season you played soccer, baseball season you played baseball, basketball season you played basketball, etc..now these kids join these training facilities that have them training year round in one sport and have leagues that go all year round, especially in the warmer climates.

 

The body is no different than a car in that parts wear out after so much use.  If your ACL only has, say, 25,000 cuts you can make on it in your lifetime before it ends up breaking down, repeatedly cutting on it in practice during the offseason is shortening the length of time before it is going to give out.  Repeatedly training for the same sport growing up year round means that area of the body never gets a break versus the kids who played all different sports growing up where different body parts were strained more in one sport than another and different muscles used regularly, etc.

 

Players used to rest far more in the offseason than they do now since everyone is trying to get a leg up with their offseason programs and since everyone else is doing them, unless you want to run the risk of falling behind, you also have to do them.

 

IMO, off-season rest would help cut the injury totals down significantly, but how can you tell a player they can't work out?

Edited November 3, 2023 by Big Turk

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

As the game gets faster, there will be more injuries.  Anything that moves fast and comes to a sudden halt with changes of direction or because they are hit puts a lot of strain the joint/muscle/ligaments.

 

It's also fair to question whether these frenetically paced defenses, often and as in our case referred to as "swarming" Ds, as a result of their pace and style of associated play factor into to it.  

 

 

[Punching Bag]

37 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Listen to the players and get rid of Turf everywhere you can.  It won't make injuries go away, but it will reduce them significantly.  The teams and league make enough money to afford grass.

 

Players would also want to work where it is not cold, etc.

There will be objections by players and agents because turf is faster and some players missing bonuses.

Grass fields in some areas of country will be very difficult to maintain and very expensive.

is NFLPA willing to restructure so some goes to teams remodeling stadiums and if not just another "give me".

[Don Otreply]

With any given players anatomy being capable of handling only so much, being that the skeleton tendons and ligaments load bearing capacity is not infinite, muscle strength loading/forces while impacting the playing surface or other players will at some point be greater than the structure can endure, and then something will give out, Only meticulous training methods can mitigate the eventual injury, be it minor or major, the NFL is an example of extremes in human physiology, with players pushing the proverbial envelope with strength training we will continue to see a fair number of injuries, is what it is.

[Charles Romes]

It has become clear that even with tens of millions of dollars on the table Olineman have become too difficult to grow with any kind of PED testing   The evidence is that Saffold and Q are signed on active rosters. 

[Dr.Sack]

This is a violent ass game 

[warrior9]

3 hours ago, Mango said:

It feels like the NFL is starting to run into a huge injury problem the last few years. And not just a strain here or a sprain there. But full on spine, concussion, ACL, achilles etc. It seems almost weekly at this point. As an NFL lifer it is becoming a bit of turn off to have all these seasons and careers cut short/ruined. It isn't great for the product. 

I think there are a few problems/solutions: 
 

1. These guys are absolute freaks, who are barely required to be in team facilities outside of the season. Having all these guys out there more or less winging it is just becoming irresponsible. For reference, most injuries occur in the preseason and first 4 weeks of the year. Spiking in the first COVID season 2020-2021. I normally side with the players on most things CBA. But the league has to get these guys back in the facilities. They don't have to hit, or wear pads. But they can work on the sleds, running routes, weights, stretching, watching film. No reason guys can't be back in the facility 4 days per week May 1. 5 days June 1. Then run training camp like normal. I think practice time is probably the biggest contributor. 

2.. These guys are bigger, faster, stronger than ever. The body can only take so much. It can take even less when its artificially made. Steroids and HGH are likely at an all time high. For player safety and longevity they likely need to find a way to clamp down a bit. 

3. Switch to grass league wide. 

 

EDIT: 
 

Injuries significantly doubled from 2014-2018. Nearly doubled.

 

https://www.weisspaarz.com/nfl-injuries-over-five-seasons/

 

Injuries decrease as the season progresses. 

 

https://www.kaggle.com/code/jaseziv83/an-analysis-of-nfl-injuries

 

This is not going to change anything. Dobbins tore his Achilles on grass, injury yesterday, grass... chubb's injury, grass. Injuries are going to happen no matter what. 

 

The surface isn't the problem.. If you look at a still photo of when Rodgers tore his achilles, again, not the turfs fault. That has been debunked. 

 

 

The bigger issue here is guys are getting bigger, faster, and stronger, AND they don't hit in practice. This is why injuries decrease as season goes on. 

 

You can't go to a practice in training camp, barely hit, barely go 100% on cuts, hits, cut blocks, etc. Then randomly go against athletic freaks, cut on a dime, change direction on your ligaments, and get hit full force and expect there to be no injury. 

Edited November 3, 2023 by warrior9