[Name Only Title] Jerry Hughes

[cv05]

Hadn't really being paying attention - but he has 8 sacks this year. Same as Von. Through half a season he has 4 times as much as he accumulated all of last year with us. 

 

With the busts we have on the d-line and absolute criminal mismanagement of this roster (Ed Oliver, AJ Epenessa, Boogie Basham, Greg R., $$$$ in Von, numerous free agents) I feel this is a real indictment on our coaching staff and talent evaluation. Especially with glaring holes on the O-line and at WR.

 

The only reason this team is relevant is the lottery ticket we cashed named Josh Allen.

[1ManRaid]

You're fun.  Wanna grab a drink?  Of bleach?

[thenorthremembers]

Cant really look at things like this in a vacuum.   You'd have to look at the Texans defense and see how many times Jerry is part of a blitz package, rather than just rushing 4 like the Bills do.   Jerry may have as many sacks as Von does this year, but he didnt have as many as Von does in this specific defense.

[Punching Bag]

Just now, 1ManRaid said:

You're fun.  Wanna grab a drink?  Of bleach?

 

Don't forget cyanide chaser. 

[Bangarang]

Did you not watch his last few years here? He looked done. The hell do I care that he has 8 sacks on one of the worst teams in the league. 

[1ManRaid]

1 minute ago, Limeaid said:

 

Don't forget cyanide chaser. 

 

Nah, it's on the rim of the glass like salt on a margarita.

[Rc2catch]

Different scheme.. Houston plays aggressive to try and cover up the lack of talent. They definitely cannot cover for 3-5 seconds. 
Buffalo plays conservative. There are plenty of guys on the roster right now who would probably thrive in a different system that played a more aggressive style. 
 

[Gugny]

8 minutes ago, cv05 said:

Hadn't really being paying attention - but he has 8 sacks this year. Same as Von. Through half a season he has 4 times as much as he accumulated all of last year with us. 

 

With the busts we have on the d-line and absolute criminal mismanagement of this roster (Ed Oliver, AJ Epenessa, Boogie Basham, Greg R., $$$$ in Von, numerous free agents) I feel this is a real indictment on our coaching staff and talent evaluation. Especially with glaring holes on the O-line and at WR.

 

The only reason this team is relevant is the lottery ticket we cashed named Josh Allen.

 

Even after looking like ass for three straight weeks, the Bills are #2 in the NFL in points scored/game and points allowed/game.  And they're still favored to win the Super Bowl.

 

Who's your favorite team?

 

[cv05]

5 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

Cant really look at things like this in a vacuum.   You'd have to look at the Texans defense and see how many times Jerry is part of a blitz package, rather than just rushing 4 like the Bills do.   Jerry may have as many sacks as Von does this year, but he didnt have as many as Von does in this specific defense.

2021 snap percent with bills : 51%
2022  snap percent with houston : 61% 

 

2021 tackles with bills : 18
2022  tackles with houston (1/2 season) : 23
 

2021 tfl with bills : 1
2022  tfl with houston (1/2 season) : 9

 

Coaching = getting the most out of what you've got. McDermott and Co. appear to stink at it. Other evidence - the rest of the d-line and a defense full of 1st and 2nd round picks. Dabol having a better record with a garbage team. 13 seconds, etc etc.

[gobills404]

The DL has been better this year and is legitimately good but yeah I would still tend to agree. Regardless of how Hughes is playing in Houston, the DL still feels somewhat underwhelming considering the insane amount of resources invested in it. With 2 1st round picks, 2 2nd round picks, and $35+ million a year spent on vets you’d expect them to be dominant.
 

On a positive note, I thought Epenesa and Basham did a great job of stepping up with Rousseau out. Against a really good pair of tackles too.

Edited November 15, 2022 by gobills404

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

9 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

Did you not watch his last few years here? He looked done. The hell do I care that he has 8 sacks on one of the worst teams in the league. 

 

I'd be pretty surprised if the 1-7-1 Texans don't finish dead last. 

 

I agree- Hughes looked pretty old and done in Buffalo the past few seasons. I never would've guessed he would have 8 sacks halfway through the season

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

Jerry is great. 
 

Sacks are weird. Jerry would always get pressure, but would have some years where he just couldn’t finish. That can be bad luck more than anything. Glad he is getting some this year. 

[Real McClappy]

Happy for Jerry to be possibly having the best year of his career in Houston at age 34. He was always a great team mate and player in Buffalo, I will always root for him outside of Buffalo.

[Turbo44]

43 minutes ago, cv05 said:

Hadn't really being paying attention - but he has 8 sacks this year. Same as Von. Through half a season he has 4 times as much as he accumulated all of last year with us. 

 

With the busts we have on the d-line and absolute criminal mismanagement of this roster (Ed Oliver, AJ Epenessa, Boogie Basham, Greg R., $$$$ in Von, numerous free agents) I feel this is a real indictment on our coaching staff and talent evaluation. Especially with glaring holes on the O-line and at WR.

 

The only reason this team is relevant is the lottery ticket we cashed named Josh Allen.

Von has 8 sacks, not the same as Hughes, but who cares about being accurate when starting a ridiculously stupid thread

[Real McClappy]

Just now, Turbo44 said:

Von has 8 sacks, not the same as Hughes, but who cares about being accurate when starting a ridiculously stupid thread

Easier to just congratulate Hughes than responding to that train wreck.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

They should have kept Hughes and cut Epenesa.  Epenesa, Ford, and Moss are massive busts. A three man DE rotation of Hughes, Miller, and Rousseau each getting about 40-50% of the snaps and Lawson/Basham getting the remainder would have been perfect.

[thenorthremembers]

43 minutes ago, cv05 said:

2021 snap percent with bills : 51%
2022  snap percent with houston : 61% 

 

2021 tackles with bills : 18
2022  tackles with houston (1/2 season) : 23
 

2021 tfl with bills : 1
2022  tfl with houston (1/2 season) : 9

 

Coaching = getting the most out of what you've got. McDermott and Co. appear to stink at it. Other evidence - the rest of the d-line and a defense full of 1st and 2nd round picks. Dabol having a better record with a garbage team. 13 seconds, etc etc.

You didnt answer my question.   How often are the Texans blitzing compared to the Bills?   You also ignored my point about Jerry not being successful in THE BILLS defense compared to what Von is doing in the same defense.

 

Yes, his stats are better this year.   But stats dont always tell the story of what is going on.   Bottom line is Von is looking to have 15 sacks this year in the same defense in which Hughes never had more than 7.  

 

Please tell me how the coaching is better on the Texans when they are currently ranked 30th in defense in the league, meanwhile the Bills, who you're making such hot takes about are ranked 8th? 

 

Sorry man, I love what Jerry Hughes did for this team, but I'd take Von Miller over him any day of the week. I'd also take the Bills coaching staff over the Texans coaching staff 100% of the time.   I dont even know how you can make the argument that a coaching staff that is likely going to be on the unemployment line at the end of the year, is getting more from their talent than the Bills staff.  And not only did you make it, you're actually defending it.   You're grasping at straws here.

Edited November 15, 2022 by thenorthremembers

[nedboy7]

Yeah the guys who created a top team in the NFL suck and can't evaluate talent. 

[TN Bills Fan]

34 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

They should have kept Hughes and cut Epenesa.  Epenesa, Ford, and Moss are massive busts. A three man DE rotation of Hughes, Miller, and Rousseau each getting about 40-50% of the snaps and Lawson/Basham getting the remainder would have been perfect.

Time to put Oliver in the “fail” category.

[Airseven]

1 hour ago, Bangarang said:

Did you not watch his last few years here? He looked done. The hell do I care that he has 8 sacks on one of the worst teams in the league. 

 

Beane deserves criticism, but as far as this thread is concerned, this guy is bang on.

[FilthyBeast]

1 hour ago, cv05 said:

Hadn't really being paying attention - but he has 8 sacks this year. Same as Von. Through half a season he has 4 times as much as he accumulated all of last year with us. 

 

With the busts we have on the d-line and absolute criminal mismanagement of this roster (Ed Oliver, AJ Epenessa, Boogie Basham, Greg R., $$$$ in Von, numerous free agents) I feel this is a real indictment on our coaching staff and talent evaluation. Especially with glaring holes on the O-line and at WR.

 

The only reason this team is relevant is the lottery ticket we cashed named Josh Allen.

 

I'll admit that I'm very surprised by this as well and you have to wonder if it's a direct indictment on this teams coaching/defensive scheme or simply just luck on a bad team whose at least fighting and trying to be aggressive with what talent they have.

 

Realistically it's somewhere in between because Hughes collective body of work (specifically his last 6 years in Buffalo) suggests this is some sort of anomaly and not really who Hughes is despite all the 'pass rush' win rate metrics we've seen to justify his putrid sack totals in recent years.

[JoshAllin]

They're 32nd in defense and 1-7-1

[cv05]

55 minutes ago, Turbo44 said:

Von has 8 sacks, not the same as Hughes, but who cares about being accurate when starting a ridiculously stupid thread

Both Von and Jerry have 8 sacks - I'm not sure I follow

[Turbo44]

14 minutes ago, TN Bills Fan said:

Time to put Oliver in the “fail” category.

he's been a bit quiet but saved the game with the sack last week.  Fail is a bit harsh

[Rigotz]

Interesting take, nestled in truly ridiculous logic.

 

Do you honestly think Jerry Hughes is the same as Von Miller?

 

Jesus man ... take a breather. The Bills are 6-3 and the defense is hovering around #1 in the league. Stop crying.

[SDS]

[This is an automated response]

 

As a courtesy to the other board members, please use more descriptive topic titles. A single name if far too vague to post as a title and provides little insight into what specifically the post is talking about.The topic starter can edit the topic title line to make it more appropriate.

 

Thank you.

[Logic]

Von Miller had 8 sacks in 2019 and 9.5 in the whole 2021 regular season on two different teams, in two different schemes.

He has 8 so far this season in just 9 games.

Do McDermott and Frazier get credit for getting more production out of Von than his three previous coaching staffs, or do they only get the blame when things go wrong?

How about Hyde and Poyer being late round, free agent afterthoughts, and now both being All-Pro caliber safeties. Do Beane, McDermott and Frazier get credit for that, or do they only get wrist-slaps and raspberries for their "criminal roster mismanagement" and the aspects of the teams you don't like?

My biggest problem with criticizers of Beane and/or McDermott is that they almost always ONLY mention the bad without also mentioning the good. 

You want to mention the players that Beane let walk that had production elsewhere? Fine, but it's only fair to also mention the players he brought in that had better production for the Bills than their previous teams.

You want to blame McDermott and his coaching staff for various players failing to live up to the expectations you have for them? Fine, but it's only fair to also mention the players that they HAVE gotten great production out of and/or coached up into productivity. 

Be objective and fair, or it's clear that you just have a myopic, one-sided, pessimistic agenda.

 

[cv05]

46 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

You didnt answer my question.   How often are the Texans blitzing compared to the Bills?   You also ignored my point about Jerry not being successful in THE BILLS defense compared to what Von is doing in the same defense.

 

Yes, his stats are better this year.   But stats dont always tell the story of what is going on.   Bottom line is Von is looking to have 15 sacks this year in the same defense in which Hughes never had more than 7.  

 

Please tell me how the coaching is better on the Texans when they are currently ranked 30th in defense in the league, meanwhile the Bills, who you're making such hot takes about are ranked 8th? 

 

Sorry man, I love what Jerry Hughes did for this team, but I'd take Von Miller over him any day of the week. I'd also take the Bills coaching staff over the Texans coaching staff 100% of the time.   I dont even know how you can make the argument that a coaching staff that is likely going to be on the unemployment line at the end of the year, is getting more from their talent than the Bills staff.  And not only did you make it, you're actually defending it.   You're grasping at straws here.

I think there are too many variables to really say one way or the other. I simply see it as a data point amongst many that McBeane are mismanaging the roster. There are plenty of things not accounted for here by either of us.

 

- Certainly, Jerry has likely been used quite differently in the Texans defense as you point out. Maybe the Bills are wrong in using Jerry the way they did. They clearly weren't maximizing his talents. There's rumors that Jerry and McDermott didn't see eye to eye. Maybe this is part of it. 

- Maybe McDermott's and Jerry's ego got in the way of the team. Wouldn't be the first time for either of them (Jerry's personal foul calls, McDermott's benching of superior talent to assert himself - see Nathan Peterman)

-The fact that the bills are ranked 8th on defense in an embarrassment - we have invested just about every 1st, 2nd and even 3rd round pick on that side of the field. Our D-line should be dominant.

- The fact that we have Josh Allen negates any comparison between the Texans and Bills coaching staff. I honestly wouldn't think it would be much worse. The Texans have very little talent after being dismantled by BoB.

-I am not saying I would rather have Jerry Hughes over Von Miller. Maybe I'm saying I'd rather have Jerry Hughes and a premier WR2 or G than Von. Or, a couple of 1st rounders on offense instead of 4 on the d-line...

[Rigotz]

https://www.pff.com/nfl/grades/position/ed

 

Jerry Hughes is the #54 ranked Defensive End this year according to PFF.

5 spots lower than AJ Epenesa.

[cv05]

8 minutes ago, Rigotz said:

Interesting take, nestled in truly ridiculous logic.

 

Do you honestly think Jerry Hughes is the same as Von Miller?

 

Jesus man ... take a breather. The Bills are 6-3 and the defense is hovering around #1 in the league. Stop crying.

Of course I don't think that. My point is that McBeane have mismanaged the roster. I would rather have Von than Jerry if the cost was the same. When you factor in the cost, I'd much rather have Jerry on the cheap, and a premier WR2 or G, or, a couple of 1st rounders on offense instead of 4 on the d-line

[Kwai San]

18 minutes ago, cv05 said:

 

- Maybe McDermott's and Jerry's ego got in the way of the team. Wouldn't be the first time for either of them (Jerry's personal foul calls, McDermott's benching of superior talent to assert himself - see Nathan Peterman)

 

 

Holy Jesus!!!  Superior Talent = Nathan Peterpick?????  YOU.  HAVE.  GOT.  TO.  BE.  KIDDING.  ME!!!!!

 

You lost what very little bit of credibility you don't have with that statement.  Step away from mommy's computer, go back downstairs and hide for 3 more months.

 

HOLY CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Mr. WEO]

2 hours ago, cv05 said:

Hadn't really being paying attention - but he has 8 sacks this year. Same as Von. Through half a season he has 4 times as much as he accumulated all of last year with us. 

 

With the busts we have on the d-line and absolute criminal mismanagement of this roster (Ed Oliver, AJ Epenessa, Boogie Basham, Greg R., $$$$ in Von, numerous free agents) I feel this is a real indictment on our coaching staff and talent evaluation. Especially with glaring holes on the O-line and at WR.

 

The only reason this team is relevant is the lottery ticket we cashed named Josh Allen.

 

 

So the Bills are mismanaging the busts on the D-line?

[RyanC883]

33 minutes ago, Logic said:

Von Miller had 8 sacks in 2019 and 9.5 in the whole 2021 regular season on two different teams, in two different schemes.

He has 8 so far this season in just 9 games.

Do McDermott and Frazier get credit for getting more production out of Von than his three previous coaching staffs, or do they only get the blame when things go wrong?

How about Hyde and Poyer being late round, free agent afterthoughts, and now both being All-Pro caliber safeties. Do Beane, McDermott and Frazier get credit for that, or do they only get wrist-slaps and raspberries for their "criminal roster mismanagement" and the aspects of the teams you don't like?

My biggest problem with criticizers of Beane and/or McDermott is that they almost always ONLY mention the bad without also mentioning the good. 

You want to mention the players that Beane let walk that had production elsewhere? Fine, but it's only fair to also mention the players he brought in that had better production for the Bills than their previous teams.

You want to blame McDermott and his coaching staff for various players failing to live up to the expectations you have for them? Fine, but it's only fair to also mention the players that they HAVE gotten great production out of and/or coached up into productivity. 

Be objective and fair, or it's clear that you just have a myopic, one-sided, pessimistic agenda.

 

they seem to do better with FAs than draft picks for sure.  on DL:  Groot was a great pick, but Basham and AJ are underwhelming.  Oliver looks like an early 2nd rounder.  

[Chandler#81]

2 hours ago, cv05 said:

Hadn't really being paying attention - but he has 8 sacks this year. Same as Von. Through half a season he has 4 times as much as he accumulated all of last year with us. 

 

With the busts we have on the d-line and absolute criminal mismanagement of this roster (Ed Oliver, AJ Epenessa, Boogie Basham, Greg R., $$$$ in Von, numerous free agents) I feel this is a real indictment on our coaching staff and talent evaluation. Especially with glaring holes on the O-line and at WR.

 

The only reason this team is relevant is the lottery ticket we cashed named Josh Allen.

🤦‍♂️

[clayboy54]

I wish I could be a fan of the Bills without being a part of the "Idiot Mafia."

[cv05]

20 minutes ago, Kwai San said:

 

Holy Jesus!!!  Superior Talent = Nathan Peterpick?????  YOU.  HAVE.  GOT.  TO.  BE.  KIDDING.  ME!!!!!

 

You lost what very little bit of credibility you don't have with that statement.  Step away from mommy's computer, go back downstairs and hide for 3 more months.

 

HOLY CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My point was McDermott started Peterman, despite, well, we all know how that turned out... 

[Kwai San]

1 minute ago, cv05 said:

My point was McDermott started Peterman, despite, well, we all know how that turned out... 

 

I totally did not get that as your POINT.  Totally did not.

 

per your words "McDermott's benching of superior talent to assert himself - see Nathan Peterman"

[Logic]

Just to sum up, in case anyone hasn't been reading along the whole way through:

Beane and McDermott have been horribly mismanaging the roster that has posted the NFL's best point differential two years in a row and has made the playoffs four out of the last five seasons and sits 6-3 currently. The #2 defense and #3 offense are part and parcel of an overall complete mismanagement of resources by the front office and coaching staff.

Additionally, Beane gets blame for letting Jerry Hughes walk and drafting Basham and Epenesa, but he does not get credit for bringing in Von Miller, Micah Hyde and Jordan Poyer, or drafting Tremaine Edmunds, Matt Milano, or acquiring Stefon Diggs. Oh, and Josh Allen was just a lottery pick that happened to hit. Total luck. No credit to Beane for drafting him or McDermott and his staff for fostering an environment in which he could grow into the player he is today.

Any good part of our team is dumb luck. Any bad part of our team is evidence of roster mismanagement and general ineptitude.

I think that about covers it.

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Jerry was a personal favorite- That said Von is a massive upgrade. 

[NewEra]

4 hours ago, Bangarang said:

Did you not watch his last few years here? He looked done. The hell do I care that he has 8 sacks on one of the worst teams in the league. 

He looked “done” the “last few years”.

 

this is such bs. exaggerate more