Is Diggs done?

[DrDawkinstein]

This constant need for Bills fans to bash Diggs is downright disgusting and pathetic. Shame on anyone who buys into it.

[Charles Romes]

According to the context, Diggs was merely making the the point that the drop off has not been a result of his lack of effort. What anyone will do to twist a quote for attention is amazing. 

[DrDawkinstein]

Just now, Slippery Rubber Mats said:

 

I put the rolled eyes emoji on your post but I want you to know that I am sitting here rolling my eyes IRL right now also. I almost fell backwards out of my chair

 

I put the thumbs down, but I actually did a DOUBLE THUMBS DOWN and a big RASPBERRY at the screen.

[BeastMaster]

The drops are absolutely his fault

 

Besides that, he's correct that teams have figured out how to keep him relatively quiet, and that the team has looked to involve the other players a bit more.

 

It only matters if we aren't scoring and aren't winning

[Slippery Rubber Mats]

Just now, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I put the thumbs down, but I actually did a DOUBLE THUMBS DOWN and a big RASPBERRY at the screen.

 

I almost chose the vomit emoji but I'm at work and I don't want to make a mess

[Beck Water]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Get Diggs help. Man has been the only weapon worth defenses to focus on his whole career in Buffalo.

 

Sometimes around here I feel like the "bad take" police.

 

🚔🚨👮‍♂️ (Keep your hands where I can see them, Sir.  Do you have any firearms with you?  OK, step out of the car)

 

Cole Beasley, John Brown, and Emmanuel Sanders say "Hi".

You could say he was the only weapon worth defensive focus in 2022. 

You could say he was the only wide receiver worth defensive focus this season.

[HappyDays]

I did not listen to the interview. If Tim Graham took quotes out of context to make it look worse than it was, I'll take the L on this one.

[Drew21PA]

12 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

https://theathletic.com/5138908/2023/12/15/stefon-diggs-buffalo-bills-drops-cowboys?source=user-shared-article

 

 

I'll be honest, I've been getting a little sick of Diggs lately. If you're gonna dish out your frustrations to other player you have to be willing to take accountability when you're not playing well. This whole interview rubs me the wrong way.

You’re reaching on your feelings

 

hes ripping his hat to the opponents working the scheme - he’s being humble 

[FireChans]

4 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Sometimes around here I feel like the "bad take" police.

 

🚔🚨👮‍♂️ (Keep your hands where I can see them, Sir.  Do you have any firearms with you?  OK, step out of the car)

 

Cole Beasley, John Brown, and Emmanuel Sanders say "Hi".

You could say he was the only weapon worth defensive focus in 2022. 

You could say he was the only wide receiver worth defensive focus this season.

Cole Beasley, John Brown, and Emmanuel Sanders were all a year or two away from being out of the league when they played with Diggs. They are all out of the league now.

 

Arrest yourself, bad take police.

[MiltonWaddams]

11 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Get Diggs help. Man has been the only weapon worth defenses to focus on his whole career in Buffalo.

Cookie and Kincaid dispute that. 

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Cole Beasley, John Brown, and Emmanuel Sanders were all a year or two away from being out of the league when they played with Diggs. They are all out of the league now.

 

Arrest yourself, bad take police.

Beasley was excellent in 2020.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

TEAM MEETING, PLAYERS ONLY!

*
NOW!!!

[FireChans]

3 minutes ago, MiltonWaddams said:

Cookie and Kincaid dispute that.

a rookie TE with less than 500 yards receiving and an RB that averages a little over 10 touches per game kinda makes my point for me here.

[HappyDays]

16 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Get Diggs help. Man has been the only weapon worth defenses to focus on his whole career in Buffalo.

 

He does need more help around him, no question. But he also has not been his usual dominant #1 WR self recently. This is the first article I've seen where someone directly asked him about his struggles over the past few games.

 

That being said I should have known better than to buy in to a clickbait headline from Tim Graham of all people...

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

4 minutes ago, Bogie_Klinkhammer said:

If it's not one ting it's an utter 🙄 

Now that's  creative. 😁

Edited December 15, 2023 by Ridgewaycynic2013

[JerseyBills]

I'd love to pick up Pittman in FA and draft a WR day 1 or 2

[Bills!Win!]

I heard that Diggs had a little spat with Allen in January. He must be done 

[NewEra]

On 12/13/2023 at 5:53 AM, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

 

 

And even if teams are doubling Diggs a lot (they aren't) 

 

On 12/13/2023 at 9:16 PM, Scott7975 said:

 

 Erik Turner puts time in. He watches every game several times.  He understand coverages.  He states what he sees.  And he sees Diggs being doubled and bracketed-  he sees that the opposition is taking his away on 2nd and 3rd down.  

@Mr. WEO care to back your claim up with something other than “they aren’t”?  
 

didn’t think so.

 

[uninja]

Feel like Allen is doing the right thing, if Diggs isn't open or the coverage says go elsewhere with the ball prove that you will and defenses will learn to respect that.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

I saw the headline of the article and thought this was a bad look for Diggs.  But after reading the article, other than the headline, nothing really bad on his part.

[Bobby Hooks]

Is this a real thread? And is it really 13 pages?? 
 

Gotta start ignorin’ this stuff guys. 

Edited December 15, 2023 by Bobby Hooks

[strive_for_five_guy]

58 minutes ago, Slippery Rubber Mats said:

 

I almost chose the vomit emoji but I'm at work and I don't want to make a mess

In order to synch up with the TBD laugh emoji, I actually had my dentist remove all of my teeth and shaved my head.

[Don Otreply]

1 hour ago, DrDawkinstein said:

This constant need for Bills fans to bash Diggs is downright disgusting and pathetic. Shame on anyone who buys into it.

It’s pretty damn obvious that our opponents are doubling Diggs to make us have to target our lesser weapons on offense, if those weapons perform as we hope, our opponents will have to spread their coverage which will make targeting Diggs more fruitful, that some folk don’t get this doesn’t say much for their thought process,

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Peter]

It is interesting that there were rumors that Diggs supposedly did not want Dorsey (and favored Chad Hall). We now know why Chad Hall left (nothing to do with Dorsey).

 

As for Diggs, I did not believe that he wanted Dorsey gone, but if he did, it is an example of be careful for what you wish for:

 

 

[Mr. WEO]

51 minutes ago, NewEra said:

 

 Erik Turner puts time in. He watches every game several times.  He understand coverages.  He states what he sees.  And he sees Diggs being doubled and bracketed-  he sees that the opposition is taking his away on 2nd and 3rd down.  

@Mr. WEO care to back your claim up with something other than “they aren’t”?  
 

didn’t think so.

 

for a guy who doesn’t read my posts, your sure can’t get off my junk lol

 

but yes he gets doubled about 30% of the time.  Is that “all the time” or even “a lot”?  Not by most interpretations of those terms. 

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

 

 Erik Turner puts time in. He watches every game several times.  He understand coverages.  He states what he sees.  And he sees Diggs being doubled and bracketed-  he sees that the opposition is taking his away on 2nd and 3rd down.  

 

In addition to this, I can’t help but think Diggs is fighting an injury as well. He doesn’t usually drop the balls he has been dropping recently.

[The Frankish Reich]

WR aging patterns:

- traditional wisdom (which went on right up to about 5 years ago) was that WRs have much greater longevity than RBs

- new analysis shows that 30 is kind of an inflection point. A lot of this has been done with respect to fantasy, which is not real life. But a lot of it is applicable to real life. I don't have time to provide links now, but maybe if I'm bored around Christmas I'll start a "WR Aging Patterns" thread that everyone can ignore ...

Diggs just turned 30. Drops? I don't think that has anything to do with aging. As a long time receiver, that's statistical noise. His drop rate going forward will very likely be what his historic drop rate has been over the course of his career. That's a blip.

But separation (earlier, page 8 somewhere, there was a comment showing Next Gen stats on separation by year) is probably a real effect, and one that is related to aging.

Bottom line: he's likely into his decline phase, but I see no reason for worry for the rest of the season. But when the decline hits it often hits hard, which doesn't bode well for next season and beyond.

 

Interesting point: big WRs, who tend to be possession receiver types, generally age better. That would apply to Gabe, except that Gabe has never really been used as a possession type receiver ...

[NewEra]

18 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

for a guy who doesn’t read my posts, your sure can’t get off my junk lol

 

but yes he gets doubled about 30% of the time.  Is that “all the time” or even “a lot”?  Not by most interpretations of those terms. 

About 30% seems like a lot to me, but do you have a link?  
 

In order to define “all the time” or “a lot” one would have to compare how often other WRs are being doubled.  Link?

Edited December 15, 2023 by NewEra

[Mr. WEO]

4 minutes ago, NewEra said:

About 30% seems like a lot to me, but do you have a link?  
 

In order to define “all the time” or “a lot” one would have to compare how often other WRs are being doubled.  Link?

 

all the time has only one meaning--it doesn't need comparison.

 

As for the 30%, that's what the top WR1s draw (or less).

 

 

52 minutes ago, Peter said:

It is interesting that there were rumors that Diggs supposedly did not want Dorsey (and favored Chad Hall). We now know why Chad Hall left (nothing to do with Dorsey).

 

As for Diggs, I did not believe that he wanted Dorsey gone, but if he did, it is an example of be careful for what you wish for:

 

 

 

this is on Diggs, not Brady--he's still forcing the ball to Diggs (30 targets those 3 games) despite the plummeting production.  Makes you wonder why Brady isn't changing it up.

[DCofNC]

On 12/13/2023 at 4:46 PM, TrentEdwardsCheckDownOn4th said:

He's 30 years old and on the tail end of his career.  He's definitely slowed down and anyone that says otherwise is kidding themselves. Because of his contract the bills are stuck with him for at least one more year . 2025 is going to look a lot different with no Gabe, diggs, Miller , or knox. Tons of cap space will be opened up. The bills could be a juggernaut in 2025 if beane plays his cards right. 

I’d eat the turd sandwich for 2024 and cut the fat, clear the old boys and start a new.  The only remaining questionable contracts would be Diggs and Knox if it were my show.   Won’t happen, but it’s time to move on from Miller, Morse, Hyde, Poyer, White, Gabe, unfortunately it will mean no room for AJE or Floyd, wouldn’t be shocked if we can’t bring Jones back either, but something has to give. There is entirely too much money wasted and you are stuck working around it, time to rip the bandaid.

[Beck Water]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

but yes he gets doubled about 30% of the time.  Is that “all the time” or even “a lot”?  Not by most interpretations of those terms. 

 

So first you're saying Diggs gets doubled about 30% of the time, but that's not "all the time" or even "a lot".

 

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

all the time has only one meaning--it doesn't need comparison.

As for the 30%, that's what the top WR1s draw (or less).

 

 

Then you present data (data are good) showing that the most-doubled (in man coverage) WRs are doubled less than 30% with one outlier (Kupp at 36%).

 

Don't you see a little contradiction there?  If 30% would be the second-highest % doubling, then being doubled 30% would be "a lot" by most interpretations.

 

Methinks you're more interested in quibbling than in having an interesting discussion, which might include how PFF is defining man (man across the board, or man on that WR?) and strategies for putting more focus on a WR in zone coverage.

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Beck Water said:

 

So first you're saying Diggs gets doubled about 30% of the time, but that's not "all the time" or even "a lot".

 

 

Then you present data (data are good) showing that the most-doubled (in man coverage) WRs are doubled less than 30% with one outlier (Kupp at 36%).

 

Don't you see a little contradiction there?  If 30% would be the second-highest % doubling, then being doubled 30% would be "a lot" by most interpretations.

 

Methinks you're more interested in quibbling than in having an interesting discussion, which might include how PFF is defining man (man across the board, or man on that WR?) and strategies for putting more focus on a WR in zone coverage.

30% mortality is a lot of dead people.

 

getting double teamed 25-30% means that for the very large majority of your routes you alone or single covered.  What is being compared  is the  frequency  one is not double teamed vs doubled….not how often others are.

 

It’s pretty clear in my first contention: even the best WRs (Diggs wasn’t in the top 5 anyway—putting him at under 20%) are not doubled often. 

so it’s not a quibble. Simple fact.  Even Diggs today said the Bills need to spread the targets around more.   He’s been rendered ineffective lately….its not like Defenses just started double teaming him 3 weeks ago….

[JPP]

Most players have slumps....Ridiculous to get rid of Diggs....who else you got? LOL....The guy will bounce back...mind you if he goes full blown DIVA than you gonna have real problems.....Unfortunately dude is so tempramental but it is what it is....we need him!

[PromoTheRobot]

Done with what? Dinner? Binging on Emily in Paris? 

Edited December 16, 2023 by PromoTheRobot

[NewEra]

23 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

all the time has only one meaning--it doesn't need comparison.

 

As for the 30%, that's what the top WR1s draw (or less).

 

 

 

this is on Diggs, not Brady--he's still forcing the ball to Diggs (30 targets those 3 games) despite the plummeting production.  Makes you wonder why Brady isn't changing it up.

Thanks- I don’t think I’ve really seen stats on doubling/bracketing before.  I’d like to see what Diggs actual number have been over the last few seasons.  Does anyone have access to those stats? Or even just this years?

 

Of all the forced passes to Diggs (and Diggs drops) Davis still has a lower catch %.  I know it’s not only on him (uncatchable passes too) but I think we’re going to be able to open up our offense once we replace gabe with a more versatile route runner and reliable pass catcher.  
 

like I’ve said-  I really like the kid, but he’s not enough to unlock the true potential of this offense.  
 

I don’t see how Josh forcing the ball to Diggs is on Diggs.  I agree that Diggs’ drops have been a problem, but forcing passes to him isn’t.

[FireChans]

On 12/15/2023 at 12:30 PM, Mr. WEO said:

 

all the time has only one meaning--it doesn't need comparison.

 

As for the 30%, that's what the top WR1s draw (or less).

 

 

 

this is on Diggs, not Brady--he's still forcing the ball to Diggs (30 targets those 3 games) despite the plummeting production.  Makes you wonder why Brady isn't changing it up.

All this tells me is that the defensive coordinators bracketing Hunter Renfrow are insane.

[The Wiz]

On 12/15/2023 at 10:28 AM, HappyDays said:

I did not listen to the interview. If Tim Graham took quotes out of context to make it look worse than it was, I'll take the L on this one.

Very out of context.  Should have a listen.

 

 

[finn]

On 12/15/2023 at 11:58 AM, Einstein said:

 

In addition to this, I can’t help but think Diggs is fighting an injury as well. He doesn’t usually drop the balls he has been dropping recently.

It's a bad look to get a lot of targets, produce little, and drop the ball--then complain to the media. 

[Beck Water]

21 minutes ago, finn said:

It's a bad look to get a lot of targets, produce little, and drop the ball--then complain to the media. 

 

I don't think that's what Diggs did.  Watch the interview.

[HappyDays]

The Chiefs have somehow always managed to lock down Diggs 1v1. First Charvarius Ward, now L'Jarius Sneed.

[finn]

32 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I don't think that's what Diggs did.  Watch the interview.

I did. He sounded frustrated, which is understandable, but he's got to keep that to himself. It may not be fair to say he was complaining exactly, but that is how the media is framing it, naturally, and it's a potential distraction for a team that doesn't need more distractions. You'd think he'd have learned from last summer's experience to just say bland things like Allen and others. Who cares if he's frustrated? What matters is that the team wins.