Will DeAndre Hopkins be available this offseason?

[The Wiz]

2 hours ago, BananaB said:

I agree with ya. To be honest, I don’t have trust in this staff drafting a player we can lean on this season. 

Even if there is a player they could lean on, they will only give that player 20% of the snaps.

[Warriorspikes51]

During an appearance on the Greg Bedard Podcast, Breer stated that “Some teams think that Cardinals are going to cut him, they think the Cardinals will wind up cutting him.” Breer said, “His market is not great right now.” He further added, “There’s nobody who was willing to take on Hopkins’ contract and pay the Cardinals initial asking price.”
 

 

 

[Warriorspikes51]

Breer: “The Hopkins one’s fascinating, ‘cause — they haven’t really been in on it (The Patriots). I know there’s at least one team that’s gotten permission to talk to Hopkins. To my knowledge that’s not been the Patriots yet. I think that was a ‘no’ for a number of different reasons. I think it was a ‘no’ because of the financial cost, ‘cause of the draft pick cost — which, initially, the Cardinals were asking for a two and something else.”

 

so Bills or Chiefs or both likely spoke with him

[Beck Water]

11 hours ago, papazoid said:

maybe dhop and his agent are helping to force his way out by refusing to renegotiate his contract with any team interested in trading for him and spreading these stories ?

 

if a free agent....that could favor kc a little as they are likely to pay more than bills and he would immediately be their #1 WR......in buff he'd be #2WR

 

In KC, DHop might be their #1 WR but he would not be their #1 target.  That's Kelce.

[Pirate Angel]

13 hours ago, nucci said:

They think he'll be released and it's possible he signs with Pats or Chiefs under certain conditions. This is considered reporting now I guess

I have to believe this is social media BS, no one would offer a 5th or 6th for him? They cant find a trade partner willing to give up top picks sure...but to me its crazy talk thinking they would rather release him and get nothing in return than to lower the price. 

[BADOLBILZ]

3 hours ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

During an appearance on the Greg Bedard Podcast, Breer stated that “Some teams think that Cardinals are going to cut him, they think the Cardinals will wind up cutting him.” Breer said, “His market is not great right now.” He further added, “There’s nobody who was willing to take on Hopkins’ contract and pay the Cardinals initial asking price.”
 

 

 

 

Yeah the Cardinals reported unwillingness to pay some of his 2023 base salary to facilitate a deal would of course make this the most likely scenario.  

 

From Hopkins perspective I think he'd be better off financially if Arizona did take on some of his 2023 base salary and trade him to get some kind of draft capital.........because he'll be lucky to get $10M in guarantees from his new team, IMO.    

 

I just doubt that they will give up $10M-$15M to get themselves a couple day 3 draft picks.

 

So for some reference on the trade value of simple dollars and cap space:

 

Back in 2017 the Texans traded Brock Osweiler to the Browns along with the Texans 2nd and 6th round picks in exchange for the Browns taking Osweiler off their hands and absorbing $16M in guarantees remaining on his contract.

 

The cap has gone up from $167M to $225M since then so that same trade today would have been worth $21.5M to the Texans.

 

Edited April 4, 2023 by BADOLBILZ

[BADOLBILZ]

41 minutes ago, Pirate Angel said:

I have to believe this is social media BS, no one would offer a 5th or 6th for him? They cant find a trade partner willing to give up top picks sure...but to me its crazy talk thinking they would rather release him and get nothing in return than to lower the price. 

 

Nobody is going to pay anything close to his $19.5M base salary this year.    That's why he doesn't have much if any trade value as it stands.  

[ndirish1978]

1 hour ago, Pirate Angel said:

I have to believe this is social media BS, no one would offer a 5th or 6th for him? They cant find a trade partner willing to give up top picks sure...but to me its crazy talk thinking they would rather release him and get nothing in return than to lower the price. 

 

This is coming from Hopkins or a suitor trying to put pressure on the Cardinals - except they don't have to trade him if they don't want to. Doesn't make much sense to think they will release him, just to eat the dead cap for fun. The Card's rookie GM could have shed some cap and picked up a mid round pick if he wanted to, but decided he'd rather dig in for an unrealistic trade haul so he could look cool. If the Cards don't eat some cap and accept less trade compensation before the draft, they probably just keep him. He's under contract for 2 more years anyway.

[BillsFanForever19]

12 minutes ago, ndirish1978 said:

 

This is coming from Hopkins or a suitor trying to put pressure on the Cardinals - except they don't have to trade him if they don't want to. Doesn't make much sense to think they will release him, just to eat the dead cap for fun. The Card's rookie GM could have shed some cap and picked up a mid round pick if he wanted to, but decided he'd rather dig in for an unrealistic trade haul so he could look cool. If the Cards don't eat some cap and accept less trade compensation before the draft, they probably just keep him. He's under contract for 2 more years anyway.

 

I disagree. I think it's legit. I don't think any team in the league is willing to take on that contract for a 31 year old WR. It's more about his contract than the trade compensation.

 

And now that the league has all sort of agreed they aren't paying the price, they've all realized that the team is going to have to cut him if they want any sort of savings. And if they do, they'll be able to get him for a MUCH cheaper price than his current contract and for no compensation.

Edited April 4, 2023 by BillsFanForever19

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

In KC, DHop might be their #1 WR but he would not be their #1 target.  That's Kelce.

If KC lands Dhop the chances of KC repeating will go up. Last thing I want to see happen. 

Edited April 4, 2023 by newcam2012

[ndirish1978]

8 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

I disagree. I think it's legit. I don't think any team in the league is willing to take on that contract for a 31 year old WR. It's more about his contract than the trade compensation.

 

And now that the league has all sort of agreed they aren't paying the price, they've all realized that the team is going to have to cut him if they want any sort of savings. And if they do, they'll be able to get him for a MUCH cheaper price than his current contract and for no compensation.

 

They need cap savings in the form of cutting their WR1 why? They have 20M in cap space they aren't spending as is. They currently have the 8th most cap space in the league. The only reason to move him is to pick up some draft capital if you want to reboot.

[BillsFanForever19]

30 minutes ago, ndirish1978 said:

 

They need cap savings in the form of cutting their WR1 why? They have 20M in cap space they aren't spending as is. They currently have the 8th most cap space in the league. The only reason to move him is to pick up some draft capital if you want to reboot.

 

They'd save 19.45m by designating him a Post 6/1 cut:

https://www.espn.co.uk/blog/arizona-cardinals/post/_/id/36243/answering-the-big-questions-about-deandre-hopkins-future-in-arizona

 

They have 20, but they're going to cut into that by half for their high Draft picks and their Practice Squad. And what they need more than anything is help in the trenches.

 

If they're interested in guys like Leonard Floyd, Frank Clark, Yanick Ngakoue, Isaiah Wynn, Dalton Risner, etc. and/or want to trade for players at other positions, they can do a lot with that extra 19.45 to rebuild their team. 

 

And if he wants out and is going to be a malcontent on a rebuilding team, would you rather spend 30m in cap space to keep an unhappy player or save 19.45? Seems a no brainer regardless of their cap situation.

Edited April 4, 2023 by BillsFanForever19

[ndirish1978]

40 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

They'd save 19.45m by designating him a Post 6/1 cut:

https://www.espn.co.uk/blog/arizona-cardinals/post/_/id/36243/answering-the-big-questions-about-deandre-hopkins-future-in-arizona

 

They have 20, but they're going to cut into that by half for their high Draft picks and their Practice Squad. And what they need more than anything is help in the trenches.

 

If they're interested in guys like Leonard Floyd, Frank Clark, Yanick Ngakoue, Isaiah Wynn, Dalton Risner, etc. and/or want to trade for players at other positions, they can do a lot with that extra 19.45 to rebuild their team. 

 

And if he wants out and is going to be a malcontent on a rebuilding team, would you rather spend 30m in cap space to keep an unhappy player or save 19.45? Seems a no brainer regardless of their cap situation.

 

You're constructing a narrative and really butchering numbers to back up what you want to happen. Almost nothing in the above post is factually correct. If you want to present a real argument I'd be happy to listen to it, but the above is just hogwash.

 

You do realize that the draft doesn't really cost more than 3-5 because the later rounds don't slot in as top 51 salaries right? Practice squad players only count against the cap if they slot in the top 51, these guys are making 200k, you're just cutting 10M because it supports what you want, there is no 10M allocated for the draft "and practice squad." You can sign 2 of the above listed players and set the guaranteed money to minimize cap hits with the cap as is.

 

Please link any article stating Hopkins is currently or plans to be a malcontent? Wanting to leave and poisoning a team are two completely different things. I understand you want him on this team, I do too. But your posts boil down to wishful thinking and a lack of actual facts.

[BillsFanForever19]

1 hour ago, ndirish1978 said:

 

You're constructing a narrative and really butchering numbers to back up what you want to happen. Almost nothing in the above post is factually correct. If you want to present a real argument I'd be happy to listen to it, but the above is just hogwash.

 

You do realize that the draft doesn't really cost more than 3-5 because the later rounds don't slot in as top 51 salaries right? Practice squad players only count against the cap if they slot in the top 51, these guys are making 200k, you're just cutting 10M because it supports what you want, there is no 10M allocated for the draft "and practice squad." You can sign 2 of the above listed players and set the guaranteed money to minimize cap hits with the cap as is.

 

Please link any article stating Hopkins is currently or plans to be a malcontent? Wanting to leave and poisoning a team are two completely different things. I understand you want him on this team, I do too. But your posts boil down to wishful thinking and a lack of actual facts.

 

You yourself implied this came from Hopkins or his camp. Wouldn't that mean he wants off the team?

 

And how would teams wanting to trade for him saying they think he's going to be released push the Cardinals to move him? What would be the point of teams putting that out there?

 

Also, on my "butchering" of the numbers - the 3rd Pick in the Draft alone is a 6.9 million Dollar Cap Hit. Our Drafts are a lot cheaper because we're generally picking at the bottom of the Draft:

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/draft/

 

And I'm not someone who is pushing for him to be on this team. I don't think it works out for us any way you slice it. Though I wouldn't be opposed to it if it were to happen, it's kind of funny that you're claiming I'm making stuff up because I "want him". I've been called a "bully" on this thread for poking holes in the legitimacy of sources and the likelihood of it happening.

Edited April 4, 2023 by BillsFanForever19

[papazoid]

i'm a big fan of Dhop.......he's a legit superstar WR still  at his age....getting him for $10mil/yr or less would be a steal and would have big impact on team. 

 

hard to showcase shiny new toy WR's when josh is running for his life or flat on his back.

 

WR#2  targets 5-10 per game ??

OL blocks 60 plays per game

 

KC invests heavily in OL and has a revolving door at WR.

 

Bills invests heavily in DL and looks for scrap heap value on OL.

 

Protect josh or we will never be a super bowl winning team....just a wannabe Top 5 or so

 

 

[NeverOutNick]

Hopefully we can find a way to do both

[Warriorspikes51]

If he were to be released,  DAL, KC, BUF all make a lot of sense.  BAL could if they somehow kept Lamar

 

3 hours ago, papazoid said:

i'm a big fan of Dhop.......he's a legit superstar WR still  at his age....getting him for $10mil/yr or less would be a steal and would have big impact on team. 

 

hard to showcase shiny new toy WR's when josh is running for his life or flat on his back.

 

WR#2  targets 5-10 per game ??

OL blocks 60 plays per game

 

KC invests heavily in OL and has a revolving door at WR.

 

Bills invests heavily in DL and looks for scrap heap value on OL.

 

Protect josh or we will never be a super bowl winning team....just a wannabe Top 5 or so

 

 

I do agree, but Cincy nearly won the SB with an Oline worse than ours...and elite weapons 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Warriorspikes51

[Solomon Grundy]

12 hours ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Breer: “The Hopkins one’s fascinating, ‘cause — they haven’t really been in on it (The Patriots). I know there’s at least one team that’s gotten permission to talk to Hopkins. To my knowledge that’s not been the Patriots yet. I think that was a ‘no’ for a number of different reasons. I think it was a ‘no’ because of the financial cost, ‘cause of the draft pick cost — which, initially, the Cardinals were asking for a two and something else.”

 

so Bills or Chiefs or both likely spoke with him

Toronto tweet from Hopkins? The proximity to Buffalo 👀

[Warriorspikes51]

Just now, Solomon Grundy said:

Toronto tweet from Hopkins? The proximity to Buffalo 👀

 

Well if our friend Erie County Bulls is to be believed, he had us talking with Hopkins days ago 

[Rigotz]

9 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

From Hopkins perspective I think he'd be better off financially if Arizona did take on some of his 2023 base salary and trade him to get some kind of draft capital.........because he'll be lucky to get $10M in guarantees from his new team, IMO.    

 

I just doubt that they will give up $10M-$15M to get themselves a couple day 3 draft picks.

 

Let's pause again for a moment to appreciate the support the Pegulas give to this franchise. 

 

There's no doubt in my mind they'd pay whatever they have to pay to get those picks and load Beane up with more draft capital.

 

Good ownership matters.

 

[Warriorspikes51]

Just now, Rigotz said:

 

Let's pause again for a moment to appreciate the support the Pegulas give to this franchise. 

 

There's no doubt in my mind they'd pay whatever they have to pay to get those picks and load Beane up with more draft capital.

 

Good ownership matters.

 

The cap flexibility we have comes from an Owner willing to pay lots of Cash $$$$

[BillsFan619]

@Pirate Angel

Edited April 4, 2023 by BillsFan619

[mikemac2001]

39 minutes ago, BillsFan619 said:

@Pirate Angel

Arizona is just trying to squeeze as much as they can out of this. I think I’m the end he goes to buff or KC to the highest bidder 

[papazoid]

where is everybody.....

 

What it Would Cost Cardinals to Release DeAndre Hopkins

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/cardinals/analysis/cost-arizona-cardinals-release-deandre-hopkins

 

Cut (Pre-June 1)

Dead money: $21.07 million

Cap savings: $8.91 million

Cut (Post-June 1)

Dead money: $10.53 million

Cap savings: $19.45 million

[Dr. Who]

8 minutes ago, papazoid said:

where is everybody.....

 

What it Would Cost Cardinals to Release DeAndre Hopkins

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/cardinals/analysis/cost-arizona-cardinals-release-deandre-hopkins

 

Cut (Pre-June 1)

Dead money: $21.07 million

Cap savings: $8.91 million

Cut (Post-June 1)

Dead money: $10.53 million

Cap savings: $19.45 million

I'm under the impression you can designate a cut post-June 1st ahead of the actual date. Don't know how that affects negotiations with other teams and how the cap is calculated now.

[BillsShredder83]

On 4/4/2023 at 6:00 AM, papazoid said:

i'm a big fan of Dhop.......he's a legit superstar WR still  at his age....getting him for $10mil/yr or less would be a steal and would have big impact on team. 

 

hard to showcase shiny new toy WR's when josh is running for his life or flat on his back.

 

WR#2  targets 5-10 per game ??

OL blocks 60 plays per game

 

KC invests heavily in OL and has a revolving door at WR.

 

Bills invests heavily in DL and looks for scrap heap value on OL.

 

Protect josh or we will never be a super bowl winning team....just a wannabe Top 5 or so

 

 

i legit dont understand this argument. we've added 2 OL where atleast one is an upgraded starter (both are likely better than saffold, so depth or maybe 2 starters).  aside from that, i dont see DHop preventing us from signing an OL right now, or we wouldve done it by now. Any addition to the OL from here out willl come from the draft, and even if we were to swing a trade for him, its not going to be a pick that excludes us from drafting an OL at a premium pick.

 

i understand the hurdles to clear in signing him, but i dont think it stops us from upgrading at OL

[JohnNord]

On 4/4/2023 at 9:12 AM, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

Well if our friend Erie County Bulls is to be believed, he had us talking with Hopkins days ago 

If you haven’t figured it out by now… that account is a complete fraud.  I laugh at people that thought he had some kind of inside information or “sources.”  He was trying to predict what would happen with D-Hop and now he had to backtrack.

 

 It’s astounding how many people fell for his BS 

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, Dr. Who said:

I'm under the impression you can designate a cut post-June 1st ahead of the actual date. Don't know how that affects negotiations with other teams and how the cap is calculated now.

 

You are correct, you can cut a player and designate the cut "post June 1" at any time.

 

But, then, any cap relief doesn't come until AFTER June 1 - team has to carry the contract on their books and count it against their cap until then

 

Post June 1 cuts, people act like it's great 'cuz it may cost less, but the cap hits don't go away, part of them are just shifted to another year.  Which may or may not be what one wants.

[gordong]

Does anyone really think he is coming here?  if buffalo was in the lead and they spoke to his rep about money they obviously could not come to an agreement, that is not going to change.   sorry but I think its about 1% chance....  Beane has said we are not signing anyone to a contract over 2 million before the draft.  Just accept Gabe stone hands as your #2 this year

[Gregg]

5 minutes ago, gordong said:

Does anyone really think he is coming here?  if buffalo was in the lead and they spoke to his rep about money they obviously could not come to an agreement, that is not going to change.   sorry but I think its about 1% chance....  Beane has said we are not signing anyone to a contract over 2 million before the draft.  Just accept Gabe stone hands as your #2 this year

 

We will probably draft a WR. I am fine with the current group of receivers if the Bills continue to improve the OL in the draft. If Allen has time in the pocket, then the Bills will be more than fine in the passing game. 

[NewEra]

On 4/4/2023 at 6:08 AM, Warriorspikes51 said:

If he were to be released,  DAL, KC, BUF all make a lot of sense.  BAL could if they somehow kept Lamar

 

I do agree, but Cincy nearly won the SB with an Oline worse than ours...and elite weapons 

Elite weapons and QB all on Rookie contracts.  Big difference 

[papazoid]

27 minutes ago, gordong said:

Does anyone really think he is coming here?  if buffalo was in the lead and they spoke to his rep about money they obviously could not come to an agreement, that is not going to change.   sorry but I think its about 1% chance....  Beane has said we are not signing anyone to a contract over 2 million before the draft.  Just accept Gabe stone hands as your #2 this year

 

party pooper

 

oh....von miller says hello

 

back to visions of sugar plums

[Jamie Nails]

I’m I Arizona for the week if anyone needs me to drop him a gift basket or a gift card to Tempo

[mrags]

38 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Elite weapons and QB all on Rookie contracts.  Big difference 

100%. Burrow, Higgins, and Chase all on rookie deals. They will feel the shock soon. Burrow will be paid as the biggest contract in NFL history when his deal gets done. Chase may be looking for highest paid WR ever. And Higgins will make more than Diggs is currently making when his deal is done. There zero chance that Cinci can keep them all. 

[NewEra]

2 minutes ago, mrags said:

100%. Burrow, Higgins, and Chase all on rookie deals. They will feel the shock soon. Burrow will be paid as the biggest contract in NFL history when his deal gets done. Chase may be looking for highest paid WR ever. And Higgins will make more than Diggs is currently making when his deal is done. They’re zero chance that Cinci can keep them all. 

yup.  The dynamics of their team will be changing over the next couple years. Gotta hit on their draft picks or they’ll be in a difficult position.  Cinci’s best chance will be this year, but the door will be open as long as they have Burrow imo.  Similar to us with 17 under center.  They opportunity to catch lightning in a bottle will always be there-  just have to hope that luck is in their side. 

[mrags]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

yup.  The dynamics of their team will be changing over the next couple years. Gotta hit on their draft picks or they’ll be in a difficult position.  Cinci’s best chance will be this year, but the door will be open as long as they have Burrow imo.  Similar to us with 17 under center.  They opportunity to catch lightning in a bottle will always be there-  just have to hope that luck is in their side. 

Exactly. As long as 17 is our QB we have a window open. The same will be said for Cinci with Burrow. They likely  won’t be able to keep both of the WRs but they will definitely keep one of them. 
 

I wonder if that will try and keep both though. Signing Higgins this year and worrying about Burrow and Chase when their time comes. Imo they would be fools to do that. But they may think they can hold out until the cap rises and they can somehow keep them all. 

[Warriorspikes51]

I think it's realistic that if our 1st round graded players are gone at 27, we could see something like this:  

#27
2024 Conditional 3rd, 2nd if AFC Champ, 1st if SB

For

Hopkins

#34

[mrags]

4 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

I think it's realistic that if our 1st round graded players are gone at 27, we could see something like this:  

#27
2024 Conditional 3rd, 2nd if AFC Champ, 1st if SB

For

Hopkins

#34

I think you’re right on with that except I’d drop the 2024 conditionals by 1 rd each. So a 4th, 3rd, or 2nd. 

[C.Biscuit97]

Spoiler alert: The bills aren’t trading for him. 

Edited April 5, 2023 by C.Biscuit97

[gordong]

4 hours ago, papazoid said:

 

party pooper

 

oh....von miller says hello

 

back to visions of sugar plums

sorry man just being real...   hey I would love for it to happen but I just think that ship has sailed.