Cuts around the league..

[BillMafia716ix]

Dianna Russini from ESPN just tweeted out: 

 

Just texted with an NFL head coach about the upcoming cuts and what he expects…

“It’s going to be a massacre next week all around the league”

 

Seeing that the Bills are very close to the cap. Do you think the Bills will make any surprising cuts before free agency? 

 

Edited March 3, 2021 by BillMafia716ix

[BuffaloRebound]

I think a fair amount of players on the Bills have a deadline of taking a pay cut or outright getting cut.  

[Southern_Bills]

It sounds about right, smaller cap smaller salary. Not sure many stars that still produce will be cut but mid level solid starters will be bludgeoned. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

4 minutes ago, BillMafia716ix said:

Dianna Russini from ESPN just tweeted out: 

 

Just texted with an NFL head coach about the upcoming cuts and what he expects…

“It’s going to be a massacre next week all around the league”

 

Seeing that the Bills are very close to the cap. Do you think the Bills will make any surprising cuts before free agency? 

 

Bills can create a lot of room with a team option restructure of Dawkins and White

I think I heard $14 million. So technically they're not really in trouble. With the return of Star they can create another $6-7 million by releasing 1 DT, Jefferson or Butler. 

 

So they're actually pretty good. That doesn't even include other vets like John Brown. Mitch Morse, and Lee Smith possibly released. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

16 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

I think a fair amount of players on the Bills have a deadline of taking a pay cut or outright getting cut.  

 

I doubt it, but who do you think they are?

 

Players may be asked to restructure, but 99% of restructures are not cuts. 

 

The Bills are in the middle-class of teams.  They lack cap space, but can create quite a bit with 2 or 3 restructures and  3 or perhaps 4 cuts.

 

My thoughts are that Lee Smith and Quinton Jefferson get cut, and Dion Dawkins and Tre' White are asked to restructure. 

I think the only player in line for "restructure or be cut" might be John Brown.

 

The "blood bath" and deadline of "renegotiate or take pay cut" will take place on the teams that are significantly over the cap, such as the Saints, Eagles, Rams, Chiefs, Falcons, Steelers, and Packers

 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I doubt it, but who do you think they are?

 

Players may be asked to restructure, but 99% of restructures are not cuts. 

 

The Bills are in the middle-class of teams.  They lack cap space, but can create quite a bit with 2 or 3 restructures and  3 or perhaps 4 cuts.

 

My thoughts are that Lee Smith and Quinton Jefferson get cut, and Dion Dawkins and Tre' White are asked to restructure. 

 

I think the only player in line for "restructure or be cut" might be John Brown.

 

The "blood bath" and deadline of "renegotiate or take pay cut" will take place on the teams that are significantly over the cap, such as the Saints, Eagles, Rams, Chiefs, Falcons, Steelers, and Packers

 

 

WR isn't super top heavy, but coming off the injury year that Brown had, he may have trouble getting any term.  He's likely looking at 1 yr deal outside of buffalo, and I'm not sure teams look at him as a better option than guys like Hilton Watkins and Perriman.  Tack on an extension year and you can lower the base salary (7 mil) considerably, and keep him for 2 years at like 14 or something like that.

[BuffaloRebound]

Nobody’s paying Morse $7.5m with his concussion history.  And nobody’s paying Addison $8m or Butler $7m.  Jefferson most likely isn’t getting $7m either but he’s more versatile.  With Brown, that makes 5 guys who most likely are taking pay cuts or getting cut.  Yes, most years these guys would be offered a restructured deal but not when the cap is going down 10% instead of up 10%.  

[Solomon Grundy]

To quote Bart Scott, "Can't Wait"

[DrDawkinstein]

46 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Bills can create a lot of room with a team option restructure of Dawkins and White

I think I heard $14 million. So technically they're not really in trouble. With the return of Star they can create another $6-7 million by releasing 1 DT, Jefferson or Butler. 

 

So they're actually pretty good. That doesn't even include other vets like John Brown. Mitch Morse, and Lee Smith possibly released. 

 

What do you(they) have in mind here considering these deals are barely 6 months old?

[Rubes]

Feels like there is a thread for this already...

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

31 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

What do you(they) have in mind here considering these deals are barely 6 months old?

Switching base salary into a bonus then spreading the bonus out. 

[hjnick]

51 minutes ago, Rubes said:

Feels like there is a thread for this already...

 

Pinned to the top of the page too...

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, hjnick said:

Pinned to the top of the page too...

 

I feel like that thread is for players who are actually released, where this thread is regarding the "news" from Russini that there will be a blood bath of cuts.

 

Ahhh, the offseason.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

16 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

Cutting both Brown & Kroft saves $14 million. Neither did anything in the 2nd half of the season when our offense was racking up yards & putting up a ton of points.

Cut Pufnstuf?!  Never! 😡

🎶Can't do a little cause he can't do enough !🎵

😁

[BillsFanThru-N-Thru]

27 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

Cutting both Brown & Kroft saves $14 million. Neither did anything in the 2nd half of the season when our offense was racking up yards & putting up a ton of points.

How do you figure that about Kroft??  I believe he contracted ended and he's a UFA.  At least on Sportrac and OvertheCap that's what it states

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

7 minutes ago, BillsFanThru-N-Thru said:

How do you figure that about Kroft??  I believe he contracted ended and he's a UFA.  At least on Sportrac and OvertheCap that's what it states

You are correct. I didn't notice lines crossing out the dollar amounts for 2021. Should've read the next line down.

[BuffaloRebound]

Tyrell Williams just signed 1 year deal with Detroit for $4.7m that could be worth $6.2m with incentives.  John Brown is 2 years older and also coming off an injury plagued season.  Tells me Brown would be lucky to get $5m if he was cut when Williams is jumping on that deal from Lions.  

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Cuts I expect - two of the three DL - Jefferson, Addison, and Butler will be gone

Cuts I fear will happen - Brown

Cuts I would not be shocked but don't expect - Morse, Star

Cuts that could happen but I would be shocked - Hughes, Hyde, Fromm

[Albany,n.y.]

Harry Anderson is available.  Since he ruined Steve Hauschka's career with a cheap shot hit, the Bills should sign him just to bring him to camp so someone can break his legs.

[Doc]

7 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Cuts I expect - two of the three DL - Jefferson, Addison, and Butler will be gone

Cuts I fear will happen - Brown

Cuts I would not be shocked but don't expect - Morse, Star

Cuts that could happen but I would be shocked - Hughes, Hyde, Fromm

 

No chance. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

What do you(they) have in mind here considering these deals are barely 6 months old?

 

Basically, keeping the same total contract value but converting some of this year's salary to bonus and spreading it over the life of the contract.

 

Since these are young players we intend to keep and who have showed they played hard even after getting paid, it's a win-win - the player gets the same amount of money this year but more up-front instead of spread over 17 weeks, which may give them some flexibility as to what they do with it - the Bills get cap space this year at the cost of more future cap downstream.

[mjt328]

Sounds like the smart play this offseason will be to sit-back... wait until the bottom-feeders blow their cap space on second-contract guys hoping for a big payday... then swoop in and get bargain discounts on the vets who became cap casualties.

 

 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

44 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Harry Anderson is available.  Since he ruined Steve Hauschka's career with a cheap shot hit, the Bills should sign him just to bring him to camp so someone can break his legs.

Hell, I'll kick in $20 of his contract, and  $20 to the player that does it.  Maybe just someone leave a shower mat in his path? 🤔

[DCofNC]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

No chance. 

The only one there is no chance on is Fromm, until the end of camp at least.  Hughes never gets home, Star is old AF and expensive, Hyde is expensive/older and though I don’t want him gone, could be a cap casualty.  All that said, I’d keep Hyde, the rest are average at best.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

2 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Cuts I expect - two of the three DL - Jefferson, Addison, and Butler will be gone

Cuts I fear will happen - Brown

Cuts I would not be shocked but don't expect - Morse, Star

Cuts that could happen but I would be shocked - Hughes, Hyde, Fromm

Star hurts the Cap of released 

Edited March 4, 2021 by TheyCallMeAndy

[Doc]

5 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

The only one there is no chance on is Fromm, until the end of camp at least.  Hughes never gets home, Star is old AF and expensive, Hyde is expensive/older and though I don’t want him gone, could be a cap casualty.  All that said, I’d keep Hyde, the rest are average at best.

 

Fromm could be released in final cut downs, but there's no need to cut him right now to free cap space since it wouldn't free much, plus he might have a future as a backup QB.  Star will cost a lot more to release than keep.  And Hughes and Hyde are cheaper than what the Bills would need to find to replace them.

[DCofNC]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

Fromm could be released in final cut downs, but there's no need to cut him right now to free cap space since it wouldn't free much, plus he might have a future as a backup QB.  Star will cost a lot more to release than keep.  And Hughes and Hyde are cheaper than what the Bills would need to find to replace them.

Fromm is safe barring poor performance.  Star say a year and is old, not sure he’s worth keeping.   Hughes and Hyde are not statistically significant, like them both, but I’m not sure there is a huge drop off to replace them A LOT cheaper. Personally, I like Hyde, I think Hughes is done, on the business side, I’d let them go a year early vs a year late.  Both are in the twilight of their careers, neither was actually impactful last year, they are good, not great, their two salaries could add a great player.  Add in a replacement in the draft and boom, the team is better.   Don’t sleep on them being gone.

[BobbyC81]

8 hours ago, Rubes said:

Feels like there is a thread for this already...

 

Yes, that breaks the TSW First Commandment set forth in the year 1998:

 

”Thou shalt not start a duplicate thread”

 

The OP’s penance shall be to say three “Where else would you rather be than right here, right now?”  and two “It’s fandamanium out here!”

 

Edited March 4, 2021 by ColeB

[Doc]

58 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

Fromm is safe barring poor performance.  Star say a year and is old, not sure he’s worth keeping.   Hughes and Hyde are not statistically significant, like them both, but I’m not sure there is a huge drop off to replace them A LOT cheaper. Personally, I like Hyde, I think Hughes is done, on the business side, I’d let them go a year early vs a year late.  Both are in the twilight of their careers, neither was actually impactful last year, they are good, not great, their two salaries could add a great player.  Add in a replacement in the draft and boom, the team is better.   Don’t sleep on them being gone.

I guess we will only agree on Fromm.  And are you saying that you would release Star and take an additional $4.7 million hit against the cap?

[Richard Noggin]

1 hour ago, DCofNC said:

Fromm is safe barring poor performance.  Star say a year and is old, not sure he’s worth keeping.   Hughes and Hyde are not statistically significant, like them both, but I’m not sure there is a huge drop off to replace them A LOT cheaper. Personally, I like Hyde, I think Hughes is done, on the business side, I’d let them go a year early vs a year late.  Both are in the twilight of their careers, neither was actually impactful last year, they are good, not great, their two salaries could add a great player.  Add in a replacement in the draft and boom, the team is better.   Don’t sleep on them being gone.

 

I'm having trouble with your Hyde and Hughes takes. Especially Hyde. No way McDermott (and Frazier) part with Hyde this offseason. That dude is essential in ways stats can't convey.

 

Hughes is NOT "done," as you say, both statistically and intangibly. Sacks can be a little like home runs, analytically, in that they can be misleading (baseball isn't a great analogy for football, but hopefully you get my drift). Some players sacrifice steady production for occasional, all-or-nothing glory. Like Jordan Phillips did in his contract year: terrible stats in basically every category except sacks. 

 

I WILL agree that at some point soon Hughes WILL be done, and a team can get better sack production from cheaper options. But I say let him play out his contract as the veteran rock of the DE group. Hyde, too. 

[Billzgobowlin]

12 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Cuts I expect - two of the three DL - Jefferson, Addison, and Butler will be gone

Cuts I fear will happen - Brown

Cuts I would not be shocked but don't expect - Morse, Star

Cuts that could happen but I would be shocked - Hughes, Hyde, Fromm

Star won't help the team at all because of dead money.  Addison might be restructured but not cut.  Morse might be cut but only if we sign feliciano.  Hyde and Fromm will not be cut and Hughes might restructure 

[BarleyNY]

13 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Basically, keeping the same total contract value but converting some of this year's salary to bonus and spreading it over the life of the contract.

 

Since these are young players we intend to keep and who have showed they played hard even after getting paid, it's a win-win - the player gets the same amount of money this year but more up-front instead of spread over 17 weeks, which may give them some flexibility as to what they do with it - the Bills get cap space this year at the cost of more future cap downstream.

I want to clarify what the term “team option restructure” refers to.  It is an option that is already in a contract that allows a team to convert salary into a signing bonus.  The upshot is that there is no need to go through the motions of getting players with that clause in their contracts to agree to restructure.  It’s just a matter of the team executing that clause.  There is no downside to the players since they get cash sooner and it just saves paperwork. 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

1 hour ago, Billzgobowlin said:

Star won't help the team at all because of dead money.  Addison might be restructured but not cut.  Morse might be cut but only if we sign feliciano.  Hyde and Fromm will not be cut and Hughes might restructure 

 

So the thoughts around morse are, feliciano starts.  The only big question is - who starts at RG with him kicking inside, and you only have a few million to spend. 

[BuffaloRebound]

6 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

So the thoughts around morse are, feliciano starts.  The only big question is - who starts at RG with him kicking inside, and you only have a few million to spend. 

Draft.  Or the flood of vets who are gonna be cut.  
As an aside, it must be absolutely crazy right now for GM’s and agents.  Every vet contract is being put under a microscope and re-priced in a down 10% cap world.  There only 24 hours in a day and each one of these vet contracts probably takes tons of time on the front offices to come up with a new number and then the agents to figure out what their clients could get in open market if they reject a re-structure/ pay cut.  

[Doc]

53 minutes ago, dneveu said:

So the thoughts around morse are, feliciano starts.  The only big question is - who starts at RG with him kicking inside, and you only have a few million to spend. 

 

Ford.

[Billzgobowlin]

1 hour ago, dneveu said:

 

So the thoughts around morse are, feliciano starts.  The only big question is - who starts at RG with him kicking inside, and you only have a few million to spend. 

Gabe Jackson or a draft pick?  Gabe would give a little more nastiness than Morse and probably would be cheaper after all is said and done.

[DCofNC]

21 hours ago, Richard Noggin said:

 

I'm having trouble with your Hyde and Hughes takes. Especially Hyde. No way McDermott (and Frazier) part with Hyde this offseason. That dude is essential in ways stats can't convey.

 

Hughes is NOT "done," as you say, both statistically and intangibly. Sacks can be a little like home runs, analytically, in that they can be misleading (baseball isn't a great analogy for football, but hopefully you get my drift). Some players sacrifice steady production for occasional, all-or-nothing glory. Like Jordan Phillips did in his contract year: terrible stats in basically every category except sacks. 

 

I WILL agree that at some point soon Hughes WILL be done, and a team can get better sack production from cheaper options. But I say let him play out his contract as the veteran rock of the DE group. Hyde, too. 

I am a huge fan of Hyde, but I believe he’s replaceable, in terms of production at very least.  Hughes is at that point where he’s just a player in my eyes.  He’s good, but the explosive, game changer, is gone.  I’m also a believer in getting rid of a guy a year early vs a year late.  Now the clear argument is trying to replace him for less money, that may not be possible as his position is a premium.

22 hours ago, Doc said:

I guess we will only agree on Fromm.  And are you saying that you would release Star and take an additional $4.7 million hit against the cap?

First of all, we don’t know Star is coming back, after a year off, he may be done.  Secondly, the cap hit sucks, but the roster spot is valuable too, so if he’s lost anything (not that he had a lot), I don’t need him in the way.   So yeah, I could see him going.

[Doc Brown]

23 hours ago, Doc said:

I guess we will only agree on Fromm.  And are you saying that you would release Star and take an additional $4.7 million hit against the cap?

I worry about Star retiring.  He’s obviously concerned about his long term health opting out this year.  Pretty sure we’d take that additional cap hit if he did.

[NewEra]

30 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

I am a huge fan of Hyde, but I believe he’s replaceable, in terms of production at very least.  Hughes is at that point where he’s just a player in my eyes.  He’s good, but the explosive, game changer, is gone.  I’m also a believer in getting rid of a guy a year early vs a year late.  Now the clear argument is trying to replace him for less money, that may not be possible as his position is a premium.

First of all, we don’t know Star is coming back, after a year off, he may be done.  Secondly, the cap hit sucks, but the roster spot is valuable too, so if he’s lost anything (not that he had a lot), I don’t need him in the way.   So yeah, I could see him going.

Ok....so you want to get rid of Hyde and Hughes.  We can save 12-13M.  Who do you plan on replacing them with?

 

that leaves us with who at DE?  If we’re going to cut Jerry, I’m sure we’d have to cut Addison too, because keeping Addison and cutting Jerry is asinine.  So that leaves us with AJ and Daryl johnson at DE.  Which means we have to sign 2 starting DEs.  
 

we save 5.1 cutting Hyde.  Who are we replacing him with?  A new safety that doesn’t know the D and doesn’t have a rapport with Poyer and the other DBs.  
 

makes sense....,if you don’t want to win a super bowl

 

 

[Simon Says]

On 3/3/2021 at 1:11 PM, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Bills can create a lot of room with a team option restructure of Dawkins and White

I think I heard $14 million. So technically they're not really in trouble. With the return of Star they can create another $6-7 million by releasing 1 DT, Jefferson or Butler. 

 

So they're actually pretty good. That doesn't even include other vets like John Brown. Mitch Morse, and Lee Smith possibly released. 

If I got this rignt: Star didn't count ( much,if anything)against the 2020 cap. His cap hit returns in 2021 for 7.6 million