Sean McDermott: "Culture Trumps Strategy" ?​​​​​​​

[teef]

1 minute ago, PeterDude said:

 

How do you get that without actually winning due to bad coaching & lack of talent?

Right. It has to be the perfect storm. Good coaching, the right talent, winning attitude, etc. 

[CountDorkula]

2 minutes ago, teef said:

Jesus Scott, he didn’t say or imply that at all. I think all coaches know that if your line and backs aren’t up to snuff, the running game suffers. Culture can’t change that, nor was it ever implied. 

He literally said "Once the attitude improves the run game will improrve."

 

He either is lying out of his ass, or is an idiot. 

[teef]

5 minutes ago, apuszczalowski said:

Yeah, no one said you dont need talent or strategy, just that he feels culture is more important when building a team then just talent for strategy. They know they need talent, but if they are evaluating between players, they look at they type of person/player they are as much as their talent

That’s fair, but some posters are running with this like he’s implying talent isn’t that important. We know that’s not the case. I don’t like McDermott said anything was more important that the other. To make a Super Bowl run, you have to have it all. 

[teef]

Just now, CountDorkula said:

He literally said "Once the attitude improves the run game will improrve."

 

He either is lying out of his ass, or is an idiot. 

If he really thinks that, then I’m certainly not on board. I suppose that would mean that he thinks the talent is ok, and that guys aren’t just properly motivated. No one thinks the talent is ok. 

[Wayne Arnold]

4 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

He implied it.

 

He's said the running game will improve if the Bills attitude changes. 

 

And I have no idea why he keeps saying this team is young. They aren't. 

 

To be fair, when your starting quarterbacks in both units (MLB is considered the QB of the defense) are rookies, you can consider yourself young.

 

And I’d be curious to know how many teams have more combined first and second year players on their 53-man rosters.

[teef]

1 minute ago, ScottLaw said:

Did you listen? 

I didn’t see that. Look above. 

[C.Biscuit97]

SM would probably be an amazing high school coach.  He definitely should be running a nfl team though.

 

and in fairness, I don’t care about quotes.  The proof is on the field.  They get credit for breaking the drought (as does Dalton, luck, and a crap AFC). But this has been some boring football.  132 passing yards in a league that is setting scoring records.

3 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

To be fair, when your starting quarterbacks in both units (MLB is considered the QB of the defense) are rookies, you can consider yourself young.

 

And I’d be curious to know how many teams have more combined first and second year players on their 53-man rosters.

Aren’t we one of the oldest teams in the nfl?

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

Starting to get this uneasy feeling that we're witnessing Gregg Williams 2.0 ?

[teef]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

SM would probably be an amazing high school coach.  He definitely should be running a nfl team though.

 

and in fairness, I don’t care about quotes.  The proof is on the field.  They get credit for breaking the drought (as does Dalton, luck, and a crap AFC). But this has been some boring football.  132 passing yards in a league that is setting scoring records.

Aren’t we one of the oldest teams in the nfl?

This is where I’m at with it. 

[JoPar_v2]

1 minute ago, AlCowlingsTaxiService said:

Starting to get this uneasy feeling that we're witnessing Gregg Williams 2.0 ?

You’re the second person to make that comparison in this thread. That is...concerning to say the least. 

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

I don't buy this. 

Im sure there is a reason why he said it (although i dont know what that is)

 

He coached this team to the playoffs last year....you gotta let him do his thing this year he has earned that.

[Philo]

17 minutes ago, nucci said:

what are the many key pieces.....there is no core of star players to build around...there is going to be a large roster turnover again next season...many of the vets that are team leaders (Williams, Alexander....) will be gone...

 

They believe they have their QB, MLB, LT, CB1 in place as well as a few other talented young players contributing (for example Milano, Johnson, Phillips). 

 

A lot of talent is still needed, so yes there will be significant turnover next year. Until then we have to deal with the growing pains of young talent. 

[John from Riverside]

20 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

If McDermott and Beane are trying to build the culture - which I am totally down with - they need to do a better job at identifying players who fit the culture.

 

Off the top of my head, Vontae Davis and Kelvin Benjamin, have been big whiffs.  One quit and the other clearly seems to be lacking effort.

 

Also, I think finding "team first" guys is becoming more and more difficult as players (in the NFL, in general) have finally come to the realization that the teams don't give two ***** about them.

I think they have identified them....they just dont have all the players on board to replace the players that are NOT part of the culture they are trying to biuld yet....which comes next year.

 

And for the ppl disputing whether this is a "old or young" team....the CORE of this team is young......everyone else is just replaceable parts...i think when they are talking about it being a young team they are talking specifically about guys like Allen, Edmunds, Dawkins, etc....guys that are actually gonna be here a while...the other guys are just rentals

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, John from Riverside said:

Im sure there is a reason why he said it (although i dont know what that is)

 

He coached this team to the playoffs last year....you gotta let him do his thing this year he has earned that.

 

He hasn't earned anything. What's past is past and he has to prove himself every day, week, and year just as anyone else does.  NFL stands for Not For Long. He'll either evolve and adapt with the proper balance of strategy, tactics, talent, and culture or die. 

[iinii]

Strategy is defined as having a plan. Macro equals culture? Micro equals talent? Sports and language are a brutal mashup.

[RobbRiddick]

He should have said "culture is just as important as strategy".

 

It's like when I drunkenly told my wife "a good ass beats personality". I knew just from her scowl that I should have at least put them on equal footing.

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

He hasn't earned anything. What's past is past and he has to prove himself every day, week, and year just as anyone else does.  NFL stands for Not For Long. He'll either evolve and adapt with the proper balance of strategy, tactics, talent, and culture or die. 

Says who?  You or the husband/wife combo that owns the team?

 

I dont think they are looking at this the same way you are

[jkeerie]

I agree with McDermott to a point.  He didn't say "Culture is everything."  He's basically saying if you don't have players that go about things the right way, your strategy won't succeed...likely long term.  Look at Miami.  Gase took a page from McDermott's book and cut talented players that don't fit what they're trying to do.  As someone said, they put themselves ahead of the team (Landry, Suh).  Miami looks better for it this year.

 

Having said that though, there are obviously flaws in the talent area and the coaching area.  The TEAM is young...not individual players.  The TEAM has only been together 2 years.  We loved this team last year because this TEAM, despite the lack of talent, won enough games to make the playoffs...over the previously more talented teams that didn't have the right culture.  They have added new pieces, that individually have to grow and learn...and collectively have to grow and learn.

 

We're frustrated now because the team hasn't played well...particularly the offense, which has the most new starters.  I'm going week to week this season.  If they bounce back this week and play better football, we'll all feel better.  I want to see steady improvement...from the rookies, the coaches and the team.  It doesn't mean I've drunk the cool-aid.  It just means that I'm willing to be objective and patient. (For now.)

[4_kidd_4]

19 minutes ago, Gugny said:

Also, I think finding "team first" guys is becoming more and more difficult as players (in the NFL, in general) have finally come to the realization that the teams don't give two ***** about them.

 

Bingo. And I do not blame any players with a “me first” mentality.

 

“It’s a business” works both ways.

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, John from Riverside said:

Says who?  You or the husband/wife combo that owns the team?

 

I dont think they are looking at this the same way you are

 

No you're right. He has a job for life no matter the results. 

[ColoradoBills]

43 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

My initial reaction to this (the whole quote) was "Oh no, Oh no."
Maybe there's yet more context to it, in terms of the question he was asked

 

I suppose the details of what he means by "culture" and by "strategy" matter.

 

Gentle readers:

What do those two words mean to you?

 

 

 

31 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

See, this is kind of where I am.  Culture is important - do people want to be there?  Do they consistently put in their best effort to prepare, execute, evaluate, and improve?  Are they team first, and not memememe?

 

But I think it's hard - maybe impossible - to build a great culture if you don't have a sound strategy and have people believe in that strategy.

 

I think a lot of people in this thread are confusing strategy and tactics, which with I sympathize because it's always been a point I get mixed.

 

 

Your questions are the real base of what comments like this from a HC or GM mean.

 

Taking your terms I will attempt to describe what I think McDermott is trying to say.

Let's start from the bottom and work up.

 

Tactics:  I would think is means the play to play, half time adjustments, and specific game plans.

These SHOULD change the most IMO to be effective.  Coaches have a plan BUT a "responsible" player can influence a tactic by saying,

"I know I can beat this DB inside".

 

Strategy:  High football planning,  Examples would be a 4-3 D vs 3-4.  Run first vs West Coast.

This gets trickier when it comes to coaching.  Do you as a coach move towards your overall base strategy or do you adjust your strategy to fit

the players you currently have.  What is the strategy of your coordinators vs your own theory.  Are your position coaches fulfilling the needs.

This can change, but you don't want to change every year.  Belichick is real good at adapting his Strategy when needed.

 

Culture:  The most "theoretical" of all.  Rex Ryan had a culture that was "player friendly".  Marrone had a "I'm the boss" top down culture.

Belichick has his "Patriot Way" which is another type of top down.  Davis had his "Just Win Baby".

 

From what I see and hear from McDermott is this "I want to play football" culture.  Self responsibility, adaptability, team first, work well with others

culture.  Coaches don't (or shouldn't) change the culture, it's the way the players and coaches ACT at a human level.

[iinii]

9 minutes ago, AlCowlingsTaxiService said:

Starting to get this uneasy feeling that we're witnessing Gregg Williams 2.0 ?

Join the club. I am on record in this forum making that assertion at least 2 weeks ago. You will have to get one of the nerdier types to find it though. 

Dumping big contracts and BIG people were the “hallmarks” of Greggo’s Regime. 

[MJS]

So do you guys think that the coaches aren't trying to use strategy on game days?

 

I think it is pretty obvious that they are trying. I'm just not sure if Daboll is the right guy with the right strategy or play calling. And obviously we have a telent deficiency, which should change in part next year with all the draft picks and cap space.

 

The team better be good in two years, with big strides made next year. Even if Allen is not a franchise QB, the Jags have shown that you can compete with an average one. Allen, with his physical gifts, can at least be average.

[Nihilarian]

The Bills made the playoffs last year, so what's wrong with the culture? 

 

I think I'll take Sean McVay's strategy over building a culture. The Bills need to fix the offensive run game before they ruin this rookie QB.

[Gugny]

6 minutes ago, 4_kidd_4 said:

 

Bingo. And I do not blame any players with a “me first” mentality.

 

“It’s a business” works both ways.

 

Absolutely.  Loyalty is completely gone.  This is why the whole, "attracting free agents," notion is a joke.  It's all about the Benjamins (except Kelvin ... not him).

[MJS]

5 minutes ago, iinii said:

Join the club. I am on record in this forum making that assertion at least 2 weeks ago. You will have to get one of the nerdier types to find it though. 

Dumping big contracts and BIG people were the “hallmarks” of Greggo’s Regime. 

 

Greg Williams was, and is, a complete @$$. He is more interested in acerting his dominance than actually building something.

 

McDermott is different. He is a lot more humble and wants to actually build something and learn from mistakes. Maybe he will be successful, or maybe not. But he is a better leader and a lot better motivator.

 

But ultimately the results on the field are what matter. McDermott, like any other coach, won't stick around if the team continues to lose, even if last year bought him an extra year or two.

Edited October 3, 2018 by MJS

[transient]

I thought he was saying culture grabbed strategy by the... err... ladybits.

[iinii]

11 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I think they have identified them....they just dont have all the players on board to replace the players that are NOT part of the culture they are trying to biuld yet....which comes next year.

 

And for the ppl disputing whether this is a "old or young" team....the CORE of this team is young......everyone else is just replaceable parts...i think when they are talking about it being a young team they are talking specifically about guys like Allen, Edmunds, Dawkins, etc....guys that are actually gonna be here a while...the other guys are just rentals

Shady is a rental. He won’t make it to the promise land. Sadly we should find him a good home and take whatever draft capital we can get. After seeing Earl Thomas go down, Shady has to be thinking, I am risking what I have left for what? 

[zow2]

The Culture stuff is real but he's just rationalizing publicly why they suck so badly.  It's easy to say "we're trying to build the right culture here, growing pains,etc."  blah blah, blah.

 

Bottom line- if they miss on Josh Allen... if JA doesn't prove to be a solid NFL QB... then this whole staff and GM will be blown up.  They have the 2019 offseason and next fall to get this right. 

[JoPar_v2]

6 minutes ago, MJS said:

So do you guys think that the coaches aren't trying to use strategy on game days?

 

 

No I think people are just disagreeing with where McDermott placed strategy in his hierarchy.

[ColoradoBills]

1 minute ago, MJS said:

So do you guys think that the coaches aren't trying to use strategy on game days?

 

I think it is pretty obvious that they are trying. I'm just not sure if Daboll is the right guy with the right strategy or play calling. And obviously we have a telent deficiency, which should change in part next year with all the draft picks and cap space.

 

The team better be good in two years, with big strides made next year. Even if Allen is not a franchise QB, the Jags have shown that you can compete with an average one. Allen, with his physical gifts, can at least be average.

 

This is the biggest question that us fans have in the last 2 weeks.

I truly don't think Daboll "forgot" what was working in the Vikings game as compared to the GB game.

 

The Bills HAVE to completely redo the talent on offense.  A blind man knows that next year will be almost a completely different roster.

FACT:  The Bills drafted a strong armed, gunslinger type QB that has some "Hero" Brett Farve type qualities.

Is it smart to play your QB in a "dink and dunk" offense? 

If this year is an evaluation of what players on offense you want to keep wouldn't you want to evaluate them in the type of

down field passing scheme I believe Daboll want to have?

 

IMHO, Daboll and Beane SHOULD be building an offense around Josh Allen 100%.  If that means losing some games badly this year...........so be it.

 

I got a feeling it will be a much more balanced attack this week in front of the home crowd.  BUT, it won't be the type of ball they will want

to ultimately see from Josh Allen.

[LABILLBACKER]

All I know is this cute little "culture" and "process" thing better find us better players in the next 2 years or these 2 guys are gone. Preferably offense Sean....

[nucci]

2 minutes ago, iinii said:

Shady is a rental. He won’t make it to the promise land. Sadly we should find him a good home and take whatever draft capital we can get. After seeing Earl Thomas go down, Shady has to be thinking, I am risking what I have left for what? 

The difference is McCoy got the big money contract extension and Thomas did not

[C.Biscuit97]

20 minutes ago, JoPar_v2 said:

You’re the second person to make that comparison in this thread. That is...concerning to say the least. 

Gregg Williams is a piece of crap and a miserable human being. SM seems like a genuine and nice guy.  If anything, he is young Dick Jauron.  We have essentially played Jauronball the last 2 years.  We “overachieved” because of the lack of talent they helped provided.  Last year was the greatest version of Jauronball ever besides Jauron’s 13-3 year.

[iinii]

7 minutes ago, MJS said:

 

Greg Williams was, and is, a complete @$$. He is more interested in acerting his dominance than actually building something.

 

McDermott is different. He is a lot more humble and wants to actually build something and learn from mistakes. Maybe he will be successful, or maybe not. But he is a better leader and a lot better motivator.

 

But ultimately the results on the field are what matter. McDermott, like any other coach, won't stick around if the team continues to lose, even if last year bought him an extra year or two.

Williams didn’t build a defense that win a Suber Bowl?

[BarleyNY]

It was a stupid thing to say. It’s a bad look in general and something that would obviously lead to the tweets and other comments that we’ve seen from the media. McD has to be smarter than that.  I’ll give him the benefit of doubt that he really didn’t mean it that way.

[jkeerie]

10 minutes ago, 4_kidd_4 said:

 

Bingo. And I do not blame any players with a “me first” mentality.

 

“It’s a business” works both ways.

The team that McDermott refers to though is not the Bills "business."  It's playing for each other.  It's 53 individuals collectively playing for one goal.  Coaches coach the players they are given.  They recognize the business aspect of it...thus turnover...but move forward irrespective of it since most times they have little control over the business side of things.

 

 

[4_kidd_4]

8 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Absolutely.  Loyalty is completely gone.  This is why the whole, "attracting free agents," notion is a joke.  It's all about the Benjamins (except Kelvin ... not him).

 

Ha!

 

Pay to play indeed. I chuckle at some of these “rah rah” locker room speeches because you know there’s at least a handful of guys rolling their eyes in there.

 

Didn’t someone on the Steelers film themself basically doing just that during a Tomlinson rahrah session?

[CountDorkula]

19 minutes ago, jkeerie said:

I agree with McDermott to a point.  He didn't say "Culture is everything."  He's basically saying if you don't have players that go about things the right way, your strategy won't succeed...likely long term.  Look at Miami.  Gase took a page from McDermott's book and cut talented players that don't fit what they're trying to do.  As someone said, they put themselves ahead of the team (Landry, Suh).  Miami looks better for it this year.

 

Having said that though, there are obviously flaws in the talent area and the coaching area.  The TEAM is young...not individual players.  The TEAM has only been together 2 years.  We loved this team last year because this TEAM, despite the lack of talent, won enough games to make the playoffs...over the previously more talented teams that didn't have the right culture.  They have added new pieces, that individually have to grow and learn...and collectively have to grow and learn.

 

We're frustrated now because the team hasn't played well...particularly the offense, which has the most new starters.  I'm going week to week this season.  If they bounce back this week and play better football, we'll all feel better.  I want to see steady improvement...from the rookies, the coaches and the team.  It doesn't mean I've drunk the cool-aid.  It just means that I'm willing to be objective and patient. (For now.)

 

1st bold he said "once our attitude changes the run game will improve" - which is entirely false. 

2nd bold This makes zero sense. in that case every team in the NFL is young because players and coordinators are constantly changing.

 

 

4 minutes ago, jkeerie said:

The team that McDermott refers to though is not the Bills "business."  It's playing for each other.  It's 53 individuals collectively playing for one goal.  Coaches coach the players they are given.  They recognize the business aspect of it...thus turnover...but move forward irrespective of it since most times they have little control over the business side of things.

 

 

 

Find me a team that doesn't do this. 

[K-9]

He’s right; football character trumps every other aspect involved. All the talent in the world means squat without the character to do what it takes to get the most out of it and it’s what separates those who make it and those who don’t; the bad teams from the good, the good from the great. The greatest strategists can incorporate schemes to beat the opponent, but it is wasted if players don’t have what’s necessary to apply them. 

 

Every player in the league is athletically gifted enough to be there and there is a razor thin line between super bowl champ and worst team in the league when it comes to that aspect. 

 

Football character applies to GMs, coaches, scouts, trainers, and everybody else in football ops as well.