LB48 Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Every NFL team is faced with the same situation this year with no opponent team scrimmages or pre-season games. Josh needs work on pocket presence, retreating backwards trying to escape a pass rush and a relatively slow release while reading a defense. Can these obvious negative attributes be corrected by basically playing catch with your receivers and a limited pass pressure from your teammates during this camp??? I hope maturity will help! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayray808 Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 I like what I have seen so far TBH. A good day at practice, followed by a bad day where the defense is collapsing on him, only to come back the following day improved. It's all we can ask for at this point figuring we have one of the best defenses in the league ?♂️ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB48 Posted August 25, 2020 Author Share Posted August 25, 2020 6 minutes ago, rayray808 said: I like what I have seen so far TBH. A good day at practice, followed by a bad day where the defense is collapsing on him, only to come back the following day improved. It's all we can ask for at this point figuring we have one of the best defenses in the league ?♂️ Yes - I agree. Just wish he got more work against other teams! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjt328 Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 I don't think it will make much difference. We usually do one scrimmage (which is no more than a glorified practice) against another team each year. And if you add up all of his normal preseason time, you are usually talking about one full game of action. Most mechanical improvements (like when Allen is working with Jordan Palmer) are made during offseason training, before the team even gets together. Training camp is more for physical conditioning, implementing the playbook, developing timing with teammates, etc. Preseason is for gradually getting into game speed. According to the reporters watching training camp, Allen's mechanics (especially on those deep throws) have looked cleaner from Day 1. Hopefully he doesn't slip back into old habits once the real bullets start flying, and the pressure is on. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 6 hours ago, LB48 said: Every NFL team is faced with the same situation this year with no opponent team scrimmages or pre-season games. Josh needs work on pocket presence, retreating backwards trying to escape a pass rush and a relatively slow release while reading a defense. Can these obvious negative attributes be corrected by basically playing catch with your receivers and a limited pass pressure from your teammates during this camp??? I hope maturity will help! He's very good at avoiding the rush and scrambling to make plays 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 No more than any other camps. He missed a day in camp. Is it disastrous? I don't think so. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulldog Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 No more effect on Josh Allen than any other NFL Player - everyone is in the same boat on this. The circumstances of this strange NFL Off-season are not unique to the Bills or Josh Allen. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaw66 Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 7 hours ago, LB48 said: Every NFL team is faced with the same situation this year with no opponent team scrimmages or pre-season games. Josh needs work on pocket presence, retreating backwards trying to escape a pass rush and a relatively slow release while reading a defense. Can these obvious negative attributes be corrected by basically playing catch with your receivers and a limited pass pressure from your teammates during this camp??? I hope maturity will help! Learning the position is cumulative. Reps, reps, more reps, film study, games, more reps, etc. So yes, Josh is missing something with reduced work. But he is still learning. I'm not too worried. If Josh jas what it takes, 2020 wont keep him from succeeding over his career. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 To put in context, guys like Joe Burrow, Tua, etc. have a much more difficult time. Allen has played two pre-seasons, amd two regular seasons, and a couple of years with Palmer in the off season. Does it stink, sure, but he’s going into his third year. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maynard Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Maybe some yes. The good thing is Josh is facing off against a top 5 D every day! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Don’t forget we also face the Jets, Dolphins, Rams, and Raiders to start the season so it’s not like we start with the Seahawks, 49ers, Chiefs, and Patriots. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Lol gotta love the preempting of excuses. The Bills defense mechanism is real Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 9 hours ago, LB48 said: Yes - I agree. Just wish he got more work against other teams! This could be said by a fan of any of the other guys from his class though--that's why ultimately I'm not that worried about it. Darnold, Mayfield & the rest are all operating within the same prep parameters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 He isn't a rookie. He knows how to play in games. Allen needs to improve his field awareness (reading the defense) and decision making. That comes from watching film, studying, and playing real games. I don't think playing a few series in preseason matters all that much for his development. Playing the REAL games is what will help him the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROCBillsBeliever Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 @LB48 : I think the more significant question is HOW MUCH the COVID training camp will set Josh back, versus other QB's. That's where McD and Beane, and the staff around the team play a major role. We have put together an incredibly adept staff, and they plan hard for a multitude of outcomes. Think back to the Wrecks-led joke of a staff we had a few years back... There are teams out there with Wrecks-like staffs (cough... cough... J-E-S-T-S)... Those are the teams whose QB's will be set back MORE than ours by the COVID camp. Go Bills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 no more than it would any other teams QB. Everyone is in the same boat. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 9 hours ago, LB48 said: Every NFL team is faced with the same situation this year with no opponent team scrimmages or pre-season games. Josh needs work on pocket presence, retreating backwards trying to escape a pass rush and a relatively slow release while reading a defense. Can these obvious negative attributes be corrected by basically playing catch with your receivers and a limited pass pressure from your teammates during this camp??? I hope maturity will help! How much of the covid did you drink? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 (edited) 9 hours ago, LB48 said: Every NFL team is faced with the same situation this year with no opponent team scrimmages or pre-season games. Josh needs work on pocket presence, retreating backwards trying to escape a pass rush and a relatively slow release while reading a defense. Can these obvious negative attributes be corrected by basically playing catch with your receivers and a limited pass pressure from your teammates during this camp??? I hope maturity will help! He potentially faces the best defense in the NFL every day...I am sure that helps. Games should be a lot easier. Edited August 25, 2020 by matter2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Isn't this the exact situation everybody was clamoring for when he entered the league. Don't rush him. He needs to sit back, learn, and work on fully ingraining his new mechanics. Without OTA's and the nation wide quarantine earlier in the year, all he could do was work on mechanics and footwork. Also, not playing 6 quarters over 4 pre-season games are 100% not setting Josh back at all. If it does, I think we have bigger issues. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWATeam Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 8 minutes ago, matter2003 said: He potentially faces the best defense in the NFL every day...I am sure that helps. Games should be a lot easier. This line of thinking is often parroted and makes sense, but why do teams with great D's often have subpar offenses? Shouldn't these great defenses make their O's better in practice? It's rare to see a team that excels at both. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Just now, SWATeam said: This line of thinking is often parroted and makes sense, but why do teams with great D's often have subpar offenses? Shouldn't these great defenses make their O's better in practice? It's rare to see a team that excels at both. Typically because they have a lot more salary cap $ tied up in the D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeTime101 Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 no. he practices regularly against an amazing defense that is there to compete butthere to help josh on decision making to.. no.. it does not hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rc2catch Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 The only thing holding josh back is mechanics and his footwork. He can get those reps in his backyard. Reading defenses and making adjustments is a lot of film work and maturity. This weird offseason shouldn’t have any different effects on his progression. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayray808 Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 hopefully Daboll is dialing up quick hitters to get the ball out of his hands to guys with YAC appeal - completion % will go up - the 300 yard passing game curse will be lifted 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwai San Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 5 minutes ago, rayray808 said: hopefully Daboll is dialing up quick hitters to get the ball out of his hands to guys with YAC appeal - completion % will go up - the 300 yard passing game curse will be lifted Once he gets past the 300yd curse methinks a lot of his issues will fade into the past...a whole ton load of people me included are hung up on that 300yd plus game. To me once he gets to that level he will hopefully stop overthinking things are it will be more organic for him..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 10 hours ago, LB48 said: Every NFL team is faced with the same situation this year with no opponent team scrimmages or pre-season games. Josh needs work on pocket presence, retreating backwards trying to escape a pass rush and a relatively slow release while reading a defense. Can these obvious negative attributes be corrected by basically playing catch with your receivers and a limited pass pressure from your teammates during this camp??? I hope maturity will help! Uhhhhh, no. The preseason means nothing for Allen. He faces one of the NFL's 3 best defenses in practice every single day. He'll be just fine when the regular season bullets start flying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Maybe a little. There is probably some value of camp and practice but he really will only learn when the games are real and at full speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 (edited) 32 minutes ago, H2o said: Uhhhhh, no. The preseason means nothing for Allen. He faces one of the NFL's 3 best defenses in practice every single day. He'll be just fine when the regular season bullets start flying. Reps matter. Reps against your team's defense; reps against another team's defense; reps against different styles of defense; reps in a game day setting with fans. Will he be fine? Maybe, but the preseason definitely does matter. Edited August 25, 2020 by JoshAllenHasBigHands 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: Reps matter. Reps against your team's defense; reps against another team's defense; reps against different styles of defense; reps in a game day setting with fans. Will he be fine? Maybe, but the preseason definitely does matter. How many reps does a team's Franchise QB usually get in the preseason? Maybe one full game's worth? 4 quarters of football in a meaningless setting is really not going to do much for him. Also, with McDermott being the defensive mind he is, I'm sure he has our defenses simulating other teams' concepts used previously that caused Josh issues. He's not taking the hits he typically would with a normal preseason slate, but I surely believe they are preparing him for what he will face down the road to the best of their abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 1 minute ago, H2o said: How many reps does a team's Franchise QB usually get in the preseason? Maybe one full game's worth? 4 quarters of football in a meaningless setting is really not going to do much for him. Also, with McDermott being the defensive mind he is, I'm sure he has our defenses simulating other teams' concepts used previously that caused Josh issues. He's not taking the hits he typically would with a normal preseason slate, but I surely believe they are preparing him for what he will face down the road to the best of their abilities. Thats like 60 to 70 reps. How much better (or more comfortable) are you after 60 to 70 reps? And its 4 games of preparation, even if he is only playing a quarters worth of snaps. Being at the stadium at a certain time, preparing your body in a certain way, getting your routine right. It changes the dynamic of the game. Sure, McDermott can simulate other teams. But he does it with the same guys Allen practiced against all month. Guys that have tendencies that Allen is intimately familiar with. And, super important, Allen isn't getting hit. He is the first to tell people that he doesn't feel comfortable in a game until he gets hit. It definitely matters. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: Thats like 60 to 70 reps. How much better (or more comfortable) are you after 60 to 70 reps? And its 4 games of preparation, even if he is only playing a quarters worth of snaps. Being at the stadium at a certain time, preparing your body in a certain way, getting your routine right. It changes the dynamic of the game. Sure, McDermott can simulate other teams. But he does it with the same guys Allen practiced against all month. Guys that have tendencies that Allen is intimately familiar with. And, super important, Allen isn't getting hit. He is the first to tell people that he doesn't feel comfortable in a game until he gets hit. It definitely matters. We'll just agree to disagree. I have full confidence in our staff to get him prepared for the regular season and I believe that the missed preseason this year doesn't hinder his development in any way. Edited August 25, 2020 by H2o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 23 minutes ago, Kwai San said: Once he gets past the 300yd curse methinks a lot of his issues will fade into the past...a whole ton load of people me included are hung up on that 300yd plus game. To me once he gets to that level he will hopefully stop overthinking things are it will be more organic for him..... What does a 300 yard game in a loss prove? There is zero correlation between 300 yard passing games and wins. Give me 225 yards, no interceptions, and a win. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warcodered Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Ethan in Portland said: What does a 300 yard game in a loss prove? There is zero correlation between 300 yard passing games and wins. Give me 225 yards, no interceptions, and a win. Right at this point the only reason I want him to hit 300 in a game is so people will shut up about it.. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 It kind of doesn’t matter as there is nothing that can be done about it for all 32 starting QB’s are dealing with the same problem. Even 20 year veterans like Brady, Rivers of 17 years are on new teams. Rookie QB’s are going to be most challenged as their first pro football snap is in their first real game. Then there are QB’s that have little if any coordination with these shiny new rookie WR’s. At least Allen is very used to Brown, Beasley, Singletary, Knox, and he has a two time 1000 yard pro the last two years in Diggs. Enough the building in of excuses by a few. The glass is half full not empty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 16 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: Thats like 60 to 70 reps. How much better (or more comfortable) are you after 60 to 70 reps? And its 4 games of preparation, even if he is only playing a quarters worth of snaps. Being at the stadium at a certain time, preparing your body in a certain way, getting your routine right. It changes the dynamic of the game. Sure, McDermott can simulate other teams. But he does it with the same guys Allen practiced against all month. Guys that have tendencies that Allen is intimately familiar with. And, super important, Allen isn't getting hit. He is the first to tell people that he doesn't feel comfortable in a game until he gets hit. It definitely matters. I think you are both correct. The reps and the preparation have some value. But the value is minimal compared to regular season experience. And I'd argue that practice reps when working on a particular play or skill are far far more important than anything done in pre-season. Nobody would argue pro-bowl reps are of value and the same goes for meaningless preseason games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Yes. We should start Barkley all year. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 No more than any other 3rd year player imo. Not that the additional reps are not important, but I believe that Josh will get past it by the end of the day tomorrow, he will handle it just fine. Go Bills!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 Game 1 against the Jets will be our preseason game. Their 2 best defensive players are gone. It's a perfect game to start a weird season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 34 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said: I think you are both correct. The reps and the preparation have some value. But the value is minimal compared to regular season experience. And I'd argue that practice reps when working on a particular play or skill are far far more important than anything done in pre-season. Nobody would argue pro-bowl reps are of value and the same goes for meaningless preseason games. Except coaches, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted August 25, 2020 Share Posted August 25, 2020 12 hours ago, LB48 said: Yes - I agree. Just wish he got more work against other teams! TBH I think the "work against other teams" aspect of preseason games is overrated. Most teams don't game-plan on either offense or defense. Stars and established vets don't want to get hurt and start the season on IR, so there's a little edge taken off. Rookies have commented how it ratchets up between preseason and regular season games. I think preseason games may actually give coaches and younger players a false sense of security - as when Peterman (and the coaches) thought he could make those throws based on preseason, but at actual regular season game speed, he couldn't. Hopefully they'll have come up with some way to simulate game speed and get Josh focused on the time frame where he needs to make a decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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