Should we trade Ed Oliver?

[GunnerBill]

25 minutes ago, SectionC3 said:

 

 

I think this depends on how we look at the draft, and the other options on the board.  Say, for sake of argument, we’re dying to add a quality WR.  But we know we can’t get it done at pick 27, and we don’t want to burn draft capital to trade up.  I don’t think this is the case, but perhaps we also feel confident that we could either draft Oliver’s replacement at 27 or sign a replacement in FA to a more economical deal than what Oliver has (Ford, perhaps?).  In that context it might make sense to move Oliver to open cap space and help us acquire something that we can’t get at 27.  What that something is, and who would be willing to take on Oliver for that purpose, is beyond me.  Bottom line, I guess, is that there are a lot of moving parts here and how they perceive their needs and the ability to fill those needs in the draft might dictate their approach to Oliver.  

 

That would be a bad move. Trading Oliver for picks in this draft makes no sense. None at all. 

 

If they trade him for a guy who can make a difference on offense now, immediately, I am here for it. Trading him for a pick in a garbage draft is nuts. I'd rather let him play out the year and take the comp pick later.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Here is something to keep in mind: there is a very good chance our 2 LBs will be 220 and 224 pounds. Ed is a solid good player but being 287 has it’s disadvantages keeping LBers clean. Having a larger 1Tech might be critical now. 

[gobills404]

4 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

Oliver and Gabe for Darnell Mooney and an early day 3 pick. Then use the money it frees up to sign another vet DT like Daquan that will actually show up and do their job every Sunday. 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, 4merper4mer said:

Noticed you quickly edited the post where you didn’t even remember what you had posted 5 minutes ago and changed your tune.  
 

Jeudy is and was overrated.  That doesn’t mean everyone from Bama is overrated but we have a little experience with some.  Ruggs also played for the same Bama team.  How’s he doing?  
 

Your diatribe is to dump Oliver because he hasn’t produced and you’re advocating picking up a guy that ………hasn’t produced but has excuses?

 

Yes, I have focuses other than this board and forget things.  It doesn't change my argument.

 

Come on dude.  You gave two specific reasons why Jeudy was overrated and that's what I replied to....which applies to anyone player from Alabama.

Oh Ruggs played for the same Alabama team...you got me!  I think Jaylan Waddle played for Bama but not sure...was it UTEP or something?  Is this how we cherry pick?

 

I guess QB's do not matter.  "Jeudy hasn't produced with a horrible Russell Wilson, career back up in Bridgewater and another back up in Drew Lock".  With Wilson last year, he had 972 yards and 6 TD's and 67 receptions....again with Wilson as his QB.  

Are you under the impression that a WR would produce more with a better QB?  Mind blown...I know.

[4merper4mer]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Agree with the bolded. Ford is better as a 1T and even Pete Carroll has said that. He would be a clear step down from Ed.

Evans is one thing but Jeudy and Hopkins are high $, and low durability/production.  
 

For me, I think the salary cap jockeys on a message board are silly.  That’s Beane’s job.  Equating Oliver to a WR acquisition based on salary cap stuff is something for Madden.

[BuffBillsForLife]

If you can find a team willing to give up a 1 or equivalent for Oliver you take it no questions asked.  

[4merper4mer]

Just now, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Yes, I have focuses other than this board and forget things.  It doesn't change my argument.

 

Come on dude.  You gave two specific reasons why Jeudy was overrated and that's what I replied to....which applies to anyone player from Alabama.

Oh Ruggs played for the same Alabama team...you got me!  I think Jaylan Waddle played for Bama but not sure...was it UTEP or something?  Is this how we cherry pick?

 

I guess QB's do not matter.  "Jeudy hasn't produced with a horrible Russell Wilson, career back up in Bridgewater and another back up in Drew Lock".  With Wilson last year, he had 972 yards and 6 TD's and 67 receptions....again with Wilson as his QB.  

Are you under the impression that a WR would produce more with a better QB?  Mind blown...I know.

Lol you gave a rudimentary reason for Oliver being subpar and then forgot this reason in five minutes.  But you’re solid on not only our answer via trade but how this should be achieved?  Shirley,

 

At least according to reports, Jeudy would cost more in draft capital than Diggs did and he would have to be extended soon.  According to your GMing it would also create a hole in the DL.  
 

Spoiler alert: Jeudy would be hurt again by week 3.

 

I’ll pass.

[djp14150]

56 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

But any move away from him is almist certainly a significant downgrade. You only do that to get something good back in return. A mid round pick in this ***** draft ain't it. 

 

you could flip him for a different player post draft.

[4merper4mer]

After we trade Oliver and dump Gabe Davis, who will be our next villain.  My money is on the combo of Spencer Brown and Tre White but Who knows?

[SCBills]

Twitter threads from Bears people are hilarious right now...

 

All of them speculating Oliver might be getting traded there due to his posts.

 

Bears fans all getting hype wanting this trade to happen.  Bills fans jumping in the comments like take him, please.  Bears fans like wait, what?

[Royale with Cheese]

3 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Lol you gave a rudimentary reason for Oliver being subpar and then forgot this reason in five minutes.  But you’re solid on not only our answer via trade but how this should be achieved?  Shirley,

 

At least according to reports, Jeudy would cost more in draft capital than Diggs did and he would have to be extended soon.  According to your GMing it would also create a hole in the DL.  
 

Spoiler alert: Jeudy would be hurt again by week 3.

 

I’ll pass.

 

Did you miss the part where I said he's not in the backfield enough?  Please tell me and the rest of this board who agrees Oliver hasn't lived up to his top 10 status, on how he's been that integral of a part.  Tell us how he consistently is in this backfield disrupting plays.  Keyword is consistently.  I know he's flashed here and there.

 

This board has been discussing Hopkins and Jeudy and we are discussing if we would trade Oliver straight up.  But for whatever reason, you've got your panties in a wad.  I'm not the only one discussing this trade deal and whether we would do it.

 

Are you the guy that once said losing to an NFC team actually hurts us?

3 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Twitter threads from Bears people are hilarious right now...

 

All of them speculating Oliver might be getting traded there due to his posts.

 

Bears fans all getting hype wanting this trade to happen.  Bills fans jumping in the comments like take him, please.  Bears fans like wait, what?

 

Browns fans are all over Jeudy right now.

[4merper4mer]

3 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Did you miss the part where I said he's not in the backfield enough?  Please tell me and the rest of this board who agrees Oliver hasn't lived up to his top 10 status, on how he's been that integral of a part.  Tell us how he consistently is in this backfield disrupting plays.  Keyword is consistently.  I know he's flashed here and there.

 

This board has been discussing Hopkins and Jeudy and we are discussing if we would trade Oliver straight up.  But for whatever reason, you've got your panties in a wad.  I'm not the only one discussing this trade deal and whether we would do it.

 

Are you the guy that once said losing to an NFC team actually hurts us?

Where he was drafted is no longer relevant.  What matters is whether he contributes to the team.  Are you saying if he had been drafted in the 5th then we should keep him for 2023?  Other than a cap figure, which is Beane’s job, not yours,, how does that make any sense at all?

 

Tua was 5 overall or something like that.  He hasn’t lived up to that.  Should the fish just dump him with no plan for succession?

25 minutes ago, gobills404 said:

Oliver and Gabe for Darnell Mooney and an early day 3 pick. Then use the money it frees up to sign another vet DT like Daquan that will actually show up and do their job every Sunday. 

That would leave us pariahless.  

[Airseven]

29 minutes ago, BuffBillsForLife said:

If you can find a team willing to give up a 1 or equivalent for Oliver you take it no questions asked.  

 

You won't find a team.

[Royale with Cheese]

12 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Where he was drafted is no longer relevant.  What matters is whether he contributes to the team.  Are you saying if he had been drafted in the 5th then we should keep him for 2023?  Other than a cap figure, which is Beane’s job, not yours,, how does that make any sense at all?

 

Tua was 5 overall or something like that.  He hasn’t lived up to that.  Should the fish just dump him with no plan for succession?

 

You are all over the place my god and another cherry picked player.  You bring up Ruggs and now Tua lol.  What about Devin Bush?  The Steelers dumped him.

Are you going to continue cherry picking?  Oliver and Tua are completely different situations lol.

 

How do you know we wouldn't have a succession plan?  You know what else is Beane's job and not yours or mine?  Succession planning.

 

This is exactly how I view Oliver.

 

 

Edited March 22, 2023 by Royale with Cheese

[SCBills]

Ed Oliver is literally trending nationally on Twitter

 

Currently #19 in United States trends

 

3 cryptic IG stories.. 

 

Amazing

 

 

Edited March 22, 2023 by SCBills

[4merper4mer]

1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

You are all over the place my god and another cherry picked player.  You bring up Ruggs and now Tua lol.  What about Devin Bush?  The Steelers dumped him.

Are you going to continue cherry picking?  Oliver and Tua are completely different situations lol.

 

How do you know we wouldn't have a succession plan?  You know what else is Beane's job and not yours or mine?  Succession planning.

 

This is exactly how I view Oliver.

 

 

Try to keep up.  Oliver is a viable player under contract, even if some don’t think it matches his draft slot years ago.  Dumping him creates a hole on a team wishing to contend.  The same is true of Tua.  The same is not true of Bush or Josh Rosen, thus they were not mentioned.

[QCity]

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

Ed Oliver is literally trending nationally on Twitter

 

Currently #21 in United States trends

 

He's creating and deleting posts because it's become abundantly clear to his camp that we aren't going to come close to meeting their long-term contracts wishes.

 

We'll likely lose him for nothing after this year, so I'm not sure why so many want to die on the Oliver hill.

[Steptide]

11 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Ed Oliver is literally trending nationally on Twitter

 

Currently #19 in United States trends

 

3 cryptic IG stories.. 

 

Amazing

 

 

His tweets/stories stem from something. I'm just waiting for some more beane magic 

[Royale with Cheese]

2 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Try to keep up.  Oliver is a viable player under contract, even if some don’t think it matches his draft slot years ago.  Dumping him creates a hole on a team wishing to contend.  The same is true of Tua.  The same is not true of Bush or Josh Rosen, thus they were not mentioned.

 

He doesn't match the $10.7 million dollars his cap hit is this year.  You're pounding the sand for an above average player.  You are in the minority here.

 

Again, why are you just assuming we have no succession plan?  Our defense is going to cripple without an above average DT?

We have a bigger hole at WR and potentially the OL.    

 

I would rather not pay $10.7 million for a "viable" player who we won't resign to a long term extension.

 

What sounds better?  Oliver for Hopkins/Evans/Jeudy or keep Oliver, have him walk next year and get nothing.

What sounds better to you?  I honestly don't know.

[BuffaloRebound]

I like it.  Somebody at OBD sending him the message that he’s gotta up his game.  I don’t think he ends up getting traded unless it’s for a Hopkins, Jeudy or Simmons.  More likely McBeane is trying to light a fire under him.  

[Dr. Who]

I'm waiting for the reboot of The Odd Couple starring Royale with Cheese and 4merper4mer. It's going to be a dramedy where every episode will end in a cliffhanger. Will they ever agree or possibly the series ends when one of them explodes or knocks off the other?

[Simon]

1 hour ago, IndyMark said:

And by beating those double teams, he finished with 5 TFL’s and 2.5 sacks? You have a funny definition of ‘beating’.

 

Also, disrupting and pressures are strawman-like arguments.  That is like saying Gabe Davis almost caught the ball when the reality is he did not catch it. Ed does not finish plays, clearly.
 

Stop with the rose colored glasses. There were plenty of times he was single-blocked and taken out of a play.
 

Double teams all year? Not close. Triple teamed is flat out comical.

 

Most on here would lambaste Beane if he signed a DT tomorrow on a 1 yr - $10m deal that last year produced 5 TFL and 2.5 sacks while being undersized.

 

Ed is worth 1/2 that. Sure he has 3 good games a year. That should not be acceptable, but if it is for you that is just curious.

 

 

Thank you for clarifying that you don't watch games, can only judge DT's on statistics and think that disrupting offenses is meaningless.

I'll step out now.

 

[Alphadawg7]

6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

That would be a bad move. Trading Oliver for picks in this draft makes no sense. None at all. 

 

If they trade him for a guy who can make a difference on offense now, immediately, I am here for it. Trading him for a pick in a garbage draft is nuts. I'd rather let him play out the year and take the comp pick later.

 

Im with you on this...I do think we should trade Oliver simply because I think there is almost no chance they pay him and extend him next year.  But, I would MUCH rather see Oliver included in a trade that brought back immediate help somewhere on this team plus a draft pick either this year or next year.  

 

For example:  If we trade Oliver and get his salary off the books so we can make a move for say Hopkins, then that is the kind of move that can move the needle for this team this season.  Bills w/Hopkins >>> Bills w/Oliver IMHO.  And if we can say get AZ to eat $9M of Hopkins salary, maybe we can just ship Oliver in a package for Hopkins where the cap hits wash this year.  Still need to get his next years cap hits down, but they can just do a small extension to handle that.  

 

But Oliver has more value to the team IMHO than just shipping him out for a decent draft pick slot in a mediocre at best draft.  We are still pressing for a SB this year, so I don't think just opening another hole is the best approach unless we are upgrading somewhere else.  Oliver isn't a bum, he just isn't really moving the needle either due to his inconsistency.   

[4merper4mer]

8 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

He doesn't match the $10.7 million dollars his cap hit is this year.  You're pounding the sand for an above average player.  You are in the minority here.

 

Again, why are you just assuming we have no succession plan?  Our defense is going to cripple without an above average DT?

We have a bigger hole at WR and potentially the OL.    

 

I would rather not pay $10.7 million for a "viable" player who we won't resign to a long term extension.

 

What sounds better?  Oliver for Hopkins/Evans/Jeudy or keep Oliver, have him walk next year and get nothing.

What sounds better to you?  I honestly don't know.

Ooooh I’m in the minority.

 

There are so many flaws in your “logic” that it is impossible to enumerate them without exceeding the limits of whatever server this thing is running on.  Here are the highlights:

 

Oliver is under contract.  If it is so obvious to you he is not worth his contract and you are in fact correct, it just might be equally obvious to prospective trade partners who happen to be. NFL GMs.
 

Your assumption that Oliver departing means one of those receivers arriving is based on literally nothing.  Is it plausible to you that the two things are unrelated?  

 

By your own player evaluation, which I’ll grant you is faulty at best, Oliver is a viable player.  When you jettison a viable player, it creates a hole.  Your answer to this is “Um, somebody”……paraphrased, not an actual quote.

 

Your evaluation of WRs seems to be based on draft position, performance from the distant past, or I don’t know what….maybe Madden….but your evaluation is faulty.  Trading for Jeudy is a giant risk, while trading for Hopkins is like straight up cutting Oliver.  
 

Oliver also serves a viable role to this board as pariah after the departure of Frazier and Edmunds,  if he goes, I fear that will fall to Tre White and I really like Tre.  Admittedly this is a personal bias of mine.

 

 

[Airseven]

1 hour ago, SCBills said:

 

 

This makes a lot of sense in terms of need, cap space, and surplus picks. Perhaps for 1 of their 2 4ths and 1 of their 2 7ths.

Edited March 22, 2023 by Airseven

[Back2Buff]

These players know what is happening around them.  Look at the Mckenzie tweets before the Harty signing.

[Aussie Joe]

Only doubt I would have about trading him is that he is going to be motivated playing for a new contract this year…he could have a big year ..

 

Then  .. happy that he goes elsewhere and we can get the comp pick after a year of good play in the middle of peak JA Super Bowl window without opening up another hole.. 

 

 

[OldTimer1960]

Completely unfounded, my brother in Vegas says the rumor is Oliver, pick 27 and Bills’ 4th to Bears for pick 9.  I have no opinion on that other than if they already know his salary demands for next year and won’t pay it, then trade makes some sense.  I *think* that would free up $10M in cap possibly allowing them to sign a FA LB.

[Aussie Joe]

8 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

Completely unfounded, my brother in Vegas says the rumor is Oliver, pick 27 and Bills’ 4th to Bears for pick 9.  I have no opinion on that other than if they already know his salary demands for next year and won’t pay it, then trade makes some sense.  I *think* that would free up $10M in cap possibly allowing them to sign a FA LB.

Vegas you say? Did he hear this around the Craps table? 

[colin]

8 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

Completely unfounded, my brother in Vegas says the rumor is Oliver, pick 27 and Bills’ 4th to Bears for pick 9.  I have no opinion on that other than if they already know his salary demands for next year and won’t pay it, then trade makes some sense.  I *think* that would free up $10M in cap possibly allowing them to sign a FA LB.

 

that would be a big get, kinda risky cuz you really need that pick to work out, but you also get a potential difference maker at a low salary for a while.  the rook vs oliver cost might make room for another move too.

[JohnNord]

1 hour ago, Simon said:

 

Thank you for clarifying that you don't watch games, can only judge DT's on statistics and think that disrupting offenses is meaningless.

I'll step out now.

 

Questioning Oliver’s production over the past 4 years given his draft status is a very logical take.  

[BillsShredder83]

5 hours ago, SCBills said:

 

What's "meaningful"?

 

I am clearly not a big Ed Oliver fan, but tweets like this are also annoying.   We can move Oliver.  Look at what some of these DT's are getting paid..  

 

He's a young player, and he is talented - despite the very valid criticisms.  I am sure quite a few GM's were high on out of college.  It's a one year commitment and you get him in-house, with the ability to see how he fits on your Defense.  

 

 

agreed about return being minimal. would much rather package him and a pick for a player, or for higher pick then the one we send them

[JohnNord]

13 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

Completely unfounded, my brother in Vegas says the rumor is Oliver, pick 27 and Bills’ 4th to Bears for pick 9.  I have no opinion on that other than if they already know his salary demands for next year and won’t pay it, then trade makes some sense.  I *think* that would free up $10M in cap possibly allowing them to sign a FA LB.

This rumor started on Twitter because Eddie posted highlights from his game against Chicago on his Instagram story.  Apparently the jump from 27 to 9 would roughly equate his value. 
 

I wouldn’t buy into these rumors:

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, 4merper4mer said:

Ooooh I’m in the minority.

 

There are so many flaws in your “logic” that it is impossible to enumerate them without exceeding the limits of whatever server this thing is running on.  Here are the highlights:

 

Oliver is under contract.  If it is so obvious to you he is not worth his contract and you are in fact correct, it just might be equally obvious to prospective trade partners who happen to be. NFL GMs.
 

Your assumption that Oliver departing means one of those receivers arriving is based on literally nothing.  Is it plausible to you that the two things are unrelated?  

 

By your own player evaluation, which I’ll grant you is faulty at best, Oliver is a viable player.  When you jettison a viable player, it creates a hole.  Your answer to this is “Um, somebody”……paraphrased, not an actual quote.

 

Your evaluation of WRs seems to be based on draft position, performance from the distant past, or I don’t know what….maybe Madden….but your evaluation is faulty.  Trading for Jeudy is a giant risk, while trading for Hopkins is like straight up cutting Oliver.  
 

Oliver also serves a viable role to this board as pariah after the departure of Frazier and Edmunds,  if he goes, I fear that will fall to Tre White and I really like Tre.  Admittedly this is a personal bias of mine.

 

 

 

Teams have different values on players.  It's why players hit the open market to test FA.  First time in an NFL offseason?

 

I don't have that assumption at all.  I'm kinda flabbergasted that this simple conversation is so difficult to you.

It's a thread topic on a board if we should trade Oliver and what would you trade him for.  None of us know what's going behind closed doors and we are just discussing options.  You've been on this board for years and I know this isn't the first thread about what to do with a player.

 

Seriously, why is this so hard for you?  

Edited March 22, 2023 by Royale with Cheese

[LABILLBACKER]

On 1/25/2023 at 5:57 PM, JaCrispy said:

I would trade him and use the cap savings to get a top OL if possible…

 

Oliver is just average to me, so finding his replacement shouldn’t be difficult…

I'm sure they're trying hard to trade him right now.  His highest trade value is probably a 3rd but more likely a 4th.  It's the cap savings that is valuable.  Use that money to find a RT and just use (2) 1 tech DT's.  Oliver just doesn't generate sacks.

[BillsShredder83]

2 hours ago, 4merper4mer said:

Noticed you quickly edited the post where you didn’t even remember what you had posted 5 minutes ago and changed your tune.  
 

Jeudy is and was overrated.  That doesn’t mean everyone from Bama is overrated but we have a little experience with some.  Ruggs also played for the same Bama team.  How’s he doing?  
 

Your diatribe is to dump Oliver because he hasn’t produced and you’re advocating picking up a guy that ………hasn’t produced but has excuses?

Very strange comp. 

 

OJ Simpson was an actor and a murderer.

Where was Ashton Kutcher when Jon Benet Ramsey went missing?

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Im with you on this...I do think we should trade Oliver simply because I think there is almost no chance they pay him and extend him next year.  But, I would MUCH rather see Oliver included in a trade that brought back immediate help somewhere on this team plus a draft pick either this year or next year.  

 

For example:  If we trade Oliver and get his salary off the books so we can make a move for say Hopkins, then that is the kind of move that can move the needle for this team this season.  Bills w/Hopkins >>> Bills w/Oliver IMHO.  And if we can say get AZ to eat $9M of Hopkins salary, maybe we can just ship Oliver in a package for Hopkins where the cap hits wash this year.  Still need to get his next years cap hits down, but they can just do a small extension to handle that.  

 

But Oliver has more value to the team IMHO than just shipping him out for a decent draft pick slot in a mediocre at best draft.  We are still pressing for a SB this year, so I don't think just opening another hole is the best approach unless we are upgrading somewhere else.  Oliver isn't a bum, he just isn't really moving the needle either due to his inconsistency.   

Would love to get Dhop for Oliver. You can even throw in Gabe. Dhop is elite! Now this would be a game changing move.

[skibum]

I think the DL would be dangerously thin if they traded Ed. But you never know, maybe they have a plan for that.

[BillsShredder83]

My biggest motivator in trading him:

 

$10m Offense >>> $10m Defense

 

We'd need a plan first, so IF he were to be moved I dont see it happening quickly.  Admittedly I dont know FA OL well, but the idea of a $10m RT or a beast guard is intriguing af.  Defenses are handicapped, mental tie break will always lean towards offense for me.  An OL plays every down, vs rotational guy (strike 2).

 

Time to check out the avail OL list...............

[BillsShredder83]

54 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

Completely unfounded, my brother in Vegas says the rumor is Oliver, pick 27 and Bills’ 4th to Bears for pick 9.  I have no opinion on that other than if they already know his salary demands for next year and won’t pay it, then trade makes some sense.  I *think* that would free up $10M in cap possibly allowing them to sign a FA LB.

Sounds unlikely (nothing personal, stuff like this is more interesting than keeping to yourself, so thanks).

 

Moving past that, again, for fun...... who does everyone think we'd be gunning for if we had #9 overall?

28 minutes ago, skibum said:

I think the DL would be dangerously thin if they traded Ed. But you never know, maybe they have a plan for that.

if we were to turn this deal into a nice OL or WR, that frees up a pick to the defense rd 1 or 2, that i dont believe should be used that way as of today