Are the Bills set at TE?

[billieve420]

This was a weak draft for the TE position. If they are going to take one in the draft get the one of the best ones in a future draft.

[Jerry Jabber]

3 minutes ago, nikuman said:

 

Hell, we barely have receivers reach that mark.  Difficult when 95% of your drives go Run-Run-Pass-Punt.

 

I know it isn't really 95%, but sure feels like it sometimes.

Agreed. Now that the Bills have at least three legitimate NFL receivers, we’ll see what Daboll can do with the offense. Hopefully this season he won’t call three run plays from the ten yard line starting at first and goal.

 

3 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

They signed 4 TE's last year, I wouldn't call that neglected.

 

The one thing I do know if no one knows how good Know could be including you.

That was last year. Kroft was injured and didn’t do much. Sweeney only saw real action in Week 17. Knox looked like a rookie TE, flashed potential, but had some key drops. Smith is primarily a blocker. Not sure if Knox can be a #1 TE, still too early to tell. 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

1 minute ago, Jerry Jabber said:

That was last year. Kroft was injured and didn’t do much. Sweeney only saw real action in Week 17. Knox looked like a rookie TE, flashed potential, but had some key drops. Smith is primarily a blocker. Not sure if Knox can be a #1 TE, still too early to tell. 

 

Your post stated that they neglected the TE for years.  Signing 4 TE's last year isn't neglected. Knox looked like a rookie because he was a rookie.  Yes he had drops, but also made plays some that very others have the skill set to make.  And yes is too early to tell, but if you sign another TE to take over as the #1, then you'll never know what Knox can do.

[MrEpsYtown]

I think Sweeney would have gone in the 4th in this draft. 
 

I really liked Kmet and Trautman, but I think Knox is the real deal, again just a raw player who has to fix some drops. I still think it was a case of a guy trying to do too much. Kroft will be here and I truly hope they see the obvious that Tommy Sweeney belongs. He’s an ideal #2 and his skill set complements Knox really well. 

[Jerry Jabber]

9 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Your post stated that they neglected the TE for years.  Signing 4 TE's last year isn't neglected. Knox looked like a rookie because he was a rookie.  Yes he had drops, but also made plays some that very others have the skill set to make.  And yes is too early to tell, but if you sign another TE to take over as the #1, then you'll never know what Knox can do.

Is it an exaggeration? Maybe to a certain degree. You can say the Bills invested heavily in Charles Clay to get him away from Miami. Knox was a third round pick, otherwise, the rest of the TE’s over the past 20 years have been lower round picks or castoffs from other teams. Again, not heavy investment in the position, so you can arguably say, it’s been neglected. 

[nikuman]

6 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Your post stated that they neglected the TE for years.  Signing 4 TE's last year isn't neglected. Knox looked like a rookie because he was a rookie.  Yes he had drops, but also made plays some that very others have the skill set to make.  And yes is too early to tell, but if you sign another TE to take over as the #1, then you'll never know what Knox can do.

 

Agree on Knox.  Just now I was rewatching the first Miami game from last season where he made one of those drops -- turning to find the defender before securing the ball.  That's concentration/focus, not lack of skills.  I think he'll be just fine.

[Jerome007]

Knox has made crazy good catches. Has competitive spirit galore. And yes... lots of drops. But he is inexperienced, and most drops were too quick to go for yards and not looking the football in. I find that more correctable, and he has FIRE

 

How is he as a blocker?

 

TE group might not be game breakers but still, at least average with very good depth.

 

[ganesh]

2 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Knox or bust....the rest of these guys are scrubs....next year we will target TE in FA or the draft. The Bills historically have never put a huge emphasis on TE's, so I hope Dawson Creek develops?

I wish they had taken a flier on Colby Parkinson from Stanford in the 4th round.  He was team captain, 

 

Here is what ESPN had to say about Colby:

 

Pre-Draft Analysis

Parkinson is a team captain and big target with a wide catching radius. He makes tough catches over the middle, and Stanford took advantage of his ability to win 50-50 balls by isolating him out wide. Parkinson is fast enough to make some plays down the seam. He's a competitive blocker with the frame to get better. -

[Rc2catch]

Wonderful times to see people trying so hard to find complainants. 
We are now down to no star tight end

not enough talent at punter 

backup quarterback 

4-5th corner spots

4th safety spot 

5-6th linebacker spot

 

Not bad, I can handle the crying over those categories 

[Flip Johnson]

1 hour ago, RobbRiddick said:

Knox had some key drops but he also made some great plays. I loved the guy as soon as he ran over those Bengals DBs and he made enough plays the rest of the year to make me think he'll show a big step up in his second year. 

 

When you consider they barely threw him the ball in college, I think he did pretty well and has the potential to be really good.

 

Olson or anyone other vet type is a progress blocker. Knox has big time talent and the right thing to do is put the pressure on him.

[billsfan714]

Just now, Buffalo_Stampede said:

How? TE IMO is the strongest it's ever been since I've been a Bills fan. Everyone is so focused on the drops but Knox is a legit TE prospect to develop. 

In your world is Dawson Knox Travis Kelce?   is Kroft Zach Ertz?   Its overall a pretty weak unit.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

10 minutes ago, billsfan714 said:

In your world is Dawson Knox Travis Kelce?   is Kroft Zach Ertz?   Its overall a pretty weak unit.

He's flashed elite skills. Needs to develop. Knox had a very good rookie season for a TE.

[djp14150]

3 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Looks like McBeane is happy with Knox, Sweeney, Kroft, Smith and Croom. IMO, the TE position has been neglected for years. While I like the other offensive additions this offseason, I felt TE was a glaring hole. Yes, Knox flashed some potential, but he also had a lot of drops. Not saying Knox doesn’t have the ability to improve, but if the Bills are planning on Knox to be the #1 TE, then I think it’s a mistake. It would be nice if the Bills could get with the rest of the NFL and get one to two TE’s that have the potential for multiple 100+ yard games a season. If I’m wrong and Knox and Sweeney turn out to be diamonds in the rough for the Bills, then I will gladly eat some crow on this. 

They drafted TE last year

they knew this draft would be weak in TE

they have Knox, Sweeney, and kroft this is more likely TE by committee

you figure they likely have a rotation of 4 WRs in a game and 2 RBs who catch passes

 

they used a late 3rdon Knox and brought in Kroft last year. Not every rookie has sn all pro season.

 

have 100+ yds per game will be a bad measuring stick.

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

How many games did the Bills TE’s have 100+ yards receiving in last year, let alone the past twenty years? 

 

Getting 100+ yd games is not a measuring stick.

 

hiw many 20+ down field throws to receivers were there last season.  To get 100+ yd games you usually need a couple of long pass plays in a game not a bunch of 4-10 yd pass plays.

[djp14150]

1 hour ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Thanks again! Not surprised by the Cheatriots numbers.

 

Lets no mix a TE playing in a WR position on a play vs actually playing in a TE slot.

[BuffaloBillsGospel]

3 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Looks like McBeane is happy with Knox, Sweeney, Kroft, Smith and Croom. IMO, the TE position has been neglected for years. While I like the other offensive additions this offseason, I felt TE was a glaring hole. Yes, Knox flashed some potential, but he also had a lot of drops. Not saying Knox doesn’t have the ability to improve, but if the Bills are planning on Knox to be the #1 TE, then I think it’s a mistake. It would be nice if the Bills could get with the rest of the NFL and get one to two TE’s that have the potential for multiple 100+ yard games a season. If I’m wrong and Knox and Sweeney turn out to be diamonds in the rough for the Bills, then I will gladly eat some crow on this. 

 

You say were not keeping up with NFL, did we not trade up for Knox and grab Sweeney? We also have developmental in Croom and if Kroft can ever stay healthy he's a versatile guy. Knox is our future, I know people are having a hard time with this but get on board with him as our guy because he looked really good for a rookie in year 1 and I'm banking he improves even more as he gets acclimated to the NFL. 

[djp14150]

1 hour ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Is it an exaggeration? Maybe to a certain degree. You can say the Bills invested heavily in Charles Clay to get him away from Miami. Knox was a third round pick, otherwise, the rest of the TE’s over the past 20 years have been lower round picks or castoffs from other teams. Again, not heavy investment in the position, so you can arguably say, it’s been neglected. 

 

In thadt 10 years only 7 TEs were picked in the first round.

 

what does that say to you?   You don’t invest early in TEs . Instead you draft them in the 3rd-5th rounds and hope they can develop.

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

4 minutes ago, djp14150 said:

 

In thadt 10 years only 7 TEs were picked in the first round.

 

what does that say to you?   You don’t invest early in TEs . Instead you draft them in the 3rd-5th rounds and hope they can develop.

 

That's the key. TEs need time to develop, at least a year before they become a major part of the offense. Easily the most difficult of the skill positions to get touches as a rookie.

 

Knox had some drops but also some spectacular catches. Showed he can make yac. Willing blocker, needs work there.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Buffalo_Stampede

[Paup 1995MVP]

3 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Outside of Metzelaars, I have to agree. Been watching the Bills since the same time period (during the Chuck Knox era).

We signed Charles Clay in 2015 to a big contract coming off of several very good years with the Fish.  He was a huge disappointment for us.  Played with the enthusiasm of a corpse.  Give Sweeney a chance.  He can make plays.  The decision making on who played and who was inactive on Sundays last season on offense was dubious at best.  Yeldon Sweeney and Duke should have been playing ahead of Gore Smith and Foster the entire second half of the year.  

[TigerJ]

4 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

Just signed a guy UDFA, see the thread

The guy the signed is a shade under 6'1."  That means it's unlikely they view him as a pure tight end.  Another clue might be the fact that he's listed as a FB/TE.  More than likely this is a message to Patrick DiMarco that the Bills are looking for options.  If the UDFA comes in and shows well in training camp, it might give Buffalo a position flexible player they can move around and get more use from than a pure fullback.  To put it in simpler terms, the signing of Gilliam says more about DiMarco than it does about the tight ends.

Edited April 26, 2020 by TigerJ

[Cash]

3 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

How many games did the Bills TE’s have 100+ yards receiving in last year, let alone the past twenty years? 

 

How many do you think we should expect?  (Honestly curious what you think.)  FYI, there were 28 total 100-yd TE games last year, by 14 total players:

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=game&year_min=2019&year_max=2019&season_start=1&season_end=-1&pos[]=TE&is_starter=E&game_type=R&career_game_num_min=1&career_game_num_max=400&qb_start_num_min=1&qb_start_num_max=400&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&week_num_min=0&week_num_max=99&c1stat=rec_yds&c1comp=gt&c1val=100&c5val=1.0&order_by=player

 

And I might've misread it, but I don't believe any team had 2 different TEs have a 100 yard game.  Less than half of the league had a TE get to 100 yards last year, and only 8 total TEs had multiple 100 yard games.  I'll give you 9 since Zach Ertz is clearly capable of it, but that's not exactly something fair to expect or demand from the team.  Especially since this was by all accounts a really bad TE draft. 

 

IMO, drafting bad TEs won't solve the problem of lack of TE production.  I'm not 100% sold on Knox, but I feel much better about him than any Bills TE since Riemersma, and I also like Sweeney to a decent degree.  Kroft is fine but probably won't ever be a guy who moves the needle, and Lee Smith blocks and gets flagged.  Even if Knox pans out, I'd love to have 2 real threats at TE with Sweeney also on the depth chart.  But I just don't think that was available to add this year.  I liked that they tried to sign Greg Olsen, but he didn't come here.  Failing that, any other FA would've both cost too much and potentially stunted Knox's development.  And I just don't think any TE in the draft would've helped more than the guys they actually took.  Especially because they already have 2 young TEs, and IMO it's hard to develop a lot of young players at the same position simultaneously. 

 

So anyway, I agree that the team should be trying to upgrade the TE position, I just think it's harder than you make it seem.  And I also think that our best short-term path to upgrading that position is to focus development resources on Knox & Sweeney.

[Nelius]

I don't think we are. We're gambling on Knox. I'm for it, but he's so raw and inexperienced in general that it wouldn't be crazy if he didn't meet our hopes, or even completely disappeared next year. Or just gets hurt. Depth other than Kroft (bum) and Sweeney (who knows) would be nice.

 

Ha, oh yeah, Jason Croom. How could I forget. Does he add anything or is he truly just a nepotism holdover? I feel like it's been a long time since I've seen him play and I knew little about him to begin with.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Nelius

[NoName]

12 hours ago, BaaadThingsMan said:

I also think Sweeney could emerge as a good one as well. He may surprise people this year

I don't see it with Sweeney.  Nothing stands out about him.  The ceiling on him is as a 3rd TE/blocking specialist to replace Lee Smith.  Very interested in seeing how Knox develops.  Croom is interesting to me. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

8 hours ago, Nelius said:

Ha, oh yeah, Jason Croom. How could I forget. Does he add anything or is he truly just a nepotism holdover? I feel like it's been a long time since I've seen him play and I knew little about him to begin with.

No, Croom can catch...wait, maybe it's 'no Croom can catch'.  Also hinges on whether we're talking footballs, or Pegula women.  ?

[davefan66]

Knox will be our #1 TE.  Feel he should solidify that status by the end of next season.

 

Until then, Kroft is a capable guy as long as he can stay on the field.  I think Sweeney has the potential to be a good #2, needs some time.  Other than them, don’t see much from Croom and Smith is done.

 

Doesn't say much for our TE group.  If someone unexpected gets cut, Beane will always be looking at his options.

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

13 hours ago, r00tabaga said:

Lee Smith is gone?

Smith is the only legitimate blocking TE on the roster. He needs to clean up his penaltys but he does fill a need on this roster. Knox is most likely the starter with Kroft. Sweeney has potential to develop into a solid all purpose TE. I think it's crystal clear that Croom is only on the TE depth chart because he's dating the owners daughter. He can't block, he runs horrid routes, he cannot get open, he has horrid situational awareness.

[Hebert19]

10 hours ago, Nelius said:

I don't think we are. We're gambling on Knox. I'm for it, but he's so raw and inexperienced in general that it wouldn't be crazy if he didn't meet our hopes, or even completely disappeared next year. Or just gets hurt. Depth other than Kroft (bum) and Sweeney (who knows) would be nice.

 

Ha, oh yeah, Jason Croom. How could I forget. Does he add anything or is he truly just a nepotism holdover? I feel like it's been a long time since I've seen him play and I knew little about him to begin with.

I like croom tbh.  He has potential to he everything clay was supposed to be. 

[Mr. WEO]

14 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

How? TE IMO is the strongest it's ever been since I've been a Bills fan. Everyone is so focused on the drops but Knox is a legit TE prospect to develop. 

 

Knox has potential.

Lee is useless.

Croom hasn't shown much....whne he has been able to play.

Kroft was a predictable dud.  Another team's damaged goods.

Sweeney could be a sleeper.

 

If that's the strongest it's ever been, it's a testament ot how badly the franchise has treated the position since they have existed.

[Einstein's Dog]

The Bills are probably set at TE this year.  As others have said the FO has not neglected the position, they drafted 2 last year.

It seems a purposeful strategy to identify winning draft picks and allow to develop.  If successful the Bills will be good for an extended period of time.

If the draft picks work you slowly release the veterans and maintain the home grown studs (usually slowly but can be quick like with RBs).

 

Knox is one of those developing players that will be a stud (w Allen, T White, Edmunds, Singletary).  You should start marinating your crow now, because it looks like it will happen this season.

 

I would have liked to see an addition though.  They missed on Olsen.  I don't think OJ Howard is the answer.  Time for Knox to be the man IMO.

[Alphadawg7]

18 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Looks like McBeane is happy with Knox, Sweeney, Kroft, Smith and Croom. IMO, the TE position has been neglected for years. While I like the other offensive additions this offseason, I felt TE was a glaring hole. Yes, Knox flashed some potential, but he also had a lot of drops. Not saying Knox doesn’t have the ability to improve, but if the Bills are planning on Knox to be the #1 TE, then I think it’s a mistake. It would be nice if the Bills could get with the rest of the NFL and get one to two TE’s that have the potential for multiple 100+ yard games a season. If I’m wrong and Knox and Sweeney turn out to be diamonds in the rough for the Bills, then I will gladly eat some crow on this. 

No disrespect, but you can’t say the TE position has been neglected for years when just last year Bills drafted two of them, including trading up back into the 3rd to get one.  
 

Is it set?  Yes and No.  Yes being they have 2 young TEs that showed a lot of promise they are developing right now, but no as they are still only entering their 2nd year.

 

So yeah, not a surprise they didn’t make a move for a TE.  We have a vet in Kroft finally healthy to go along with 2 promising second year players, especially Knox.  I’m sure they would have if something made sense, Beane is never afraid to add competition to the mix or make a move he feels makes us better.  But this wasn’t a good draft for TEs at all, might be the worst position in this draft IMO.

 

I could still possibly see Beane making a trade too for either Njoku (Browns signed Hopper and drafted TEs) or Howard (Gronk and Brate their) if the price is right. But at the same time, won’t surprise me at all if he doesn’t given they like Knox and Sweeney’s potential.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Knox has potential.

Lee is useless.

Croom hasn't shown much....whne he has been able to play.

Kroft was a predictable dud.  Another team's damaged goods.

Sweeney could be a sleeper.

 

If that's the strongest it's ever been, it's a testament ot how badly the franchise has treated the position since they have existed.

Sweeney IMO showed enough to considered a decent developmental TE. Kroft is fine as a depth TE. Kroft has been a good depth TE in Cincy. Kroft is not much more than that because he can't stay healthy.

 

It is a talented group of TE's. There's potential, just nothing proven. It's rare to get a good proven TE in their prime either by trade or free agency. You typically have to develop your own. We'll know a lot more about this group after this year. If no one takes steps toward being a good starting TE then we probably add someone else to the group next year.

[IgotBILLStopay]

19 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Looks like McBeane is happy with Knox, Sweeney, Kroft, Smith and Croom. IMO, the TE position has been neglected for years. While I like the other offensive additions this offseason, I felt TE was a glaring hole. Yes, Knox flashed some potential, but he also had a lot of drops. Not saying Knox doesn’t have the ability to improve, but if the Bills are planning on Knox to be the #1 TE, then I think it’s a mistake. It would be nice if the Bills could get with the rest of the NFL and get one to two TE’s that have the potential for multiple 100+ yard games a season. If I’m wrong and Knox and Sweeney turn out to be diamonds in the rough for the Bills, then I will gladly eat some crow on this. 

We just need some stickum for Knox and need to sit Lee Smith. Otherwise we are set.

 

 

[Mr. WEO]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Sweeney IMO showed enough to considered a decent developmental TE. Kroft is fine as a depth TE. Kroft has been a good depth TE in Cincy. Kroft is not much more than that because he can't stay healthy.

 

It is a talented group of TE's. There's potential, just nothing proven. It's rare to get a good proven TE in their prime either by trade or free agency. You typically have to develop your own. We'll know a lot more about this group after this year. If no one takes steps toward being a good starting TE then we probably add someone else to the group next year.

 

 

Guys who can't stay healthy (Kroft, Croom) can't be considered depth, unless you mean on the IR list. 

 

Knox and Sweeney have a long way to go.  The other 3 have a combined 46 catches over the past 2 seasons.  Deadwood.

[MrEpsYtown]

Players will shake loose from teams who drafted tight ends, Adam Shaheen, Jake Butt, maybe a Will Dissly/Jacob Hollister type of guy. I do like our group, but some young vets could shake loose in the coming weeks. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

21 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Guys who can't stay healthy (Kroft, Croom) can't be considered depth, unless you mean on the IR list. 

 

Knox and Sweeney have a long way to go.  The other 3 have a combined 46 catches over the past 2 seasons.  Deadwood.

 There is potential with this group. They do really like Croom as well. 

 

I wanted them to upgrade Kroft as depth but it didn't happen, he took a  pay cut. I wouldn't mind Delanie Walker as depth over Kroft but I don't know how interested he'd be in that role for Buffalo.

Edited April 26, 2020 by Buffalo_Stampede

[Marvlevydraftdaygenius]

I like sweeney the guy has suchuncops for hands.

[Jerry Jabber]

2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

No disrespect, but you can’t say the TE position has been neglected for years when just last year Bills drafted two of them, including trading up back into the 3rd to get one.  
 

Is it set?  Yes and No.  Yes being they have 2 young TEs that showed a lot of promise they are developing right now, but no as they are still only entering their 2nd year.

 

So yeah, not a surprise they didn’t make a move for a TE.  We have a vet in Kroft finally healthy to go along with 2 promising second year players, especially Knox.  I’m sure they would have if something made sense, Beane is never afraid to add competition to the mix or make a move he feels makes us better.  But this wasn’t a good draft for TEs at all, might be the worst position in this draft IMO.

 

I could still possibly see Beane making a trade too for either Njoku (Browns signed Hopper and drafted TEs) or Howard (Gronk and Brate their) if the price is right. But at the same time, won’t surprise me at all if he doesn’t given they like Knox and Sweeney’s potential.

It was a generalization of how the Bills haver treated the TE position over the decades. I've been a Bills fan since 1980 and can only name a handful of TE's that have made any kind of impact on the team. Clay and Knox are probably the most the Bills have invested in the TE position since the 90's. The Bills overpaid for Clay and got some good production out of him early on, but declined significantly towards the end. Knox has potential, but he has a lot of work to do. 

1 hour ago, IgotBILLStopay said:

We just need some stickum for Knox and need to sit Lee Smith. Otherwise we are set.

 

 

I love that movie. "Coach, it looks like I just jacked off an elephant..." 

[first_and_ten]

20 hours ago, DJB said:

We cant draft an A+ prospect for every position each year.

 

We tried to add G Olsen sonwe aren't satisfied with the group.

 

Hopefully Knox takes a big step or we will likely be looking for a draft upgrade next year

 

This is true. We cannot get a top prospect every year. I thought that they might draft one somewhere, but I think they realize they won't get one better than what they already have later in the draft. I like Knox. He's a tough player. Will he make a big enough jump to qualify as a threat that other teams have to be afraid of, we will see.

[DJB]

15 minutes ago, first_and_ten said:

 

This is true. We cannot get a top prospect every year. I thought that they might draft one somewhere, but I think they realize they won't get one better than what they already have later in the draft. I like Knox. He's a tough player. Will he make a big enough jump to qualify as a threat that other teams have to be afraid of, we will see.

 

It was a relatively weak class as well. I love Trautman but even I'm not sure hes a huge upgrade on Knox. Plus he is a long term prospect and likely won't make much impact year 1. 

 

Kmet is another guy who has a high floor but low ceiling.  Will impact year one but again I dont see much if any improvement over Knox. 

 

We will find out if Sweeney and Knox are here to stay or if a big upgrade is needed come draft time next year. 

[KD in CA]

They drafted Knox to be the guy.  If he develops into that, they are set.  The rest are role players.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

2 hours ago, Marvlevydraftdaygenius said:

I like sweeney the guy has suchuncops for hands.

'suchuncops'?  Between your screen name and 'suchuncops', I think your space bar is broken.