Stads Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I was listening to "The John Murphy Show" tonight and one caller said we have been winning since E.J. is being utilized as a game manager. Murph disagreed pretty strongly and said he is too talented for that role. I think, as of right now, game manager is all I want him to be. It ain't broken, so no need to fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 (edited) I was listening to "The John Murphy Show" tonight and one caller said we have been winning since E.J. is being utilized as a game manager. Murph disagreed pretty strongly and said he is too talented for that role. I think, as of right now, game manager is all I want him to be. It ain't broken, so no need to fix it. Ben Rothelisberger was a game manager in his first two seasons on his way to the AFC Championship in the first year and the Super bowl in the 2nd season. His goal was to not make mistakes and make the right throws. The defense and STs were built to win the championshop for them. I am perfectly happy with EJ being a game manager for the next two seasons as long as we continue to win. BTW, a game manager still needs to make sharp and critical throws. EJ still has his task cut out. THe only thing is that the Bills are not asking him to win the games by himself. Edited September 17, 2014 by ganesh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FluffHead Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Manuel has really played well these first two games. I have been critical of him in the past but he really has played well. However he is a game manager right now, and that is fine. He's winning and that's what matters. Where he differs from the Alex Smiths of the world is he has the potential to develop into more than a game manager Murphy is a cheerleader/homer so of course he's gonna try to sell Manuel as more than he currently is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 EJ DA GREAT !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonechiller Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Not to sound like an idiot, but aren't all QB's "game managers"? It is just basically how much of a risk do you take? The more confident you get, the more risk you take Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Manuel has really played well these first two games. I have been critical of him in the past but he really has played well. However he is a game manager right now, and that is fine. He's winning and that's what matters. Where he differs from the Alex Smiths of the world is he has the potential to develop into more than a game manager Murphy is a cheerleader/homer so of course he's gonna try to sell Manuel as more than he currently is. Right. I heard the segment, too, driving home. The caller mentioned several names of QBs in the modern football era that won Super Bowls with game managers, including the Ravens with Dilfer, the Bucs with Gannon, the Seahawks, etc. What Murph was saying though was that he doesn't think of EJ as only a game manager, he thinks he has a much higher ceiling than that because he's big and strong and has a strong arm, etc. He really wasn't talking about his performance now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Grundy Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Teams, like NE, are going to game plan to make EJ beat them. They're gonna load up the box and leave their CBs on Revis Island. It's gonna be up to EJ to make the throws to beat them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOVEMESOMEBILLS Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Manuel has really played well these first two games. I have been critical of him in the past but he really has played well. However he is a game manager right now, and that is fine. He's winning and that's what matters. Where he differs from the Alex Smiths of the world is he has the potential to develop into more than a game manager Murphy is a cheerleader/homer so of course he's gonna try to sell Manuel as more than he currently is. Your right EJ is, as of now, a game manager. I'm hoping by the end of the year he's a very good QB. Winning while, developing and gaining experience, will help him and any QB for that matter. I'm a fan of his, a homer at times I admit, but I think everyone would have to say he's show definite improvement. Was excited to see the deep pass to Watkins and the pass to Chandler on the sideline, those were both thrown rather deep, before they were open, and were very well placed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Not to sound like an idiot, but aren't all QB's "game managers"? It is just basically how much of a risk do you take? The more confident you get, the more risk you take I think that's a valid point - all QB are game managers to some extent. I think the way the term is generally used, though, is to describe a run-first type offense where the QB is expected to make a few critical throws and avoid mistakes. There are QB in this league, not many but a few, who can pretty well carry the team to victory on their passing ability and decision making. Brees. Rodgers, Brady. Peyton Manning. Luck appears to be moving in that direction. Possibly Rivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Right. I heard the segment, too, driving home. The caller mentioned several names of QBs in the modern football era that won Super Bowls with game managers, including the Ravens with Dilfer, the Bucs with Gannon, the Seahawks, etc. What Murph was saying though was that he doesn't think of EJ as only a game manager, he thinks he has a much higher ceiling than that because he's big and strong and has a strong arm, etc. He really wasn't talking about his performance now. That was brad Johnson with the bucs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnwalter Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 the line between "game-managers" and "non-game-managers" is so blurry that the phase carries little-to-no weight - it's meaningless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 That was brad Johnson with the bucs. Right. My bad. The guy just mentioned the Bucs, not the QB specifically I don't think, and I mixed those two guys up. Same thing though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Ben Rothelisberger was a game manager in his first two seasons on his way to the AFC Championship in the first year and the Super bowl in the 2nd season. His goal was to not make mistakes and make the right throws. The defense and STs were built to win the championshop for them. I am perfectly happy with EJ being a game manager for the next two seasons as long as we continue to win. BTW, a game manager still needs to make sharp and critical throws. EJ still has his task cut out. THe only thing is that the Bills are not asking him to win the games by himself. Precisely. "Game manager" isn't a judgement of quality. It is more a description of role. At this point in time, EJ is a game manager. And for the first two games of the year, a pretty good one at that. But a great game manager needs to make big plays, when the situation calls for it. But typically the game manager doesn't have the weight of the offense entirely on his shoulders. At the moment, that's the ideal situation for EJ and the team. Right. I heard the segment, too, driving home. The caller mentioned several names of QBs in the modern football era that won Super Bowls with game managers, including the Ravens with Dilfer, the Bucs with Gannon, the Seahawks, etc. What Murph was saying though was that he doesn't think of EJ as only a game manager, he thinks he has a much higher ceiling than that because he's big and strong and has a strong arm, etc. He really wasn't talking about his performance now. And he could be right. At some point in time, the Bills may need the QB to take on a different role, If, for example, the RB corp gets decimated by injury, or the OL falls apart, the weight of the offense may have to be carried by EJ. I hope that doesn't happen in the near future. I happen to be one who thinks EJ has the physical skills to be able to excel in that role. But currently he hasn't had to demonstrate the ability to do it. Of course, he hasn't been asked to do it, either. I prefer he doesn't have to do it in the near future. Not to sound like an idiot, but aren't all QB's "game managers"? It is just basically how much of a risk do you take? The more confident you get, the more risk you take Of course. In some offenses, though, the QB is the centerpiece of just about every play. In others, he is more of a complementary piece. Still a great game manager is a usually a very good QB any way you look at it. And a great QB is typically a very good game manager. Guys like Dilfer were adequate game managers, who happened to be play for teams with great defenses---and they avoided mistakes. But you can tell by the limited success Dilfer had over time, he wasn't a great game manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Brady and Big Ben were most certainly game managing QBs in each of their 1st Super Bowl wins. Nothing to be ashamed of early on in a QB's career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Brady and Big Ben were most certainly game managing QBs in each of their 1st Super Bowl wins. Nothing to be ashamed of early on in a QB's career. That's an interesting argument. To me, Big Ben and Russell Wilson, while they had modest stats, were really playmakers, and made all kinds of big plays when needed, which was a huge help to their team and vital to their offense. Trent Dilfer and the early Brady were not nearly the playmakers that Ben and Wilson were (Ben even more so than Wilson). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Allan in MD Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 How can one be too talented to be a game manager? Managing the game means taking charge, directing, and executing. It doesn't necessarily take tons of talent to pull that off. You need to be on top of things and work to make things happen. Last season EJ showed little aptitude in any of these areas. This year he certainly appears to be running the show as opposed to running scared. Too talented? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Whenever the Steelers needed a third and long conversion Ben would make a ridiculous run or pass or scramble or escape, like Wilson, and keep the drive alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 That's an interesting argument. To me, Big Ben and Russell Wilson, while they had modest stats, were really playmakers, and made all kinds of big plays when needed, which was a huge help to their team and vital to their offense. Trent Dilfer and the early Brady were not nearly the playmakers that Ben and Wilson were (Ben even more so than Wilson). Doug Flutie was the Ultimate game manager for the Bills. When he played we knew we had a shot to win. Whenever the Steelers needed a third and long conversion Ben would make a ridiculous run or pass or scramble or escape, like Wilson, and keep the drive alive. Isn't that being a good manager. Ben was not the centerpiece of that team. The RBs (Parker and Bettis), Defense (Polamalu, Hampton) and ST were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Isn't that being a good manager. Ben was not the centerpiece of that team. The RBs (Parker and Bettis), Defense (Polamalu, Hampton) and ST were. I think of a game manager of just doing enough to not lose, and playing conservative and within those conservative confines so you do not make mistakes. I think of Big Ben and Russell Wilson and Doug Flutie as playing within a conservative gameplan but also making a lot of plays a lot if not most QBs may not make just when you need them that produce wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klos63 Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Ben Rothelisberger was a game manager in his first two seasons on his way to the AFC Championship in the first year and the Super bowl in the 2nd season. His goal was to not make mistakes and make the right throws. The defense and STs were built to win the championshop for them. I am perfectly happy with EJ being a game manager for the next two seasons as long as we continue to win. BTW, a game manager still needs to make sharp and critical throws. EJ still has his task cut out. THe only thing is that the Bills are not asking him to win the games by himself. I understand what is meant by game manager but it makes no sense. No player is asked to win games by themselves. No QB wants to make mistakes and all QB's want to make the right throws. Some are better at it than others.Manuel is expected to make every throw he attempts. We haven't had the need to air it out yet, but when it happens he will be expected to do more than he is now. We do have a style of team that doesn't need a QB throwing 400 yards. We rely on our running game and our defense. That's how championships are won. Think Phil Simms when you see Manuel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T master Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I was listening to "The John Murphy Show" tonight and one caller said we have been winning since E.J. is being utilized as a game manager. Murph disagreed pretty strongly and said he is too talented for that role. I think, as of right now, game manager is all I want him to be. It ain't broken, so no need to fix it. Murph needs to look at the red zone percentage I think i read where the Bills are 28th in the league in red zone percentage or was that 3rd downs can't remember exactly but either one is not good so he is managing the game & is not a elite QB talent . Wake up Murph …. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stads Posted September 17, 2014 Author Share Posted September 17, 2014 How long does everyone think the "don't let E.J. do too much" game plan can be effective? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 How long does everyone think the "don't let E.J. do too much" game plan can be effective? Works pretty well for the Seahawks and 49ers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Game manager, to me is like that stupid phrase #1 receiver. Ambiguous and dependent upon a million different variables that change with circumstances, game situations, coverages, what the defense is giving you, etc. If you have a young qb who is average and learning the ropes, you give him a thinner playbook so he can focus on fundamental plays. If that makes him a game manager then that's what he is. I see it as a meaningless term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Funny how "game manager" has become a euphemism for any starting quarterback that isn't a household name. Kind of like "character actors". To me, it's a specific term for a QB whose savvy and risk-averse nature overcomes an inability to hit intermediate and deep routes. Think Chad Pennington or Matt Cassel. The Bills run a ton of plays on the ground because that's where their strengths lie, but when EJ is asked to throw he has the full gamut of routes at his disposal. In my opinion, he is NOT a game manager. On the same token, Fitz (a below average starter overall) isn't a game manager. He's a misbegotten gunslinger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Teams, like NE, are going to game plan to make EJ beat them. They're gonna load up the box and leave their CBs on Revis Island. It's gonna be up to EJ to make the throws to beat them I personally cannot wait for them to do that. I truly believe our WR core will have a field day if you let them run around in single coverage. They won't load the box long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I personally cannot wait for them to do that. I truly believe our WR core will have a field day if you let them run around in single coverage. They won't load the box long. Yes. Game manager blah blah blah. Dude is twelve games into his career and like you, I love the thought of leaving our skill players in single coverage!! I think our line is doing enough that EJ will be just fine in the art of game management! That art is to win. Just win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Murph needs to look at the red zone percentage I think i read where the Bills are 28th in the league in red zone percentage or was that 3rd downs can't remember exactly but either one is not good so he is managing the game & is not a elite QB talent . Wake up Murph …. Those little poison pills in your comments.....red zone percentage does not boil down to the "talent" of EJ........there are several different factors involved here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I would say that EJ is being used is in a conservative game managing manner. But I don't think that's bad. The guy is a young QB with a good amount of talent around him. Ask for him to play in a context that helps him develop and the team win. Its a lot easier to ask the guy to be a conservative type player now and then slowly open up what he is doing later on in the season and his career, then to lean on him too much and collapse his confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Fong Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Teams, like NE, are going to game plan to make EJ beat them. They're gonna load up the box and leave their CBs on Revis Island. It's gonna be up to EJ to make the throws to beat them Exactly right. In the past Bills teams have folded once this strategy was employed. Hopefully this team is different. If they are EJ is going to have to throw down the field when he's needed in a way that we haven't seen a QB do since Bledsoe was around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Isnt every QB a game manager? Code for "he sucks but his team is awesome." B.S. Right now EJ is making the right decisions, he's getting rid of the ball, not turning it over, making plays, and all the while looks very confident in the pocket. You know, out playing the other guy. It's a shame that all the EJ bashing just can't allow us to sit back and enjoy watching this kid develop. Instead we dissect every pass. Or every "check down." Btw, there are check downs and there are panic checkdowns. EJs have been the former. He's going to have a bad day. He's going to make bad throws. Remember, the plan is to develop and see what we have by seasons end. And so far so good. Can't wait till Sunday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JESSEFEFFER Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 To me "game manager" is all about how agressively a coaching staff thinks about their offensive play calling. Run first, patient teams with defenses and special teams units that are succeeding and that are developing a young QB want a game manager performance. It means their game plan has worked. If their plans work then there is no reason for their still developing QB to make 40 pass attempts. When things are going well in all three phases, as they have so far, EJ will look like a game manager and the Bills will likely win. If not then circumstances will dictate that they need him to play more agressively. So, the difference is between what they ask of a QB while the game is going well and what he is actually capable of doing when things aren't going well. True game managers typically have no upside and are limited by their talent. I think Murph is right in that EJ is limited by design and circumstance but he can do more when circumstances change. It will be interesting to see just how much he can do and how soon he will show us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I think Big Ben's first two years are a good comparitor for EJ. If I was describing him at this moment in time, in terms of what I see him as NOW - he is a game manager who has shown an ability to be clutch (Carolina, Atlanta, Chicago and I'm sure I'm forgetting one). That is exactly what Big Ben did in those early years. I know what Murph is saying and I do think people get very hung up on the "game manager" term.... I think that the majority of good QBs in this league are game managers to some degree. There are some "boom or bust" QBs.... Romo springs to mind.... but they don't win a great deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 EJ is in the game manager mode right now, as it is the next step in his process. The hope is that he gets a little more of the reigns as time goes on and he takes it upon his shoulders more with success. That would be the next step. Its all a process. That's just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skibum Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 (edited) "Game Manager" is the most overused and inane term in football today. Every QB is a game manager. They run the plays as they are called. Run, throw, whatever. It's not like EJ has some special instructions to limit his pass attempts. It's as annoying as the term "Puck-possession team" is for hockey. Every team is a puck-posession team. If you don't possess the puck, you lose. Edited September 17, 2014 by skibum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I was listening to "The John Murphy Show" tonight and one caller said we have been winning since E.J. is being utilized as a game manager. Murph disagreed pretty strongly and said he is too talented for that role. I think, as of right now, game manager is all I want him to be. It ain't broken, so no need to fix it. right, and John Murphy is not a shill for OBD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Whatever wins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamSandwhich Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Whatever wins +1000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Teams, like NE, are going to game plan to make EJ beat them. They're gonna load up the box and leave their CBs on Revis Island. It's gonna be up to EJ to make the throws to beat them You can bet Marrone will keep using the read option as a threat, but EJ will have to scare opposing defenses with some runs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaattMaann Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I don't know for certain and I don't think any of us do, but I don't think the play book is scaled down for EJ - I think all plays are available for Hackett to send in, I think our coaches are making a concentrated effort at putting EJ is winnable situations as far as limiting risk and getting to good down and distances.... They are establishing an identity (which they attempted to begin last year) - hard hitting, dominating defense and power run game....which by nature asks less of a starting QB It's an identity....you wouldn't do that with Drew Brees on the saints because that's not where their talent lies, but on the flip side you are seeing the Packers attempt to switch to more of a ball control, power offense because they have a work horse running back now and an oline that has not been able to keep Rodgers off his back for years now - you coach the team you've got - and EJ is playing his part to a T right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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