MLB Battle

[4th&long]

9 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

No love for Dorian Williams in here?

He’s not even in the race. They are keeping him as milanos backup for now.

[PBF81]

12 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

Based on everything Beane/McDermott have said over the past 5-6 months, this team is clearly moving away from the traditional MLB.  

They DO NOT CARE about size.  I'm not sure why so many fans are struggling to catch-on.

 

This team has drafted three linebackers in the past two years.  Terrell Bernard, Baylon Spector and Dorian Williams.

All are closer to the Matt Milano mold.  And newsflash... Milano isn't going anywhere.

The plan is to have two Milano-type LBs on the field in most of our base sets.  It's probably been the plan since Tremaine Edmunds walked out the door.

 

Not sure if one of the young guys will be ready to start Week 1, because they want someone who can run the defensive huddle and communicate assignments.  That is why Tyrell Dodson is in the mix to start, and AJ Klein was signed as backup insurance.  But eventually (probably this season), one of those three guys almost certainly will be taking over the MLB.

 

You should also add based on our approach to drafting and a seeming complete lack of concern for the position.  At least that would explain the current situation.  

 

Sounds original and ambitious.  I also think that only works if you have a LB that's also as good as Milano is.  If you don't it could be playing with fire.  We don't have that other LB on the roster yet.  

 

It is intriguing though.  We'll find out soon whether there's an official MLB spot on the official depth chart or just two LBs.  

 

 

8 minutes ago, 4th&long said:

He’s not even in the race. They are keeping him as milanos backup for now.

 

I'm not even sure why he's in the discussion.  There's nothing in any of his major draft profiles that suggests he even has the skillset to play in the middle.  Yet so many have insisted that they drafted him to play MLB.  

 

 

[mjt328]

25 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

You should also add based on our approach to drafting and a seeming complete lack of concern for the position.  At least that would explain the current situation.  

 

I think they consider linebacker a valuable position.  This offseason was just the perfect storm.

 

They certainly wanted to keep Tremaine Edmunds, but just couldn't match what his value was on the open market.  Considering what the Bears gave him, that was probably a very wise decision.

 

After that, free agency was extremely weak at the position, and there was nobody really worth signing.  The draft was equally as bad, and never came close to lining up value with our draft position.  Beane wasn't ever going to throw a big contract at an aging Bobby Wagner, or reach to grab someone like Jack Campbell.

 

 

25 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

Sounds original and ambitious.  I also think that only works if you have a LB that's also as good as Milano is.  If you don't it could be playing with fire.  We don't have that other LB on the roster yet.  

 

It is intriguing though.  We'll find out soon whether there's an official MLB spot on the official depth chart or just two LBs.  

 

The Bills will likely cast the MLB as the player with the mic in his helmet.  Outside of that, I don't think you will see much physical difference between the two guys.

 

Considering the league's pullback on the running game (and RBs in general), it's an interesting approach to go smaller.  We will see.

 

 

[BuffaloBillyG]

31 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

Poyer did not have surgery by my understanding.  Hyde had a back/neck issue and those have a nasty little habit of recurring.  Both Benford and Elam have a pretty sizable jump to get to even average starter status.  Let's hope that their "year 2" jump is better than what we've typically gotten from our draft picks.  Floyd, Ford, Rapp we'll see.  Rapp should be very good.  I don't understand any particular excitement over Ford who won't even start.  Floyd seems primarily destined to keep Miller's spot warm.  Speaking of which, you forgot to mention Miller.  Assuming that he comes back full strength, which is a huge questionmark, he's still on the cusp of aging out.  The combination could be two much.  With Floyd in for Miller we'll be somewhere between what we were there with Miller and having no reliable consistent pass-rusher.  

 

Either way, there's likely to be a huge unsolved hole in the middle of our D that IMO people are significantly discounting the impact of.  

 

No comment on the statement about the Offense?  You think they can lead the league also?  

 

IMO, whatever they lose on D they'll make up for on O.  

 

 

 

Isn't it though. 

 

 

I believe you are correct with Poyer not having surgery. Kind of a good thing, no? Hyde was supposedly cleared to play after the divisional round so his health should be back to normal. If the "nasty little habit" recurs..as you said, Rapp should be very good and can step in. Also, would love to see the "nasty little habit" of neck injury reoccurring in players supported in some way other than "trust me, bro".

 

Floyd is holding Miller's spot as top pass rusher...as you say. So what? That's actually going to be helpful to Groot and when Miller comes back you now have some real pass rush depth. Miller is already leaps and bounds ahead of where White was last year. You can see that in the camp footage and reports. Who cares if he's on the cusp of aging out? That won't really matter this year. 

 

Also, if you don't see what the excitement is about Ford...just wait. You will. I'm sure you aren't an avid watcher of the Seahawks so it's understandable. You're gonna love the guy by week 4. "Trust me, bro".

 

I'm an Edmunds fan. I like what the guy did in coverage. I do not discount his loss by any means. However, his talents dictated a lot of the style of defense we played...along with Leslie Frasier and his tentative nature. Personally, I believe McDermott will make a difference in how he sets up guys to succeed. Be prepared for MLB to play more downhill. They won't be asking whoever plays there this year to do the same things they asked Edmunds and they have said as much already.

 

 

[TheyCallMeAndy]

It’s a safe bet to say each guy will get to start a preseason game. We are only 4 days in, but it sounds like every guy has shown flashes of being able to hold down the job. Williams is still the future at MLB, IMO.

[Charles Romes]

11 hours ago, akcash said:

Did you watch Bernard play last year?

 

they were mostly ST reps because he was a third round pick. He played 2 games and didn't play very good on defense. Hes too small there is no way he is playing MLB. And Spector is bigger and more explosive and from watching the games has better instincts and shedding ability.

 

He shedded Quinton Nelson last year (week 1 preseason game) in a head on collision at full speed. Bernard could never do that.

Quinton Nelson regressed badly in 2022 and has admitted as such. 

[drumizen]

11 hours ago, boyst said:

Spector ain't it. He looked lost last year in PS.  I hope I'm wrong. 

Dotson is solid, has potential for a stop gap at the least but is capable of starting.

Klein is capable of starting, smart, and able to mesh with the defense.

Bernard ia a wildcard

The rookie dude starting this year terrified me.

Spector looked great in Preseason last year

[OldTimer1960]

I think there may be a lot of dime defense with Milano being the only LB.

[noacls]

Hilarious how the same posters are saying you can't  make any assumptions to the pads come on, are the same posters that are all over Kincaids jock. 

 

Beane has brought Spectors name up  multiple times in the off-season unasked.  Also has mentioned him during camp. 4.60 guy, with intangibles, and played at dominant college program. IMHO Dodson on running downs. Spector in coverage. 

[4merper4mer]

1 hour ago, PBF81 said:

 

 

I'm not even sure why he's in the discussion.  There's nothing in any of his major draft profiles that suggests he even has the skillset to play in the middle.  Yet so many have insisted that they drafted him to play MLB.  

 

 

Very similar hair to Edmunds.

Edited July 31, 2023 by 4merper4mer

[boyst]

15 minutes ago, drumizen said:

Spector looked great in Preseason last year

i didn't think so. he was making plays but while he passed the eye test he didn't pass the sniff test.

 

he didn't seem to be diagnosing very fast, making the initial first steps, reads and routes. he was a man amongst midgets on scout team.

[noacls]

2 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Very similar hair to Edmunds.

Also like Edmunds runs a sub 4.5 and has 6'8" wingspan. Dude has some length for being 6'1"

[RoyBatty is alive]

12 hours ago, boyst said:

Spector ain't it. He looked lost last year in PS.  I hope I'm wrong. 

Dotson is solid, has potential for a stop gap at the least but is capable of starting.

Klein is capable of starting, smart, and able to mesh with the defense.

Bernard ia a wildcard

The rookie dude starting this year terrified me.

Yes we all know, you have expressed your fear over Dorian Williams ad nauseam.

 

I for one think he will be starting MLB maybe not this year but next year he will be.  That is a LOT to ask of a rookie to me and NFL starting MLBer who effectively calles defensive adjustments.  He is smart, hardworking and a modern elite pass coverage MLB with speed/

[Chaos]

 

one guys takeaway on McDermotts comments regarding Spector

[gonzo1105]

24 minutes ago, drumizen said:

Spector looked great in Preseason last year

 

Yea, idk what this guy was watching. Spector was fantastic in preseason albeit against 3rd stringers most of the time. He definitely is not getting cut because he provides ST's value at the very least and like I have said I think he will be the starter by midseason.

 

Klein will be the guy who gets cut and a lot of people in this thread think he will be starting. They would also keep Spector over Matekevich as well who if I recall correctly took a pay cut to stay here. 

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

12 hours ago, boyst said:

Spector ain't it. He looked lost last year in PS.  I hope I'm wrong. 

Dotson is solid, has potential for a stop gap at the least but is capable of starting.

Klein is capable of starting, smart, and able to mesh with the defense.

Bernard ia a wildcard

The rookie dude starting this year terrified me.

Are you serious lol? Spector was all over the place last Ps. He was an animal. That’s not the argument against this guy. There probably are plenty but that ain’t it

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, Back2Buff said:

My personal choice is Klein, Spector, Bernard, then Dodson.

 

People need to go watch the Cleveland game from last year.  I think Dodson was the worst player in the entire league.

 

Klein was actually good last year when he played.  I thought he did well in the Det game.  Out played Milano.

And the 2nd half of the Vikings game after 49 went out.  Pretty terrible

[Orlando Tim]

I am going to make my prediction based on what Williams happen later in year, Williams and Milano will be the top two LBs by week 10. Williams is fast and willing to hit. I have not seen anything from Spector and Dodson that makes me think they will be good enough to keep Williams from taking the job relatively soon. 

[RoyBatty is alive]

29 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Very similar hair to Edmunds.

I thought initially that was a typo but he  does have similar hair to Edmunds.  He is a smaller and I think smarter version of Edmunds, one thing Edmunds always lacked was anticipation and proper diagnosis of plays.  I recall how Belichek absolutely abused Edmunds in his rookie year.  

[BuffaloBillyG]

15 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

Are you serious lol? Spector was all over the place last Ps. He was an animal. That’s not the argument against this guy. There probably are plenty but that ain’t it

Spector made a bunch of plays in the PS last year and you are correct in saying he was all over the place 

 

However, while it worked out some of the time he was also out of position a lot as well. He was very aggressive which I like, but also feels like he needed to reign it in and play within the defense a bit more. Took a lot of risks.

[Mark Vader]

11 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

No love for Dorian Williams in here?

Does any LB, not named Milano, get any love from here?

[Udubalum07]

I'm hoping it's Spector. The guy had an over 9 RAS score so, he is plenty athletic.  The coaching staff has talked about great instincts and from what we saw from PS last year, the guy loves to hit. 

[Nextmanup]

10 minutes ago, Mark Vader said:

Does any LB, not named Milano, get any love from here?

The pro Edmunds people gave a LOT of love to him. But then he left the team, so now I guess those people are back to hating him.

 

That's usually how it works.  Total loyalty for anyone or anything currently associated with the team, followed by disdain the moment they are no longer with the team.

 

Don't worry, I don't understand it either.

 

🤷‍♂️

[noacls]

I'm glad to see 49 gone. Very overrated. Bears will be left wanting for what they paid him. Looks like Tarzan  plays like Jane. 

[drumizen]

55 minutes ago, boyst said:

i didn't think so. he was making plays but while he passed the eye test he didn't pass the sniff test.

 

he didn't seem to be diagnosing very fast, making the initial first steps, reads and routes. he was a man amongst midgets on scout team.

Maybe get your nose checked?

[wppete]

I’d go with Dotson starting but maybe Bernard can play a hybrid LB/S on some packages? 

[OldTimer1960]

This is a pretty depressing position all around except for Milano.

[BuffaloBillyG]

19 minutes ago, Udubalum07 said:

I'm hoping it's Spector. The guy had an over 9 RAS score so, he is plenty athletic.  The coaching staff has talked about great instincts and from what we saw from PS last year, the guy loves to hit. 

Realistically, I don't care who starts. I personally don't have a dog in the fight, so to speak. My only hope is that one of them step up and TAKE the job rather than they start because they were the best option of a subpar bunch. 

[boyst]

1 hour ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

Are you serious lol? Spector was all over the place last Ps. He was an animal. That’s not the argument against this guy. There probably are plenty but that ain’t it

He just didn't move my needle. 🤷🏼‍♂️

58 minutes ago, NewEra said:

And the 2nd half of the Vikings game after 49 went out.  Pretty terrible

That he couldn't handle it, and Spector didn't find time there was telling. But by those points in the game/season we were struggling.  I forgot who else was out for those games. 

26 minutes ago, drumizen said:

Maybe get your nose checked?

Nah, I know defense. 

[Mister Defense]

13 hours ago, akcash said:

 

 

Spector

Dotson

Bernard

Outside hire

 

Klein- insurance

 

I believe this is a two horse race with the definite possibility we sign somebody or Klein starts week one. I think Beane try's to unload Bernard somewhere. I'm hoping Spector wins. 

 

Didn't see a thread for this discussion.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 I'm confused...

 

Which are the "two horse" s  as you name three?

 

And, more importantly, why? What are your reasons that those two are the best options?  And why is Spector the one you hope to win?

 

Very unclear post, so clarify. please.

 

13 hours ago, akcash said:

I seen enough from these three linebackers last year to get an ideas what's gonna happen.

 

You say "I seen" but then, again, give us no actual information, nothing concrete to back up what you say.

 

What did you 'seen', last year??

Edited July 31, 2023 by Mister Defense

[Matt_In_NH]

12 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

No love for Dorian Williams in here?

Beane and McDermott have specifically said in recent days, he is a WLB right now and that is where he is focusing.

Edited July 31, 2023 by Matt_In_NH

[Rc2catch]

I find it very disappointing how easy some of us write players off and act as if they can never improve over the offseason. Especially when some are so young. Every year players are winning jobs or forced into duty because of injuries and elevate their game. Just because “he sucks” or “he was so bad last year” does not mean there’s no improvement the following years. 
 

The obsession with edmunds is still  strong despite being in another city now. It’s weird to see how many are wishing for him to fail and predicting Chicago will regret the contract. 

 

[CSBill]

36 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Realistically, I don't care who starts. I personally don't have a dog in the fight, so to speak. My only hope is that one of them step up and TAKE the job rather than they start because they were the best option of a subpar bunch. 

If that is the case, “the best option of a subpar bunch” then it will be Klein. The coaches trust him and his experience. 

[NewEra]

46 minutes ago, boyst said:

He just didn't move my needle. 🤷🏼‍♂️

That he couldn't handle it, and Spector didn't find time there was telling. But by those points in the game/season we were struggling.  I forgot who else was out for those games. 

Nah, I know defense. 

I don’t think it’s telling of anything that a 7th rd pick couldn’t beat out the incumbent backup that was in his 3rd year in the system.  
 

If he can’t beat him out this year…. It’s telling

 

 

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, noacls said:

Hilarious how the same posters are saying you can't  make any assumptions to the pads come on, are the same posters that are all over Kincaids jock. 

 

Beane has brought Spectors name up  multiple times in the off-season unasked.  Also has mentioned him during camp. 4.60 guy, with intangibles, and played at dominant college program. IMHO Dodson on running downs. Spector in coverage. 

I’m IN Kincaids jock.  I didn’t say anything about pads 

[BullBuchanan]

I think Klein gets penciled in at #1 until someone takes it from him. I don't think Dodson is an NFL talent, though that might not stop McD from forcing the issue, because they backed themselves in a corner.

I think Bernard is a cut candidate unless he can carve out an ST role. Williams likely won't be ready. Spector could have a shot. He had some nice plays last pre-season, but still a very long shot.

[FireChans]

47 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I don’t think it’s telling of anything that a 7th rd pick couldn’t beat out the incumbent backup that was in his 3rd year in the system.  
 

If he can’t beat him out this year…. It’s telling

 

 

Agree. Even Milano couldn’t displace journeyman Ramon Humber as a rookie.

[boyst]

47 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I don’t think it’s telling of anything that a 7th rd pick couldn’t beat out the incumbent backup that was in his 3rd year in the system.  
 

If he can’t beat him out this year…. It’s telling

 

 

maybe i mispoke.

 

that dotson couldn't hold his own weight last year and was not-so-good isn't a good indicator of what spector was - and i don't believe a 7th round player can have that much breakthrough talent in year two at a position like mlb.

Just now, FireChans said:

Agree. Even Milano couldn’t displace journeyman Ramon Humber as a rookie.

milano was an entirely different player. i remember after edmunds rookie year getting blasted that milano was going to be the better player by a mile even though edmunds and his position was more important at his position on the defense.

[NewEra]

17 minutes ago, boyst said:

maybe i mispoke.

 

that dotson couldn't hold his own weight last year and was not-so-good isn't a good indicator of what spector was - and i don't believe a 7th round player can have that much breakthrough talent in year two at a position like mlb.

milano was an entirely different player. i remember after edmunds rookie year getting blasted that milano was going to be the better player by a mile even though edmunds and his position was more important at his position on the defense.

Here’s to you hopefully being wrong 🍻 Agree to disagree 

[FireChans]

20 minutes ago, boyst said:

maybe i mispoke.

 

that dotson couldn't hold his own weight last year and was not-so-good isn't a good indicator of what spector was - and i don't believe a 7th round player can have that much breakthrough talent in year two at a position like mlb.

milano was an entirely different player. i remember after edmunds rookie year getting blasted that milano was going to be the better player by a mile even though edmunds and his position was more important at his position on the defense.

Yes but Edmunds’ rookie year was Milano’s second. And I agree that’s when he started really popping.