Everyone Talks Trade Up For QB, But What If....

[Magox]

20 minutes ago, mob16151 said:

 

Really?? Aaron Maybin,and Erik Flowers say hello. Oh look over there it's Mike Williams,and Donte Whitner.......The list just keeps going on.

 

Yeah, really!

 

We gave up 2 first rounders for an underperforming player.  At least Maybin cost us only one.   

[Da webster guy]

2 hours ago, Charlottebillsfan2 said:

too many holes to fill unless your moving up for a QB. Stay put and let the draft come to you. 

 

Yes.   One thing about drafting in the early 20's is there are people there who you never thought would fall.  Happened last year with guys like Peppers, Ramczyk, TreD etc.

 

Recently QB's like Derek Carr, Bridgewater, Garoppolo fell into the position where you could easily have grabbed them in the 20's, or traded back a dozen spots and still get them.  Obviously keep your options open, but there is no Andrew Luck in this draft, and I hate to see us burn two first rounders to get someone we really aren't sure of to begin with.

 

I love the wheeling and dealing for fun on draft day, but I'd love to see us stay put and hammer two solid back to back players on day one right at 21, 22.

[MAJBobby]

2 hours ago, starrymessenger said:

 

Cornelius Bennett says hello. Technically not a trade up but six of one and a half dozen of the other.

 

Not a trade up. And still the reason fora trade up is a LBer that played how many years ago?

2 hours ago, KelsaysLunchbox said:

JP Losman on line 3...

 

Right position it was a trade up for a QB wasnt it?

[mob16151]

28 minutes ago, Magox said:

 

Yeah, really!

 

We gave up 2 first rounders for an underperforming player.  At least Maybin cost us only one.   

John McCargo

[Reed83HOF]

18 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Not a trade up. And still the reason fora trade up is a LBer that played how many years ago?

 

Right position it was a trade up for a QB wasnt it?

 

Or save next year's pick for Aaron Rodgers...

[BuffaloBillyG]

16 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Not a trade up. And still the reason fora trade up is a LBer that played how many years ago?

 

Right position it was a trade up for a QB wasnt it?

It was. But not the right QB. That's the thing, if you trade up in the first it damn well better be for a player that can take your team to the next level. JP wasn't it. Sammy was not it. But it doesn't mean that if there is an absolute game changer you shouldn't trade up. A Julio Jones for instance. 

 

I'd love to stay put myself. Let the draft fall how it may. At 21 & 22 there's a good chance we come out with a QB and another possible impact player. 

[Adam727]

I genuinely hate this idea.  And even if Smith ended up being the best LB in the league I would STILL hate this idea.

 

Trade up for a QB, make their picks at 21 & 22, or trade back and acquire more future draft capital.  I'd be fine with any/all of those. 

 

But if they traded down instead of selecting Watson or Mahomes last year so that they could package those extra picks the following year to draft a LB, it would be really difficult to try to support this team until Beane is gone.  

[fansince88]

I say trade the 1st 3 picks for a new kicker....

[Xwnyer]

I want us to Trade DOWN get more picks fill the voids of talent.  

[njbuff]

Like most people have said in here...............

 

Unless it's a QB, don't waste 4 blue chip picks in rounds one and two.

 

There is a long way to go in this draft process that hasn't even begun yet and don't count the Bills out of trading into the top 2 if they love Darnold like we were told they were. Obviously (my Marrone pun), the draft process will play itself out to see where the Bills will go.

 

I wouldn't want this team to kill their cap on QB (Cousins) who is an upgrade from Taylor (obviously, again, lol), but doesn't guarantee any type of success with him now and in the future. Cousins has had talented skill players to work with in Washington, but to no success.

[NewEraBills]

3 hours ago, H2o said:

It's just a thought. I like Smith a lot as a player and I'm sure McDermott wants to find his Kuechley for this defense. I'm not saying I would trade up for him because I like Tegray Scales of Indiana almost as much and think he can be had @ 21 or 22. This is something I could see happening though if they really feel Smith is that important a piece of the defense so I threw it out there. 

 

Smith is my favorite player in the draft and honestly, when it comes to best players in the draft I think he's better than all of the QB's but we have too many holes to fill to be thinking about using that many assets on one player.

[MAJBobby]

1 hour ago, KelsaysLunchbox said:

It was. But not the right QB. That's the thing, if you trade up in the first it damn well better be for a player that can take your team to the next level. JP wasn't it. Sammy was not it. But it doesn't mean that if there is an absolute game changer you shouldn't trade up. A Julio Jones for instance. 

 

I'd love to stay put myself. Let the draft fall how it may. At 21 & 22 there's a good chance we come out with a QB and another possible impact player. 

 

Julio hasnt dont anything really for Atlanta has he???  Sure as heck isnt going to be some LBer to take your team to a Championship level 

[Mat68]

Imo you move up that far for only a Qb.  

[BuffaloBillyG]

27 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Julio hasnt dont anything really for Atlanta has he???  Sure as heck isnt going to be some LBer to take your team to a Championship level 

Yea, Julio has been a colossal flop. And Ray Lewis... definitely didn't propel a Baltimore championship. That was allllllllll former 1st rounder Trent Dilfer.

Edited January 17, 2018 by KelsaysLunchbox

[ndirish1978]

We just throwing up names of people we like and wondering aloud if we could get them for 2 first rounders? Cause I'd venture to say we could get most non-QB players in the NFL if we did that. Hell, we could probably just trade those picks for Kuechly.

Edited January 17, 2018 by ndirish1978

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, ndirish1978 said:

We just throwing up names of people we like and wondering aloud if we could get them for 2 first rounders? Cause I'd venture to say we could get most players in the NFL if we did that. 

 

Maybe the Packers will take #s 21 and 22 for Rodgers??? 

[ndirish1978]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Maybe the Packers will take #s 21 and 22 for Rodgers??? 

Damn you for quoting me while I was in the middle of editing my post!

[MAJBobby]

31 minutes ago, KelsaysLunchbox said:

Yea, Julio has been a colossal flop. And Ray Lewis... definitely didn't propel a Baltimore championship. That was allllllllll former 1st rounder Trent Dilfer.

 

Has Julio got Atalnta multiple championships?  Was Ray Lewis a trade up. 

 

Sorry no position justifies giving up multiple 1sts other than QB

[NewEra]

5 hours ago, H2o said:

What if we package our two 1st Round picks to move up for Roquan Smith? The LB from Georgia, imo, is one the ELITE players in this draft. He would be the QB of the defense for the next 10 years. He goes sideline to sideline, has great instincts, can cover, and is a tackling machine. He's a not often found type of LB who would make an immediate impact for this team. Our Luke Kuechley. Here is a nice little write up and I think most of us here watched him in the CFP if nothing else this year. Would you be on board with this move?

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2017/12/30/linebacker-roquan-smith-drives-georgias-defense/990880001/

He’s my favorite non qb prospect in the draft. That being said.  No, I wouldn’t trade up for him unless he skipper out of the top 13 or so.  If we could trade 21 and a 3rd, I’d do it.  Then I’d trade down from 22 and acquire as many picks as possible.  

 

If we don’t trade up for a QB I expect and hope that we trade down from 21 or 22.  We can hold a team ransom if we know they are looking for a certain player that we don’t necessarily really want him.  We can tell them we’re going to draft him if they don’t trade up to 21.  We have LOTS of holes.  The more picks the better.  Either trade up for the qb or trade down with at least one of the picks.  Maybe even 2.  I could see a scenario where we draft Mason Rudolph (ugh, I don’t want him in the least) or the best QB available then trade down with the other.  

[Fadingpain]

NO!  You don't trade up in the NFL draft!

 

Not unless you are going hard for what you believe to be your franchise QB.

 

Otherwise, pretend trading up is not allowed.

 

TRADE DOWN! 

 

Get more picks! 

 

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

My god people are in rare form today. 

[Green Lightning]

6 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

I will hunt Beane down and gut him like a fish!

 

?Ditto!

[FearLess Price]

6 hours ago, starrymessenger said:

 

Cornelius Bennett says hello. Technically not a trade up but six of one and a half dozen of the other.

 

The Bills won that trade. Lot of picks for CB

[starrymessenger]

10 minutes ago, FearLess Price said:

 

The Bills won that trade. Lot of picks for CB

 

They won big time. I think he's still the highest drafted defensive Bama player ever. He was worth the #2 spot when Indy took him, and he was worth the picks we gave up for him. And he was a linebacker. Imagine that.

[dollars 2 donuts]

7 hours ago, H2o said:

What if we package our two 1st Round picks to move up for Roquan Smith? The LB from Georgia, imo, is one the ELITE players in this draft. He would be the QB of the defense for the next 10 years. He goes sideline to sideline, has great instincts, can cover, and is a tackling machine. He's a not often found type of LB who would make an immediate impact for this team. Our Luke Kuechley. Here is a nice little write up and I think most of us here watched him in the CFP if nothing else this year. Would you be on board with this move?

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2017/12/30/linebacker-roquan-smith-drives-georgias-defense/990880001/

 

H2o, I honestly hear where you are coming from.  Seriously.  Keuchley, Mack, I get it.

 

i just wouldn't do it, or at least wouldn't do it while currently being without a qb.

[BuffaloBillyG]

1 hour ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Has Julio got Atalnta multiple championships?  Was Ray Lewis a trade up. 

 

Sorry no position justifies giving up multiple 1sts other than QB

Does it though? Look at the way moving up for a Qb has "helped" other teams other times. You and I could, I'm certain go back and forth with trades that have and haven't worked out on draft Day. I can talk RGIII, you can talk Big Ben...point being trading up for a QB based on position is not always great. However, had someone traded 2 firsts for a Ray Lewis or another legit HoF generational talent...would absolutely be worth it. The deal is no matter what you trade and what you get you still have to build a team around said player. 

[Punching Bag]

Maybe Beane with trade one of our 2 1st round picks to Browns for their #1 pick next year and some other picks this year and grab the QB next year.

[folz]

I don't know much about the kid to have an opinion on the player, but...

 

If the Bills truly felt he was a generational type player and with that possibly being the most important spot/role in McDermott's defense, then I would be ok with it.

 

However, if they don't feel the drop off from him to the next LBs is that large (ala Lattimore to Tredavius), then no way would they do it. Lattimore may still turn out to be the superior player, but I'd rather have Tre and another 1st rounder instead. Same for this year. 

[Thurman#1]

11 hours ago, BuffaloBaumer said:

NEVER EVER trade up again unless it is for a QB......or unless you are in the 3rd round or beyond and giving up a 7th or something for a couple spots.

 

 

It's not never trade up. But yeah, you don't give up two firsts except for a QB, you just don't. It's why the Sammy trade was mostly panned from minute one. Picking Sammy was good, though Mack might have been better. Making the trade up to get the #4 pick was really bad. Same with trading up for Roquan unless it's like a 1st and a 4th or something, which I doubt puts them in a good enough position to get Roquan.

[Thurman#1]

6 hours ago, KelsaysLunchbox said:

Yea, Julio has been a colossal flop. And Ray Lewis... definitely didn't propel a Baltimore championship. That was allllllllll former 1st rounder Trent Dilfer.

 

 

Obviously Julio isn't a flop. But the huge host of picks they had to give up caused Atlanta to be pretty bad for three years. And Julio hasn't won them a title; if he had you'd have to say it was a good trade, as a title justifies  pretty much anything, as I'm sure Belichick would agree.

 

There's still a really good argument that the Jones trade was a mistake, as good a player as he is.

 

They gave up the 2011 #27, the 2011 #59, the 2011 #124, the 2012 #22, and the 2012 #118. Just look at what they might have gotten for only the two 1sts and one 2nd they gave up. 

 

For the 2011 #27, they could have gotten Anthony Castonzo, Cameron Jordan, Jonathan Baldwin, Mark Ingram, Carimi, Muhammad Wilkerson or Cameron Heyward.

 

For the 2011 #59 they could have gotten Marcus Gilbert,  Randall Cobb, Terrell McClain, Justin Houston or DeMarco Murray.

 

For the 2012 #22 they could have gotten Riley Rieff, David DeCastro, Dont'a Hightower, Whitney Mercilus, Zeitler, Harrison Smith or Fleener.

 

And yeah, it's easier for me to pick after the fact, but all of those guys were available within 10 or so picks of where the picks the Falcs gave up were. 

 

That's a major harvest, and doesn't even count the two later picks. And the Julio trade is a rarity. Most trades of that kind are obvious horrible flops. Only a small percentage of trades of that much draft ammo can be considered even possible successes. You're taking a low-odds gamble by doing something like this.

Edited January 18, 2018 by Thurman#1

[Pete]

I want to trade up for Roquan.  But two 1sts to move up 16 spots is too much.  I suggested in another thread that we could possibly trade both #1s for pick 5 and their 2nd round pick.  It is pretty close on trade value chart.  And we would not lose a pick

[MAJBobby]

4 hours ago, KelsaysLunchbox said:

Does it though? Look at the way moving up for a Qb has "helped" other teams other times. You and I could, I'm certain go back and forth with trades that have and haven't worked out on draft Day. I can talk RGIII, you can talk Big Ben...point being trading up for a QB based on position is not always great. However, had someone traded 2 firsts for a Ray Lewis or another legit HoF generational talent...would absolutely be worth it. The deal is no matter what you trade and what you get you still have to build a team around said player. 

 

So who is the legit generational talent HOFer in this class. Please dont tell me is is a LBer from GA?  

 

Point is if you are going to swing for a talent in a trade up it should be in the most important position on the football field. Not a LB or WR 

[MJS]

We need quantity just as much as quality. I am against trading away high picks unless it is for a QB. You can find plenty of starter caliber players right where we stand in the draft, and that's what we need.

[BuffaloBillyG]

14 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

So who is the legit generational talent HOFer in this class. Please dont tell me is is a LBer from GA?  

 

Point is if you are going to swing for a talent in a trade up it should be in the most important position on the football field. Not a LB or WR 

Oh, we have no way of knowing who the HoF talent is in this draft. Which is why I said earlier and I maintain that trading up simply to swing for a QB is a bad idea. Frankly speaking, You have a better chance hitting on a HoF type player than you do a franchise QB.

 

This team needs a QB, but is far from just a QB away from serious Super Bowl contention. There is no reason to burn draft assets on one guy that may be Peyton Manning...but just may be Christian Ponder. The theory that you just need that "franchise QB" is becoming a dated notion. You need more than that. Lets not build to be the Packers or Colts of the world. 

[xRUSHx]

13 hours ago, Bangarang said:

 

I hate the idea of trading up for a LB. I’m more concerned about who the QB of the offense would be.

I agree man. I would love to have the option to move up for a different player but the focus really needs to be on QB till one is found. After we find a QB only then can this team reach for other positions. ImO

[purple haze]

12 hours ago, Johnny Hammersticks said:

I’d rather have Rashaan Evans AND Vita Vae/Maurice Hurst

That would be a great combo.  

 

To play devil's advocate: what if the trade up was a swap of one of the Bills first round picks with team X + Cordy Glenn?  For example,  pick 21 + Cordy going out,  and lets say Bengals pick 11 coming back.  So in essence they're trading Glenn to move up.

Edited January 18, 2018 by purple haze

[Ol Dirty B]

I think we should package our two firsts for sammy again so everyone who still bitches about that trade will finally make the jump.

[PIZ]

4 hours ago, purple haze said:

That would be a great combo.  

 

To play devil's advocate: what if the trade up was a swap of one of the Bills first round picks with team X + Cordy Glenn?  For example,  pick 21 + Cordy going out,  and lets say Bengals pick 11 coming back.  So in essence they're trading Glenn to move up.

 

Seeing lots of trade ideas involving Glenn, but is any team going to believe he is healthy enough or will stay healthy enough to trade for?

[Billsfansinceday1]

2 firsts for a LBer?  That would be insane.

[SoTier]

21 hours ago, Magox said:

Have we not learned from the Sammy Watkins debacle?

 

Possibly the worst GM move that the Bills have made on draft day in decades.  

 

I do not want to package two firsts unless it's a QB.

 

The Bills traded their 2005 first rounder, their 2004 second, and a fifth rounder to get Dallas' 2004 first rounder to pick JP Losman, who not only turned out to be a bust, but lost them the opportunity to draft Aaron Rodgers the next year.  THAT was easily "the worst GM move that the Bills have made on draft day in decades."