Elam's issues

[All I Need is Hope]

Does anyone have any actual intel (not opinions) for why Elam is pushed down the depth chart and now behind 6th and 7th round CB's?  Is it mental, adjusting to new techniques, schemes, ???.

 

McDermott and crew have typically been really good at getting the best out of DB's.  

 

This one's a head scratcher.

Edited October 3, 2023 by All I Need is Hope

[Warriorspikes51]

I’m still puzzled. He had very important plays at KC and vs MIA in the wildcard

 

it would sure be nice if he flipped a switch and became Pat Surtain

Edited October 3, 2023 by Warriorspikes51

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Is it really that difficult to see Dane Jackson and Christian Benford are good players?

[BuffaloBillyG]

1 minute ago, All I Need is Hope said:

Does anyone have any actual intel (not opinions) for why Elam is pushed down the depth chart and now behind 6th and 7th round CB's?  Is it mental, adjusting to new techniques, schemes, ???.

 

McDermott and crew have typically been really good at getting the best out of DB's.  

 

This one's a head scratcher.

Point may be proven as McDermott seems to have gotten the best out of Benford and Jackson...to the point where we have 4 solid CB options.

 

Let's see what Elam does with the opportunity 

[Warriorspikes51]

Just now, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Is it really that difficult to see Dane Jackson and Christian Benford are good players?

props to Dane. He had a big hit immediately after coming in

[All I Need is Hope]

1 minute ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Point may be proven as McDermott seems to have gotten the best out of Benford and Jackson...to the point where we have 4 solid CB options.

 

Let's see what Elam does with the opportunity 

Makes it even more puzzling to understand why they can't get top end production out of someone with Elam's elite athletic traits

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Let me add the only issues we heard about were in practice. He was grabbing a little too much. But other than that the kid can play. 
 

 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Is it really that difficult to see Dane Jackson and Christian Benford are good players?

I think it also has to do with Elam though. Lot of negative innuendo in the comments by McDermott about Elam. Even today, he basically was like, “we’ll see” about Elam. 

[NewEra]

The reason he’s been pushed down the depth chart:  Dane is currently a better zone CB for McDs system.  

[SCBills]

Benford’s coverage metrics have been elite.   
 

Tre was solid. 
 

We know the staff loves Dane Jackson, and if he could ever develop any semblance of ball skills, he’d be a coveted corner given his run defense and sticky coverage. 
 

It’s not out of the realm of possibilities that Elam has simply been beat out by 3 good players.  
 

The bright side is that Elam has the highest ceiling, traits-wise, of anyone in this secondary, even before Tre went down. 

The downside is that, even with his above average performances in big moments last year, the staff doesn’t trust him yet. 
 

He’s one of the more talented players on this defense, but on a unit that requires you to be a cog, he’s used to going man up and it seems the staff is struggling to coach that out of him. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

3 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

I think it also has to do with Elam though. Lot of negative innuendo in the comments by McDermott about Elam. Even today, he basically was like, “we’ll see” about Elam. 

I don’t know. Thats trying to read into things. On the field he’s been more than fine. 

[Mr. WEO]

This is begging for a 3rd thread…

[HurlyBurly51]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

The reason he’s been pushed down the depth chart:  Dane is currently a better zone CB for McDs system.  

Maybe McD could’ve whispered to BBB in the war room he wasn’t a fit.

[wppete]

Really hope he takes advantage of this massive opportunity. I think he will. 

[BuffaloBillyG]

8 minutes ago, All I Need is Hope said:

Makes it even more puzzling to understand why they can't get top end production out of someone with Elam's elite athletic traits

 

Not really. In this defense physical traits at the CB position isn't a big deal. This defense is about being in the right spot at the right time and doing your 1/11th. Making the right reads. 

 

Elam had further to come than Benford and Jackson. More ground to cover. He'll have his opportunity to show how far he's come. At the very least we should see if his opportunity grows and we should have a much better idea of how he fits in the coming weeks.

[SCBills]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I don’t know. Thats trying to read into things. On the field he’s been more than fine. 

McDermott is definitely weird about Elam.   His answers whenever asked about Kaiir come across like he’s beyond annoyed to have to talk about him. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

McDermott is definitely weird about Elam.   His answers whenever asked about Kaiir come across like he’s beyond annoyed to have to talk about him. 

I feel that also. I’ve mentioned it seems like he wanted to draft someone else. We’ll never know. Just a wild guess.

 

At worst he’s been even with Benford. Typically the tie goes to the 1st rounder. Elam seems to have a great attitude about it though. Never hear him complaining.

[artmalibu]

Im glad we have Elam, and dont care why he was sitting out!  

[NickelCity]

10 minutes ago, SCBills said:

McDermott is definitely weird about Elam.   His answers whenever asked about Kaiir come across like he’s beyond annoyed to have to talk about him. 

 

I'm hoping the annoyance is just due to "what do you want me to say he's not practicing as well as the other guys..."

 

But idk

[Mango]

30 minutes ago, All I Need is Hope said:

Does anyone have any actual intel (not opinions) for why Elam is pushed down the depth chart and now behind 6th and 7th round CB's?  Is it mental, adjusting to new techniques, schemes, ???.

 

McDermott and crew have typically been really good at getting the best out of DB's.  

 

This one's a head scratcher.

I think Elam is likely “fine”. I don’t think he’s a bust. Probably “meh”.
 

Jackson struggled as the year went on and everybody on defense went down, but when Tre went down Dane played really well. And by the time we hit the playoffs was better than Levi. Through the first 5 or so games of last season DJ was something like top 5 in passer rating when targeted. He’s struggled but he can ball too.

 

All that said Benford beat him out in a close battle. And apparently Elam wasn’t too far behind. 
 

I think it’s a factor of having an all-pro on one side and and 2 pretty goods on the other. Pair that with minimal game experience, being strongest at the defenses least used skill set, and a lack of versatility compared to the guys in front of him, he finds himself the odd man out. 

[EasternOHBillsFan]

27 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Is it really that difficult to see Dane Jackson and Christian Benford are good players?

 

Well, we're about to find out as Calvin Ridley and Christian Kirk will be their responsibilities. Maybe we might get Poyer back...?

[Solomon Grundy]

35 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Is it really that difficult to see Dane Jackson and Christian Benford are good players?

Or maybe better in run support? 

[whorlnut]

24 minutes ago, NewEra said:

The reason he’s been pushed down the depth chart:  Dane is currently a better zone CB for McDs system.  

Why can’t anyone see this? Who cares if Elam was a first rounder?  He hasn’t earned it yet and it should never be given to him based off is draft position. 

[NewEra]

4 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

Why can’t anyone see this? Who cares if Elam was a first rounder?  He hasn’t earned it yet and it should never be given to him based off is draft position. 

I think most people understand 

[BillnutinHouston]

OP, have you gotten enough "facts" yet?

[John from Riverside]

I mean at this point, it doesn’t matter
 

DaneJackson will probably start over him but he’s going to get time

[djp14150]

He’s more man CB than a zone  CB

he doesn’t do special teams

Edited October 3, 2023 by djp14150

[Dr.Sack]

Bottomline is Tre works extremely hard and is smarter (High School Valedictorian). Elam works harder but is likely not as smart as Tre. So you have two 1st round corners one who is one of the smartest in the NFL and is the hardest worker. That is a tough bar to clear if you are Elam.  As for Benford and Jackson it is my opinion that the Bills CB 2 is likely more a position of dealing with WR 2 and that is less demanding athletically. 

[Maynard]

Better get over them quick?

[cage]

7 hours ago, BillnutinHouston said:

OP, have you gotten enough "facts" yet?

 

I'm glad it's not just me.... everyone here seems as confused as I am.  

[Charles Romes]

I think the analytics department armed with irrefutable data demanded changes from mcbeane after the season. Part of the changes were limit the drops so they targeted a journeyman 3 and 4 who do not drop. Another part of the changes were limiting penalties especially chunk yardage PI. That’s where Elam got the axe. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

43 minutes ago, Charles Romes said:

I think the analytics department armed with irrefutable data demanded changes from mcbeane after the season. Part of the changes were limit the drops so they targeted a journeyman 3 and 4 who do not drop. Another part of the changes were limiting penalties especially chunk yardage PI. That’s where Elam got the axe. 

Buffalo Bills Analytics Department:

 

[Charles Romes]

32 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Buffalo Bills Analytics Department:

 

38-10, 37-3, 48-20

[Sargent Hulka]

My biggest takeaway is that whoever the college scout on Beane's staff is that recommended Elam as their 1st Round pick, he should never again be involved with picking that high of a selection. Honestly, some of the Bills scouts suck at their job.

[Tommy Callahan]

Huge fan of 47.   Hopefully the benching put a fire in his belly and we see it when he comes back.

 

 

[Shaw66]

10 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Is it really that difficult to see Dane Jackson and Christian Benford are good players?

I agree with this, but it isn't an answer.  Elam has, in all probability, some better physical skills than Jackson and Benford.  That's why he was a high pick.   So, what is it that makes him so clearly worse at the job than the three who are ahead of him?

 

The OP asked for actual information, not opinion, but there is no actual information.  McDermott didn't hold a press conference to explain why Elam isn't active. 

 

We're about to find out.  When he wasn't active, there wasn't much pressure on Elam to improve.   But if he goes active, he's going to have 42 teammates telling him he needs to make the plays.   Frankly, I'm expecting him to rise to the challenge.   

[Matt_In_NH]

I really think its just a numbers thing and is more a reflection of how deep the Bills are at corner.  White,  Benford, Jackson are better for this defense, he is on the team and will now get a jersey.  The only issue I have seen is that he is a little too physical and draws too many penalties.  Or at least the staff fears that.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Matt_In_NH

[boyst]

normally people root for the underdogs like Benford and Jackson, yet here we are chomping the bite for the blue chip.

 

in this case the only true concern i have is that we didn't get Elam active enough to have him get his feet underneath him. however, we have a great stretch where he can do that heading into a daunting 4 week stretch of @cin, @kc, dal, @san diego.

[Franco_92]

It's pretty clear from interviews that Elam gets lost in zone coverages and just doesn't have that intuition for where he needs to be and move to. He's fine in man coverage and has shown that. Beane's comments that they wish it was just a work ethic thing allude to the fact that something isnt happening right mentally when he is playing our system. Hopefully he can figure it out - he's young. But when you watch any film breakdown it's clear how important it is in our system (and any system) to be able to communicate and leverage yourself properly every play. These things aren't easy 

Edited October 3, 2023 by arcane

[Royale with Cheese]

I just think McDermott doesn't trust Elam.  It has to be the mental part because he physically has it.

 

You saw how precise the Bills defense is from what we saw on the Dolphins game review.  Elam probably just isn't in the right spot or gets easily confused or bites on play fakes....something mentally is keeping him off the field.