This place has become poisonous

[hemma]

I think it is time to stop whining and start talking about the Combine.

 

Back to work.

[Billsfan1972]

55 minutes ago, corta765 said:

 

This is where I lie and why I have stayed clear since the CIN loss.

 

Did the Bills fail their goal, the fans dream, most predictions of a SB win? Yes. 

Are there things they need to improve on and legitimate questions ranging from coaching to draft? Yes.

Did they still overcome a sh*t ton of obstacles in every possible and win a lot? Also Yes.

And as you said would most fanbases take having McD, Beane, & Josh? Yes outside a select few who happen to also be really angry they lost or didn't make the SB or your KC.

I know people want it to be a black and white thing but like many things in life it is a far more complex grayed story and analysis. 

 

I have said numerous times I have zero issue with being objective on things the Bills need to work or and legitimate questions including whether the DC should stay, why the head coach tenses in playoff games, and most importantly why they just came out so flat in a game at home in game that would've give you a neutral field shot to slay the dragon. I think that is fine to discuss but it needs to be articulated with some logic not "Fire this guy" "burn it down" "Without Josh their the worst team in football" etc... 

 

Everyone complaining about McD but worship Reid forget up until 2019 Reid was considered a good offensive coach who couldn't close the deal. 2 SB wins later and now he is brilliant and that doesn't matter. Heck had the Bills won the SB this year all the people ignoring the injuries and adversity would've wrote it as part of story on how this team overcame. I am happy that the standard for many is SB or bust as opposed to just being happy they made the playoffs. They have a good team, they have a great QB, and they have a pretty good coach and GM who you should want more from. But find a healthy ground of reality also and maybe step away that football isn't the end all be all and your not fixing everything or winning the SB in one second.

And have the Bills made the SB?  

 

This get's so old as it is a circuitous debate that all really revolves around one person, McD. 

 

1. How much control does he have over the GM and thus drafting? 

2. Is he too focused on the Defense? 

3. Is he too Loyal to Frazier? 

4. Can he coach in the moment? 

5. What the heck happened those 13 seconds? 

6. How has he helped the offense?

7. Is it McD or Allen responsible for these last 4 years?

 

To some here they have this "fake" narrative (yes I'm going to exaggerate here) that he took over a 2-14 team in 2017 and with only a pair of pliers & chicken wiring took the Bills to the Playoffs singlehandedly and thus now has a pass to only get to the playoffs, because then you know it's just a crapshoot.  

 

Others think that with Josh Allen, he struck gold and has done not enough to develop or protect him and is too focused on the defense.

 

90% agree you can't fire him (nor should you) and some are convinced that he's run his course and what the Bills are left with is a competitive team, that with be one of the top 4 in the league, but they'll always be an excuse and something will always derail them. 

Edited February 13, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[Shaw66]

51 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

There is a difference of people rationally discussing the honest things that need to improve vs a total hysterical flip out and declaring the end before the new season even begins.  

 

I agree, the board was impossible to be around the week after the game.  I myself took some time to let the disappointment calm down before I came back to what was surely going to be a cess pool of negativity...which it was.  

 

But I do think that has died down quite a bit and there are a lot more quality conversations going on now regarding this team strengths and weaknesses.  The overly negative crowd is never going away, but I think their nonsense is starting to get drowned out by better convos lately.  

 

This team will always be a contender with an elite player like Josh and a GM committed to building a winner.  Doesn't mean all the right decisions, plays, etc will be just right, but we will be someone to contend with for the foreseeable future.  The question is what is keeping this team from getting over that hump and what can we do to change that before other teams keep improving around us as they try and over take us.  

 

Those are all fair questions heading into an offseason where we were 13-3 (8 points from being undefeated) and then laid down like we were the 7th seed despite being at home, with motivation (Hamlin), in bad weather (allegedly an advantage for us), with our opponent having a decimated OL.  We can't keep doing the same things and expecting different results.  

With you all the way until the last sentence.  McDermott will keep doing the same thing, which is following his process.   His process is designed to have a continuously improving team.  Doesn't mean there won't be ups and downs, but it does mean that over time it will get better.   McDermott expects that by continuing to follow the process he WILL get different results.  

 

 

[TheyCallMeAndy]

15 minutes ago, hemma said:

I think it is time to stop whining and start talking about the Combine.

 

Back to work.

I never clocked out!

[Billsfan1972]

5 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

With you all the way until the last sentence.  McDermott will keep doing the same thing, which is following his process.   His process is designed to have a continuously improving team.  Doesn't mean there won't be ups and downs, but it does mean that over time it will get better.   McDermott expects that by continuing to follow the process he WILL get different results.  

 

 

Stop with the Process.  Shaw you're one of the best people on here, thoughtful, intelligent, with an eye for the game, but have drank the McD Koolaid.  

 

He has invested way too much in the defense, got so lucky with Allen & added one offensive player in Diggs.  The rest has been meh at best. 

[corta765]

6 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

And have the Bills made the SB?  

 

This get's so old as it is a circuitous debate that all really revolves around one person, McD. 

 

1. How much control does he have over the GM and thus drafting? 

2. Is he too focused on the Defense? 

3. Is he too Loyal to Frazier? 

4. Can he coach in the moment? 

5. What the heck happened those 13 seconds? 

6. How has he helped the offense?

7. Is it McD or Allen responsible for these last 4 years?

 

To some here they have this "fake" narrative (yes I'm going to exaggerate here) that he took over a 2-14 team in 2017 and with only a pair of pliers & chicken wiring took the Bills to the Playoffs singlehandedly and thus now has a pass to only get to the playoffs, because then you know it's just a crapshoot.  

 

Others think that with Josh Allen, he struck gold and has done not enough to develop or protect him and is too focused on the defense.

 

90% agree you can't fire him (nor should you) and some are convinced that he's run his course and what the Bills are left with is a competitive team, that with be one of the top 4 in the league, but they'll always be an excuse and something will always derail tem. 

 

He is the crux of it and people will spin the context for support or against him how they want it. I think it 100% accurate to say the honeymoon is beyond over and the proverbial hot seat at least is in the city even though it might now be here now. If the team keeps winning I doubt he goes anywhere even if they cant crack a SB birth. It gets very interesting if they were to regress though and where ownership goes. Right now they are printing money, they are relevant as heck, and they are a contender in the big league eyes. The only way I think they move own is if those things start to change.

[Billsfan1972]

2 minutes ago, corta765 said:

 

He is the crux of it and people will spin the context for support or against him how they want it. I think it 100% accurate to say the honeymoon is beyond over and the proverbial hot seat at least is in the city even though it might now be here now. If the team keeps winning I doubt he goes anywhere even if they cant crack a SB birth. It gets very interesting if they were to regress though and where ownership goes. Right now they are printing money, they are relevant as heck, and they are a contender in the big league eyes. The only way I think they move own is if those things start to change.

And I want the Bills to win the SB in 2023 9well February 2024), so yep win in spite of McD.......😉

 

Do you really think that Fans "Hate" McD more then their want for the Bills to win a SB?   

[corta765]

7 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Do you really think that Fans "Hate" McD more then their want for the Bills to win a SB?   

 

I do not think fans hate him at all. I do think there is a lot of frustration because of how the team lost and some coaching decisions from him. But from most advanced analytics I read he is like a top 5-10 guy there so you would do a lot lot worse. The expectations heading into this year were so heavy SB or bust, when it didn't happen someone is the fall guy. Mind you in the weeks prior most fans wanted him to be coach of the year for what they did overcome lol

 

Lets be honest it is easier to lose in a heartbreaker like 13 seconds where your QB looks like god and you are so close then to fall so flat vs CIN. That loss just seeps into you because it opens far more questions (some valid some not) when it is possible you just had a bad day which overexposed your flaws. Countless examples of football teams having a bad day at the worst moment;  with the expectation's and what happened McD becomes target 1.

 

Again to me camelot still existed in some form with the team and coach into this year. That is no longer there, but people have swung a bit too far the other way too.

[Shaw66]

16 minutes ago, corta765 said:

 

He is the crux of it and people will spin the context for support or against him how they want it. I think it 100% accurate to say the honeymoon is beyond over and the proverbial hot seat at least is in the city even though it might now be here now. If the team keeps winning I doubt he goes anywhere even if they cant crack a SB birth. It gets very interesting if they were to regress though and where ownership goes. Right now they are printing money, they are relevant as heck, and they are a contender in the big league eyes. The only way I think they move own is if those things start to change.

I don't know if the hot seat is anywhere on the horizon.  

 

It would be interesting to know what the annual post-season dialog is like among Steeler fans.   That's the ultimate continuity-based franchise.  Tomlin has never been below .500, but he hasn't won a Super Bowl since 2008 and hasn't been to the Super Bowl since 2010.   Have the owners settled for just winning more than they lose, getting to the Super Bowl every decade or so?   Or do they recognize that a lot of things have to fall right for even the right coach to win it all?   

 

If it were easy to be the Chiefs, everyone would be the Chiefs.   What's wrong with the Bengals?  Why can't they win the big one?   They're clearly regressing - didn't beat the Chiefs this time around.  Maybe it's time to think about a new coach there.   

 

Well-run teams take a long time to get rid of winning coaches.  

[corta765]

28 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

It would be interesting to know what the annual post-season dialog is like among Steeler fans.   That's the ultimate continuity-based franchise.  Tomlin has never been below .500, but he hasn't won a Super Bowl since 2008 and hasn't been to the Super Bowl since 2010.   Have the owners settled for just winning more than they lose, getting to the Super Bowl every decade or so?   Or do they recognize that a lot of things have to fall right for even the right coach to win it all?   

 

I have a buddy who is a huge Steeler fan and sometimes the idea of moving in is attractive because of change and getting different results. On the flip side he knew they were not a playoff team and Tomlin was doing well to break in the new pieces as they transitioned their team this season and Pickett showed some real promise. I think in terms of SB they know it is a little of everything luck, good coaching, roster is set in the right way, and it takes a while for it all to fall together. He thinks it is insane when Bills fans bring up moving on from McD because it really has not been that long he has been the coach by their standards.

 

I think it is far easier though to have patience when you have won a ring (rings in their case). In a different universe if Norwood made his kick I think you would see a far more patient group of fans that wouldn't be freaking as much. Josh and this group has shown this could be the time so everyone wants it now and I get that.

[Billsfan1972]

57 minutes ago, corta765 said:

 

I do not think fans hate him at all. I do think there is a lot of frustration because of how the team lost and some coaching decisions from him. But from most advanced analytics I read he is like a top 5-10 guy there so you would do a lot lot worse. The expectations heading into this year were so heavy SB or bust, when it didn't happen someone is the fall guy. Mind you in the weeks prior most fans wanted him to be coach of the year for what they did overcome lol

 

Lets be honest it is easier to lose in a heartbreaker like 13 seconds where your QB looks like god and you are so close then to fall so flat vs CIN. That loss just seeps into you because it opens far more questions (some valid some not) when it is possible you just had a bad day which overexposed your flaws. Countless examples of football teams having a bad day at the worst moment;  with the expectation's and what happened McD becomes target 1.

 

Again to me camelot still existed in some form with the team and coach into this year. That is no longer there, but people have swung a bit too far the other way too.

Agreed and maybe as said better to go into 2023 as just one of the SB contenders, as opposed to the favourite.  

 

But sorry 13 seconds was worse then anything (I canceled my SB party because of it).

 

What the Cincy game did was unfortunately validate a lot of what many said was apparent from the second half of the GB game on and what McD didn't address or have answers for and in the Cincy game seemingly did absolutely nothing to turn it around.

 

BTW let's compare that to yesterday and the exact same scenario.  KC down 10 pts at half and failed in their two minute offense to end the half and they come out with urgency and score.  They allow a FG and then score again. 

 

They came out of the halftime and reacted like champs and the Bills as stated in the same scenario were still in it and preverbally 'rolled over".   

Edited February 13, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[corta765]

15 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Agreed and maybe as said better to go into 2023 as just one of the SB contenders, as opposed to the favourite.  

 

But sorry 13 seconds was worse then anything (I canceled my SB party because of it).

 

What the Cincy game did was unfortunately validate a lot of what many said was apparent from the second half of the GB game on and what McD didn't address or have answers for and in the Cincy game seemingly did absolutely nothing to turn it around.

 

BTW let's compare that to yesterday and the exact same scenario.  KC down 10 pts at half and failed in their two minute offense to end the half and they come out with urgency and score.  They allow a FG and then score again. 

 

The came out of the halftime and reacted like champs and the Bills were still in it and preverbally 'rolled over".   

 

I 100% get that and agree. KC loss the 1st time conservativeness on FG instead of trying for TDs was frustrating, last year it was 13 seconds with how that played out, and this year just flat and the entire team, coaching staff, billy the buffalo stunk across the board. He will obviously get more changes but I do understand fans saying "show us you have learned from this and are not repeating the same frustrations".

 

I have thought the Bills had enough distractions entering 22' as favorites in the media and the amount they embraced it before things actually started going wild during the season. I too have kinda thought as I created in another thread a more focused less distraction driven season might be the right antidote for the team and fans.

[Low Positive]

The Bills are by far the most successful team that I support but this message board is the most negative and toxic of all that I participate in. I think its a combination of the last game of the year being such a letdown and the fact that only the negative posters are currently participating. There is also a drought-era reflex of assuming that every player on every other team is better than Bills players. It and you cool and savvy back then. BTW, the Bills needs one OG and a offensive playmaker to be right back in the mix again.  

Edited February 13, 2023 by FrenchConnection

[vincec]

On 2/11/2023 at 8:22 PM, wppete said:

I think it’s just that the OP is very sensitive and doesn’t quite understand how boards work….. The Eagle boards are a sight to behold that’s for sure 😂 

 

 

I occasionally visit other fan boards to try and get some first hand perspective on things and TBD is, by far, the mildest fan board I’ve seen. That’s what makes all the people slamming the “poisonous” atmosphere on this board strange to me. But it’s all a matter of perspective I guess.

[starrymessenger]

2 minutes ago, vincec said:

I occasionally visit other fan boards to try and get some first hand perspective on things and TBD is, by far, the mildest fan board I’ve seen. That’s what makes all the people slamming the “poisonous” atmosphere on this board strange to me. But it’s all a matter of perspective I guess.

You are exactly right. I visit other message boards and I usually come away with the impression that this one is better, both for courtesy, restraint and level of analysis. Its not that there aren’t good posters elsewhere, it just like there seem to be more here.

[The Frankish Reich]

2 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

With you all the way until the last sentence.  McDermott will keep doing the same thing, which is following his process.   His process is designed to have a continuously improving team.  Doesn't mean there won't be ups and downs, but it does mean that over time it will get better.   McDermott expects that by continuing to follow the process he WILL get different results.  

 

 

I’m not sure “the process” is to continually improve the team. The team is already pretty damn good. Nobody improves over 3 or 4 loss seasons, other than making some moves aimed at getting over the playoff hump. 
 

“The process” is to build a team that remains competitive year after year. Not the Rams, throwing it all out there to try to win a SB in a 2-year window and then go straight back into a rebuild. Ideally, a new Pats. More realistically, another Chiefs or Packers. Even more down to earth, a new Panthers. McD and his mentors had that working great until his offensive AND defensive mainstays - Cam and Kuechly - both completely broke down at unusually young ages. 
 

I’ve asked it before: all other things being equal, would you give up a decade of playoff appearances for a 2 or 3 year run resulting in one SB win, followed by several really down years? I wouldn’t. I’m happy that the team I love to follow is poised to remain relevant and a SB competitor year after year after year. That SB win didn’t seem to have such a great impact on Rams fans after it was over. In fact, it didn’t even seem to create more Rams fans. They can have that model. I’ll take “the process” - the good with the bad. 

[wppete]

9 minutes ago, vincec said:

I occasionally visit other fan boards to try and get some first hand perspective on things and TBD is, by far, the mildest fan board I’ve seen. That’s what makes all the people slamming the “poisonous” atmosphere on this board strange to me. But it’s all a matter of perspective I guess.

I think the OP went away. He needs a long break. The stress was getting to him. I agree TBD is mild compared to a lot of other teams boards. 

[vincec]

8 minutes ago, starrymessenger said:

You are exactly right. I visit other message boards and I usually come away with the impression that this one is better, both for courtesy, restraint and level of analysis. Its not that there aren’t good posters elsewhere, it just like there seem to be more here.

Right. There is actually a lot of good thought, analysis and even original information on here. It seems that the other boards are 90% rage posts.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

11 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

I’m not sure “the process” is to continually improve the team. The team is already pretty damn good. Nobody improves over 3 or 4 loss seasons, other than making some moves aimed at getting over the playoff hump. 
 

“The process” is to build a team that remains competitive year after year. Not the Rams, throwing it all out there to try to win a SB in a 2-year window and then go straight back into a rebuild. Ideally, a new Pats. More realistically, another Chiefs or Packers. Even more down to earth, a new Panthers. McD and his mentors had that working great until his offensive AND defensive mainstays - Cam and Kuechly - both completely broke down at unusually young ages. 
 

I’ve asked it before: all other things being equal, would you give up a decade of playoff appearances for a 2 or 3 year run resulting in one SB win, followed by several really down years? I wouldn’t. I’m happy that the team I love to follow is poised to remain relevant and a SB competitor year after year after year. That SB win didn’t seem to have such a great impact on Rams fans after it was over. In fact, it didn’t even seem to create more Rams fans. They can have that model. I’ll take “the process” - the good with the bad. 

I would. All I want is a super bowl. I'm 50. I don't have the time or patience to wait another 20 years.

[The Frankish Reich]

1 minute ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

I would. All I want is a super bowl. I'm 50. I don't have the time or patience to wait another 20 years.

Well let’s just say I’ve got a few years on you. And I’m enjoying these Bills seasons after the two decade drought. For me it’s more like another multi-year rebuild would just cause me to lose interest. Maybe forever. If you stay really good and are always winning your division or coming close, that Saints/Brees or Colts/Manning or Giants/Manning or Packers/Rodgers or Steelers/Ben year will come, and you will get that SB parade you’ve been waiting for all your life. 

[Negan]

I think Bills fans in general are becoming more aware of the deficiencies of this team, front office, and coaching staff.  The rose colored glasses are off and the process seems to be treading on E.  

 

[SoCal Deek]

I’m not sure why this is complicated or confusing to anyone. The Bills are obviously competitive but have just as obviously reached a plateau. Their recent playoff resume is growing ever longer by the year. Many of us want to see them take the next step, but the organization appears stubbornly resistant, and looks to many of us to be content where they are. It’s a simple debate. 

[The Wiz]

1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m not sure why this is complicated or confusing to anyone. The Bills are obviously competitive but have just as obviously reached a plateau. Their recent playoff resume is growing ever longer by the year. Many of us want to see them take the next step, but the organization appears stubbornly resistant, and looks to many of us to be content where they are. It’s a simple debate. 

I don't think many are content with where they are.  I think they are happy where they have come from but won't find any fan that doesn't want more.

[Chaos]

24 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

I would. All I want is a super bowl. I'm 50. I don't have the time or patience to wait another 20 years.

You are actually young among active posters on this board.  Lots of people in their 60's 70's and 80's. My guess is that 10% of the active posters have a life expectancy shorter than Josh Allen's remaining career expectancy.  My personsal opinion is that Josh is the last super star QB the Bills will have in my lifetime, and my sense of urgency for the Bills to win is to take advantage of Allen's talent before it is too late. 

[BillsFanForever19]

On 2/11/2023 at 11:19 AM, Dr. K said:

I went away for the last weeks since the loss to the Bengals thinking that of course people are going to act out their disappointment; it's natural, I thought, let them get it out of their system. But it's as bad this morning as ever.  

 

I'm in the same spot as you. I figured things would chill out after some time and especially after it became clear no one was going anywhere.

 

But it's just as bad now as it was right after the loss. I can understand the fears that maybe this is far as this coaching staff can get us and of Beane's Drafts.

 

But is this what the board is going to be all 2023? People posting that the coaching staff and front office need to go unsolicited in every reply? Secretly or not so secretly rooting on the teams demise so that there will be change?

 

It's become a really depressing toxic place of late for sure.

[John from Riverside]

2 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

I'm in the same spot as you. I figured things would chill out after some time and especially after it became clear no one was going anywhere.

 

But it's just as bad now as it was right after the loss. I can understand the fears that maybe this is far as this coaching staff can get us and of Beane's Drafts.

 

But is this what the board is going to be all 2023? People posting that the coaching staff and front office need to go unsolicited in every reply? Secretly or not so secretly rooting on the teams demise so that there will be change?

 

It's become a really depressing toxic place of late for sure.

Buckle up because we’re going to see this going into next year and now, even after we win games the people that feel they have the right to everything we’re gonna be crying after wins because they weren’t dominant enough and there’s gonna be more people doing it now because it’s become acceptable
 

It’s unfortunate, but it’s happening

[gobills404]

It’s simple. Sports fandom is supposed to be fun and something that has a positive impact on our lives. Unfortunately, a lot of fans view anything less than a championship as a catastrophic failure and will therefore be disappointed and bitter towards an overwhelming majority of seasons. It’s a phenomenon known as “being a miserable person”.

[Figster]

10 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m not sure why this is complicated or confusing to anyone. The Bills are obviously competitive but have just as obviously reached a plateau. Their recent playoff resume is growing ever longer by the year. Many of us want to see them take the next step, but the organization appears stubbornly resistant, and looks to many of us to be content where they are. It’s a simple debate. 

Signing Von Miller is not what I would call a content where they are kind of move IMO. More a look how close we came so lets find the missing piece to the puzzle. The missing piece to the puzzle wasn't there in the playoffs. Its doubtful to me the McBeane regime is content where they are about anything IMO. Our HC never lost a wrestling match. Content with losing? I don't think so...

Edited February 14, 2023 by Figster

[Billsfan1972]

Yes us "malcontents" are out in force and have turned this place poisonous.  

 

I love the title of this thread and the OP and how upset he is that people post their thoughts on the Bills.

 

During the year the Bills went 13-3 and those three losses were all mind numbing and really could be blamed on bad luck, bounces, coaching, play calls or situational awareness.  

 

But again after the bye week things slowly took a turn and some here noted that things were off and though injuries certainly played a part, the team kept winning, but in general did not seem to be playing at expected levels.

 

And when those concerns were raised here, they were for the most part drowned out by the majority.

 

So then came Cincy and yep what a clinker, but it affirmed much of what was said and commented earlier and yes the season and expectations dashed and as is want we crawled out from the woodwork and said "Told you so".

 

No Cincy & KC are not head and shoulders better then Buffalo, so those who try and rationalize it I'll disagree.  This is still a SB winning team and next year I hope all you "others" come here the second week of February and say "Told you so, Buffalo Bills SB Champions" 

 

Then I'll be the one to start a 2024 post saying how Poisonous this site is.....😉

[SCBills]

13 hours ago, Negan said:

I think Bills fans in general are becoming more aware of the deficiencies of this team, front office, and coaching staff.  The rose colored glasses are off and the process seems to be treading on E.  

 

This. 
 

There’s been fans openly questioning draft picks and decisions for a couple years now, but we always believed we were on the same level as KC/CIN, so… “trust the process”. 
 

Then this year happened. 
 

Beane, once again, drafted a guy on Day 2 that makes no sense.  We, once again, struggled to utilize high picks.  We, once again, were outdone at the trade deadline by our peer contenders.  
 

Were once again bringing back Frazier, who is the opposite of KC/Spags.  Heavy investment, fails in the post-season.  Compared to moderate investment, gets better as the season goes on. 
 

Beane’s comments sound like nothings going to change. 
 

He sounded defeated in his presser in acknowledging we don’t have many moves to be made this off-season, except we do …. He doesn’t need to keep Oliver, he doesn’t need to re-up Edmunds.. but it seems in his mind that those guys must be here next year, but I can tell you one thing… if Veach ran this team, I doubt either would be on the roster in 23.   Veach would then have 24M to spend on Offense. 

[Dr. Who]

4 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

Buckle up because we’re going to see this going into next year and now, even after we win games the people that feel they have the right to everything we’re gonna be crying after wins because they weren’t dominant enough and there’s gonna be more people doing it now because it’s become acceptable
 

It’s unfortunate, but it’s happening

I think you're misreading the room. Sure, there are some fans who are unrealistic, but that is not where much of the current discontent is coming from. Read through SCBills' post above. I was not one of those bitter about "style points." A win is a win. There are problems and the past year made some of them evident. Folks are concerned they won't be adequately addressed.

[Billsfan1972]

1 minute ago, Dr. Who said:

I think you're misreading the room. Sure, there are some fans who are unrealistic, but that is not where much of the current discontent is coming from. Read through SCBills' post above. I was not one of those bitter about "style points." A win is a win. There are problems and the past year made some of them evident. Folks are concerned they won't be adequately addressed.

Please clarify.  Absolutely right a win is a win & style points don't count, but every week many expected things to get better and things to click and they never did.

 

I was at the forefront concerned things were off and was told "Not to worry".  The Bills I'm convinced were a 13-3 team, but maybe 11-5 would have lit a fire under them and the coaching to change things come the playoffs?

 

[CoudyBills]

God forbid everyone doesn't flock to TBD to tell you it's all going to be okay.  

[Dr. Who]

Just now, Billsfan1972 said:

Please clarify.  Absolutely right a win is a win & style points don't count, but every week many expected things to get better and things to click and they never did.

 

I was at the forefront concerned things were off and was told "Not to worry".  The Bills I'm convinced were a 13-3 team, but maybe 11-5 would have lit a fire under them and the coaching to change things come the playoffs?

 

Well, I'm responding to the fella who said "we’re gonna be crying after wins because they weren’t dominant enough and there’s gonna be more people doing it now because it’s become acceptable." Last season, you could point to injuries, weather related issues, Damar, et al. as factors that may have contributed to the slog the season became. I understand why folks could respond to those highlighting problems that there were reasonable mitigating factors. Nonetheless, the lack of post-season success, and the absolutely miserable, flat performance at home to end the year are indicative of problems with the roster build and coaching that extend beyond the exigencies of a disappointing season. 

 

I already wrote upthread that I think Bills' fans from the critical to the enthusiastic ought to be welcomed. Only the trolls are worthy of disparagement. In season, folks are going to credit those who share their sentiments and disagree with those who don't. That's human, and nothing will change that.

[papazoid]

have a take, move along, doesn't matter who does or doesn't think alike.

 

PRO: bills are 3rd favorite to win next years SB.....that's  fair and pretty darn good

 

CON: if they want get to #1.....top priority is improve the O-line, add a WR2 and get healthy on defense

[SoCal Deek]

4 hours ago, Figster said:

Signing Von Miller is not what I would call a content where they are kind of move IMO. More a look how close we came so lets find the missing piece to the puzzle. The missing piece to the puzzle wasn't there in the playoffs. Its doubtful to me the McBeane regime is content where they are about anything IMO. Our HC never lost a wrestling match. Content with losing? I don't think so...

With all due respect, there’s a big difference between your ‘content with losing’ take away and my perception of the utter lack of preparation that we saw against the Bengals. Nobody wants to lose…obviously. My point is that the Bills simply don’t appear to be in the moment when the moment is there to be in. Too many collapses and head scratching lack of effort. I blame the coaches for that. Do I like watching them win games during the regular season. Sure! They’ve done that for quite awhile now. Now I want the Team to be laser focused at the moment when the games are there to be won or lost in the playoffs. 

[H2o]

4 hours ago, gobills404 said:

It’s simple. Sports fandom is supposed to be fun and something that has a positive impact on our lives. Unfortunately, a lot of fans view anything less than a championship as a catastrophic failure and will therefore be disappointed and bitter towards an overwhelming majority of seasons. It’s a phenomenon known as “being a miserable person”.

And what does misery love?............ Company. Because they are miserable, they try to drag whoever else they can down into the same pit of misery. 

 

[teef]

i think it's worth pointing out that there's a difference between being negative/critical and being whiney.  there's a big difference.  

[Dr. Who]

8 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

With all due respect, there’s a big difference between your ‘content with losing’ take away and my perception of the utter lack of preparation that we saw against the Bengals. Nobody wants to lose…obviously. My point is that the Bills simply don’t appear to be in the moment when the moment is there to be in. Too many collapses and head scratching lack of effort. I blame the coaches for that. Do I like watching them win games during the regular season. Sure! They’ve done that for quite awhile now. Now I want the Team to be laser focused at the moment when the games are there to be won or lost in the playoffs. 

You watch all those regular season games and sweat the close ones in hopes of getting to the playoffs. The reason you want to get to the playoffs is to win them. A postseason that never ends in a SB win is all foreplay, no happy ending. When you're waiting decades for the happy ending, folks are going to get surly. (Hope this isn't whiney, Teef😜)

[SoCal Deek]

14 minutes ago, teef said:

i think it's worth pointing out that there's a difference between being negative/critical and being whiney.  there's a big difference.  

I don’t read any of this as whiney. I just see fans being truly frustrated. To them, the Bills appear to have painted themselves into a corner, and fans think it’s going to take a miracle draft to fix it…or…a change of coaching strategy (that clearly isn’t coming).