Breaking News: Doctor that cleared Tua in concussion protocol is fired...

[Patrick Duffy]

54 minutes ago, Gugny said:

But wait!!  He's an expert and he'd NEVER do anything to jeopardize his career!  Right?!?

This.....Can't remember who said that....lol

[boco357]

I love how they don't use the words Doctor or Neurologist.  I'm sure this guy was a buddy of Steven Ross

[Playoffs?]

20 minutes ago, BUFFALOBART said:

If ‘The Doctor’ is working the Medical Tent, then he is the one making the call. Who else is to blame? Do you think that the team has a secret ‘if Tua gets a concussion?’ Policy in advance?

 

Well… based on the eye test alone, one could question the team doctors, the head coach, the owner, teammates, Tua, etc.   He left the game with a head injury. He couldn’t stand on his own. He came back into the game after revising from a head injury to a back injury. Then they proceed to test him for concussions the following days… why?   You don’t think there was anything fishy (no pun intended) going on?  I sure do. 

[TampaBillsJunkie]

yeah, but the science says....... (yawn)

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

1 hour ago, Malazan said:

DeMaurice Smith is a moron. He fires this guy which gives a perfect scapegoat for the league and Dolphins. He should have been attacking the protocol and the team.

you think Smith is done? This is more than likely just step one.

[Scott7975]

55 minutes ago, Pete said:

one astute poster raised a great point.  The NFL was buying bull#### that is was a back and ankle injury.  Why didn't the NFL and Dolphins give back ankle tests and updates?

If I was a reporter, I would ask Miami coach- "I's got to know.  how is Tuas back?  He was obviously hurt.  How is Tuas ankle?"

 

Also if they didnt think it was a concussion then why did they check him throughout the week for a concussion?  If they were concerned enough that they doubted the initial prognosis then there should have been enough doubt to keep him out of the rest of the Bills game and put him in protocol.

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, Rc2catch said:

Hello Mr scapegoat… Thank you for falling on the knife. 

Yup, the NFL is 100% culpable but as usual nothing will happen. Big game, lots of viewership.  Of course they were going to shove him back out there.

[Let's Go Buffalo]

Anyone with any common sense at all knew that Tua was concussed when his head slammed on the ground, and he got up wobbling in the wrong direction before having to be helped go in the right direction, so there should be other dominoes falling in my opinion as well.

[Scott7975]

26 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

The UNC doctor and the team physician both make the call.

Buffalo Channel 7 has this article that is short and concise of the procedures.

 

https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/faq-what-actually-happens-when-an-nfl-player-enters-concussion-protocol

 

I do like this part.

If the NFL Commissioner determines that a medical team failed to follow the protocol in order to win a game, the Commissioner can require the team to forfeit draft picks and impose fines that can exceed the amounts above.

 

 

Theres even a better part.  The NFL already issued a statement days ago that said Miami followed protocol.

 

Another interesting thing I found is that this is not the first time protocol was in question for Miami and it was found that they didnt follow protocol then either:

https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-statement-on-matt-moore-concussion-protocol-review-0ap3000000779128

 

Heres a snip

 

Quote

The Miami Dolphins were notified in a letter co-signed by Dr. Hunt Batjer, Co-Chair of the NFL Head, Neck & Spine Committee and Dr. Thom Mayer, Medical Director for the NFLPA, that the NFL-NFLPA review determined that the Protocol was not strictly followed. The letter further advised the Dolphins that they must engage their staff in a full review of the Protocol and conduct additional education, if necessary. The Dolphins were also advised that any future deviation from the Protocol may result in enhanced discipline, including monetary fines assessed against the Club.

 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

1 hour ago, buffaloboyinATL said:

Fyi, there is a pretty good conversation on this, in the NFLPA investigation thread.  
 

I agree, the Dolphins are going to try and hide behind this. 
 

Dolphins kinda should hide behind this. If this independent doctor is saying Tua was fine, you would think the dolphins would just rely on that. 
 

I am curious how this works though behind the scenes— does the team doctor just defer to the independent guy? Do they examine him together and consult with each other? 

[BillsFanForever19]

1 hour ago, Malazan said:

DeMaurice Smith is a moron. He fires this guy which gives a perfect scapegoat for the league and Dolphins. He should have been attacking the protocol and the team.

 

Oh, I'm sure he is. He doesn't have the power to fire team doctors like he did the UNC. I'm sure this is just Step 1. I'd be shocked if the Team Doctor survives this and the Dolphins don't face consequences. As minimal as Offense 1 violation punishment is.

[Motorin']

1 hour ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said:

this one?

 

 

That looks an awful lot like his finger contortion against the Bengals. It just didn't happen for as long. 

 

But the idea that the doctor cleared him when this happened to his fingers right before he collapsed is gross incompetence. 

[Beast]

Here’s a photo of the bastard!

[ColoradoBills]

6 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

Dolphins kinda should hide behind this. If this independent doctor is saying Tua was fine, you would think the dolphins would just rely on that. 
 

I am curious how this works though behind the scenes— does the team doctor just defer to the independent guy? Do they examine him together and consult with each other? 

 

But the protocol states that IF it's determined that the "symptoms" of the player is not concussion related the Team Physician determines

whether he plays or not.  It seems obvious to me that the system was set up that no one person alone can say the player can play.

 

Everything I have heard after the Bills game injury was the Miami team saying it wasn't a concussion.

We all will have to wait until more of the story in unfolded to us fans.

[Scott7975]

2 minutes ago, Beast said:

Here’s a photo of the bastard!

 

You sure it wasnt this guy?

 

[chongli]

I mentioned this in another thread somewhat jokingly, but I want any play Tua was involved in after the injury in the Buffalo game to be not counted, which means the Bills would have won the game 19-14, and now be 3-0 now, and Miami would be 2-2. I obviously know that will never happen, but it just irks me. The Bills were clearly the better team, and Tua never should have gone back in the game. Bridgewater wouldn't have beaten us.

[Scott7975]

2 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

But the protocol states that IF it's determined that the "symptoms" of the player is not concussion related the Team Physician determines

whether he plays or not.  It seems obvious to me that the system was set up that no one person alone can say the player can play.

 

Everything I have heard after the Bills game injury was the Miami team saying it wasn't a concussion.

We all will have to wait until more of the story in unfolded to us fans.

 

The team physician has exclusive decision whether he plays or not.

[Logic]

I wonder what all the indignant, righteous Dolphins fans who've spent the past few days calling this a witch hunt and saying everything was done by the book are thinking right about now.

[Scott7975]

1 minute ago, chongli said:

I mentioned this in another thread somewhat jokingly, but I want any play Tua was involved in after the injury in the Buffalo game to be not counted, which means the Bills would have won the game 19-14, and now be 3-0 now, and Miami would be 2-2. I obviously know that will never happen, but it just irks me. The Bills were clearly the better team, and Tua never should have gone back in the game. Bridgewater wouldn't have beaten us.

 

Nah this is about player safety.  Id rather incompentent people just get fired and lose their license while the team gets heavily fined and loses draft picks for the next two years because I dont think they have any this year.  It should be heavy because this is the second time they failed to follow protocol.

1 minute ago, Logic said:

I wonder what all the indignant, righteous Dolphins fans who've spent the past few days calling this a witch hunt and saying everything was done by the book are thinking right about now.

 

They are simps.  They still will think its a witch hunt.  They dont give two ***** about player safety.

[ExiledInIllinois]

7 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

You sure it wasnt this guy?

 

But they checked the X-Ray Fluoroscope!

[Roundybout]

6 minutes ago, Logic said:

I wonder what all the indignant, righteous Dolphins fans who've spent the past few days calling this a witch hunt and saying everything was done by the book are thinking right about now.

 

Goalposts are shifted to "WELL THE NFL'S DOCTOR SAID HE WAS FINE SO IT'S NOT OUR FAULT"

[ColoradoBills]

5 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

The team physician has exclusive decision whether he plays or not.

 

That is what I cannot find.  Everything I read is that both have the say.  Do you have something specifically saying that?

[billybrew1]

2 hours ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

needs to go much further then that.

One thing you have to understand is tua really wanted to play. He was in on it as much as anyone. He wants to be a great QB and is willing to do stupid things to try and make that happen. It just blew up in his face and everyone else’s….

 

I think I have seen this before though…. I thought a QB was done because of concussion syndrome yet he was able to come back. It went away for him….

[since79]

What I find interesting in all of this is if he is put in the protocol on Sunday from our game I believe He would not clear for Thursday.  It took Bates till Friday.  I think the protocol is 4 days asymptomatic.  If he sits our second half he sits Thursday. This had to play into their decision to put him back out there. 

Edited October 1, 2022 by since79

[Fallser]

The league needed a villain, they found someone (unnamed) to fall on the sword...meanwhile Tua has jellybrain...

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, billybrew1 said:

One thing you have to understand is tua really wanted to play. He was in on it as much as anyone. He wants to be a great QB and is willing to do stupid things to try and make that happen. It just blew up in his face and everyone else’s….

 

 

Part of me can understand a QB wanting to come back in the 2nd half in the heat of a battle. 

Everything after is now 100% on him.  He now has had plenty of time to come to a man's decision.

 

I said this earlier today.  If he is somehow cleared to play against the Jets next Sunday and chooses to play his health is his

responsibility.  If some Jets player causes another traumatic injury (even if that guy got fined) and he's out for the year, it's on him.

[Scott7975]

17 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

That is what I cannot find.  Everything I read is that both have the say.  Do you have something specifically saying that?

 

Yeah I posted it a ton of times lol

 

Quote

For the avoidance of doubt, the responsibility for the diagnosis of concussion and the decision to return a player to a game remain exclusively within the professional judgment of the Head Team Physician or the Club physician designated as responsible for the diagnosis and management of concussion.

 

http://NFL Concussion Diagnosis and Management Protocol https://www.nfl.com/playerhealthandsafety/resources/fact-sheets/nfl-head-neck-and-spine-committee-s-concussion-diagnosis-and-management-protocol

 

That actual state it several times to make sure its absolutely clear

[ToGoGo]

2 hours ago, Malazan said:

DeMaurice Smith is a moron. He fires this guy which gives a perfect scapegoat for the league and Dolphins. He should have been attacking the protocol and the team.

 

Hahahahahahahahahahahahha. 

 

Nobody is a moron. If you have no ethics, this is the perfect move. 

 

What else would the NFL do if they had no ethics? 

[jethro_tull]

Mike McDaniel and the team physician should also be fired.  

What kind of dumb arse coach lets his player back in the game when he couldn't even stand up.  

Edited October 1, 2022 by jethro_tull

[Scott7975]

5 minutes ago, since79 said:

What I find interesting in all of this is if he is put in the protocol on Sunday from our game I believe He would not clear for Thursday.  It took Bates till Friday.  I think the protocol is 4 days asymptomatic.  If he sits our second half he sits Thursday. This had to play into their decision to put him back out there. 

 

He firsts has to rest 24-48 hours before he can do anything.  That starts the second he is put in protocol.  Then he has to go through 5 stages and be cleared by an independent.  The chances of doing all that between Sunday afternoon and Thursday, especially for an away game, are slim to none.

3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Part of me can understand a QB wanting to come back in the 2nd half in the heat of a battle. 

Everything after is now 100% on him.  He now has had plenty of time to come to a man's decision.

 

I said this earlier today.  If he is somehow cleared to play against the Jets next Sunday and chooses to play his health is his

responsibility.  If some Jets player causes another traumatic injury (even if that guy got fined) and he's out for the year, it's on him.

 

Im betting he will play.  They may keep him out as some sort of "see we do care" measure but at most he will miss one game.  Its really not all that hard to get through concussion protocol.  Its just time.

[Warcodered]

52 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Theres even a better part.  The NFL already issued a statement days ago that said Miami followed protocol.

 

Another interesting thing I found is that this is not the first time protocol was in question for Miami and it was found that they didnt follow protocol then either:

https://www.nfl.com/news/nfl-statement-on-matt-moore-concussion-protocol-review-0ap3000000779128

 

Heres a snip

 

 

But they're such a well run circus.

 

[HappyDays]

 

[ColoradoBills]

23 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

http://NFL Concussion Diagnosis and Management Protocol https://www.nfl.com/playerhealthandsafety/resources/fact-sheets/nfl-head-neck-and-spine-committee-s-concussion-diagnosis-and-management-protocol

 

That actual state it several times to make sure its absolutely clear

 

Can you give me the site.  The one posted takes me right back to this thread.

Edited October 2, 2022 by ColoradoBills

[Solomon Grundy]

38 minutes ago, Logic said:

I wonder what all the indignant, righteous Dolphins fans who've spent the past few days calling this a witch hunt and saying everything was done by the book are thinking right about now.

They're called Tuanon😎

[Scott7975]

3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Can you give me the site.  The one posted takes me right back to this thread.

 

Thats strange I copy and pasted the link.  Let me try again.

 

https://www.nfl.com/playerhealthandsafety/resources/fact-sheets/nfl-head-neck-and-spine-committee-s-concussion-diagnosis-and-management-protocol

 

There is also this one

 

https://www.nfl.com/playerhealthandsafety/health-and-wellness/player-care/concussion-protocol-return-to-participation-protocol

 

Both official NFL links

[ColoradoBills]

13 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Thats strange I copy and pasted the link.  Let me try again.

 

https://www.nfl.com/playerhealthandsafety/resources/fact-sheets/nfl-head-neck-and-spine-committee-s-concussion-diagnosis-and-management-protocol

 

There is also this one

 

https://www.nfl.com/playerhealthandsafety/health-and-wellness/player-care/concussion-protocol-return-to-participation-protocol

 

Both official NFL links

 

Thank you. 

So, if the UNC has no authority to pull a player, it stands to reason he cannot be a scape goat.

He is no different than a PGA golfers caddy.  I know a bit sarcastic.

 

Now, more than ever I feel it's 100% on the Miami organization.  They put Tua in to win the game, thus draft pick forfeit and fines

should be given.

 

ps  I was on 2 official NFL sites talking about this and none specified what yours did about the team Dr.

Thanks again. 

 

 

Edited October 2, 2022 by ColoradoBills

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

40 minutes ago, billybrew1 said:

One thing you have to understand is tua really wanted to play. He was in on it as much as anyone. He wants to be a great QB and is willing to do stupid things to try and make that happen. It just blew up in his face and everyone else’s….

 

I think I have seen this before though…. I thought a QB was done because of concussion syndrome yet he was able to come back. It went away for him….

steve young was forced to retire due to concussions. although he was 38 he would of had a couple three more good years since he got a late start due to sitting behind joe.

 

stupid can get you killed in a violent game such as this. I don't believe tua, young in his career, can afford another blow like that he got thursday night as well as the one he took (to the head) this past sunday.

 

 

Edited October 2, 2022 by DaBillsFanSince1973

[Joe Ferguson forever]

scapegoat but complicit.  Lawsuit legal eagles?

Edited October 2, 2022 by redtail hawk

[ColoradoBills]

1 hour ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

Dolphins kinda should hide behind this. If this independent doctor is saying Tua was fine, you would think the dolphins would just rely on that. 
 

I am curious how this works though behind the scenes— does the team doctor just defer to the independent guy? Do they examine him together and consult with each other? 

 

Now that Scott showed me otherwise, I was wrong about both needed to clear a player.  Only the team physician has that power.

They both examine and consult but the team doctor has all the power.

 

Just want to update you @Rochesterfan.

Edited October 2, 2022 by ColoradoBills

[Joe Ferguson forever]

1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

But the protocol states that IF it's determined that the "symptoms" of the player is not concussion related the Team Physician determines

whether he plays or not.  It seems obvious to me that the system was set up that no one person alone can say the player can play.

 

Everything I have heard after the Bills game injury was the Miami team saying it wasn't a concussion.

We all will have to wait until more of the story in unfolded to us fans.

nope. we all saw him staggering.  we all saw his head hit the turf. c'mon.  This was malpractice and I'm not a fan of the lawsuits , generally.  We all make mistakes. But this was egregious.

Edited October 2, 2022 by redtail hawk