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2018 QB Redraft. - PFF Says Allen should have went as the 4th QB

MAJBobby

By MAJBobby
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OldTimeAFLGuy Hall of Famer

OldTimeAFLGuy

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1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

This is wrong but I’m not surprised from the website that believes Duck Hodges is the better player. 

 

...maybe we should wait until year 2 and/or 3 until we crown Lamar the next "Brady + +"..............not a chance he could be the next RG II 1/8 or Kaep that DC's figured out.....

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Kirby Jackson
Kirby Jackson

This is wrong but I’m not surprised from the website that believes Duck Hodges is the better player. 

whatdrought
whatdrought

No. They're not. Allen would be the second QB off the board after Jackson. Easily. He has fixed a ton of the issues that people worried about, and he's shown the sky high upside that had him damn clos

Casey D
Casey D

Nobody takes Mayfield and Darnold over Allen unless there is an ax to grind.  No one.

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SCBills All Pro

SCBills

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I don’t really know many Bills fans who would rather have Baker or Sam... 

 

I know, read, hear a lot of Browns and Jets fans who would rather have Allen.  
 

That’s really all that matters.  Not some analytic site that determined Duck Hodges was the best QB in the Steelers/Bills game. 

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Wayne Arnold Veteran

Wayne Arnold

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1 hour ago, Albany,n.y. said:

We fired Roman in-season.  It's funny how the OC is always the most unpopular guy in Buffalo, yet a few have left & found success elsewhere (and even a Super Bowl ring like Kevin "Killdrive") .  

 

1 hour ago, Not at the table Karlos said:

He did take a long time to get plays to the huddle but his offense was good. Funny how we scored 30 something points that game and the defense gave up more so we fired the OC.

 

“We” didn’t fire Roman. Rex Ryan did because the two of them couldn’t get along.

 

Roman’s offense was the only thing keeping the team’s head above water. Maybe Rex was jealous/threatened.

29 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

I'm not listening to the singer from Warrant discussing football

199.jpg

 

She’d be pretty if she waxed her upper lip.

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whatdrought All Pro

whatdrought

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1 hour ago, matter2003 said:

 

This is the problem with relying solely on analytics/grading each play and not actually watching what happens in the game in its entirety. with being worthless *****. 

 

 

Fixed it for ya.

 

PFF uses stats for part of what they do, then they get into subjective grey matter that is complete and utter bullshite and is full of their opinion. They do this from a place of arrogance and idiocy that fully encapsulates the millennial mind in sports analysis. 

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Kirby Jackson Hall of Famer

Kirby Jackson

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22 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...maybe we should wait until year 2 and/or 3 until we crown Lamar the next "Brady + +"..............not a chance he could be the next RG II 1/8 or Kaep that DC's figured out.....

He’s a runaway MVP. We should give him the respect that he deserves. He should be 1 and it shouldn’t be close.

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H2o Hall of Famer

H2o

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2 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-re-drafting-the-2018-quarterback-class

 

4. JOSH ALLEN

Unlike some others on this list, Allen has seen his arrow point decidedly upward from year one to year two, and he's deservedly moved up our rankings over the past two seasons. His underneath and intermediate accuracy has seen a considerable bump year on year. Only 7.9% of his passes that were targeted 1-19 yards downfield were charted as perfectly placed last season, but this year, that number is 20.4% — higher than anyone else in the 2018 quarterback class. His accuracy, combined with his playmaking ability with his legs, has been a massive value-add to the Bills' offense — especially in the red zone.

The worrisome thing is that Allen has still never been able to truly open up the offense as a passer. In 26 career starts, he’s never had a single 300-yard passing game. A big reason why is the lack of big plays, as his deep-ball accuracy has been all over the place this season. Despite his improved play, Allen has fewer big-time throws this year (13) than he did even a year ago (17), and the former ranks 26th among all quarterbacks in the NFL this year. He’s only completed 26.9% of his targets 20-plus yards downfield — the fourth-worst in the NFL — and that’s the opposite of what you’d expect for a player with that kind of arm strength.

 

 

PFF employees on the way to work.

 

B000I9U792_Radio_UXSY1._V142676556_SX1080_.jpg

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CorkScrewHill Veteran

CorkScrewHill

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I think this is fair. The problem is that you are drafting guys on what they will/can be not what they are today. That’s why Josh went in the top 10. 2 years in there is no reason to believe that the future of Baker or Darnold is brighter than that of Josh. Talent evaluators would absolutely roll the dice on the upside of Josh at this point before more established players.

I think the best way to look at this is would a QB needy team willingly give up a top 5 pick in the draft for these QBs. Lamar - yes, Josh Allen - yes, Darnold probably, Baker - someone might but his lack of maturity two years in would give pause ... Rosen and Rudolph ... maybe a 4th or a 5th rounder. I look at what coaches and players say and don’t say about a player...Josh’s teammates talk about him being a future superstar ... 

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John Adams All Pro

John Adams

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2 minutes ago, CorkScrewHill said:

I think the best way to look at this is would a QB needy team willingly give up a top 5 pick for these QBs. Lamar - yes, Josh Allen - yes, Darnold probably, Baker - someone might but his lack of maturity two years in would give pause ... Rosen and Rudolph ... maybe a 4th or a 5th. I look at what coaches and players say and don’t say about a player...Josh’s teammates talk about him being a future superstar ... 

 

Baker is getting a 1st for sure. 

 

Baker is probably more highly thought of than Josh by most people. 

 

As far as the underlined, do you expect them to say he sucks? 

Edited by John Adams
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Pine Barrens Mafia Hall of Famer

Pine Barrens Mafia

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1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

Mayfield had a legitimately excellent rookie season. He has had a down year this season, but it's way too soon to tell. The coaching situation there is a complete sh*tshow, so I'd hold off on drawing any grand conclusions yet.

 

 

And yet you have no problems with grand conclusions here, odd.

 

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dave mcbride Hall of Famer

dave mcbride

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Just now, Joe in Winslow said:

 

And yet you have no problems with grand conclusions here, odd.

 

I don't know what your point is or even what you're referring to. I haven't drawn *any* grand conclusions about *any* of these players. Why the hostility anyway? What's the point of that?

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Pine Barrens Mafia Hall of Famer

Pine Barrens Mafia

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Just now, dave mcbride said:

I don't know what your point is or even what you're referring to. I haven't drawn *any* grand conclusions about *any* of these players. Why the hostility anyway? What's the point of that?

 

Why the hostility? Lotta stupid takes on Allen around these parts.

 

A LOT of stupid takes. If you're not one that has them, then you have my apologies.

 

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dave mcbride Hall of Famer

dave mcbride

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Just now, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Why the hostility? Lotta stupid takes on Allen around these parts.

 

A LOT of stupid takes. If you're not one that has them, then you have my apologies.

 

??? I *like* Allen. I criticize certain aspects of his game, for sure, but I believe he can improve and certainly has the talent to do so. He's only 23! 

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Pine Barrens Mafia Hall of Famer

Pine Barrens Mafia

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1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

??? I *like* Allen. I criticize certain aspects of his game, for sure, but I believe he can improve and certainly has the talent to do so. He's only 23! 


That's where I'm at, mostly.

 

Young kid, IMPROVING kid.

 

And yet, there's MASSIVE hostility among fans toward him.

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CorkScrewHill Veteran

CorkScrewHill

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4 minutes ago, John Adams said:

 

Baker is getting a 1st for sure. 

 

Baker is probably more highly thought of than Josh by most people. 

 

As far as the underlined, do you expect them to say he sucks? 

I do not expect them to say he sucks ... but they do not say the generic things .. they go out of their way to discuss his future greatness. I did not see that with Rosen in either of his locals and saw that withBaker last year .. but not this year. I think you are misunderstanding what I stated. I was referring to giving up a top 5 pick in the draft .. I agree you could get a first for Baker ..but not necessarily one of the top 5 picks.

 

Btw - for those of you have not taken a vow of celibacy as it relates to PFF ... they have a really good and I think fair analysis of the Bills offense here. Definitely worth a read. https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-how-the-buffalo-bills-built-a-winning-offense

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JoPoy88 Veteran

JoPoy88

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Disagree with their placement - Allen would the 2nd 2018 QB in my mind, not 4th (or 3rd if you still have faith in Mayfield I suppose.) But I do think their evaluation in the OP’s post is fair enough. Credit is given (as it should be) to Allen’s underneath and intermediate accuracy. The problem remains his accuracy on long passes. 

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Phil The Thrill Veteran

Phil The Thrill

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1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

Mayfield had a legitimately excellent rookie season. He has had a down year this season, but it's way too soon to tell. The coaching situation there is a complete sh*tshow, so I'd hold off on drawing any grand conclusions yet.

There were plenty here who ripped him. I recall it well. We could have Alexander the Great as our OC and a decent segment of Bills fans would still blame everything on him. 


Maybe I am projecting my own thoughts because I thought Roman was doing a good job.  Sure the opening game vs Baltimore was disgusting but I think a lot of that was Tyrod’s fault.  
 

I was at the Bills vs NYJ Thursday night home opener.  People were pissed the Bills lost but hardly anyone faulted Roman.  Many people were mad that Rex’s defense was owned and that our “lockdown” corners of Stephon Gilmore and Ron Darby could defend against Brandon Marshall, Eric Decker and Wuincy Enunwa.

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JMF2006 Veteran

JMF2006

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3 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-re-drafting-the-2018-quarterback-class

 

4. JOSH ALLEN

Unlike some others on this list, Allen has seen his arrow point decidedly upward from year one to year two, and he's deservedly moved up our rankings over the past two seasons. His underneath and intermediate accuracy has seen a considerable bump year on year. Only 7.9% of his passes that were targeted 1-19 yards downfield were charted as perfectly placed last season, but this year, that number is 20.4% — higher than anyone else in the 2018 quarterback class. His accuracy, combined with his playmaking ability with his legs, has been a massive value-add to the Bills' offense — especially in the red zone.

The worrisome thing is that Allen has still never been able to truly open up the offense as a passer. In 26 career starts, he’s never had a single 300-yard passing game. A big reason why is the lack of big plays, as his deep-ball accuracy has been all over the place this season. Despite his improved play, Allen has fewer big-time throws this year (13) than he did even a year ago (17), and the former ranks 26th among all quarterbacks in the NFL this year. He’s only completed 26.9% of his targets 20-plus yards downfield — the fourth-worst in the NFL — and that’s the opposite of what you’d expect for a player with that kind of arm strength.

 

 

 

I hate crap like this.

 

Only 2QB's in that draft class have their team in the playoffs right now.

 

I bet the Browns wish they had drafted JA.

 

Glad he fell to us he is the perfect fit for Buffalo ,smart . tough, charismatic, rifle arm, athletic. natural leadership ability.

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DCOrange Veteran

DCOrange

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I think I'd probably put Allen #2, but 2-4 is pretty debatable IMO. Lamar is clearly #1 and Rosen/Rudolph are clearly #5 and #6.

 

It's kinda bizarre how much worse Baker has looked this season; seems like he desperately needs the offseason to begin so he can take some time away and just mentally regroup. He's still a very talented passer but he picked up some bad habits this season and it's really hurt his play. Still, Cleveland's offense has outproduced our own, though it's probably mostly due to the play of Chubb.

 

I think Darnold has played very well this season on the whole. The Patriots game was an absolute disaster, but beyond that, he's been good and has flashed pretty routinely.

 

Altogether, I remain pretty high on the top 4 with Lamar being a distant #1.

 

I was never very high on Rosen/Rudolph and obviously they haven't done anything to this point to prove me wrong.

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Pokebball Veteran

Pokebball

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3 hours ago, whatdrought said:

 

No. They're not. Allen would be the second QB off the board after Jackson. Easily. He has fixed a ton of the issues that people worried about, and he's shown the sky high upside that had him damn close to going #1 to begin with.

Yeah, this is where I went, and immediately.  One could argue a case for Baker, but Allen would have definitely been drafted ahead of Sam.

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Pokebball Veteran

Pokebball

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I'm looking forward to the "re order" of this class' QBs at the end of year three...and year four...and year five...

 

I can understand articles like this in the down season, but dang, we're heading into the playoffs!  OK, perhaps this article is for Baker, Sam and the other Josh :) 

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billsbackto81 Veteran

billsbackto81

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Posted

Even after seeing what Jackson has become so far in Baltimore it's still way to early to decide which will have the better career. It's not matter of their talent so much as to what's around them. Jackson and Allen have had the benefit of superior coaching and a competent front office.

Darnold and Mayfield are subjected to horrible coaching,  management and diva entitled players at every turn.

 

 

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Pokebball Veteran

Pokebball

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Posted
1 hour ago, John Adams said:

 

Baker is getting a 1st for sure. 

 

Baker is probably more highly thought of than Josh by most people. 

 

As far as the underlined, do you expect them to say he sucks? 

All I hear about out here in the Rockies anymore is LJ and JA.  My son lives in Seattle and he says the same thing.

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dakrider RFA

dakrider

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I think if given a chance to repeat, Cleveland, NY and  Buffalo would still all take Mayfield, Darnold and Allen, respectively.   I don't think none of these teams regret their QB choice.  Arizona obviously would not taken Rosen though, I don't know if they would rather have Jackson now or not?  The other big difference would be Jackson would not have fallen to Baltimore as someone would have taken him.   Indy would likely have grabbed him at #6 knowing what they know now.  

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