What we didn't see in the Bills 2-0 start

[Inigo Montoya]

When the national sports media talks about the Bills starting 2-0, they all point out that the two wins were against the Jets and the Giants and that neither team is any good.  To be fair, it's a valid point.  The Jets and Giants do look woeful right now.  That's what they see.  I see something different in these two victories.

 

As a long suffering Bill's fan who has watched this team wandering in the desert for 20 years, what the national sports media has clearly missed is that in years past I have no doubt that the Bills would have come out of these first two games with a record of 1-1.  I have no doubt that the "old Bills" would have found a way to lose one of these two road games. We all know what we saw during these last two games, but what is even more important that what we saw in those two victories, is what we didn't see in those victories.   

 

We didn't see stupid penalties twenty yards away from the ball negate big plays over and over again.

 

We didn't see a QB and offense that turned the ball over 4 times, gave up a Pick-6 and a safety, and not score a single point in the first half,  just implode and collapse.

 

We didn't see that fourth quarter comeback drive fall just a little bit short...

 

We didn't see questionable coaching decisions and horrible clock management cost the team late in the game.

 

We didn't see some late game special teams collapse, a late TD / punt return, or missed field goal cost us a game.

 

We didn't see Bills players yelling at each other and standing around looking dejected on the sidelines when things went against them.

 

We didn't see a QB who looked over his head and playing simply not to lose the game.

 

We didn't see a blown coverage on defense or a missed tackle give up a last minute touchdown snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

 

Sure it was just the Jets and the Giants, but the thing that impressed me most is not what the Jets and Giants brought to MetLife these last two weeks, but what the Bills didn't bring.  They didn't bring all the dysfunction that has sabotaged winnable games over and over again for the last 20 years.  If the Bills can just continue to get the hell out of their own way, they have enough talent on this roster to be playing football well into January this season.

 

 

Edited September 19, 2019 by Inigo Montoya

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

Good points. Agreed re lack of penalties and ST blunders. That’s due to better talent and coaching. 

[ProcessYaDigg]

I think the biggest point here is that, we won games that we're supposed to win.  Yes, these are the 2 bottom of the barrel teams, so we won them like we're supposed to.  As you mentioned, we would've normally imploded.  But we're closing out games, which is something we haven't seen in a long time.

[Bob in STL]

What the National media says and thinks is not important.  Winning games is.    I have never heard New England apologize for their schedule.   

 

IF the Bills can beat the Bengals on Sunday we will be 3-0 and their opponents could potentially be a combined 0-9.   

 

We play the schedule we are given.  Tough games are coming.  What the media says does not change the standings.  

Edited September 20, 2019 by Bob in STL

[SoCal Deek]

I think a big factor is that virtually everyone who wandered through that desert are now gone. While I was concerned about dumping Shady, in the end it means the offensive huddle is completely new. Josh Allen doesn’t know anything about collapsing. He doesn’t know he’s not supposed to win these games and I think the fact that Coach McD got to the playoffs in Year One suggests that he doesn’t Harbor those losing memories either. The fans do...but the new Bills don’t.

[billsfan1959]

13 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

When the national sports media talks about the Bills starting 2-0, they all point out that the two wins were against the Jets and the Giants and that neither team is any good. 

What I find interesting is that those same pundits do not qualify their statements about Lamar Jackson and the Ravens who have played, statistically, the two worst defenses in the NFL. - or really making those same qualifying statements about many other QBs/teams.

 

The Bills just need to continue winning and those things will probably change.

[PromoTheRobot]

7 minutes ago, Circlethewagon8404 said:

I think the biggest point here is that, we won games that we're supposed to win.  Yes, these are the 2 bottom of the barrel teams, so we won them like we're supposed to.  As you mentioned, we would've normally imploded.  But we're closing out games, which is something we haven't seen in a long time.

 

Actually the Jets were favored by slightly more than half the experts week 1. They suck know because we came back on them.

 

The biggest thing I see is confidence. This is a confident team, even when playing from behind, which they've done twice now. This week I'd like to see them take a lead and drive it to the end.

[Patrick Duffy]

Thing is that same media stayed on the Jets nut sack the whole offseason about how improved they were going to be. The Bills beat them with their starting QB and all their players that this same media hyped up so much. Now they say they suck, yes maybe now they will have some problems with their QB down.

 

But that was not the case before, they only lost Mosley late in the game. The Jets are a solid team IMO when Darnold is healthy, however I like most people I question the Gase hire. Either way the Jets were no push over when the Bills played them.

Edited September 19, 2019 by Patrick_Duffy

[Protocal69]

16 minutes ago, Bob in STL said:

What the National media says and thinks is not important.  Winning games is.    I have never heard New England apologize for their schedule.   

 

IF the Bills can beat the Bengals on a Sunday we will be 3-0 and are opponents could potentially be a combined 0-9.   

 

We play the schedule we are given.  Tough games are coming.  What the media says does not change the standings.  

Right.Its early but the PATS " havent played anyone yet" Pitt only scored 3 pts and they played the dolphins, and this week they are going to play the JETS JV squad

[billsfan1959]

29 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Actually the Jets were favored by slightly more than half the experts week 1. They suck now because we came back on them.

 

The biggest thing I see is confidence. This is a confident team, even when playing from behind, which they've done twice now. This week I'd like to see them take a lead and drive it to the end.

Right. Actually, after two weeks, the Jets defense has a DVOA ranking of 6th (6th passing, 11th rushing). Not exactly in the "completely suck" category.

Edited September 19, 2019 by billsfan1959

[BillsFanSD]

The Jets suck now, because they're starting some random third-string QB who they signed off the street.  They didn't suck when we played them.  Not that they're a SB team with Darnold or anything, but that was a quality win in my book.

 

By way of contrast, New England has beaten a Pittsburgh team that looks devoid of offense, and a Miami team that shows promise of being the worst NFL team since the merger.  

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

I’d like to add for the past two decades it seemed like opposing teams would at least once per game have some guy wide open for huge pass play on busted coverage or scheme gap. 

 

my my brother and I always wondered why that never happens for the Bills.  

 

Happened 3 times already this season at least and josh found them. 

 

 

Edited September 19, 2019 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[Rock'em Sock'em]

24 minutes ago, Circlethewagon8404 said:

these are the 2 bottom of the barrel teams

 

Certainly true now, but also: 

NYJ were a different team when we played them.  The Bills coupled with Darnold's mono may have made them into a bottom of the barrel team.

NYG had the #1 offense in the preseason and put up 450+ yards at Dallas.  The Bills held them to under 400 yards in their home opener and now Eli is benched.

 

[MrSarcasm]

I'd like to see some accuracy from Allen. 65% accuracy just doesn't cut it in this league. 

 

?

[US Egg]

"What we didn't see in the Bills 2-0 start"

 

Bills opposing starting QB's not starting their next game ?

 

(Andy Dalton, you have been warned !)

[MrSarcasm]

44 minutes ago, Rock'em Sock'em said:

 

Certainly true now, but also: 

NYJ were a different team when we played them.  The Bills coupled with Darnold's mono may have made them into a bottom of the barrel team.

NYG had the #1 offense in the preseason and put up 450+ yards at Dallas.  The Bills held them to under 400 yards in their home opener and now Eli is benched.

 

 

 

NJJ

NJG

-Fixed-

 

?

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, MrSarcasm said:

I'd like to see some accuracy from Allen. 65% accuracy just doesn't cut it in this league. 

 

?

 

Iits impossibile for him to have 65% accuracy.  I read it in an anytics site. 

 

 

https://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/2019/05/i-do-not-see-a-nfl-starting-qb-in-buffalo-bills-josh-allen-says-espns-aaron-schatz.html

 

Aaron Schatz is getting exposed as a total fraud.. 

Edited September 19, 2019 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[BADOLBILZ]

36 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Iits impossibile for him to have 65% accuracy.  I read it in an anytics site. 

 

 

https://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/2019/05/i-do-not-see-a-nfl-starting-qb-in-buffalo-bills-josh-allen-says-espns-aaron-schatz.html

 

Aaron Schatz is getting exposed as a total fraud.. 

 

 

Bill Polian said Lamar Jackson should switch to WR.    He is HOF as a personnel man.    

 

Just saying  there might be some gray area between having a bad take and being "a total fraud".

 

I haven't let the detractors of Allen affect my opinion.........I see talent and progress that I like a lot but still obvious concerns with things like ball placement/accuracy(for instance you really can't miss John Brown by f'n 25 feet on that deep post with no pressure in the pocket).........but then again I don't have to write about and evaluate every NFL player for a living so I don't need to take a short cut when forming an opinion on him.

[Foxx]

McD should be a coach of the year candidate.

[Rocket94]

2 hours ago, Bob in STL said:

What the National media says and thinks is not important.  Winning games is.    I have never heard New England apologize for their schedule.   

 

IF the Bills can beat the Bengals on a Sunday we will be 3-0 and are opponents could potentially be a combined 0-9.   

 

We play the schedule we are given.  Tough games are coming.  What the media says does not change the standings.  

I never hear New England apologize about anything. They were throwing long drives and bombs at the Dolphins long after the game was out of reach.

[DC Tom]

2 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

I never hear New England apologize about anything. 

 

Cheating, for example.

 

Hard to believe Brady's first child is 12 years old this year.  Wonder what Gisele thinks of that?

[SCBills]

I'll take early season games against teams that aren't good because this Bills team should only get better as the season goes on. 

 

Ed Oliver should only get better in the middle of this DL. 

 

Our fairly talented OL should get better each game, as they gel together.

 

Our ultra-talented QB should only get better as this is only his second season.

 

Every team faces injuries, but we have legit depth at almost every position and will be getting our All-Pro Kick/Punt Returner back soon, along with Tyler Kroft providing a veteran pass catching TE presence as a guy like Dawson Knox grows into his role.

 

*Nvm on Kroft.  It’s the Knox/Sweeney show now. 

 

Edited September 19, 2019 by SCBills

[CLTbills]

5 hours ago, Circlethewagon8404 said:

I think the biggest point here is that, we won games that we're supposed to win.  Yes, these are the 2 bottom of the barrel teams, so we won them like we're supposed to.  As you mentioned, we would've normally imploded.  But we're closing out games, which is something we haven't seen in a long time.

Another thing that I didn't see is the Bills playing down to the quality of their opponent. 

 

Fluky turnovers not withstanding, the Bills thoroughly outplayed both teams. The Jets game is a bit weird, again because of fluky turnovers, but we dominated them up and down the field in every phase of the game. Hell, we gave them four extra chances through weird bounces. 

 

The Bills of old would have played down to the level/quality of their opponent.

Edited September 19, 2019 by CLTbills

[Shaw66]

2 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

When the national sports media talks about the Bills starting 2-0, they all point out that the two wins were against the Jets and the Giants and that neither team is any good.  To be fair, it's a valid point.  The Jets and Giants do look woeful right now.  That's what they see.  I see something different in these two victories.

 

As a long suffering Bill's fan who has watched this team wandering in the desert for 20 years, what the national sports media has clearly missed is that in years past I have no doubt that the Bills would have come out of these first two games with a record of 1-1.  I have no doubt that the "old Bills" would have found a way to lose one of these two road games. We all know what we saw during these last two games, but what is even more important that what we saw in these two victories, is what we didn't see in those victories.   

 

We didn't see ridiculous penalties twenty yards away from the ball negate big plays over and over again.

 

We didn't see a QB and offense that turned the ball over 4 times, gave up a Pick-6 and a safety, and not score a single point in the first half,  just implode and collapse.

 

We didn't see that fourth quarter comeback drive fall just a little bit short...

 

We didn't see terrible coaching decisions and horrid clock management cost the team late in the game.

 

We didn't see some late game special teams collapse, a late TD / punt return, or missed field goal cost us a game.

 

We didn't see Bills players yelling at each other and standing around looking dejected on the sidelines when things went against them.

 

We didn't see a QB who looked over his head and playing simply not to lose the game.

 

We didn't see a late game blown coverage on defense or missed tackle give up a last minute touchdown snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

 

Sure it was just the Jets and the Giants, but the thing that impressed me most is not what the Jets and Giants brought to MetLife these last two weeks, but what the Bills didn't bring.  They didn't bring all the dysfunction that has sabotaged winnable games over and over again for the last 20 years.  If the Bills can just continue to get the hell out of their own way, they have enough talent on this roster to be playing football well into January this season.

 

 

These are great points.  Thanks.

 

Everything is different.   It's like we were looking in the mirror and then stepped through it into an alternative universe.   Through the looking glass. 

[Rocket94]

16 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

 

Cheating, for example.

 

Hard to believe Brady's first child is 12 years old this year.  Wonder what Gisele thinks of that?

All she has to do is tune in to an episode of Blue Bloods! I think Bridgette Moynihan is prettier.

Edited September 19, 2019 by Rocket94

[Nanker]

We haven't seen The Bills totally dominate their opponent yet.

Then again, we haven't seen The Bills be totally dominated by their opponent yet.

We haven't seen Josh air it out for a full game.

We haven't seen a truly dominant run game by The Bills... yet.

We haven't seen gross time clock mismanagement. 

They control their own destiny.

 

Go Bills! 

 

[DrDawkinstein]

2 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

When the national sports media talks about the Bills starting 2-0, they all point out that the two wins were against the Jets and the Giants and that neither team is any good.  To be fair, it's a valid point.  The Jets and Giants do look woeful right now.  That's what they see.  I see something different in these two victories.

 

As a long suffering Bill's fan who has watched this team wandering in the desert for 20 years, what the national sports media has clearly missed is that in years past I have no doubt that the Bills would have come out of these first two games with a record of 1-1.  I have no doubt that the "old Bills" would have found a way to lose one of these two road games. We all know what we saw during these last two games, but what is even more important that what we saw in these two victories, is what we didn't see in those victories.   

 

We didn't see ridiculous penalties twenty yards away from the ball negate big plays over and over again.

 

We didn't see a QB and offense that turned the ball over 4 times, gave up a Pick-6 and a safety, and not score a single point in the first half,  just implode and collapse.

 

We didn't see that fourth quarter comeback drive fall just a little bit short...

 

We didn't see terrible coaching decisions and horrid clock management cost the team late in the game.

 

We didn't see some late game special teams collapse, a late TD / punt return, or missed field goal cost us a game.

 

We didn't see Bills players yelling at each other and standing around looking dejected on the sidelines when things went against them.

 

We didn't see a QB who looked over his head and playing simply not to lose the game.

 

We didn't see a late game blown coverage on defense or missed tackle give up a last minute touchdown snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

 

Sure it was just the Jets and the Giants, but the thing that impressed me most is not what the Jets and Giants brought to MetLife these last two weeks, but what the Bills didn't bring.  They didn't bring all the dysfunction that has sabotaged winnable games over and over again for the last 20 years.  If the Bills can just continue to get the hell out of their own way, they have enough talent on this roster to be playing football well into January this season.

 

 

 

All very good points, and I am always leaning toward optimism... but there were some things that happened in the first 2 games that WILL sink us against better teams (namely, the PATS)

 

When we got the ball back with 1:49 left in the first half, and two timeouts, that should have been a scoring drive that at the very least ended with us kicking a FG as time expired.

 

Instead, we ran 3 botched plays, stopped the clock, and Punted the ball back to the Giants with 1:32 remaining. That WILL cost us the game against the Patriots who would use that time to move down the field and get points before halftime.

 

Plenty to tighten up, but I agree overall, we seem to be a much better team as it pertains to the details and what should be irrelevant stuff that can sink a team.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

48 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Bill Polian said Lamar Jackson should switch to WR.    He is HOF as a personnel man.    

 

Just saying  there might be some gray area between having a bad take and being "a total fraud".

 

I haven't let the detractors of Allen affect my opinion.........I see talent and progress that I like a lot but still obvious concerns with things like ball placement/accuracy(for instance you really can't miss John Brown by f'n 25 feet on that deep post with no pressure in the pocket).........but then again I don't have to write about and evaluate every NFL player for a living so I don't need to take a short cut when forming an opinion on him.

 

I watched Aaron Rodgers miss the same throw just in the past two weeks.  Guess there are still a lot of questions on whether he’s a franchise guy.

 

the analytics college to pro qbase projection is rubish.  They just categorized QBs in the pros that are good and then made a model that fit collegiate performance.  It’s not predictive. The model is trash. There are other examples too. 

Edited September 19, 2019 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[yungmack]

3 hours ago, billsfan1959 said:

What I find interesting is that those same pundits do not qualify their statements about Lamar Jackson and the Ravens who have played, statistically, the two worst defenses in the NFL. - or really making those same qualifying statements about many other QBs/teams.

 

The Bills just need to continue winning and those things will probably change.

FTR, I have heard commentators on multiple shows make exactly that point.

[Mr. WEO]

"solid competition"

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

I watched Aaron Rodgers miss the same throw just in the past two weeks.  Guess there are still a lot of questions on whether he’s a franchise guy.

 

the analytics college to pro qbase projection is rubish.  They just categorized QBs in the pros that are good and then made a model that fit collegiate performance.  It’s not predictive. The model is trash. There are other examples too. 

 

 

I missed him overthrowing an unobstructed receiver by nearly 10 yards but there is also this:

 

Aaron Rodgers 62 career 300 yard passing games.

 

Josh Allen 0 career 300 yard passing games.

 

One of many reasons why Rodgers is a franchise QB and why nobody knows whether Allen will be or not.

 

 

Edited September 19, 2019 by BADOLBILZ

[Albany,n.y.]

5 hours ago, Patrick_Duffy said:

Thing is that same media stayed on the Jets nut sack the whole offseason about how improved they were going to be. The Bills beat them with their starting QB and all their players that this same media hyped up so much. Now they say they suck, yes maybe now they will have some problems with their QB down.

 

But that was not the case before, they only lost Mosley late in the game. The Jets are a solid team IMO when Darnold is healthy, however I like most people I question the Gase hire. Either way the Jets were no push over when the Bills played them.

The thing that people forgot was the Jets had 3 suspended players on opening day.  They were a mess against Cleveland because Mosley & Darnold joined the suspended guys on the inactive list.  In a few weeks the Jets won't be a mess anymore.  They do need to upgrade their O-line & should be seeking any means necessary to do so ASAP.

However, as long as they have Gase as HC, they'll never reach their true potential.  

[benderbender]

One of the concerns for me in the Giants game was how timely the penalties were for us. Particularly the gift of the one that turned a FG to a TD with another set of downs. Chalk it up to mental errors on their part or luck on ours, but don’t usually get those calls and I’m hoping we don’t need them to win. 

[Albany,n.y.]

2 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

All very good points, and I am always leaning toward optimism... but there were some things that happened in the first 2 games that WILL sink us against better teams (namely, the PATS)

 

When we got the ball back with 1:49 left in the first half, and two timeouts, that should have been a scoring drive that at the very least ended with us kicking a FG as time expired.

 

Instead, we ran 3 botched plays, stopped the clock, and Punted the ball back to the Giants with 1:32 remaining. That WILL cost us the game against the Patriots who would use that time to move down the field and get points before halftime.

 

Plenty to tighten up, but I agree overall, we seem to be a much better team as it pertains to the details and what should be irrelevant stuff that can sink a team.

I'd bet any team with 8 out of 11 new starters on offense would still need to tighten things up 2 weeks into the season before they are ready to compete with the world champions.  

[Mark Long Beach]

12 minutes ago, benderbender said:

One of the concerns for me in the Giants game was how timely the penalties were for us. Particularly the gift of the one that turned a FG to a TD with another set of downs. Chalk it up to mental errors on their part or luck on ours, but don’t usually get those calls and I’m hoping we don’t need them to win. 

 

We took advantage of those penalties.  The Jets were gifted 4 turnovers and if not for one being a pick-6 they did NOTHING with those turnovers.  Turnovers are far worse than a penalty to boot.  

 

We're a newly put together offensive team.  I'm pretty impressed with what we've accomplished so far with so many long drives.  

[MassHog]

5 hours ago, Bob in STL said:

What the National media says and thinks is not important.  Winning games is.    I have never heard New England apologize for their schedule.   

 

IF the Bills can beat the Bengals on a Sunday we will be 3-0 and are opponents could potentially be a combined 0-9.   

 

We play the schedule we are given.  Tough games are coming.  What the media says does not change the standings.  

The fact that our first 3 opponents can be 0-9 is insane. What a gift the football gods have given. 

[RevWarRifleman]

Yes, Ingo, and we're not seeing one-on-one missed tackles in the open field much either.

We're not seeing (thank God) a Ryan brother on the sideline anywhere.          Go Bills!

 

 

 

 

 

 

**On a extreme side note, Ingo Montoya, oddly enough, was the name of the kid who sat behind me in my high school science class.    Just an FYI for you.

 

 

[DrDawkinstein]

1 hour ago, Albany,n.y. said:

I'd bet any team with 8 out of 11 new starters on offense would still need to tighten things up 2 weeks into the season before they are ready to compete with the world champions.  

 

For sure, and Im not bagging on them too hard. But "scoring before halftime" is one of the most overlooked keys of winning games. It's something that Belichick takes very seriously. And we cant make that same mistake against teams like the Pats, or else we are basically handing them the game. When asked about their crazy winning record over the past couple decades, Belichick has said (paraphrasing) "more teams have lost games then we have won". Meaning, it's those little things the other team doesnt execute or capitalize on that swings the favor to the Pats.

[Inigo Montoya]

4 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

For sure, and Im not bagging on them too hard. But "scoring before halftime" is one of the most overlooked keys of winning games. It's something that Belichick takes very seriously. And we cant make that same mistake against teams like the Pats, or else we are basically handing them the game. When asked about their crazy winning record over the past couple decades, Belichick has said (paraphrasing) "more teams have lost games then we have won". Meaning, it's those little things the other team doesnt execute or capitalize on that swings the favor to the Pats.

 

Belichick is right, most teams beat themselves.  Atlanta and Seattle both lost the Super Bowl to the Pats with stupid play calling at the end allowing the Pats to win.  The Bills have been masters of this for a long time.

 

These last two games the Bills managed to stay out of their own way and not give the game away.  They had the four turnovers in the Jets game but they were the result of bad bounces more than bad decisions or choking.

 

If the Bills can keep playing smart, clean football they are going to stack up some wins.

[Drunken Pygmy Goat]

Basically, you're saying the Bills weren't very "Billsy"...

 

Other football terms I like:

 

Making foolish decisions in the draft: "Brownsing" (although that may be a fading term). Formerly known as "Billsing" in the 2000s

 

Acting like hot **** when you're not: "Jagoff"

 

Tanking: "Finning"

 

Cheating: "The Patriot Way"