Week 8: Dolphins at Bills

[Warcodered]

13 minutes ago, Logic said:

As in you wish YOUR legs were like that, or as in you literally want to have those legs?

yes.

[YoloinOhio]

Death, taxes, and Micah Hyde burying McKittrick

Edited October 28, 2021 by YoloinOhio

[Roundybout]

How's the traffic with COVID checks and all? My lady and I will be leaving from Buffalo around 9:30 or 10. How has traffic been around the stadium and how soon should we head for the gate? 

[Mark Vader]

1 hour ago, Tom Donahoe, GM said:

I've had another look at those shorts and I gotta say he's in uncharted waters there. Those are the shortest shorts

Shorter than the basketball shorts pre 1990's?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, Tom Donahoe, GM said:

I've had another look at those shorts and I gotta say he's in uncharted waters there. Those are the shortest shorts

 

McKenzie wears shorter

6 hours ago, LeGOATski said:

I think he would put Epenesa higher than Andre Smith, Tyrel Dodson, Efe Obada, and maybe Harry and Zimmer.

 

It's possible that Epenesa is having bad practices. He certainly hasn't had as much of an impact since his first couple weeks, but neither have the guys who were active over him.

 

I also know the coaches make certain decisions for the sake of helping a player's growth/humility even if it doesn't give them the best tactical advantage for a regular season game.

 

 

How do you know this?

 

If Frazier sat Epenesa to “help his growth or humility” at the cost of a tactical advantage that could have won the game, I would be so not OK with that

 

Me, I don’t believe it and I think they felt Obada and Harrison gave them better run defense than Epenesa and Butler

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

Death, taxes, and Micah Hyde burying McKittrick

 

Is that Tre White he asks “we’re talking about McKenzie, how do you feel about him?” What does Tre reply?

[CodeMonkey]

On 10/25/2021 at 8:10 AM, YoloinOhio said:

Bills currently -13.5

I don't care who it is, that's a lot of freaking points to give man.

[atlbillsfan1975]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

McKenzie wears shorter

 

How do you know this?

 

If Frazier sat Epenesa to “help his growth or humility” at the cost of a tactical advantage that could have won the game, I would be so not OK with that

 

Me, I don’t believe it and I think they felt Obada and Harrison gave them better run defense than Epenesa and Butler

My take on the inactive list for Tenn had to do with McD’s confidence in Milano to play up to the level necessary. Why have all those LB’s active?
Personally, I would have liked to see Klein line up with Edmunds. Milano sit and then activate Epenesa. Oh well, hindsight 

[BillsFan619]

2 hours ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

Thursday, October 28, 6:57.

 

It is officially 100 years until kickoff on a Sunday.

 

Jeepers.

It’s always a catch 22 for me. I’m so excited to get to and watch the game. That said, I don’t want the weekend to be over with.

[The Wiz]

I have trunk and treat with my kids from 2-4.  I'm gonna be that guy that brings a TV, power supply and cast it from my phone while they are walking around. 

[Warcodered]

17 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Is that Tre White he asks “we’re talking about McKenzie, how do you feel about him?” What does Tre reply?

Sounded like "Don't feel *something*" couldn't make it out too well.

13 minutes ago, CodeMonkey said:

I don't care who it is, that's a lot of freaking points to give man.

Guess they think we'll score at least 13 points.

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Turf Toejam 34]

1 hour ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

My take on the inactive list for Tenn had to do with McD’s confidence in Milano to play up to the level necessary. Why have all those LB’s active?
Personally, I would have liked to see Klein line up with Edmunds. Milano sit and then activate Epenesa. Oh well, hindsight 

I often think about what a Milano/Klein backfield would look like.   

[LeGOATski]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

How do you know this?

 

If Frazier sat Epenesa to “help his growth or humility” at the cost of a tactical advantage that could have won the game, I would be so not OK with that

 

Me, I don’t believe it and I think they felt Obada and Harrison gave them better run defense than Epenesa and Butler

They do this type of stuff every year. Like sitting Moss the first game. It was all about gut-checking him to get his ass in gear.

 

And just like you've expressed here, people weren't happy.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, Mark Vader said:

Shorter than the basketball shorts pre 1990's?

 

Only a Speedo brief from the same era was shorter than those pre-90s basketball shorts.  Don’t believe me go look at old Larry Bird clips on Youtube.  Yikes.

 

1 hour ago, LeGOATski said:

They do this type of stuff every year. Like sitting Moss the first game. It was all about gut-checking him to get his ass in gear.

 

And just like you've expressed here, people weren't happy.

 

I don’t know who “they” is, but it sounds to me like you’re making stuff up.

 

The first game, they wanted Breida active so they had a “Plan B” at kick/punt returner since McKenzie had a shoulder injury.   A second factor was Daboll’s game plan against a “Blitzberg” defensive plan that could be countered with 4 and 5 WR sets and speed to the outside.  But Pittsburg went in a completely different direction so in hindsight he had the wrong guy active for offense (but the need for a backup KR/PR was still legit, as we saw when McKenzie left the game)

 

It had nothing to do with “gut checking” Moss or giving him some kind of message to “get his ass in gear”.  

 

What possible need could there even be to deliver such a message in the very first game of the season?  

[LeGOATski]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

I don’t know who “they” is, but it sounds to me like you’re making stuff up.

 

The first game, they wanted Breida active so they had a “Plan B” at kick/punt returner since McKenzie had a shoulder injury.   A second factor was Daboll’s game plan against a “Blitzberg” defensive plan that could be countered with 4 and 5 WR sets and speed to the outside.  But Pittsburg went in a completely different direction so in hindsight he had the wrong guy active for offense (but the need for a backup KR/PR was still legit, as we saw when McKenzie left the game)

 

It had nothing to do with “gut checking” Moss or giving him some kind of message to “get his ass in gear”.  

 

What possible need could there even be to deliver such a message in the very first game of the season?  

The press conference afterwards McDermott said Moss is "motivated" now and was looking a lot better in practice leading up to week 2 than he had all offseason.

 

It's odd to me that you don't think that type of thing is needed. You're weirdly dramatic about this. McDermott expresses all the time the importance of staying "humble and hungry" and he has a reputation for holding back praise on his younger players.

 

The "why" in Moss's case was obvious. In order keep growing into a more complete team, the Bills need their running game to take a couple steps forward. So, McDermott will try to motivate those guys however he can. There was a notably positive result with Moss after the week 1 benching.

[Doc Brown]

2 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

The press conference afterwards McDermott said Moss is "motivated" now and was looking a lot better in practice leading up to week 2 than he had all offseason.

 

It's odd to me that you don't think that type of thing is needed. You're weirdly dramatic about this. McDermott expresses all the time the importance of staying "humble and hungry" and he has a reputation for holding back praise on his younger players.

 

The "why" in Moss's case was obvious. In order keep growing into a more complete team, the Bills need their running game to take a couple steps forward. So, McDermott will try to motivate those guys however he can. There was a notably positive result with Moss after the week 1 benching.

You're not going to lessen your chances of winning by making a usual starter "inactive" to prove a point.  Hap is right in that it was gameplan specific to the Steelers.  I'm not sure about backup returner may have had to do with it as they could've used Hyde for punt returns and Jones for kick returns.  Singletary had the better training camp and it was just a numbers game at that point like McDermott said after the game.

[LeGOATski]

16 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

You're not going to lessen your chances of winning by making a usual starter "inactive" to prove a point.  Hap is right in that it was gameplan specific to the Steelers.  I'm not sure about backup returner may have had to do with it as they could've used Hyde for punt returns and Jones for kick returns.  Singletary had the better training camp and it was just a numbers game at that point like McDermott said after the game.

They barely used Breida, so there was nothing gameplan specific about sitting Moss. It was because he wasn't performing to their standard. We all saw the before and after effects.

 

With Epenesa, they didn't need to have a third string LB or DT active over him. Although, like I said before, I think in Epenesa's case it was more a matter of the coaches overthinking the matchups.

[Pete]

 

[JMF2006]

Or maybe its that he(AJE) didn't practice well or he was a bit knicked up and another week or two gets him 100%

 

We don't know all the reasons.

Edited October 29, 2021 by JMF2006

[Forward Progress]

16 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Flowchart for determining excessive shortness of shorts:

 

Can you see Peter?

Yes -> too short

No -> they're good

 

What about Paul and Mary?  Can they be visible?  Asking for a friend.

[Chandler#81]

AFC -maybe Pittsburgh, maybe Indy..   NFC -probably All of them except TB, LA & GB by default 

[BuffaloBillyG]

8 minutes ago, Chandler#81 said:

AFC -maybe Pittsburgh, maybe Indy..   NFC -probably All of them except TB, LA & GB by default 

I'd add Cleveland to that as well. They have had a ton of injury. They could be in a dogfight at the end of the year for a spot. KC is a fringe team as well with the way their defense is performing and a brutal schedule. Still think they find a way in but with teams like Cincy and the Charges ready to pounce I'd say Buff, Balt and Tenn are the only "surest things".

[uninja]

8 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

I’d say def Pittsburgh, def Colts. 
 

Right now I’d say Bills, Chargers, Titans, Ravens, Bengals, Browns, and either KC/Vegas make the playoffs. 
 

Pittsburgh sucks. Solid defense but Ben is a shell of himself, they’ll be .500 or so when it’s all said and done, IMO. Bills should’ve never lost that opening day game. 

 

I think Colts will definitely be in contention for a WC down the stretch. AFC is loaded but Reich knows how to coach, Wentz looks like he's figuring ***** out, their running game is good/great, their defense is above average and they know how to win ugly. It's just like last year where you spend half the year wondering if the Colts are good or dog**** and then boom, they're in the playoffs. I'm thinking that game against them on 11/21 is going to be a lot more difficult than a lot of people think its going to be.

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Rockinon]

Bengals, Browns, Squeelers, an Ravens are going to beat the crap out of each other by the end of the season. No telling who comes out on top. Injuries have effected all of these teams. Similar situation in KC's division. KC is in trouble and the other teams in that division smell blood. We are fortunate to be in the division we are in. We will cruise to the playoffs and all of these other teams will be in a dog fight. Not ruling out NE making it in either. They are clearly better than Miami and the Jets even if they did drop their first game to Miami.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

 

 

 

[Greg S]

My guess on the AFC playoffs.

 

East - Bills

North - Ravens or Bengals winner

South - Titans

West - Chargers or Raiders winner

 

Wild Cards

 

Chargers or Raiders loser

Ravens or Bengals loser

Last spot will be a fight between the Browns, Chiefs, and maybe the Colts and Pats can get into the mix.

[RichRiderBills]

That one loss by Josh.... the incredible game winner bounced off Charles Clay's chest. To date, it was one of Josh's most amazing plays and the moment I knew we had one. 

Edited October 29, 2021 by RichRiderBills

[Mat68]

19 minutes ago, RichRiderBills said:

That one loss by Josh.... the incredible game winner bounced off Charles Clay's chest. To date, it was one of Josh's most amazing plays and the moment I knew we had one. 

100%.   Ive went back and watched some of those games.  My god the team had no talent on offense.  The stats will never show how well he actually played his rookie year. 

[Royale with Cheese]

31 minutes ago, Greg S said:

My guess on the AFC playoffs.

 

East - Bills

North - Ravens or Bengals winner

South - Titans

West - Chargers or Raiders winner

 

Wild Cards

 

Chargers or Raiders loser

Ravens or Bengals loser

Last spot will be a fight between the Browns, Chiefs, and maybe the Colts and Pats can get into the mix.

 

It is so crazy to think the Chiefs are an "in the hunt" team.  It looked like they were going to be a 12-15 win team a year for many years to come.

 

I think the Browns fall too far behind.  

They have the Steelers twice, Bengals twice, the Ravens twice, the Pats and Raiders left.

I see them losing most of them...probably at least 5.

Edited October 29, 2021 by Royale with Cheese

[Hapless Bills Fan]

6 hours ago, LeGOATski said:

The press conference afterwards McDermott said Moss is "motivated" now and was looking a lot better in practice leading up to week 2 than he had all offseason.

 

It's odd to me that you don't think that type of thing is needed. You're weirdly dramatic about this. McDermott expresses all the time the importance of staying "humble and hungry" and he has a reputation for holding back praise on his younger players.

 

The "why" in Moss's case was obvious. In order keep growing into a more complete team, the Bills need their running game to take a couple steps forward. So, McDermott will try to motivate those guys however he can. There was a notably positive result with Moss after the week 1 benching.

 

LOL at saying I'm "wierdly dramatic" while you're making up conspiracy theories that coaches bench players to teach them motivational lessons at the cost of a better chance for a win.  😅

 

I think you're mis-quoting McDermott. 

 

Moss pulled a hamstring in training camp and missed a couple pre-season games before getting very limited snaps (4 carries) against the Bears and Packers.  We all know that hamstrings are unpredictable and can linger if not allowed to recover fully.  This is what was quoted in the media at the time.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/sean-mcdermott-shares-details-about-rb-zack-moss-week-1-absence/ar-AAOyNIN

Quote

McDermott said Moss was inactive in Week 1 because there were some concerns about his health leading up to that game. However, the second-year tailback has looked good in practice this week and should return to the lineup this Sunday against the Miami Dolphins

 

 

Find a quote where McDermott said being inactive "motivated" Moss or was for the purpose of sending him a "message".  Bet you can find some dude on a fan blog spinning some conspiracy theory, but nothing McDermott actually said.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Forward Progress said:

What about Paul and Mary?  Can they be visible?  Asking for a friend.

 

Yes!

[YoloinOhio]

Spencer Brown will not practice again today per McDermott but he did not commit to his game status 

[BearNorth]

58 minutes ago, Greg S said:

My guess on the AFC playoffs.

 

East - Bills

North - Ravens or Bengals winner

South - Titans

West - Chargers or Raiders winner

 

Wild Cards

 

Chargers or Raiders loser

Ravens or Bengals loser

Last spot will be a fight between the Browns, Chiefs, and maybe the Colts and Pats can get into the mix.

Massey projects all games, as of this morning, he has

Bills projected at 12-5

Cinci, Balt, Tenn, at 11-6,

Raiders & Chargers at 10-7. 

7 seed at 9-8 is one of Pitts, Cleve, Indy, KC. 

Tenn and Pitts have a win over Bills, so we would have to finish a game ahead of them.

Locking up #1 seed might mean playing starters week 18. 

Only other AFC contender we play is Indy on 11/21. 

He has Patsies finishing at 8-9. 

Teams with toughest remaining schedules are Pitts, KC, Browns, and PoeBirds. 

Bills have the easiest remaining schedule in the league. 

[YoloinOhio]

 

 

[BringBackFlutie]

15 hours ago, Logic said:

As in you wish YOUR legs were like that, or as in you literally want to have those legs?

 

Nevermind. Don’t answer.

 

15 hours ago, Warcodered said:

yes.

 

...I didn't need to.

[2003Contenders]

11 hours ago, LeGOATski said:

They do this type of stuff every year. Like sitting Moss the first game. It was all about gut-checking him to get his ass in gear.

 

And just like you've expressed here, people weren't happy.

 

I suspect that the personnel for the Tennessee game was very game-plan specific. They were worried about Henry breaking loose and Tannehill running around -- so they employed a defense that had less to do with getting pressure on the QB and more to do with stopping the run. Sadly, the net result was that Tanney had all day long to survey the field, was patient, minimized mistakes, and found mid-range receivers.

 

With little threat of a running game from Miami, I believe that the game plan defensively this week will revert back to what we saw pre-Tennessee, which probably means an active AJ. The key will be to beware of the screen game, which Miami can run well with Tua, Gaskin and Gesicki.

[Nineforty]

52 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

LOL at saying I'm "wierdly dramatic" while you're making up conspiracy theories that coaches bench players to teach them motivational lessons at the cost of a better chance for a win.  😅

 

I think you're mis-quoting McDermott. 

 

Moss pulled a hamstring in training camp and missed a couple pre-season games before getting very limited snaps (4 carries) against the Bears and Packers.  We all know that hamstrings are unpredictable and can linger if not allowed to recover fully.  This is what was quoted in the media at the time.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/sean-mcdermott-shares-details-about-rb-zack-moss-week-1-absence/ar-AAOyNIN

 

 

Find a quote where McDermott said being inactive "motivated" Moss or was for the purpose of sending him a "message".  Bet you can find some dude on a fan blog spinning some conspiracy theory, but nothing McDermott actually said.

 

Didnt mcdermott originally say it was about "the numbers" as to why he was inactive?

 

I could see how one would make the leap to 'dog house'or the 'motivation'. But that doesnt make it right  either. Especially given the new comments by mcd and it being injury related

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Just now, Nineforty said:

Didnt mcdermott originally say it was about "the numbers" as to why he was inactive?

 

Correct.  Then a week later McD brought up "concerns about his health" prior to the game. 

 

IMO, McKenzie's shoulder injury and wanting Brieda active as a "back up plan" at KR/PR, while never stated, was very likely to be a factor - as we saw when McKenzie went to the locker room and was announced as "questionable to return" (he did).   I think that's what McDermott meant when he originally said it was numbers - if needing a slot for Brieda (numbers) weren't a factor, they likely would have had Moss active and perhaps limited or on a "pitch count".

 

Another factor was likely the very pass-heavy game plan vs. Pittsburgh, where we ran 43% 4 or 5 WR sets.  We had 15 rush attempts by RBs and 51 pass attempts.

 

Just now, Nineforty said:

I could see how one would make the leap to 'dog house'or the 'motivation'. But that doesnt make it right  either. Especially given the new comments by mcd and it being injury related

 

On a professional football team with professional football players, benching a player to "teach them a lesson" or "motivate them" seems likely to take a far back seat vs. matchup concerns that week; need to activate another player due to roster concerns at another position, and also need to let the player heal a bit more. 

 

It's nuts to think an NFL team would sit a player who would actually give them a better chance to win for some kind of "player development" "send a message" "motivate them" reason.   The team will activate the players it feels will give them the best chance to win that week.

 

That's not to say motivation isn't part of the equation, but not directly.  For example, let's say Epenesa has been letting his weight drop and has been overpursuing against the run in previous games or in practice.  The team benches him and has Obada active because they see Obada as a better matchup against Henry and Tenn.  Epenesa obviously wants to know why he's being benched, and "you need to be better at this and that (hopefully with specific examples), and you need to get your weight up" will be part of the conversation.  But the primary reason he's being benched is because at this point in time, Obada is honestly believed by the coaches to offer them the better matchup and better chance at victory.