Diggs interview today

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, DCofNC said:

In all fairness, Lamb and Jeudy are killing it and could have been had for pretty much the same picks.  Both are on rookie deals and locked up for 5 years, so try not to be too pompous.

 

What's your thinking there?

 

I'm not a draft value maven, but I Think Not. 

 

For Diggs, we gave up: Pick #22 in the first round, a 5th and 6th round pick, and a next year's 4th that devalues a round for being next year.

(We got back a 7th)

 

This Draft Value Chart (which I believe is considered to under-value 1st round picks based on current trades) says the difference between #22 and #14 (1 pick above Jeudy) is 320 points.  The draft value of #22 5th and 6th and a second 5th (next year 4th) is 81.4, or almost exactly 1/4 of the difference between #22 and #14.  At the least, we'd have been talking about giving up our 2nd round pick to trade up from #22 to #14 - and that's assuming someone wants to trade.

 

Last year, the Steelers traded to move from #20 to #10 (pretty close to what we would have had to do for Lamb) and gave the Broncos their 2nd and a 2020 3rd

 

I think if we drafted a receiver in the 1st, it would likely not have been Lamb or Jeudy.  And if we tried to move up for Lamb or Jeudy from #22 to #10-14, it would have almost certainly have cost far more than a 5th and a 6th round pick.  Likely a 2nd and next years 3rd or 4th.

[Augie]

52 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I remember a lot of people complaining relative to the price Arizona paid for Hopkins, and also complaining we should never trade a first round pick for a WR.

 

40 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Which was a ridiculous complaint Arizona robbed Houston you can't expect that to happen.

 

Interview was great he definitely seems to enjoy playing hear plus what he had to say about Gabriel Davis has me excited about what the rook can do.

 

Different deals, as Hopkins was going to be FAR more expensive much sooner. A PROVEN #1 WR is well worth a 1st round pick (and change). Drafting a guy is a crap shoot. I liked the trade then, I LOVE the trade now. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, kota said:

just makes you wonder what happened in Minnesota.  Media portrayed him as a Diva.  He has been anything but.  Dude just wants to win. 

My guess is that he didn't like Kirk Cousins much.

 

I think on a personal level, there's no dislike as such.  They probably weren't playing Call of Duty together or joking around, but I think they're both decent guys.

 

Cousins throwing to a WR like Diggs is a bit like giving a Porsche Boxster to a guy who always drives 5 miles under the speed limit.  It's not that the car can't do what the guy needs; it's that it has capabilities that aren't being explored.  And if those unexplored capabilities (switching back to football) might win the team a game, that's got to be frustrating to a through-and-through competitive guy.

 

I think Beasley started out last year being pretty frustrated at times (that helmet throw!), when he was open and Josh didn't see or wouldn't throw to him, but an open line of communication and trying constantly to get closer to the same page, as well as seeing how much of himself Josh put out there every game seems to have settled him down.  And of course this year, Josh is making throws he wouldn't try last year.

 

[Penfield45]

Diggs was the right move over a rookie WR b/c a rookie #1 WR cannot elevate the game of a young QB. 

 

Allen needed Diggs, and his presence is showing to have worked in helping Allen develop. 

[DCofNC]

19 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

What's your thinking there?

 

I'm not a draft value maven, but I Think Not. 

 

For Diggs, we gave up: Pick #22 in the first round, a 5th and 6th round pick, and a next year's 4th that devalues a round for being next year.

(We got back a 7th)

 

This Draft Value Chart (which I believe is considered to under-value 1st round picks based on current trades) says the difference between #22 and #14 (1 pick above Jeudy) is 320 points.  The draft value of #22 5th and 6th and a second 5th (next year 4th) is 81.4, or almost exactly 1/4 of the difference between #22 and #14.  At the least, we'd have been talking about giving up our 2nd round pick to trade up from #22 to #14 - and that's assuming someone wants to trade.

 

Last year, the Steelers traded to move from #20 to #10 (pretty close to what we would have had to do for Lamb) and gave the Broncos their 2nd and a 2020 3rd

 

I think if we drafted a receiver in the 1st, it would likely not have been Lamb or Jeudy.  And if we tried to move up for Lamb or Jeudy from #22 to #10-14, it would have almost certainly have cost far more than a 5th and a 6th round pick.  Likely a 2nd and next years 3rd or 4th.

Lamb went at 17, so let’s talk about moving 5 spots, the reality of the situation.  If you want to cherry pick and act like somebody could not actually see the draft in front of them and know who was on the board.  So let’s say we have to move to 16,  now look at the cost and the value to move to 10 is way higher than to move to 14, so just read your own chart.  Even less to go to 16.  Now look at the contract implications, Diggs is paid 3x what the rookies are making and his contract runs out before them.  So by the time they get to “real money” he’s going to be looking for top money.  So take your extra 4 catches and shove them in terms of value.

 

Again, Diggs is doing great.  He’s a stud, no denying it, love having him.  To say it was far better than moving to 16 to take Lamb, not an easy argument in value.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

28 minutes ago, CaliBills said:

I honestly believe it was Cousins and that is it.

Cousins has this "high and mighty' type attitude.

I remember watching this video with him talking to Allen when Allen was coming out for the draft.

And he just came across as a very dislikable person.

 

Do you mean "The Wake-Up Call" series?  I thought the series intro came across as stiff and cocky, but I assume someone wrote a script Cousins was reading.

During his actual unscripted interactions with Allen, Cousins didn't come across to me as dislikeable.  Cerebral and reserved, yes, but not a jerk.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

14 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

Lamb went at 17, so let’s talk about moving 5 spots, the reality of the situation.

 

Um, no?  The reality of the situation is you don't seem willing or able to acknowledge that moving from #22 to #16 or #15 could not have been done for a 5th and 6th round pick and a 4th next year (with a 7th rd back in change).  And you're tossing in salary differential, which wasn't part of your initial post.

 

I'm outta here

[YoloinOhio]

4 hours ago, kota said:

just makes you wonder what happened in Minnesota.  Media portrayed him as a Diva.  He has been anything but.  Dude just wants to win. 

My guess is that he didn't like Kirk Cousins much.

I listen to a Buckeye podcast with Chris Spielman and he sometimes discusses the Vikes because his brother is the GM. He said they never wanted to trade him,  but they knew he didn’t want to be there. The offer was so good they decided to take it because of that. I do not think he ever gelled with Cousins. 

[JoPoy88]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Um, no?  The reality of the situation is you don't seem willing or able to acknowledge that moving from #22 to #16 or #15 could not have been done for a 5th and 6th round pick and a 4th next year (with a 7th rd back in change).  And you're tossing in salary differential, which wasn't part of your initial post.

 

I'm outta here

i feel your pain. It was pretty much established on and before draft day that the Bills could have moved up to maybe 18 for the capital in the Diggs move. Dude is making things up Hap.

[John from Riverside]

Diggs likes winning.....go figure

 

Meanwhile.....his former team is falling apart

[dma0034]

The Diggs trade was the correct trade. That said: Jefferson just destroyed the Titans to the tune of 175 yards in his 3rd start. I'll take Diggs but this could end up as one of those things where it is a win-win. The reason why anyone is mad about the 1st was because of Hopkins. It was even that Hopkins was traded for a 2nd; the Cardinals got to give them David Johnson and his cap too. It would be like giving the Vikings a 2nd and Star for Diggs. BOB is such a fool. Wish he was the GM of the Patriots

[GunnerBill]

7 hours ago, H2o said:

Jeudy has 13 catches and Lamb 16. Diggs has 20 even getting covered by each team's best CB. Jeudy has 173 yds and Lamb 230 through 3 games. Diggs 288 yds with the aforementioned attention. Jeudy and Lamb each have 0 TD's. Diggs has 2 with the aforementioned attention. Jeudy has also been dropping easy catches. The rooks are alright, but give me Diggs any day of the week and twice on Sunday. 

 

Firstly the assertion you responded to that Jeudy and Lamb could have been had for "similar picks" is not true. Brandon Beane has talked about the fact that they had some discussions and calculated where they could get to in the 1st for this value and that it would probably be a place where the top 3 guys were gone.

 

But it also comes down to where the Bills are as a team too. The Bills window is now. I love Jeudy and Lamb. Think they will be players in the league. It was genuinely an excellent receiver class but the Bills had the chance to get a prove entity, an elite route runner, in his prime (not at 29 or 30 with a year or two left) to help the team win NOW. That is what made the Diggs deal such a no brainer. This was the critical year for the franchise and their young Quarterback. If there is ever a time in the NFL to roll the dice this was it. 

[H2o]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Firstly the assertion you responded to that Jeudy and Lamb could have been had for "similar picks" is not true. Brandon Beane has talked about the fact that they had some discussions and calculated where they could get to in the 1st for this value and that it would probably be a place where the top 3 guys were gone.

 

But it also comes down to where the Bills are as a team too. The Bills window is now. I love Jeudy and Lamb. Think they will be players in the league. It was genuinely an excellent receiver class but the Bills had the chance to get a prove entity, an elite route runner, in his prime (not at 29 or 30 with a year or two left) to help the team win NOW. That is what made the Diggs deal such a no brainer. This was the critical year for the franchise and their young Quarterback. If there is ever a time in the NFL to roll the dice this was it. 

I think you meant to quote someone else my friend. 

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, H2o said:

I think you meant to quote someone else my friend. 

 

No I meant to quote you in support of your comment. The point is not just "are Lamb and Jeudy good?" It is "who is the best option for a Bills team that is in a window?"

[H2o]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

No I meant to quote you in support of your comment. The point is not just "are Lamb and Jeudy good?" It is "who is the best option for a Bills team that is in a window?"

Ahhhh, gotcha my friend. I absolutely take Diggs for that reason. He's proven and he's an upper tier, if not elite, WR in this league. DCofNC says they are "crushing it" right now when in actuality Jeudy is not crushing it. I believe both players, he and Lamb, will be good. They were 2 of the top 3 prospects in this draft. For this team though, Diggs was ABSOLUTELY the right choice and we have him under contract at a reasonable rate for the next few years. 

[eball]

15 hours ago, JoPoy88 said:

Wonder what the “shoulda kept the pick” cats are doing nowadays 🤔

 

15 hours ago, Dr. Who said:

Hanging out with the Josh Allen is a glorified running back crowd.

 

In a conference room at PFF headquarters.

[machine gun kelly]

Seems like a hindsight discussion.  Anyone can look at what Diggs has done for this team, and he wanted to leave.  He was proven, would contribute from the first day, and the NFLR guys the other day were commenting when a team gives away a top WR, like MN, or Houston with Hopkins, the old teams have not started out well.

 

I couldn’t be happier about the trade, and we didn’t fork out Fort Knox like AZ did for Hopkins.  Yes, we advanced him more of his contract which helped us, but the overall contract is flat.  Considering what some of the other top 5 WR’s are getting, we’re doing well.  Outside of maybe TE, and even that we’re not sure as Kroft had a good game, and Knox we can only hope will improve.  We have the line, stable of RB’s, a true starting QB and the results are showing with these offensive performances.  Welcome to Buffalo Diggs.  We luv ya here.

[wjag]

Hard not to smile watching that.

[Comebackkid]

I think one of the main points about Diggs was.. He was a sure thing in a year you can't be sure about much.   Regardless of what could have been done in the draft you were putting a lot eggs in the basket of chance.   

 Sometimes a sure thing is worth the extra cost and I'm sure this was the reasoning beane had before the season. 

[Royale with Cheese]

What a selfish player.  

[YoloinOhio]

I’m in love and he wears 14!! Thank you, Beane 

[Putin]

On 9/30/2020 at 4:31 PM, jeremy2020 said:

 

Any logical person knew it was a great trade the moment it was made. 

I was thrilled when I heard about the trade and we all knew then what kind of a player we’re getting ,  what I didn’t know is how unselfish and good teammate and all around just a GREAT dude Stef really is ...

my next jersey is definitely going to have # 14 on the back of it !!!

[JerseyBills]

On 9/30/2020 at 3:42 PM, hondo in seattle said:

 

Some cats overvalue picks.  How many 1st round picks never become NFL stars?

 

Diggs was a legit star.  Proven at the NFL level.  It was a great trade as we all know now.  

Also , we didn't have any glaring needs except WR , thanks to the great job of Beane, so we had the Luxury to grab Diggs for the picks because the roster is so well rounded 

 

[Alaska Darin]

This interview says a lot about Diggs and how complete the cultural transformation is at OBD.  Would Diggs be the same dude if the BILLS were 1-2 and not scoring/moving the football?  No way.  This guy wants to WIN.  There are 2 plays so far that stick out (to me) that prove this:

 

1.  The screen TD that Smoke scored against the Jets.  Diggs ran about 30 yards across the field to throw the final block needed to finish the play.

2.  The Kroft TD to beat the Rams.  Diggs gave a really good depth answer in his interview about Kroft, his story, how bothered he was by the INT and it was REALLY obvious that Diggs was genuinely happy not only because we won the game but because Kroft was the guy who made the catch to do it.

 

Diggs is everything you want in a WR.  He's tough as nails, quick, hard working, a great route runner, and he cares about winning.  This was a great trade for the BILLS.  Brandon Beane has shown that he understands the draft and how to evaluate talent.  If he thinks trading a first pick for an accomplished player is the right move, I guarantee he didn't make that decision lightly.

 

I can only imagine how much more SD is going to like Buffalo when the place is jumping with excitement.

[Don Otreply]

Diggs is the real deal, and was worth every pick and dollar, anyone who says otherwise is just not particularly intelligent. 
 

“He’s got Juice and can get off, likes watching others with juice getting off” ,  This use of language is proof that I am officially old as Hades...🤣

 

 

Edited October 2, 2020 by Don Otreply

[DCofNC]

On 9/30/2020 at 10:59 PM, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Um, no?  The reality of the situation is you don't seem willing or able to acknowledge that moving from #22 to #16 or #15 could not have been done for a 5th and 6th round pick and a 4th next year (with a 7th rd back in change).  And you're tossing in salary differential, which wasn't part of your initial post.

 

I'm outta here

What part of overall value of a trade are you missing?  The first round pick and the money are the key components to all of this.  You want to get on Diggs nuts over 3 more catches than a rookie WR, but don’t want to acknowledge he is being paid 2x as much as is under contract for far less time?  Interesting.  Not surprised with the Homer attitude.  VALUE is more than 1 thing.  
 

If you want to look at the draft value chart, the Bills gave up about 930 draft value points to get Diggs, to go to 16 to take Lamb they needed 1000.  If that fourth rounder had been this years pick, you were already there, but you could have given up a 3rd round pick and that would have been it to go up.  So to recap, the Bills essentially gave up the 18th pick for Diggs.  So to sit in your ignorant high horse and act like it’s a clear cut great trade vs making virtually the same trade to go up for a guy you have under contract for half the money and double the time, is pretty silly. 

 

Why didn’t the Bills go for Ngakue? No VALUE in trading a second round pick AND paying 20M a year.  The value of Diggs is a veteran presence, proven commodity at a reasonable contract vs his expected production, but in comparison to production, your whole argument is trash.

[StHustle]

11 hours ago, DCofNC said:

What part of overall value of a trade are you missing?  The first round pick and the money are the key components to all of this.  You want to get on Diggs nuts over 3 more catches than a rookie WR, but don’t want to acknowledge he is being paid 2x as much as is under contract for far less time?  Interesting.  Not surprised with the Homer attitude.  VALUE is more than 1 thing.  
 

If you want to look at the draft value chart, the Bills gave up about 930 draft value points to get Diggs, to go to 16 to take Lamb they needed 1000.  If that fourth rounder had been this years pick, you were already there, but you could have given up a 3rd round pick and that would have been it to go up.  So to recap, the Bills essentially gave up the 18th pick for Diggs.  So to sit in your ignorant high horse and act like it’s a clear cut great trade vs making virtually the same trade to go up for a guy you have under contract for half the money and double the time, is pretty silly. 

 

Why didn’t the Bills go for Ngakue? No VALUE in trading a second round pick AND paying 20M a year.  The value of Diggs is a veteran presence, proven commodity at a reasonable contract vs his expected production, but in comparison to production, your whole argument is trash.

 

You really think it's smarter to draft a rookie wide receiver with a super high ceiling than use the same draft capital to get a known commodity like Diggs? And your defense is because of the money? Did you learn anything from the Watkins debacle??? That type of thinking caused the draught to last as long as it did. Beane knows what he's doing.

Edited October 3, 2020 by StHustle

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Doc]

23 hours ago, DCofNC said:

What part of overall value of a trade are you missing?  The first round pick and the money are the key components to all of this.  You want to get on Diggs nuts over 3 more catches than a rookie WR, but don’t want to acknowledge he is being paid 2x as much as is under contract for far less time?  Interesting.  Not surprised with the Homer attitude.  VALUE is more than 1 thing.  
 

If you want to look at the draft value chart, the Bills gave up about 930 draft value points to get Diggs, to go to 16 to take Lamb they needed 1000.  If that fourth rounder had been this years pick, you were already there, but you could have given up a 3rd round pick and that would have been it to go up.  So to recap, the Bills essentially gave up the 18th pick for Diggs.  So to sit in your ignorant high horse and act like it’s a clear cut great trade vs making virtually the same trade to go up for a guy you have under contract for half the money and double the time, is pretty silly. 

 

Why didn’t the Bills go for Ngakue? No VALUE in trading a second round pick AND paying 20M a year.  The value of Diggs is a veteran presence, proven commodity at a reasonable contract vs his expected production, but in comparison to production, your whole argument is trash.

 

It wasn't 930 value points they gave up.  The 4th next year equals a 5th this year.  I did the math at the time and given the comp picks, the value ended up being not even enough to get to the 21st overall pick.  The top-3 WRs were expected to go well before then, leaving WRs from the 2nd tier. 

 

As for Jefferson, he had a fine game last weekend.  But it was just one game.  It will be interesting to see how he does going forward.

 

As for salary, sure you'd like to be paying everyone a rookie salary.  But it doesn't mean much.  They appear to have hit on Gabe Davis, if we're going the hindsight route. 

[NewEra]

On 10/2/2020 at 7:29 AM, DCofNC said:

What part of overall value of a trade are you missing?  The first round pick and the money are the key components to all of this.  You want to get on Diggs nuts over 3 more catches than a rookie WR, but don’t want to acknowledge he is being paid 2x as much as is under contract for far less time?  Interesting.  Not surprised with the Homer attitude.  VALUE is more than 1 thing.  
 

If you want to look at the draft value chart, the Bills gave up about 930 draft value points to get Diggs, to go to 16 to take Lamb they needed 1000.  If that fourth rounder had been this years pick, you were already there, but you could have given up a 3rd round pick and that would have been it to go up.  So to recap, the Bills essentially gave up the 18th pick for Diggs.  So to sit in your ignorant high horse and act like it’s a clear cut great trade vs making virtually the same trade to go up for a guy you have under contract for half the money and double the time, is pretty silly. 

 

Why didn’t the Bills go for Ngakue? No VALUE in trading a second round pick AND paying 20M a year.  The value of Diggs is a veteran presence, proven commodity at a reasonable contract vs his expected production, but in comparison to production, your whole argument is trash.

the Bills are 3-0 with Diggs.

 

the Vikings are 0-3 without Diggs. 
 

And you want to waste your time in order to argue about this with a fellow bills fan because he says it’s a great trade for the Bills?  It IS a clear cut great trade for the Bills. Diggs IS exactly what our unproven QB needed to become great.  What did Josh Allen achieve with Ceedee Lamb?  Nothing. It’s pretend.  It’s nonsense. Let’s talk about make believe 
 

Grab a joint and smoke it up my man.  You should chill the * out.  
 

 

 

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Hebert19]

That last catch was awesome.  He plays so much bigger than he is.  

[Royale with Cheese]

Diggs has brought an attitude to the Bills offense.  Its another’s huge benefit of his acquisition.

[MJS]

On 10/2/2020 at 8:29 AM, DCofNC said:

What part of overall value of a trade are you missing?  The first round pick and the money are the key components to all of this.  You want to get on Diggs nuts over 3 more catches than a rookie WR, but don’t want to acknowledge he is being paid 2x as much as is under contract for far less time?  Interesting.  Not surprised with the Homer attitude.  VALUE is more than 1 thing.  
 

If you want to look at the draft value chart, the Bills gave up about 930 draft value points to get Diggs, to go to 16 to take Lamb they needed 1000.  If that fourth rounder had been this years pick, you were already there, but you could have given up a 3rd round pick and that would have been it to go up.  So to recap, the Bills essentially gave up the 18th pick for Diggs.  So to sit in your ignorant high horse and act like it’s a clear cut great trade vs making virtually the same trade to go up for a guy you have under contract for half the money and double the time, is pretty silly. 

 

Why didn’t the Bills go for Ngakue? No VALUE in trading a second round pick AND paying 20M a year.  The value of Diggs is a veteran presence, proven commodity at a reasonable contract vs his expected production, but in comparison to production, your whole argument is trash.

I guess there is still someone on the planet who isn't praising the Bills for that trade. It has been an extremely successful trade.

 

You can trade up for whatever receiver you want. None of them are as good as Diggs. Diggs is a proven number 1. All those rookies are just rookies, and some of them will be busts.

 

And what are you taking about with contract length? Rookies are had for 4 years, 5 if you use the 5th year option. Diggs is under contract for 4 years. That's essentially the same length as a rookie contract.

 

If you don't think the trade for Diggs is a clear win, you are just an idiot. Homerism has nothing to do with it. Everyone outside of the organization has been praising the trade.

Edited October 5, 2020 by MJS

[Hapless Bills Fan]

16 hours ago, Hebert19 said:

That last catch was awesome.  He plays so much bigger than he is.  

 

Diggs impact on the team goes way beyond his catches.

 

I'm looking for it, but on Twitter someone put up a shot of Diggs on the sideline said to be after Allen went to the locker room.  He went right up to Matt Barkley and was calmly talking to him gesturing and looking at the Surface together.   It was clearly a "I'm here for you, we'll finish this thing together" message.  Very poised, very matter of fact.  The coach next to Barkley is nodding.  I know Stefon Diggs has an "I" in his name, but there doesn't seem to be an "I" in his demeanor.

 

Then there's the team's impact on Diggs.

Pay close attention here to the aftermath of Diggs long reception.  Two Raiders DB are yakking at Diggs (who probably started the yakking, Truth).  The second one gets in Diggs face and shoves him, possibly trying to incite a personal foul.  Brown gets right there in between Diggs and those players, pushing Diggs back and protecting his guy.

 

[Warcodered]

31 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Then there's the team's impact on Diggs.

Pay close attention here to the aftermath of Diggs long reception.  Two Raiders DB are yakking at Diggs (who probably started the yakking, Truth).  The second one gets in Diggs face and shoves him, possibly trying to incite a personal foul.  Brown gets right there in between Diggs and those players, pushing Diggs back and protecting his guy.

Yeah that was the human torpedo Abram seems kind of like a crazy person.

[NewEra]

I knew Diggs was a great WR.  
 

I didn’t know he was a top 5 WR in football.  I’d take him over Michael Thomas.  He’s a legit SUPER star.