Poor coaching by McDermott is becoming a theme

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Odd week to call out the coaching. 

I'm a McDermott skeptic and have been for a while. But coaching didn't cost the Bills this game. It was execution. Players lost it and the injuries were crushing. Only coaching mistake was no QB sneak on the goal line.

[costrovs]

Injuries, 100 degree heat, missing half the defense...

We lost by 2 points to the Dolphins.

Yeah, lets blame it on McD. 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

The better comparison is Dungy. He couldn't get the job done in Tampa with 2 HOF players on defense. 

Colts and Manning won the SuperBowl despite Dungy. Dungy was awful in the playoffs. I'm pretty sure I have the correct season. Manning had to waive the punt team off the field or they lose in the playoffs during their SupwrBowl run.

 

Allen will win a SB in Buffalo despite McDermott not because of him.

[Dr. K]

1 minute ago, DCofNC said:

The Fox comparison is perfect.  I’ve been saying the same thing without the direct comparison,  McClappy got them out of the doldrums, but his God Awful game day decisions already cost us the game forever knows as :13.  They cost the game yesterday too.  He’s a pathetically conservative coach.  Hopefully Beane sees it in one to get that ring before McD wastes this roster completely.   

I disagree. Those of you who think you can just order up somebody who is going to be an improvement on McD are fools. The things he has done to make this a unified team, to get the best performances out of a large roster of individuals, to cause them to play for each other and the team instead of focusing on individual achievements, to prepare properly for games, to manage the vast variety of different personalities, to get them all pointed in the same direction--these are not insignificant traits.

 

Every coach that ever existed can be cited for decisions they made in the heat of a game that did not work. I could give you many decisions by Bill Belichick that can be seen as costing them games over his career. 

 

Anybody who has experienced the roster of lousy coaches the Bills have had over their history ought to know better than kick McD to the curb. I say this as somebody who was vastly skeptical of his hiring; I had to be convinced, and I am convinced. 

 

PS: He is NOT a conservative coach--unless you define conservative as someone who does not automatically go for it on every fourth down. We haver seen him take big chances repeatedly in tough game situations over the last few years. 

[JohnNord]

46 minutes ago, Einstein said:

About half way into the video Mike Florio begins to voice his concern that McDermott may not be the right person to get the Bills over the hump.

He compares the situation to John Fox in Denver. Fox was good in Denver. He went 38-10 in his last three seasons.

 

But it took Fox being fired (after a 12-4 season) and Kubiak being hired for the Broncos to land a Lombardi trophy with that loaded roster.

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/video/mike-florio-buffalo-bills-received-rude-awakening-against-miami-dolphins?ls=pftvod

To be fair… Florio isn’t the only one who has made this comparison.  I don’t necessarily agree with the narrative but until they start winning close games, it’s going to be there.  And it sucks.  

With that being said, there is maybe a 99.5% chance that McDermott is the Bills HC next year and beyond.  

 

The situation in Denver was very different in a lot of ways - still it was a ballsy call by Elway to get rid of Fox.  Beane doesn’t have that power and Terry has such admiration for Sean he wouldn’t fire him unless the team became a train wreck.  

 

In all honesty, he’s done an outstanding job building resurrecting this franchise and building a team.  

 

But the bottom line is, Buffalo needs to close out these football games or these narratives will hang around 

[Low Positive]

Keep firing coaches and you end up with offensive genius Nate Hackett. 

[Awwufelloff]

Maybe Bellichik will get fired and we can hire him. 

[Slo_Bills]

48 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

Moot point.  McD and Beane are going nowhere.  Not this year, next or many years to come. 

THIIS  👍.  I'll say it again, read the knowledge that our fellow Buffalo fan LabattBlue has shared with you.  Eloquently and to the point. I understand the similarities the OP ( or the article) was trying to make but McBean are safe not going anywhere any time soon

[Buffalo716]

Andy Reid didn’t win a Super Bowl for 20 years

 

Must’ve been a loser

 

McDermott is the culture change … don’t forget that 

[aristocrat]

13 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

The better comparison is Dungy. He couldn't get the job done in Tampa with 2 HOF players on defense. 

Colts and Manning won the SuperBowl despite Dungy. Dungy was awful in the playoffs. I'm pretty sure I have the correct season. Manning had to waive the punt team off the field or they lose in the playoffs during their SupwrBowl run.

 

Allen will win a SB in Buffalo despite McDermott not because of him.

 

I've had that comparison for a while. Mcd has show to be ok with the aggression on 4th downs which give me some help. But man last year we had some weird losses that were head scratchers. 

[Logic]

22 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

The Fox comparison is perfect.  I’ve been saying the same thing without the direct comparison,  McClappy got them out of the doldrums, but his God Awful game day decisions already cost us the game forever knows as :13.  They cost the game yesterday too.  He’s a pathetically conservative coach.  Hopefully Beane sees it in one to get that ring before McD wastes this roster completely.   

He's really, really not, though.

The Bills are exceedingly aggressive both in offensive approach and in 4th down go-for-it frequency. They also typically continue to pile up points when they have big leads rather than becoming conservative on offense, hence the 20 straight double digit wins. None of these are traits of overly "conservative" coaches. 

If people want to say that they don't think McDermott is the guy for various reasons -- game management, for instance -- then so be it. But he's really NOT conservative, let alone "pathetically" conservative. That's just an unreasonable and unfounded take.

Edited September 26, 2022 by Logic

[BringBackFlutie]

56 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Question...Did John Fox open the season demolishing the defending champs and then the AFC number 1 seed in back to back weeks...so much so, we had start benching starters in the 3rd Quarter?

 

Did he follow that game up with having to go on the road on a short week missing half of his defensive starters and starting OC just to lose 5 more guys who started that game and several backups, including 5 OL?  While also playing in extreme heat with no relief and seeing not injuried starters have to keep coming out of the game for fluids and cramping?  

 

If not...then everyone needs to pipe down.  McD and Beane were the toast of the NFL a week ago, then in an extreme situation game some breaks didn't go our way.  Is it McD's fault Van Roten botched a snap at end of half costing us a FG attempt?  Is it McD's fault Bass shanked a gimme FG?  Is it McD's fault Milano dropped a pick 6?  Is it McD's fault McKenzie didn't run straight out of bounds giving us enough time for one more play for yards on the sideline at end of game?  Is it McD's fault the 2nd and 3rd string OL while having been on the field almost an entire quarter with no one to sub in, no shade, no breaks was gassed down the stretch?  

 

I mean we took NINETY THREE offensive plays compared to their 39 and dominated the time of possession.  And there is a thread today about whether or not our Defensive coach needs to be fired for someone who knows offense?  

 

How about we just need to get healthy and we have the best team and roster in the NFL?

 

Actually I think they did play the season opener against the SB champion Ravens and Manning threw 7 TD passes 😅

 

Then I think they lost to the #1 seed Pats a few weeks later. The game was pretty close.

[billsfan89]

At some point you will reach an Andy Reid (in Philadelphia) tipping point where you have a coach getting a team to the playoffs consistently and making runs but never getting over the hump and there comes a point where the team has to move on from a successful coach.

 

That being said I don’t think McD is anywhere near that point. Maybe if the Bills take losses in the playoffs in 2022 and 2023 you can start that question but it is far too soon. It’s a week 3 loss away with a banged up team nothing to panic over.

[TheFunPolice]

It's the same thing they said about Andy Reid: can't win the big one. I loved Madden's commentary about that: tell me which ones are the "small ones." 

 

Now that Reid has a ring, there is no better example of this than the unfair criticism of Marty Shottenheimer. 

 

The year is 2006. The Chargers are 14-2. It's the Divisional round of the AFC playoffs. Marty Shottenheimer, the coach who "couldn't win the big games" had the perfect game plan to stop the Patriots machine led by Brady and Belichick. There's even film of him telling the player who won the game for SD before fumbling not to go running around when he gets the game winning INT and to just get down. 

 

So what happens? In a cruel twist of fate THAT SAME PLAYER intercepts Brady at the end and the game is OVER! Chargers win and they are going to face Indianapolis in the AFC Title Game, at home! 

 

Except no. He does exactly what coach warned him about and FUMBLES BACK TO NE instead of simply hitting the turf. NE, given another shot (sound familiar to anyone?) goes on to win, and Marty "can't win the big ones" and is fired shortly after the game with a 14-2 record that season and never coaches again. 

 

Marty was also the coach who LOVED Brees and thought he was a top QB in the making and wanted to keep him. 

 

In other words, he was RIGHT about Brees, had the perfect game plan to defeat NE, won 14 games that year, got the #1 seed, even foresaw the need to tell his DB to just go down when he got the pick (showing how detail oriented he was) and yet it's COACHING that cost SD. So he was fired after that game!

 

Marty, the guy who is 7th all-time in NFL wins by a head coach with 200, somehow wasn't good enough. BTW, the active coaches ahead of him are Reid (234 wins) and Belichick (291). Behind him are Tomlin (155) and Carroll (152). 

 

Think about how dumb that sounds. 

 

Apparently those 200 wins don't count. No "big games" in there. 

 

Football is a cruel game at times, and the single elimination format means that any one mistake can end your season. 

 

[BuffaloBills1998]

Mike Florio?? That stupid *****?? People actually listen to what that ass clown says

[ngbills]

Its good people even talk about this. It means the Bills are relevant. More than just that, people see them as a super bowl champion caliber team. 

 

The issue with McD is the glaring stats and some odd games. Until he wins a super bowl he will never escape the 13 second meltdown. Add in games like this MIA one and the NE game last year that a team has no business losing. The record in close games. The challenge failure rate. 

 

That will get you a spotlight from the media.

 

Rather than saying McD should be fired - ask your self this question. Pick a few coaching names - would the Bills be better or worse with them? With this talent there are a ton of coaches that could win with this roster. Maybe some would be better, maybe not? 

[34-78-83]

How about this? All of the dim wits that think McD is even making his “ game day decisions” by himself, raise your hands. He’s literally got a team of people in his ear for every type of situation that may arise whether it be a challenge, a 4th down decision, a clock management decision, and more. The Bills have one if I not the largest employee representation in their analytics department in the league.

 

 Does he still make the final call and does he go with his gut sometimes? Absolutely. But man o man people learn about how your own supposed favorite team operates before stuffing an agenda down everyone’s throat.

[Dopey]

We went from everybody's darling to Cinderella after midnight. 

[TheFunPolice]

1 minute ago, BuffaloBills1998 said:

Mike Florio?? That stupid *****?? People actually listen to what that ass clown says

 

This too! Florio HATES Buffalo and is still sour that the team didn't move to Toronto. 

[GunnerBill]

How many times are you gonna start this thread @Einstein?

 

We get the message. You'd fire McDermott because he is cautious with injuries, takes time outs when you wouldn't and Mike Florio says so. 

 

Next time you come up with a new reason why not add it to one of your existing threads?

Edited September 26, 2022 by GunnerBill

[TheFunPolice]

Just now, Dopey said:

We went from everybody's darling to Cinderella after midnight. 

 

cool! we're terrible favorites but great underdogs. I was getting a little worried about all the SB talk so early. 

[Jauronimo]

41 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

I would not be surprised if the Ravens beat us. Har is a better coach than McD with a worse QB and wr group. 

The last time "Har" beat McD, Nathan Peterman was playing.

[balln]

1 hour ago, SCBills said:

McDermott is getting roasted in the media today. 
 

He needs a bounce back win Sunday in a big way. 
 

Not for his job security this year, but these voices will become LOUD if this team is sitting there at .500

This is what I said after rams game. He HAS to win the super bowl. They have a killer roster. Qb. All pressure / questions are about him. Sleepless nights this year 

[BuffaloBaumer]

Would all this crap being posted today even happen if 1 of 10 plays were made yesterday. The Bills CRUSHED that Dolphins team and nothing but missed plays and scorching heat with injuries stopped it from being 100 - 3

[Ethan in Cleveland]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Andy Reid didn’t win a Super Bowl for 20 years

 

Must’ve been a loser

 

McDermott is the culture change … don’t forget that 

Neither did KC. Both Reid and KC made a change and that put both of them over the top. 

McDermott isn't going anywhere this season no matter what happens. 

If they don't make a SuperBowl this year the seat gets got in the media. But the media is not Pegula and that is all that matters. 

[eball]

Florio can pound sand.  There were 7-8 plays yesterday that if one of them goes the other way, the Bills win.

 

McD isn’t perfect in game day situations but he is NOT the reason the Bills lost yesterday.

 

 

Edited September 26, 2022 by eball

[LABILLBACKER]

5 minutes ago, 34-78-83 said:

How about this? All of the dim wits that think McD is even making his “ game day decisions” by himself, raise your hands. He’s literally got a team of people in his ear for every type of situation that may arise whether it be a challenge, a 4th down decision, a clock management decision, and more. The Bills have one if I not the largest employee representation in their analytics department in the league.

 

 Does he still make the final call and does he go with his gut sometimes? Absolutely. But man o man people learn about how your own supposed favorite team operates before stuffing an agenda down everyone’s throat.

So he has a separate employee designated to burn 3 time outs in the 3rd quarter.     Got it 

[TheFunPolice]

so much luck goes into winning and losing in the NFL, especially in single elimination 

 

injuries

bounces

matchups

execution

penalties

 

There's such a fine line...

 

tuck rule being called a fumble, Atlanta installing Marty as HC with a 28-3 lead, and Seattle handing off to Marshawn Lynch and Brady has 4 rings instead of 7.

 

Take away 2 unreal catches by the Giants and he has 9 rings instead of 7. 

 

Brady could EASILY have 4 rings or 9 rings. All a play here and there (except Atlanta, which was a complete collapse by one team). 

 

So the key is keep getting into those spots so that you can benefit from the randomness. No matter how random it can seem, the ball will never bounce your way or a timely penalty go your way if you're sitting on your couch watching.

 

 

[BuffaloBills1998]

5 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

This too! Florio HATES Buffalo and is still sour that the team didn't move to Toronto. 

Exactly, also isn’t this clown a New England fan??? Why anyone listens to Florio is beyond me

[TheFunPolice]

"Reid" came up short in the KC/TB Super Bowl is the narrative some put out. "See, we told you so!"

 

Meanwhile, KC had reserves playing OL against a top defense, Mahomes was running for his life while limping around with a busted ankle/foot and KC's WR dropped everything that hit them. 

 

Circumstances matter. 

[DCbillsfan]

43 minutes ago, BillsShredder83 said:

Just as a thought experiment, there's not one coach in the league you'd trade McD for?

At the risk of being trashed, no I wouldn't trade for another coach.  BB is 70, Reid is one cheeseburger away from the big one, Harbaugh isn't leaving, and neither is McVay.  McD is a good coach and a good guy.  I wish he had Shakir active yesterday because they definitely could have used him.  Other than that, they were a lot of player mistakes yesterday.

[Buffalo716]

7 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Neither did KC. Both Reid and KC made a change and that put both of them over the top. 

McDermott isn't going anywhere this season no matter what happens. 

If they don't make a SuperBowl this year the seat gets got in the media. But the media is not Pegula and that is all that matters. 

That doesn’t mean anything… Andy Reid was the head coach for 20 years before he won a Super Bowl… 

 

He was in philli for 14 years without one and KC 7 years without one 

 

Sean has been a head coach for six years

 

His trajectory is high

[34-78-83]

1 minute ago, LABILLBACKER said:

So he has a separate employee designated to burn 3 time outs in the 3rd quarter.     Got it 

Most time outs are not optional when players fail in their assignments, or because like 4 of them on the field are completely inexperienced at their position and role due to a mass of injuries. That has zero to do with my point. Awesome point

[TheFunPolice]

McDermott need to clean some things up, but he and his staff have done a lot of winning here. 

 

We're a LONG WAY from "football is a tough game for tough people" or "it's hard to win in the NFL"

 

We have a very good staff, and they've only really been expected to be a good team once (last year) so you can't say much about playoffs since they lost to KC (in KC) twice in a row. 

 

Point is, the story of McDermott is still early. 

[colin]

im hard on mccoach sometimes, and i still think the 13 seconds debacle was on him (the kick and the goofy D vs a team w 3 times outs).  im sure coaches below him or players made mistakes, but imo in that kind of situation, he's got to keep the ship on track

 

all that said, he had a mash unit which got worse yesterday ready to play and playing their butts off.  the offensive sequence on the 2nd drive, and the coverage/pass rush on the 3rd and 22 as mentioned before were coaching errors, but against that we have some just outstanding set ups and call, and practice squad players playing like their hair was on fire.  that's just good to great over all coaching in my book.

 

we lost on the back of a unique mix of chance and player mistakes.   there were about 7 things that coulda gone slightly differently and we walk away winners.

 

tough loss, but that's football.

[Logic]

If you believe that the Bills are the best team in the league, then it necessarily follows that McDermott must be a very good coach. You don't play as exciting and dominant a brand of football as the Bills play without good coaching.

Think about the best parts of this roster -- Hyde and Poyer, Tre White, Von Miller, Josh Allen, Stefon Diggs....none of them would be the factors they are for Buffalo if it were not for McDermott.

It was McDermott that took two unwanted corners in free agency and coached them up into All-Pro safeties. It was McDermott that coached an afterthought draftee at cornerback into a top five corner in the league. It was the culture that McDermott built that lured Von Miller here and that has helped make Stefon Diggs happy enough here that he remains supremely productive and wants to finish his career in Buffalo. And last but not least...Josh Allen. The patience, consistency, and support this coaching staff has given Allen, thus allowing him to become the best QB in the league, has been MASTERFUL.

I get it -- McDermott is an elite Monday through Saturday coach and sometimes not quite as elite on Sundays. His game management is not always perfect. Very few coaches have perfect game management. Andy Reid STILL struggles with it, and he has a Lombardi and multiple NFC and AFC Championship Game apperances. 

The bottom line is that it's not reasonable to only point out the flaws in McDermott's coaching without also pointing out the absolutely ELITE job he's done coaching up the Bills roster, fostering an environment in which a raw QB prospect could ascend to greatness, and ultimately creating a consistent championship contending team. 

For anyone that thinks it would be easy to find a coaching upgrade to Sean McDermott, I beg you to look around the league and follow its annual hiring and firing cycle. Coaching turnover in the NFL is CONSTANT. Consistently good head coaches are incredibly hard to find. Who's walking through the door that's better than McDermott? Be careful what you wish for.

Edited September 26, 2022 by Logic

[Dopey]

11 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Neither did KC. Both Reid and KC made a change and that put both of them over the top. 

McDermott isn't going anywhere this season no matter what happens. 

If they don't make a SuperBowl this year the seat gets got in the media. But the media is not Pegula and that is all that matters. 

Reid got to KC in 2013 and finally made it to the SB 7 years later. He also took over a better team than McD did. Now that we're good, does McD get that amount of time? 

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

You started this thread because it was a negative spin on McDermott.  If it wasn't, you wouldn't have started it.

I gotta say that Einstein's take on this, as expressed in the comparison to Fox, is a legitimate concern.  And, frankly, I think McDermott would agree with it.   I think McDermott already understands that he's not winning close games.  If he didn't understand it before yesterday, he does now.  The players he put on the field were better players (if not in raw talent, then in terms of discipline, teamwork, complexity of offense and defense), with a much better quarterback, and McDermott knows that.  I think he would say that winning games like yesterday is a capability that he, his staff, and his players must develop. 

 

McDermott has only one objective, and that's winning.   If he's not winning, he wants to correct it.  

[Donuts and Doritos]

If he wins the Superbowl that will end a lot of the arguments/doubts about the Bills, McD, Josh etc... No point debating it, let their play do the talking. This is a put up or shut up year. We'll see how it ends. 

[MJS]

50 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

Of course I do. It's the nature of the beast. Are you new to this?

Then you are drunk. There is a 0.0% chance that McDermott will be on the hot seat after this year if they don't make the superbowl.

 

You clearly do not follow the league. You suffer from Bills myopia.

Edited September 26, 2022 by MJS