DeShawn Williams (DT) Expected To Sign With Bills

[colin]

1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

 

Beane is like a college kid who spent years overdrafting his credit card and now is finally forced to make smart spending decisions. Let's hope it's a long term lesson and not just a short term change out of necessity.

 

 

ya, in some management training stuff i did recently they made a distinction between urgent and important, (some would look at it as big upside vs unacceptable downside).  urgent stuff always gets eyes on it, because the kind of people who run organizations in the modern world have a huge bent towards avoiding downside and love to be proactive (i'd say an elon musk type is the exception, where he's always "looking down field" so to speak).  Beane is obviously a prototype Type A guy, so he's concerned about the urgent stuff, but that's lead him to over pay to keep poyer, you might say the same about morse, over draft RBs (as we've always had a bit of a hole there) and at times way over pay for rotational D lineman.  

 

I suspect he's learning that slight differences between toohils and addisons of the world are not worth the big contract differences when you are throwing them in for a limited number of snaps, but the slight differences between kinkaid and knox are sufficient in terms of their game impact to go out and draft kinkaid when you already have knox, and so forth.

 

i still think we need to have a new real play maker on O emerge (maybe diggs goes back to 2020 form, maybe rookie, maybe cook continues to imrprove, whatever) and we need to add play makers on D vs last year (milano being healthy, von returning to form, aj growing, i think there a few paths there) to get us over, and no amount of medium to good signings (like we used to love) is gonna get us there.

[Back2Buff]

He's better than Jordan Phillips and Settle.  Therefore, an upgrade to last year.

[Beast]

4 hours ago, Whkfc said:

Another older guy

Yeah, breaking news. Free agents are usually older guys.

[mrags]

33 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

The blips don't add up. Only the top 51 contracts count towards the cap. Vet minimums push other vet minimums out of the calculation. My hope is that the team will be more willing to let day three picks replace the likes of DeShawn Williams and Casey Toohill. But we still need a baseline piece in place before the draft because maybe we won't get any DEs for example on day three. At least now we are spending the vet minimum or close to it on these baseline depth pieces, instead of paying Jordan Phillips $5M to sit in the medical tent.

Paying these guys what they are paying them absolutely 100% better than paying Phillips to sit in the medical tent. Don’t disagree with that one bit. 
 

but the vet min contracts do add up. There will be at least 4-5 of them on the backend of the roster eating up cap space this season. When we get the final 53 we can revisit this and you can call me an idiot all you want at that point. But for now, we will just have to see. 
 

my argument is, and has always been if you up 4, 5, 6+ vet min deals and replace them with rookie deals, you pay half as much. Saving roughly 4-6m that could be spent elsewhere. It’s literally the difference between a guy like Harty and Hopkins if you look at last season as a reference. 

[Dillenger4]

6 minutes ago, Back2Buff said:

He's better than Jordan Phillips and Settle.  Therefore, an upgrade to last year.

He is? Why do you say this? If he is better than Jordan Phillips then he must be pretty damn good! I hope you are correct! I don't know this new guy so....

[The Jokeman]

7 minutes ago, mrags said:

Paying these guys what they are paying them absolutely 100% better than paying Phillips to sit in the medical tent. Don’t disagree with that one bit. 
 

but the vet min contracts do add up. There will be at least 4-5 of them on the backend of the roster eating up cap space this season. When we get the final 53 we can revisit this and you can call me an idiot all you want at that point. But for now, we will just have to see. 
 

my argument is, and has always been if you up 4, 5, 6+ vet min deals and replace them with rookie deals, you pay half as much. Saving roughly 4-6m that could be spent elsewhere. It’s literally the difference between a guy like Harty and Hopkins if you look at last season as a reference. 

In previous versions of CBA (not sure of recent one tbh) veterans earning the minimum salary counted at a lower cap figure to allow teams to not replace old guys with younger ones to allow veterans to play longer/get a vested pension etc. 

[Warriorspikes51]

7 minutes ago, Dillenger4 said:

He is? Why do you say this? If he is better than Jordan Phillips then he must be pretty damn good! I hope you are correct! I don't know this new guy so....

 

Phillips is not good IMO and takes costly dumb penalties at the worst times.   It's upsetting because he is BIG. 

 

DeShawn Williams  had 37 & 33 tackles the last 2 years.   Phillips had 20 & 15 

So just like Austin Johnson had 44 tackles las year  (more than Settle, Phillips, Ford COMBINED)  this is another upgrade in Run Defense

Williams also had 4.5 sacks in December with Denver in 2022 

Edited March 28 by Warriorspikes51

[SoonerBillsFan]

4 hours ago, mrags said:

And just when we thought we were shedding some of the aged players in this team. Going for a youth movement. Nope. Not this staff. 
 

 

You and I had this very discussion.  Nothing changes until McBeane is gone.

[Warriorspikes51]

4 hours ago, mrags said:

And just when we thought we were shedding some of the aged players in this team. Going for a youth movement. Nope. Not this staff. 
 

 

 

Absurd.  This player is 30.  No NFL team has a roster full of 25 year olds 

[Steptide]

Did the bills ever officially announce signing the o line guy from the Chargers? 

[Turbo44]

21 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

You and I had this very discussion.  Nothing changes until McBeane is gone.

You want Beane gone?  Interesting........

[The Wiz]

3 hours ago, mrags said:

Yet I haven’t seen it confirmed by the team or the nfl. Or espn. Or Wikipedia. 
 

still doesn’t take away from the fact that we’re old at the position. 

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

5 minutes ago, Steptide said:

Did the bills ever officially announce signing the o line guy from the Chargers? 

Yes

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Beane is doing a solid job getting low price one year rentals to play behind Oliver and Jones. None of these guys will make a difference other than logging some snaps.

However, Beane is now free to trade down and draft WR, Edge, and Safety with first three picks. 

Another solid off-season by Beane with the notable exception of bringing Epenesa back. 

[Dillenger4]

1 hour ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

Phillips is not good IMO and takes costly dumb penalties at the worst times.   It's upsetting because he is BIG. 

 

DeShawn Williams  had 37 & 33 tackles the last 2 years.   Phillips had 20 & 15 

So just like Austin Johnson had 44 tackles las year  (more than Settle, Phillips, Ford COMBINED)  this is another upgrade in Run Defense

Williams also had 4.5 sacks in December with Denver in 2022 

Cool, thanks for the info and breakdown. Again, not familiar with Deshawn Williams.

I like Phillips but I agree, he is always hurt. So if Williams is an upgrade I think we will all be happy.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Low miles too, might be 31 but he didn’t play from 25-27. 

[mrags]

1 hour ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

Absurd.  This player is 30.  No NFL team has a roster full of 25 year olds 

I don’t care about other nfl teams. I want this team to win the Super Bowl once 

1 hour ago, The Wiz said:

 

Yup. Finally acknowledged by the Bills. 3 days later. 

[Back2Buff]

2 hours ago, Dillenger4 said:

He is? Why do you say this? If he is better than Jordan Phillips then he must be pretty damn good! I hope you are correct! I don't know this new guy so....

 

Did you even watch the games last year?  Phillips was one of the worst players in the entire NFL.  Literally watched guys run right by him.  Dude retired before last season.

 

PFF isn't a great measurement, but Phillips had a grade of 35 last year.  Horrible.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

7 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

likely a vet minimum to give them a baseline 4th DT after Oliver, Jones and Johnson. I'd be surprised if he ends up making the 53. But if they don't land a DT anywhere in the draft maybe he has a shot. 

 

Yeah.  You go into camp with 90.  Assume a pick, maybe also some UDFA's.  He's there to try and play his way on the roster, or at the very least push the rookies to earn their spot.  

[Mat68]

Johnson and Williams seem to be better than Phillips(injured) and Settle.  I think both are more 1 techs with is fine with me.  I expect at some point in the draft Buffalo drafts a guy who can penetrate and play 3 tech.  Similar to 3-4 DE there scheme limitations can force good players to drop.  

[The Wiz]

43 minutes ago, mrags said:

Yup. Finally acknowledged by the Bills. 3 days later. 

Well the fact that Jones reported it and it took an extra 3 days for them to make it official doesn't really have anything to do with one another.

 

How many times did we hear Von go on social about all the players he was recruiting and then they went somewhere else?  Not to mention all the contract details they need to put together, schedule a physical and also work around his schedule for when he could come to Buffalo to do all of those things prior to them being able to make it official.

 

"BUT IT TOOK THEM 3 DAYS!!!!"

Edited March 28 by The Wiz

[Royale with Cheese]

46 minutes ago, mrags said:

I don’t care about other nfl teams. I want this team to win the Super Bowl once 

Yup. Finally acknowledged by the Bills. 3 days later. 

 

Did you know there has never been a team to win a Super Bowl with having nothing but 25 year olds?  Why do you think your plan wins a Super Bowl when it's never been done?

2 hours ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

Absurd.  This player is 30.  No NFL team has a roster full of 25 year olds 

 

It's crazy to me that they are criticizing something that is unrealistic.  They make up a scenario that won't work and then criticize Beane when he doesn't do it lol.

[SoonerBillsFan]

2 hours ago, The Wiz said:

 

More depth,which is a good thing.

[LABILLBACKER]

8 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Probably a vet minimum deal to compete for the 5th DT role. He’s a guy that’s played a bunch in the NFL. What’s not to like? Who would you prefer as the 5th (or 6th DT)? 

If I get the 2022 version than it's a good signing. He's better than the likes of Ford, Settle, Phillips and Joseph. 

[oldmanfan]

6 hours ago, mrags said:

@4merper4mer

so are you saying you want to keep signing guys over the age of 30 and plug them into some of the most physical spots on a football team? 
 

The argument for more DT help isn’t my issue. We need bodies there. My issue is we went from one of the oldest teams in the league last year, to cutting a lot of aged players and being one of the younger teams just by addition by subtraction. And yet here we are getting older again with a lot of these free agents.
Hollins is over 30

Jones is over 32

Morrow is 28

Williams is 31

Austin Johnson (if he’s even signed I have seen confirmation yet) will be 30 by the time camp starts. 

 

I am pretty certain that if they had not signed veteran depth your take would that the Bills would now have to waste draft picks on unproven talent to have as backups.  

[Chas56]

8 hours ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Star Lotuleileileilei says hi

 

I was downstairs at the Chophouse after a game with friends. Star was there with his family and Frazier upstairs. They came down to leave and Star has about six kids, all a head shorter than the last, and all with his jersey but sized to fit them, with their last name on it. It was quite cute 😊 

[Malazan]

ahh, Peak offseason.

[HurlyBurly51]

8 hours ago, JGMcD2 said:

Jesus Christ. He played for the Panthers for 1 season… 2023. We’re 7 years removed from McBeane being there… are some of you that clueless? 

 

 

Who's their GM?  Did he work for Beane in Buffalo?  Seems like a logical connection.

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

5 hours ago, todd said:

I don't understand the complaining about beane and the Panthers/Wash connections when it comes to players. I don't know how many of you hire people as part of your job, but I do. I gladly go with someone I know, or comes with a recommendation from someone else I trust over someone off the street I don't know much about other than their resume. It's a damn no-brainer. It's the sign of a good and responsible leader.

Sounds like the old “friends and family plan” to me … 

[mrags]

2 hours ago, The Wiz said:

Well the fact that Jones reported it and it took an extra 3 days for them to make it official doesn't really have anything to do with one another.

 

How many times did we hear Von go on social about all the players he was recruiting and then they went somewhere else?  Not to mention all the contract details they need to put together, schedule a physical and also work around his schedule for when he could come to Buffalo to do all of those things prior to them being able to make it official.

 

"BUT IT TOOK THEM 3 DAYS!!!!"

The point was if the Bills haven’t announced it it’s not official. To say it like it was happening might have been correct but just like Von saying he’s recruiting players like Hopkins and OBJ and none of it Happened. So just wait until the team official announces it before we assume anything. 

2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Did you know there has never been a team to win a Super Bowl with having nothing but 25 year olds?  Why do you think your plan wins a Super Bowl when it's never been done?

 

It's crazy to me that they are criticizing something that is unrealistic.  They make up a scenario that won't work and then criticize Beane when he doesn't do it lol.

Pretty sure I’ve expressed how much I don’t want to talk with you. Like ever. No need to reply to me. Enjoy your life. 

[BillsFanForever19]

 

[todd]

1 hour ago, AlCowlingsTaxiService said:

Sounds like the old “friends and family plan” to me … 

 

Nope. Since you are responsible for the performance of the people you hire, there's no benefit to hiring someone just because they are a relative or acquaintance. I was speaking professionally, and people I know would be good at their job. Beane does the same thing.

[The Wiz]

9 hours ago, mrags said:

Yet I haven’t seen it confirmed by the team or the nfl. Or espn. Or Wikipedia. 
 

still doesn’t take away from the fact that we’re old at the position. 

 

4 hours ago, mrags said:

Yup. Finally acknowledged by the Bills. 3 days later. 

 

1 hour ago, mrags said:

The point was if the Bills haven’t announced it it’s not official. To say it like it was happening might have been correct but just like Von saying he’s recruiting players like Hopkins and OBJ and none of it Happened. So just wait until the team official announces it before we assume anything. 

It has nothing to do with it being official or not official.  You comments prior were clear that "they signed an old guy instead of getting younger" and "no one else has confirmed it".  Just because you haven't seen it confirmed by whoever it is you trust doesn't mean that it's not happening.  We aren't talking about Aaron Donald here, or OBJ or Hopkins.  This is a vet min guy that we are adding as a rotational piece.  Kind of surprised they didn't break into march madness or the opening day of baseball for a guy that is getting a 1yr/1.2m deal.

 

Long story short:

[BillsFanForever19]

Seeing a lot of posts that allude to him being nothing more than a camp body and a placeholder that isn't guaranteed to make the roster. And while no one who's not a starting core member of the team is a 100% guarantee to make the 53 - I think people are underselling the move.

 

He's a guy who started 10 games in 2023 and 15 games in 2022. For the role of rotational 3T behind Ed Oliver, that's a pretty solid type of player for that role. Do I think we still Draft another DT and possibly high? Yes. But I could just as easily see a scenario that in Johnson and Williams, they feel good about who they have behind their starters and just take another DT as depth and developmental in Day 3.

 

The idea that he may not even make the roster and his ceiling is competing for 5th DT seems to be a heavy discount of him. He's certainly on par or better than people we've had in that role in the past.

Edited March 28 by BillsFanForever19

[QLBillsFan]

10 hours ago, mrags said:

@4merper4mer

so are you saying you want to keep signing guys over the age of 30 and plug them into some of the most physical spots on a football team? 
 

The argument for more DT help isn’t my issue. We need bodies there. My issue is we went from one of the oldest teams in the league last year, to cutting a lot of aged players and being one of the younger teams just by addition by subtraction. And yet here we are getting older again with a lot of these free agents.
Hollins is over 30

Jones is over 32

Morrow is 28

Williams is 31

Austin Johnson (if he’s even signed I have seen confirmation yet) will be 30 by the time camp starts. 

 

These are veterans to add depth in areas of need. Jones clearly was a must resign and DTs have a decent shelf life. The Bills got younger at S and OL with the vet releases as difficult as that was. No 23-24 year olds on rookie contracts are available as depth, these guys are. Per the BB way he is going to have 3-4 need areas but this allows him to take the best player and not reach in the draft. 

[QLBillsFan]

6 hours ago, mrags said:

Paying these guys what they are paying them absolutely 100% better than paying Phillips to sit in the medical tent. Don’t disagree with that one bit. 
 

but the vet min contracts do add up. There will be at least 4-5 of them on the backend of the roster eating up cap space this season. When we get the final 53 we can revisit this and you can call me an idiot all you want at that point. But for now, we will just have to see. 
 

my argument is, and has always been if you up 4, 5, 6+ vet min deals and replace them with rookie deals, you pay half as much. Saving roughly 4-6m that could be spent elsewhere. It’s literally the difference between a guy like Harty and Hopkins if you look at last season as a reference. 

The rookies will cost 2-4M and BB said he had about 6-7$ M before DT Williams. The  rookies can beat him out or not. With $10 M the Bills have plenty of $$ if they want another impact vet post draft like Floyd last year. I don’t think you’re an idiot but the Bills will have these vets and some rookies make the team. It’s a balance. 11 rookies are not making this roster because the Bills already have good backups. Now if they see an amazing DT at a value pick they will take him. If not they have a 4 man rotation set to go because BB wisely added these 2 “old” vets. Perhaps they will go after DE, WR, and S earlier than DT. But if they get Newton at 28 the DT it’s because he’s the best guy and not a reach. More likely they get DE or WR. But imho he is positioning the Bills to have a very good draft of 8-9 guys who have a great chance to make the team. WR, DE, S, CB, RB, OT, LB, DT, KR. One of each could make the Bills. 

[JGMcD2]

3 hours ago, HurlyBurly51 said:

Who's their GM?  Did he work for Beane in Buffalo?  Seems like a logical connection.

That’s not where the “Beane loves Panthers” stuff originated.
 

DeShawn Williams isn’t a career Panther, or McBean Era Panther, or draft pick of Dan Morgan… he’s a journeyman that’s more recognizable for his 3 stints with Denver than anything to do with North or South Carolina, let alone the Carolina Panthers. 

[mrags]

24 minutes ago, QLBillsFan said:

The rookies will cost 2-4M and BB said he had about 6-7$ M before DT Williams. The  rookies can beat him out or not. With $10 M the Bills have plenty of $$ if they want another impact vet post draft like Floyd last year. I don’t think you’re an idiot but the Bills will have these vets and some rookies make the team. It’s a balance. 11 rookies are not making this roster because the Bills already have good backups. Now if they see an amazing DT at a value pick they will take him. If not they have a 4 man rotation set to go because BB wisely added these 2 “old” vets. Perhaps they will go after DE, WR, and S earlier than DT. But if they get Newton at 28 the DT it’s because he’s the best guy and not a reach. More likely they get DE or WR. But imho he is positioning the Bills to have a very good draft of 8-9 guys who have a great chance to make the team. WR, DE, S, CB, RB, OT, LB, DT, KR. One of each could make the Bills. 

Yea I understand everything you said. I love how people talk to me like I have no idea what’s going on. I’m simply expressing my opinion that I think it’s a terrible move. That doesn’t mean that we don’t have holes at DT or WR or any other position. My arguments are completely different. It’s that some people love to talk about things like they are in fact the best way to go. Well, news for everyone. If they were the best moves time and time again, we would have won a Lombardi by now. But they aren’t. Instead we’ve got guys like AJ Klein covering the best TE in the history of the league. There’s examples year after year. Point is, just because they are a vet doesn’t mean they are better than a rookie. Especially when they are 30+ years old and slower, and more beaten up than young kids. And I’m not arguing that every old vet is a terrible move. I’m simply saying that if you add up a lot of the old vets that are rotational, and 3rd stringers anyway, and replaced them with rookies you would save not just a little, added up it’s quite a lot. And with that pool of cash you can get yourself someone that much actually make a difference, besides AJ Klein off his couch. For example last year, for the price of Harty and Sherfield you could have had Hopkins. 
 

doesn’t matter. I’ve argued this point over and over again and everyone that likes to argue with me will makes comments like “point out what rookie players you’d rather have” my answer…. Any of them at their positions that cost half as much as vet minimum. These guys arent playing anyway. And if they are we have a lot more problems than we think. 
 

im done arguing the point. There’s no facts to base either argument being correct or not. Other than people pointing out that every other team in the league has vet minimum guys in their rosters. Great. First of all I’m not saying that every single one has to be gone. Second, I don’t give a crap about any other team in the league but the Bills. And the fact is what we’ve been doing isn’t working. We still don’t have a Lombardi trophy. We still haven’t been to a Super Bowl. We haven’t been to an AFC championship games since 2020. We’re not getting better. A change needs to be made. 
 

im done talking about it. Everyone else has their opinion and I don’t agree with them. They don’t agree with me. Neither of us is going to change each others minds. I’ll just leave it at that. 
 

54 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

 

 

It has nothing to do with it being official or not official.  You comments prior were clear that "they signed an old guy instead of getting younger" and "no one else has confirmed it".  Just because you haven't seen it confirmed by whoever it is you trust doesn't mean that it's not happening.  We aren't talking about Aaron Donald here, or OBJ or Hopkins.  This is a vet min guy that we are adding as a rotational piece.  Kind of surprised they didn't break into march madness or the opening day of baseball for a guy that is getting a 1yr/1.2m deal.

 

Long story short:

Actually. Long story short is, I disapproved of the move 3 days ago. When the rumor was put out there that he was signing. 
 

someone (and I don’t remember who, nor do I care, could have been you for all I know) made a comment that he was signed. When it was NOT IN FACT confirmed by anyone other than another player on Twitter. Not by league officials. Not by the team. Not even by Johnson himself. 
 

 

Edited March 28 by mrags

[The Wiz]

3 minutes ago, mrags said:

Actually. Long story short is, I disapproved of the move 3 days ago. When the rumor was put out there that he was signing. 
 

someone (and I don’t remember who, nor do I care, could have been you for all I know) made a comment that he was signed. When it was NOT IN FACT confirmed by anyone other than another player on Twitter. Not by league officials. Not by the team. Not even by Johnson himself. 

Well it wasn't me 3 days ago, I only posted that today that he was signed and again, not sure why a player signing (I'm assuming 1 year vet minimum) is hardly earth shattering news in the NFL.  Did you know that Justin Scheffer was cut from the Falcons?  Or that Rasheem Blackshear resigned with the Panthers?

I sure as hell didn't until I just looked up the transactions for today.

 

And again, I don't see why it's a bad thing to add depth at a position of need prior to the draft.

[QLBillsFan]

8 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

Complain about the DT signings all you want, but who else will the rookies compete with?

Yeah I’m a bit confused. BB signs a 4th DT to compete with other FA’s and Rookies. A 4-5th WR to do the same. They have like maybe 60-65 guys signed. So add in 11 rookies and these vet signings are not taking $ away from

the drafted rookies. To get these 2 DT’s in a tough market is great. If a rookie beats them out then fine. AJ Klein played because the Bills were decimated with injuries and not too much available talent is hanging around in January. Both starting LB’s were injured so… ? BB can’t sign 25 year old up and coming players at every position of need to $8 M 3 year deals.