Will DeAndre Hopkins be available this offseason?

[Dr. Who]

3 minutes ago, Aussie Joe said:

Man.. relax…see what happens …

 

This could drag out to draft day…

 

in a negotiation .. you don’t just cave into the demands from the other side straight away 

 

That AZ GM is going to end up with 27 and the Bills paying out the whole salary with IronMaidenBills at the helm.

[Aussie Joe]

Just now, Dr. Who said:

That AZ GM is going to end up with 27 and the Bills paying out the whole salary with IronMaidenBills at the helm.

And maybe even Josh Allen if the Arizona GM asked for him

[Dr. Who]

Just now, Aussie Joe said:

And maybe even Josh Allen if the Arizona GM asked for him

Nah, the fella is a little crazy, but not that crazy.

[Big Blitz]

58 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

That quote isn't exactly right. He posts the actual video in the tweet below:

 

Jeremy Fowler says Arizona is asking for "a 2nd round pick and more." He uses the McCaffrey trade as an example, he does not say Arizona wants a 2nd and a 3rd. So this isn't new information. The report all along has been that Hopkins is available for a 2nd rounder plus a conditional pick.

 

As I said earlier if Beane is playing a game of chicken and waiting until Arizona drops their asking price closer to the draft, that's fine. But if he ultimately has to lose the game of chicken to acquire a true WR2 then he should just do it. A brief history of Bills 2nd round picks in the McDermott era:

 

James Cook

Boogie Basham

AJ Epenesa

Cody Ford

Zay Jones

Dion Dawkins

 

Dawkins is the only player on that list where you would take his career with the Bills over two years of DeAndre Hopkins.

 

This hasn't been said enough - does everyone realize Gabe Davis cost us the #1 seed last year? He dropped a TD in the Dolphins loss. He dropped that ridiculous 70 yard pass on 4th and 21 in the Jets loss which at the very least put us into position to tie the game. And then against the Bengals in the playoffs when we still had a fighting chance he dropped a 3rd down deep throw which effectively ended the game for us. All of that plus he had trouble separating most of the year.

 

So just know if you don't want the Bills to give up a 2nd for Hopkins, you're signing up for another year of that. I don't get it.

 

 

I don’t understand why the 1st rounder isn’t on the table.  
 

Unless we’re bidding against ourselves obviously.  
 

If the Chiefs are in this that’s what it will cost.
 

 

Arizona gets

Bills 1st 

 

Bills Get

Hopkins 

Arizona 3rd RD pick 

 

 

I’d do this - the cost of moving up to TRY to get a WR will cost more.  

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

10 minutes ago, Aussie Joe said:

Ok… I don’t want a GM that is just going to pay whatever it takes to acquire players 

 

 The other night he wanted to give up Milano, Oliver & a 2nd for Mike Evans.😂

 

 

[LyndonvilleBill]

6 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I'm not saying Davis singlehandedly cost us the #1 seed. But we're talking about upgradeable spots on the team. Allen isn't upgradeable. Dorsey isn't getting replaced. Frazier is already gone.

 

I'm not complaining about Davis just to complain. We have a real opportunity to upgrade a part of the offense that was a major factor in why we fell short last year. Playing the blame game is missing the point. I'm focusing on something the Bills can actually control.

I know your not complaining just to complain. I enjoy most of your posts and opinions. I just think people are enamored with a big name wr and one player is not going to do it. IMO, costs outweigh the benefit in this case. 

 

We don't need to upgrade Allen. We need him to play the way he is fully capable of. He didn't in those games. Just like I think Davis is better than what we saw last season. Dorsey just needs to get his crap together and create/have better gameplans/gamecalls. Frazier is gone, so I am expecting better results if we fill the holes on D.

 

According to many, we have already upgraded the offense with Harty, Sherfield, McGovern, Edwards and Harris. Then we should have a Healthy Allen, Knox not having to be kept in to block and Shakir in his second year. Why do we have to have an expensive, shiny new toy that's 30? I'd rather use the 2nd to fill a real need and have some money available if needed.

 

Don't get me wrong in any way. If it happens, Great and I will cheer and support the the team the same way I always do. If it doesn't,  I am not going to cry or lose any sleep over it. 😉

[SCBills]

3 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

 

 

I don’t understand why the 1st rounder isn’t on the table.  
 

Unless we’re bidding against ourselves obviously.  
 

If the Chiefs are in this that’s what it will cost.
 

 

Arizona gets

Bills 1st 

 

Bills Get

Hopkins 

Arizona 3rd RD pick 

 

 

I’d do this - the cost of moving up to TRY to get a WR will cost more.  

Absolutely no way. 
 

Even if AZ ate a ton of that contract, it’s way too much. 
 

Bills need to hit on 27.  It’s imperative. 
 

Whether it’s a Tackle (my hope), LB or best skill player (Bijan or WR) … that piece needs to be contributing low cost part of this team for the next 4 years.  
 

Edited March 25, 2023 by SCBills

[Milanos Milano]

5 minutes ago, Aussie Joe said:

Man.. relax…see what happens …

 

This could drag out to draft day…

 

in a negotiation .. you don’t just cave into the demands from the other side straight away 

 

Me personally when I negotiate, I don’t haggle when I really really want something. Nickel and diming risks spoiling the mood of the other party or risking it being taken underneath you. I only haggle on things I know I can live without or it’s meh if I win meh if I lose. 
Given other options that exist realistically (OBJ, maybe Jeudy) I’d much rather have Hopkins given what he has shown last year and during his career with less surrounding talent vs playing with Alien and Diggs. 
This is a golden opportunity and I’d hate to see it fall through the cracks because we squabbled over picks or money that isn’t going to matter if we win a super bowl. 

[LyndonvilleBill]

20 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

What if AZ says F it, and just holds onto Dhop without taking the Bills “best offer” . Sometimes bidding against yourself is necessary to land the deal. 

Nope. Move on.

[Milanos Milano]

8 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

That AZ GM is going to end up with 27 and the Bills paying out the whole salary with IronMaidenBills at the helm.

And then we now have Diggs and Hopkins headed into the draft and excited to watch the best show on Earth. It would be worth it, absolutely worth watching that play out for our Alien! 

1 minute ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

Nope. Move on.

Unacceptable. Criminal to pinch pennies over a top 15 WR, and one that would free up Diggs the entire time. 

Edited March 25, 2023 by IronMaidenBills

[GETTOTHE50]

No way in hell I’m giving up a 2nd or 3rd for deandre. Cardinals are smoking some ***** asking for that 

[cba fan]

1 hour ago, Mcg said:

I'll be sleeping on the couch for avoiding my wife for the last 2 days .

 

 

sounds like she added void years to you contract?.....lol

[SCBills]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Me personally when I negotiate, I don’t haggle when I really really want something. Nickel and diming risks spoiling the mood of the other party or risking it being taken underneath you. I only haggle on things I know I can live without or it’s meh if I win meh if I lose. 
Given other options that exist realistically (OBJ, maybe Jeudy) I’d much rather have Hopkins given what he has shown last year and during his career with less surrounding talent vs playing with Alien and Diggs. 
This is a golden opportunity and I’d hate to see it fall through the cracks because we squabbled over picks or money that isn’t going to matter if we win a super bowl. 

We don’t know if Beane is haggling.  He could have offered a fair deal based on the market.  
 

From Arizona’s side, with what is being reported .. Multiple Day 2 picks and taking on the full salary is not remotely fair market rate for this trade. 

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, GETTOTHE50 said:

No way in hell I’m giving up a 2nd or 3rd for deandre. Cardinals are smoking some ***** asking for that 

DeAndre has done nothing but put up 1,000 yard seasons with mediocre QBs and no opposite WR to take off double teams. His double team rate with his career numbers is astounding. He will absolutely blow up playing with Diggs and Allen. I can’t believe we are even having this conversation. 

[cba fan]

1 hour ago, folz said:

 

 

Whoever leaked this is trying to compare a 26-year old RB whose 3 best seasons averaged 2,080 yards and 15 TDs per against a 30-year old WR whose 3 best years averaged 1,486 yards and 9TDs? And you can't use CMC injuries as an excuse that it evens things out, when DHop has missed 15 games over the last two years due to injury/suspension (despite being healthy for most of his career prior---but he is also 30 now).

 

No doubt these are both great players, and I would love to have DHop on the Bills, if it works out (at the right price)...but this comparison is beyond ridiculous. DHop is not worth the same as CMC in trade value...and no one is buying that.

 

it was also leaked they will not get that and have come off the high ask and will only get similar to the Brandin Cooks trade like a 5th and 6th.

[HOUSE]

16 minutes ago, Aussie Joe said:

Man.. relax…see what happens …

 

This could drag out to draft day…

 

in a negotiation .. you don’t just cave into the demands from the other side straight away 

 

Oh no, 350 pages 

[akcash]

I read on Cardinals message board they might move him post June 1st. 

[Milanos Milano]

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

We don’t know if Beane is haggling.  He could have offered a fair deal based on the market.  
 

From Arizona’s side, with what is being reported .. Multiple Day 2 picks and taking on the full salary is not remotely fair market rate for this trade. 

“What good is fair market rate” if it doesn’t get you want you want? Sometimes you have to pay extra for things you want. Don’t over think it, just let it flow and deal with the fallout later. 
 

 

[HappyDays]

5 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

I don’t understand why the 1st rounder isn’t on the table.  

 

For a number of reasons. First, players that get traded a 2nd time don't get the same value. Jalen Ramsey went from two 1st round picks to a 3rd round pick. Brandin Cooks has been acquired for less value each time he's been traded. Hopkins was originally acquired by the Cardinals for a 2nd round pick. It stands to reason they won't get more back for him.

 

Second, he's past the age of 30, he's a two year rental for the team that acquires him, and he's coming off a year with a PED suspension. These factors combined lower his value as a player.

 

Third, and probably most importantly, he costs a lot against the cap and the Cardinals are apparently unwilling to retain much if any of the salary.

 

Personally I would instead use our 1st rounder to acquire Jeudy if that was the asking price. He's younger with more upside and wouldn't cause the same cap issues in 2023 or 2024. Using a 1st rounder on a 24 year old still on his rookie deal makes sense.

[LyndonvilleBill]

4 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

And then we now have Diggs and Hopkins headed into the draft and excited to watch the best show on Earth. It would be worth it, absolutely worth watching that play out for our Alien! 

Unacceptable. Criminal to pinch pennies over a top 15 WR, and one that would free up Diggs the entire time. 

It's not pennies here. You NEVER pay MSRP when you go to a dealer. I would NEVER pay "Whatever it takes" to get a player. There are ALWAYS options and choices. We just did this with Von and what happened? There are NO guarantees and overpaying for a 30 year old WR would be "criminal " or "unacceptable". 

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, LyndonvilleBill said:

It's not pennies here. You NEVER pay MSRP when you go to a dealer. I would NEVER pay "Whatever it takes" to get a player. There are ALWAYS options and choices. We just did this with Von and what happened? There are NO guarantees and overpaying for a 30 year old WR would be "criminal " or "unacceptable". 

You never pay MSRP because there are other options to choose from, more than 1. There are only so many elite WRs that are available, which drives up the price for acquisition. There are no other choices outside of Hopkins that is better, none. 

[cgg716]

17 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Absolutely no way. 
 

Even if AZ ate a ton of that contract, it’s way too much. 
 

Bills need to hit on 27.  It’s imperative. 
 

Whether it’s a Tackle (my hope), LB or best skill player (Bijan or WR) … that piece needs to be contributing low cost part of this team for the next 4 years.  
 

The other problem is that these coaches would likely bench that draft pick to start 

[Aussie Joe]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

You never pay MSRP because there are other options to choose from, more than 1. There are only so many elite WRs that are available, which drives up the price for acquisition. There are no other choices outside of Hopkins that is better, none. 

If he is so valuable, then why aren’t other teams interested ?

[Milanos Milano]

4 minutes ago, Aussie Joe said:

If he is so valuable, then why aren’t other teams interested ?

Because they are undervaluing what Hopkins brings to the field. Also, some teams don’t have the type of owners we have who are willing to eat absurd amounts of cash to win. 
Hopkins has produced everywhere he’s gone, and done it with less talent than most. OBJ had Kupp and Stafford and still struggled. Hopkins has never played with a QB or WR on the same caliber as Josh and Diggs. 
If we traded for Hopkins, he would have 1,400 yard season. Sig it. 

[HappyDays]

31 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

According to many, we have already upgraded the offense with Harty, Sherfield, McGovern, Edwards and Harris. Then we should have a Healthy Allen, Knox not having to be kept in to block and Shakir in his second year. Why do we have to have an expensive, shiny new toy that's 30? I'd rather use the 2nd to fill a real need and have some money available if needed.

 

This is where we differ - I consider WR2 a need. Davis is okay as a WR2. But on a championship caliber offense he isn't good enough. I love him as a WR4. He excelled in that role in 2020. Getting Hopkins would immediately push Davis back into that role. I think the trickle down effect of that is an underrated piece of why this move makes so much sense, just like trading for Diggs also put John Brown in more favorable matchups against #2 CBs. Adding a top tier receiver doesn't just give you the surface level results, it also makes everyone else on offense better.

 

A championship caliber offense, in addition to a top tier QB, needs to have either an elite group of weapons or an elite offensive line. Right now the Bills have neither. There is no chance of us suddenly creating an elite offensive line this offseason. But there is a real chance of us suddenly having one of the best groups of weapons in the league. What you call a "shiny new toy" I call a necessity to put our offense at a championship caliber level.

 

The new players you mentioned only upgraded our depth pieces on offense. I'm happy with every one of those signings but they didn't improve the top end potential of the offense. We still have an average at best offensive line and a very good but not elite group of weapons. We are missing one piece to push us over the top. Our Devonta Smith, or Christian McCaffrey, or Tee Higgins. To me that missing piece is as big a need as any other hole on the roster. Because we're well past the point in our team building cycle where we're just trying to fill holes. We're competing for a championship. That changes the whole conversation.

 

Edited March 25, 2023 by HappyDays

[LyndonvilleBill]

3 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

You never pay MSRP because there are other options to choose from, more than 1. There are only so many elite WRs that are available, which drives up the price for acquisition. There are no other choices outside of Hopkins that is better, none. 

There are ALWAYS options. Patience is a virtue. We don't need to do anything RIGHT now. Doesn't sound like there are any other teams involved and if there are and they are willing to pay more, so be it. There's this story about a Bull and his son on a hill... 🤣 

 

I've said in other posts,  we don't need another #1 wr, it would be a luxury, not a necessity. You are just stuck on this one.

[RiotAct]

17 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

It's not pennies here. You NEVER pay MSRP when you go to a dealer. 

nowadays you do!

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

This is where we differ - I consider WR2 a need. Davis is okay as a WR2. But on a championship caliber offense he isn't good enough. I love him as a WR4. He excelled in that role in 2020. Getting Hopkins would immediately push Davis back into that role. I think the trickle down effect of that is an underrated piece of why this move makes so much sense, just like trading for Diggs also put John Brown in more favorable matchups against #2 CBs. Adding a top tier receiver doesn't just give you the surface level results, it also makes everyone else on offense better.

 

A championship caliber offense, in addition to a top tier QB, needs to have either an elite group of weapons or an elite offensive line. Right now the Bills have neither. There is no chance of us suddenly creating an elite offensive line this offseason. But there is a real chance of us suddenly having one of the best groups of weapons in the league. What you call a "shiny new toy" I call a necessity to put our offense at a championship caliber level.

 

The new players you mentioned only upgraded our depth pieces on offense. I'm happy with every one of those signings but they didn't improve the top end potential of the offense. We still have an average at best offensive line and a very good but not elite group of weapons. We are missing one piece to push us over the top. Our Devonta Smith, or Christian McCaffrey, or Tee Higgins. To me that missing piece is as big a need as any other hole on the roster. Because we're well past the point in our team building cycle where we're just trying to fill holes. We're competing for a championship. That changes the whole conversation.

 

Yep, we added some good WR depth, but I don't see any of those guys as difference makers that take some of the attention off Diggs.  DHop completely changes how a defense has to scheme against us in coverage.

[papazoid]

i'm just here to get to 200.....lol

 

seriously, the bills are one WR2 from dominating

 

dhop is just 1 year older than diggs. he is a legit superstar #1 WR

 

give josh more time (OL) and 1 more weapon and lookout !!.....all the defense needs to do is get healthy

 

this needs to be the year of the offense

 

GO BILLS !

[78thealltimegreat]

13 hours ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

 

I think it was pretty obvious that my point was that Josh didn't underthrow the ball.

 

 

I know was just joking unlike the other guy 

[NoHuddleKelly12]

Somewhere Zach Ertz is frowning that his thread length record facing serious jeopardy…

[78thealltimegreat]

1 minute ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

Somewhere Zach Ertz is frowning that his thread length record facing serious jeopardy…

Well that and playing in Arizona with zero prospect of playoff football will do that 

[HOUSE]

44 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

It's not pennies here. You NEVER pay MSRP when you go to a dealer. I would NEVER pay "Whatever it takes" to get a player. There are ALWAYS options and choices.  

Ding ding ding, I have a new hero..

[LyndonvilleBill]

19 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

This is where we differ - I consider WR2 a need. Davis is okay as a WR2. But on a championship caliber offense he isn't good enough. I love him as a WR4. He excelled in that role in 2020. Getting Hopkins would immediately push Davis back into that role. I think the trickle down effect of that is an underrated piece of why this move makes so much sense, just like trading for Diggs also put John Brown in more favorable matchups against #2 CBs. Adding a top tier receiver doesn't just give you the surface level results, it also makes everyone else on offense better.

 

A championship caliber offense, in addition to a top tier QB, needs to have either an elite group of weapons or an elite offensive line. Right now the Bills have neither. There is no chance of us suddenly creating an elite offensive line this offseason. But there is a real chance of us suddenly having one of the best groups of weapons in the league. What you call a "shiny new toy" I call a necessity to put our offense at a championship caliber level.

 

The new players you mentioned only upgraded our depth pieces on offense. I'm happy with every one of those signings but they didn't improve the top end potential of the offense. We still have an average at best offensive line and a very good but not elite group of weapons. We are missing one piece to push us over the top. Our Devonta Smith, or Christian McCaffrey, or Tee Higgins. To me that missing piece is as big a need as any other hole on the roster. Because we're well past the point in our team building cycle where we're just trying to fill holes. We're competing for a championship. That changes the whole conversation.

 

I'm not arguing against getting a #2wr and moving Davis to 4. I'm against the cost (picks and $) of Hopkins. For a 2nd, 3rd the cap space and impact it will have for the next couple of years, I'm sure we could upgrade the OL and add a #2 wr this year if they want to. 

[Warriorspikes51]

54 minutes ago, akcash said:

I read on Cardinals message board they might move him post June 1st. 

that goes against Fowler on ESPN saying teams expect a deal in the near future

[Dr. Who]

3 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

I'm not arguing against getting a #2wr and moving Davis to 4. I'm against the cost (picks and $) of Hopkins. For a 2nd, 3rd the cap space and impact it will have for the next couple of years, I'm sure we could upgrade the OL and add a #2 wr this year if they want to. 

"You mean DT, LB, and S, don't you?" says a fella named Sean.

[BigdaddyinOrlando]

3 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

that goes against Fowler on ESPN saying teams expect a deal in the near future

Yeah, plus they appear to be hitting the reset button. You want and need draft currency asap and next year picks do nothing, next year picks come in after a June 1 trade.

can’t see it happening 

[HappyDays]

4 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

I'm sure we could upgrade the OL and add a #2 wr this year if they want to. 

 

No way we can upgrade the offensive line in 2023 at this point. What we have now is what it's going to be, likely with a couple draft picks added into the mix.

 

What's your preference for adding a true WR2? Right now the available options are Hopkins for Arizona's asking price, Jerry Jeudy for a 1st, or OBJ for whatever salary he's asking for. If reports are true that OBJ wants to play with Aaron Rodgers on the Jets that gives us just Hopkins and Jeudy as the available options. Unless you have someone else in mind?

[3rdand12]

17 hours ago, mrags said:

No I don’t. Everything put together in the Terminator was built for massive power. Nothing can come close (at the time at least)  to the power that the Termi could handle. People were getting 1,000hp out of a stock motor. Was listed as 390hp stock but was closer to 420hp realistically. Ford for their ***** slapped because the 01 Cobra was falsely claiming the HP output and people were taking them to the Dyno right from the showroom floors and weren’t getting anything close. So they safely underrated the HP on the 03-04 Cobras. 
 

as far as sounds? Idk. Anyone getting a new edge mustang would most likely be putting on an exhaust anyway. Basani, Pypes, Magnaflow, or my favorite Borla Ataks. 
 

the thing that makes me go crazy is the SC whine though. You know it’s a Termi from a far ways away. Once you hear it, you know that sound. 

I enjoy SC whine. and the bigger the better.
Turbo guy myself, and built a few.

 

Mustangs have the best factory sounds on the market imo. No matter the model. 4.6 /5.0 whatever.
would never switch out unless I was going for bigg power.
 

But the Voodoo motor and that flat plane crank ? To God's Ear is that sound

[mikemac2001]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

No way we can upgrade the offensive line in 2023 at this point. What we have now is what it's going to be, likely with a couple draft picks added into the mix.

 

What's your preference for adding a true WR2? Right now the available options are Hopkins for Arizona's asking price, Jerry Jeudy for a 1st, or OBJ for whatever salary he's asking for. If reports are true that OBJ wants to play with Aaron Rodgers on the Jets that gives us just Hopkins and Jeudy as the available options. Unless you have someone else in mind?