Tyler Dunne story on McDermott - 3 parts, 25 interviews, one damning conclusion

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, JohnNord said:

He is well-sourced.  Also very biased.  

 

BTW, in the entire mix of this topic, who do you think are the most biased people?  

 

For my money I'm going for the McD apologists.  

 

 

[JohnNord]

22 minutes ago, Peter said:

 

And that is exactly what happened (he threw Dorsey under the bus) and various people here and on WGR fell for it.

 

McClappy fired the wrong coordinator. Although I had given McClappy the benefit of the doubt even though I was never a big fan, once he fired Dorsey it became clear to me that he is a snake and that all of his talk about accountability and culture etc. is pure BS.

 

The good news is that McClappy has no one else to throw under the bus.

 

I really hope that ownership does the right thing in the off season.

I’m not sure how you can watch the offense over Dorsey’s final 5 games and say he didn’t deserve to be fired.  

3 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

BTW, in the entire mix of this topic, who do you think are the most biased people?  

 

For my money I'm going for the McD apologists.  

 

 

Everyone in the forum is based.  Sports fans almost always are.  If someone is calling themselves a journalist you probably shouldn’t be biased unless it’s a schtick like Skip Bayless.  

19 minutes ago, SectionC3 said:

I’ll add this.  The Diggs piece is important, too.  If he’s going to be here, and he likely will be on next year’s roster, whomever is the coach has to be able to handle that personality.  From what I understand he is a handful.  I’ll leave that point with this:  Maddy Glab was right.  Take it for what it’s worth.  

I don’t think Diggs has much choice in the matter.  Because of his contract he’s stuck in Buffalo whether he likes it or not.

[JohnBonhamRocks]

“These boots are made for walkthroughs…”

 

Btw, complementary football is what we want. Complimentary football would be Josh being like “James, what a great 2.5 yard carry! Proud of you, bud!”

[Scott7975]

3 hours ago, Roundybout said:

https://www.golongtd.com/p/the-mcdermott-problem-part-i-blame?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
 

 

A very long read, and the other parts are only for paid subscribers, but his sources paint a picture of McD as a narcissistic control freak who won’t take accountability for anything. 
 

 

Do with this what you will. 

 

Thank you.  I have never subscribed to a news source in my life but after reading the snippet I spent the 8 bucks to read the rest.  Amazing article. McDermott needs to freaking go.  

 

It's a very long article but I recommend to everyone to spend the 8 bucks to read it.  Best Bills article I have read in a long time.  If you are on the fence on McDermott this will get you over the fence pretty fast.

[Alphadawg7]

8 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

So how did Dorsey's offense come out firing for four games then?  

 

Why was it that "complimentary football" only entered the equation after that?  

 

A wise person would question what's going on behind the scenes.  

 

 

Dorsey sucked.  Period.  End of story.  

[HomeskillitMoorman]

2 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Posters like me have been taking flak from this board for years when we criticized McDermott. 

Our only hope is just like Manning, Allen overcomes his moron HC. Dungy was a terrible coach that lucked into a top 4 QB of all time and still almost managed to never win a SuperBowl.  He should be in the Hall of Shame not the HOF. 

 

Let's hope Pegula looks back and sees what Tampa did to win a SuperBowl after years of Dungy failures.

 

 

Me too. For years I was in that same boat of all the negativity if I said one bad thing about McD. 
 

They’ll probably never admit how wrong they were, but at least many have come around. 

[Scott7975]

2 hours ago, Arkady Renko said:

I have a hunch his sources are Whaley,  Daboll and that OL who got cut after signing a big contract. 

 

He actually has a lot of sources in this article.  From coaches to assistants to players both former and current.  Some named and some not.

[SectionC3]

8 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

I’m not sure how you can watch the offense over Dorsey’s final 5 games and say he didn’t deserve to be fired.  

Everyone in the forum is based.  Sports fans almost always are.  If someone is calling themselves a journalist you probably shouldn’t be biased unless it’s a schtick like Skip Bayless.  

I don’t think Diggs has much choice in the matter.  Because of his contract he’s stuck in Buffalo whether he likes it or not.

Not the issue.  I agree with you.  The problem is finding someone capable of managing and tolerating that difficult and volatile personality. 

[PBF81]

40 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

You didn't like McD before Dunne's article.  You don't like him now.

 

So I guess BBG is right: it didn't move the needle. 

 

Not sure what that has to do with anything.  

 

I'm hardly one for hammering people that were wrong, much less touting myself, but given your comment I'll stand up for myself and say that I predicted all of this, so it's also hardly a baseless bias.  

 

You too and everyone else will be finding out more as time passes, just as we already have.  

 

Your insinuation, implicitly, that Dunne is lying about his sources and interviews is ridiculous.  And when he's posted favorable things here, everyone applauds.  

 

The most biased people in the mix are the handful and extreme minority that are still backing McD, who's done enough all by himself via his own statements to validate that he's in over his head.  

 

Either way, I'd prefer it if you'd stick to the discussion rather than go down the path of ad hominem.  I don't do that to you or anyone else, please don't do it to me.  

 

 

[Scott7975]

2 hours ago, MJS said:

These are the worst types of articles. A bunch of unamed sources who are mad they got fired for sucking at their jobs.

 

Just a bunch of garbage.

 

Sure except there are also a bunch of named sources and people who weren't fired but chose to leave.

[PBF81]

39 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

So, in short you and others have read the piece and come away feeling reaffirmed with what you had felt before the piece. Correct? That was my point.

 

I'm not going to discuss myself.  If you want to discuss the content, that's fine.  

 

 

[billsfan89]

Every head coach has “enemies” players who feel they were unfairly cut or not given a chance or coaches in a similar position. Dorsey’s offense was outright awful in design and he deserved to be fired. 
 

I know everyone is going to ***** on the defense (which unlike the offense lost 3 key starters for the season and had other players banged up) but the defense is not the reason this team lost most of the 6 games it has lost. You can only pin 2 maybe 3 losses on a bad defensive effort.

 

The Jets game was lost due to Josh and the turnovers and a ST return in OT.

The Jaguars game was lost because the offense didn’t get it going the only reason the Bills had a chance was because the defense kept a lot of points off the board.
 

The Pats loss was on the defense although had the offense got it going sooner I think they would have been fine. 
 

The Bengals loss was on both sides of the ball. The defense had a bad first half but only let up 3 points in the second half giving the offense a chance to make a comeback. 50/50 as to which side of the ball shouldered the loss.

 

The Broncos loss was completely on the offensive side of the ball as the only reason the game was close was because of turnovers the defense held their end of the bargain.

And the Eagles loss was more so on the defensive side of the ball. Although the defense did force a 59 yard field goal attempt in bad weather. Had that nearly miracle kick not happened the defense would have come up in the clutch. You can blame the defense on that loss somewhat fairly.

 

I just don’t see the defense being the primary reason this team has lost many of its games.

[PBF81]

36 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

It’s the same narrative Ty has been preaching for years.  It’s not surprising that this article is a reflection of that.  Some people have called into question his bias, and rightfully so.  

 

In the same way that biased McD supporters have been preaching for years.  

 

By the end of the season, perhaps sooner, if not by then, then next season, we'll know more.  

 

You do realize that the worst scoring offenses since our drought era began, before Allen took off in 2020, i.e. with one year under Taylor and two under Allen from 2017 to 2019, have been the worst on average, other than Jauron's, whose ranked only one spot lower, 26th compared to McD's 25th.  

 

If it isn't blatant that McD is clueless about offense at this point, I don't think that it will ever be to anyone defending him.  

 

But given that we have Allen and that the strength of our team is the offense, this isn't a difficult puzzle to solve.  Really.  

 

 

[Logic]

We tend to think of things in black and white. "Either this, or that, but not both".

But in the case of this article and of coach McDermott, I think both things can simultaneously be true:

I think Tyler Dunne probably DOES have a bit of an axe to grind against the Bills, he DOES seem to come out with one McDermott hit piece per year, the article IS a bit of a hatchet job, it DOES lack objectivity (like any quotes from people who actually LIKE McDermott to balance things out) and DOES present a one-sided view, and some of the quotes DO sound far-fetched and/or like sour grapes from other people with axes of their own to grind.

AND

I think coach McDermott probably DOES micro-manage, that he IS a bit of a hypocrite with regard to taking accountability for mistakes, that a lot of what Dunne says IS true and fair and accurate, that a lot of the quotes from the sources are valid and legitimate, and that no matter how you paint it, 25 people is a lot to be able to find to say bad things about a coach.

On the one hand, I think some of Dunne's articles may be a bit heavy-handed and do have the smell of an agenda against McDermott. On the other hand, I think a lot of what Dunne says is correct and legitimate and real.

Personally, I feel the same way after reading the article that I did before I read it: I think it's time to turn the page from Sean McDermott as head coach of the Buffalo Bills. I don't think he's as bad as his worst detractors say, nor as good as his staunchest defenders insist. There is nuance. There are layers. At the end of the day, I remain unmoved. I'm ready for a fresh start for the Buffalo Bills, and I'd be willing to bet a lot of the players are, too.

[WEATHER DOT COM]

44 minutes ago, 2003Contenders said:

While this piece was definitely a hatchet job on Dunne's part (appears he didn't even attempt to seek out alternative viewpoints),

There’s alternative viewpoints in the article… 

[PBF81]

36 minutes ago, Yobogoya! said:

Again, I think if you poll former players and staff from any coaching regime that's been in place for, say, 3+ years without a championship you'd find enough material for an article in similar tone. 

 

Doesn't mean the content of the article is untrue or that it's substance should be ignored. But it's also a lot easier to publish this article now as we're sitting 6-6 than it would be if we had closed out a few more games and landed 9-3 instead, I think. 

 

I don't know about that.  Many coaches get a pass because their talent isn't all that.  Factor in that McD has one of the few premier QBs in the game today, and a historical first, the bar should be quite a bit higher than say it's been for Shanahan in San Fran with Garoppolo, Mullens, and Purdy, don't you think?  

 

Put Allen on the Niners and they're winning b2b Super Bowls.  As it is, Shanahan's taken them once and lost two conference CGs, with Garoppolo the Neil O'Donnell of the modern era.  

 

I haven't read anything stating that Shanahan's the single dimension holding up the team.  

 

People critizing Dunne should simply come out and accuse him of lying.  He's either honest and telling the truth, or not.  Based on my experiences Dunne's a very honest person.  Objective, which many don't like.  That shouldn't be on him however.  

 

 

Edited December 7, 2023 by PBF81

[Peter]

28 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

I’m not sure how you can watch the offense over Dorsey’s final 5 games and say he didn’t deserve to be fired.  

 

 

If you really care (but I doubt you do), you can read my prior posts on the subject.

 

[Negan]

As Winston Zeddemore kind of said in Ghostbusters.

 

"If it gets McDermott fired, I'll believe in anything you say"

[HOUSE]

Vince Lombardi was an askhole and Bill Parcells a ditch head.

GOOGLE IT

[PBF81]

23 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Dorsey sucked.  Period.  End of story.  

 

LOL

 

I've read people here citing our point-differential recently, as a reason why we're good.  

Has anyone saying that stopped to look that that "differential" was generated in the first four games of the season.  +84

 

It's been +17 since.  -9 not considering our beat down of the hapless Jets.  

 

I'm hardly defending Dorsey, but we do not know what changed to turn a +21/game PD offense into one that can't even score more than it allows.  

 

"Complimentary Football" explains that for the astute.  

 

 

[Nextmanup]

3 hours ago, Roundybout said:

https://www.golongtd.com/p/the-mcdermott-problem-part-i-blame?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
 

 

A very long read, and the other parts are only for paid subscribers, but his sources paint a picture of McD as a narcissistic control freak who won’t take accountability for anything. 
 

 

Do with this what you will. 

This is 100% precisely how I have perceived him going back to the 13 seconds incident and having watched many things since.

 

He strikes me as TOTALLY being that kind of guy...judging his actions from the outside.

 

I guarantee you he's the kind of guy who can't be told anything, if it differs from his own personally held view.

 

We all know these types.

 

I'm currently in a "wait until this guy is gone" phase before I'm going to get fully excited about the Bills again.

 

I am also in a "wait and see" phase with regard to Pegula SELLING THE SABRES before I will be able to get excited about them.  I just want him to go away.  

 

In other words, pretty much standard operating procedure for a Buffalo sports fan.

 

[Peter]

Just now, Bogie_Klinkhammer said:

Vince Lombardi was an askhole and Bill Parcells a ditch head.

GOOGLE IT

 

I am not aware of either one throwing others under the bus while preaching "accountability" and complementary football . . . especially while leading a defense that has given up so many game losing drives . . . .

[BuffaloRebound]

I don’t disagree with the conclusions, but sourcing a manifesto like this with the isaiah mckenzie’s and quinton spain’s of the world has me actually defending mcdermott.  Every NFL coach who’s been around for 7+ years has accumulated a list of disgruntled ex’s .  So out of 300+ players, coach and staff mcdermott has had the last 7 years, one psycho reporter has religiously tracked down anybody who might have a beef with mcdermott.  Reporter comes off as unhinged.  

[TDO'Kearney]

3 hours ago, hondo in seattle said:

Let me be the naysayer who gets smacked around for a divergent view...

 

I like Dunne.  And he says he talked to 25 people for this article.  That's an impressive number.  

 

But I wonder who he talked to and which ones he quoted?  Coaches who were fired?  Players who were cut?  

 

It would be nice if he sought out a random sample.  Both McD detractors and fans.  But he seemingly didn't do that.  

 

I'm not arguing McD is perfect and doesn't do any wrong.  I just don't think Dunne's article is the final word.  We've heard a lot of players talk about how much they love the culture of the Bills.  Things aren't all bad.  

 

I think finding 25 ex-players and coaches in itself is impressive.   I don't think Ty Dunne could pick and choose beyong that.  The NFL is a small world and the wrong comments could keep you from being hired again.  You're only going to get the brave / nothing to lose people, most are going to keep their mouths shut.

[billsfan89]

2 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

I don't know about that.  Many coaches get a pass because their talent isn't all that.  Factor in that McD has one of the few premier QBs in the game today, and a historical first, the bar should be quite a bit higher than say it's been for Shanahan in San Fran with Garoppolo, Mullens, and Purdy, don't you think?  

 

Put Allen on the Niners and they're winning b2b Super Bowls.  

 

I haven't read anything stating that Shanahan's the single dimension holding up the team.  

 

People critizing Dunne should simply come out and accuse him of lying.  He's either honest and telling the truth, or not.  Based on my experiences Dunne's a very honest person.  Objective, which many don't like.  That shouldn't be on him however.  

 

 

There are 49ers fans who feel like Shanny’s holding them back. Mainly they feel like his inability to move on from Jimmy G and his inability to get his offense going in the playoffs is holding them back. 
 

Also “put Allen on the 49ers and they win a SB” is flawed logic. Had the 49ers had Josh they would have a QB with a much bigger cap number and not have the same roster. 
 

Most fanbases hate their head coach for various reasons. The Bills fanbase has valid criticisms of McD but I wouldn’t romanticize other teams head coaches to prove that point.

[Peter]

Just now, BuffaloRebound said:

I don’t disagree with the conclusions, but sourcing a manifesto like this with the isaiah mckenzie’s and quinton spain’s of the world has me actually defending mcdermott.  Every NFL coach who’s been around for 7+ years has accumulated a list of disgruntled ex’s .  So out of 300+ players, coach and staff mcdermott has had the last 7 years, one psycho reporter has religiously tracked down anybody who might have a beef with mcdermott.  Reporter comes off as unhinged.  

 

What did you think about McClappy invoking terrorists? Or, does that depend on who actually told TD?!?

[HomeskillitMoorman]

38 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

This right here already completely discredits this entire biased hit piece, and I am not even a McD excuse maker.  In fact, if Bills miss the playoffs I think McD should be fired because 12 men on the field and end of Philly decisions (timeout on the FG kick, not trying with Allen and 20 seconds with 1 TO), and holding onto Dorsey 2 weeks too long.  

 

But for the last time, Dorsey EARNED his firing.  He isn't a scape goat.  6 weeks prior to his firing against the weakest part of our schedule that included 3 of the worst teams in the NFL at the time we played them, the Dorsey led offense averaged 20.5 PPG, we went 2-4 and could have easily been 0-6 if not for 2 failed final plays by our 2 opponents we beat.  I said it all offseason, coming back again with Dorsey was GAMBLING on Allen and Diggs prime with an unproven OC who had lots of issues in his first year and too easily out coached.  

 

First 2 games after Dorsey, offense is avg 33 ppg against 2 tough defenses, including one (Jets) the Ken Dorsey led offense averaged 17 PPG against and was 1-2 with both losses to Zack Wilson.  

 

For someone to pretend Dorsey was a scapegoat or premeditated scape goats is utterly absurd.  In fact, McD's BIGGEST mistake was NOT firing Dorsey sooner.  He was out of his league last year at OC, and he was clearly out of his league this year again and McD held on to the point where Bills are basically now in an 8 game playoff to try and make the SB as another loss would make it very very difficult to get into the playoffs, let alone win 3 games to get to the SB.  
 

 

 

Dude you absolutely are a McScapegoat excuse maker. I remember just a couple or so weeks ago debating with you on it and you were making excuses every which way for him. 

 

Sure, Dorsey earned his firing, but McD hired him and kept him in that position for a year and a half. Just like he kept Frazier for years. He scapegoated Frazier and then does the same exact loser soft prevent zone at the end of games that he does. 

 

And the late game coaching blunders and poor game management have been going on for years, literally since year 1. This is nothing new. He's just had #17 here to constantly bail him out until this season. 

 

It's hard for me to understand why people like yourselves can't evaluate this until things go completely off the rails, and even now you're still saying he should go only "IF" we miss the playoffs! It's truly unreal. All of his blunders and gaffes are still blunders and gaffes even if we make the playoffs.

 

We've wasted 6 years of an elite talent at QB because of this trashbag coach who has never put in the slightest bit of work to improve himself or his preparation. That's the hard truth. 

[dave mcbride]

12 minutes ago, Logic said:

We tend to think of things in black and white. "Either this, or that, but not both".

But in the case of this article and of coach McDermott, I think both things can simultaneously be true:

I think Tyler Dunne probably DOES have a bit of an axe to grind against the Bills, he DOES seem to come out with one McDermott hit piece per year, the article IS a bit of a hatchet job, it DOES lack objectivity (like any quotes from people who actually LIKE McDermott to balance things out) and DOES present a one-sided view, and some of the quotes DO sound far-fetched and/or like sour grapes from other people with axes of their own to grind.

AND

I think coach McDermott probably DOES micro-manage, that he IS a bit of a hypocrite with regard to taking accountability for mistakes, that a lot of what Dunne says IS true and fair and accurate, that a lot of the quotes from the sources are valid and legitimate, and that no matter how you paint it, 25 people is a lot to be able to find to say bad things about a coach.

On the one hand, I think some of Dunne's articles may be a bit heavy-handed and do have the smell of an agenda against McDermott. On the other hand, I think a lot of what Dunne says is correct and legitimate and real.

Personally, I feel the same way after reading the article that I did before I read it: I think it's time to turn the page from Sean McDermott as head coach of the Buffalo Bills. I don't think he's as bad as his worst detractors say, nor as good as his staunchest defenders insist. There is nuance. There are layers. At the end of the day, I remain unmoved. I'm ready for a fresh start for the Buffalo Bills, and I'd be willing to bet a lot of the players are, too.

Randy Mueller agrees with you and doesn't hide behind anonymity: https://theathletic.com/5098045/2023/11/29/nfl-coaches-on-hot-seat/.

 

"Bills coach Sean McDermott is now front and center needing to have a plan for 6-6 Buffalo to not waste another year within the championship window of their perennial league MVP candidate Josh Allen.

 

McDermott is known for his attention to detail and his need to micromanage at every level. But right now his only management job should be his defense, which has underperformed this season. That’s where he needs to be a difference-maker on Sundays.

 

To be fair, some of the Bills’ issues are injury-related, but some have been a function of McDermott’s ill-timed blitzes and less-than-ideal execution. By replacing his defensive coordinator last off-season and installing himself, he has to be directly accountable for the unit’s results. His somewhat defensive responses to questions about his decisions are seen by some as an effort to pass the buck. I would love to see more transparent self-accountability. Sometimes a little humility can go a long way.

 

Forget about Allen and his propensity to make a crucial mistake. Forget about the dismissal of offensive coordinator Ken Dorsey; at this point it doesn’t matter. Forget about the lack of reinforcements that they may have been able to add to the defense before the trade deadline and didn’t. The point to focus on is that this defense has to play better over the last third of the season or questions will start to be asked about the guy who is leading the charge. Organizational skills be damned, McDermott needs to make a difference on Sundays.

 

The pass rush has generated sacks (41), but the sub package pressures to affect the opposing QB have been a letdown at critical times. The Bills rank 14th in opponent passer rating and 17th in getting off the field on third downs, per TruMedia. Neither is good enough to advance in the postseason.

 

The offense is trending in the right direction with the changes instituted by McDermott. Now he must do the same with the side of the ball where his expertise lies."

[BuffaloBillyG]

12 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

In the same way that biased McD supporters have been preaching for years.  

 

By the end of the season, perhaps sooner, if not by then, then next season, we'll know more.  

 

You do realize that the worst scoring offenses since our drought era began, before Allen took off in 2020, i.e. with one year under Taylor and two under Allen from 2017 to 2019, have been the worst on average, other than Jauron's, whose ranked only one spot lower, 26th compared to McD's 25th.  

 

If it isn't blatant that McD is clueless about offense at this point, I don't think that it will ever be to anyone defending him.  

 

But given that we have Allen and that the strength of our team is the offense, this isn't a difficult puzzle to solve.  Really.  

 

 

I just want some clarification here. Not trying to pick a fight, but the way I'm reading this seems...odd.

 

You're saying that in the early days of McDermott we had the worst scoring average of the drought years . Fine. Mind you we were trotting players like Mike Tolbert, Chris Ivory and Kelvin Benjamin out there as well so I see that as possible without needing to even look that up. Then over the years under McDermott we built the offense to be the strength of the team...this somehow proves McDermott is clueless about offense. 

 

Mind you I am not a McD supporter and am not defending him here. Just trying to get the rationale here is all.

[PBF81]

1 minute ago, billsfan89 said:

There are 49ers fans who feel like Shanny’s holding them back. Mainly they feel like his inability to move on from Jimmy G and his inability to get his offense going in the playoffs is holding them back. 

 

That in and of itself is fair, but what's been said about his game-day decision-making and other decisions being the primary core issue holding his team back?  

 

That's what's being said in Buffalo, ... and not only by Dunne.  

 

 

1 minute ago, billsfan89 said:

Also “put Allen on the 49ers and they win a SB” is flawed logic. Had the 49ers had Josh they would have a QB with a much bigger cap number and not have the same roster.   

 

Don't you think that they could have afforded and worked in a little shift there?  

 

It's pretty certain they'd have worked it out somehow.  LOL  

 

Either way, you're getting into the role of their GM there, Lynch.  

 

 

1 minute ago, billsfan89 said:

Most fanbases hate their head coach for various reasons. The Bills fanbase has valid criticisms of McD but I wouldn’t romanticize other teams head coaches to prove that point.

 

Whose romaticizing about other coaches in this thread?  Or elsewhere?  

 

It's pretty simple, if McD really is holding the team up, which many many many other people besides Tyler Dunne clearly see as being the case, then why would anyone defend against moving on?  

 

At the end of the day, and this cannot possibly be emphasized enough, our current Bills team revolves entirely around the play of the offense.  

 

There is nothing, absolutely nothing, on record to suggest that McDoesn'tKnow has the first clue about the offense, driven by his own words now in fact, and oddly that he would even admit that, but it is what it is.  

 

If that doesn't spell things out clearly, nothing will other than complete and utter collapse.  ... which may lie ahead.  

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

10 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

In the same way that biased McD supporters have been preaching for years.  

 

By the end of the season, perhaps sooner, if not by then, then next season, we'll know more.  

 

You do realize that the worst scoring offenses since our drought era began, before Allen took off in 2020, i.e. with one year under Taylor and two under Allen from 2017 to 2019, have been the worst on average, other than Jauron's, whose ranked only one spot lower, 26th compared to McD's 25th.  

 

If it isn't blatant that McD is clueless about offense at this point, I don't think that it will ever be to anyone defending him.  

 

But given that we have Allen and that the strength of our team is the offense, this isn't a difficult puzzle to solve.  Really.  

 

 

 

Dude, not sure how this is so confusing for you.  This is literally called confirmation bias...but both you and Dunne.  Dunne has for years been down on McD, so OF COURSE he is going to write an article that supports that position.  You, as a big anti McD person, are going to instantly gravitate to it and say "see, I told you" because it confirms your bias.  

 

This isn't complicated what people are saying.  Now that doesn't make the article true or false, the point is, because of your personal bias that everything is McD's fault, you are going to dismiss anything that might support McD and affirm anything that condemns him, right or wrong.  

 

And your angle with Dorsey is 100% clear proof of that.  There is literally no defending Dorsey, his performance last year should have got him fired instead of gambling Allen and Diggs prime on an unproven OC who had way too many growing pains last season.  And then this year, he was terrible and there is a ton of film that shows the issues with the Dorsey led offense.  

 

You want to point out the first 4 games...well week 1 offense stunk.  Week 2 the offense stunk for more than half the game.  And when you have Josh Allen, when he gets hot it doesn't matter who the OC is, we are gonna roll.  But then the offense stalled because it was not hard to figure out and didn't take the league long to figure out how to defend it and all the issues with it.  And we went on a 6 game stretch where we averaged 20.5 PPG and were 2 plays away from being 0-6 because the offense was pathetic and against mostly bad to weak defenses.  

 

So...any defense of Dorsey and his firing as if Dorsey did not EARN that firing is 100% pure anti-McD bias.  There are plenty of issues to discuss about McD like 12 men on the field against Denver, the TO against philly on the FG try, not trying to get or own FG with Allen and 20 seconds with a TO, etc.  But to blame McD for the offense when Brady has come in and turned the offense completely around and raised the PPG by 14 points is just someone on an agenda and not objectively analyzing the situation.  

 

And people who know a lot more about football than you or I have done a ton of film coverage on what a big difference it has been switching to Brady.  

[FLFan]

3 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

I know this will be taken as 100% factual information, but I struggle with unnamed sources. 
 

If someone got benched for fired, they won’t have favorable reviews of McD period because lack of accountability is a very common problem. 
 

Some of these stories just sound made up, opinions, or exaggerated. 
 

And for what it’s worth, my stance on McD has changed. I do think we will be best served with a new direction. 

I also struggle with unnamed sources here and I question Dunne’s objectivity frankly, and not just here.  It is actually not very hard to elicit negative opinions from disgruntled ex employees of any business.  I think this article needs to be taken with a large grain of salt. That said, there is a lot of smoke here, even independent of Tyler’s hit piece, making it likely there is some level of problem that needs to be addressed by management in the off season.  My patience with McD is certainly wearing thin.  

[Gunsgoodtime]

4 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

I just want some clarification here. Not trying to pick a fight, but the way I'm reading this seems...odd.

 

You're saying that in the early days of McDermott we had the worst scoring average of the drought years . Fine. Mind you we were trotting players like Mike Tolbert, Chris Ivory and Kelvin Benjamin out there as well so I see that as possible without needing to even look that up. Then over the years under McDermott we built the offense to be the strength of the team...this somehow proves McDermott is clueless about offense. 

 

Mind you I am not a McD supporter and am not defending him here. Just trying to get the rationale here is all.

You happened to miss the middle part that those of us are that are ready for Mcd to go say.  Josh Allen.  Josh Allen changed the offense, not Mcdefense. Take Josh Allen out of the equation, there goes all your winning seasons, and McBeane would have been fired years ago

[Yobogoya!]

6 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

I don't know about that.  Many coaches get a pass because their talent isn't all that.  Factor in that McD has one of the few premier QBs in the game today, and a historical first, the bar should be quite a bit higher than say it's been for Shanahan in San Fran with Garoppolo, Mullens, and Purdy, don't you think?  

 

Put Allen on the Niners and they're winning b2b Super Bowls.  

 

I haven't read anything stating that Shanahan's the single dimension holding up the team.  

 

People critizing Dunne should simply come out and accuse him of lying.  He's either honest and telling the truth, or not.  Based on my experiences Dunne's a very honest person.  Objective, which many don't like.  That shouldn't be on him however.  

 

 

 

Oh I definitely agree that McDermott has underperformed with Allen. Believe me I hold the guy primarily responsible for our collapses this year (and past), I'm not trying to defend him too hard. 

 

More like, just trying to play a little devil's advocate on what mostly amounts to an opinion piece about a man's character. McDermott has made plenty of tangible mistakes from a purely decision-standpoint that warrant discussion and criticism. If the guy's a control freak or a scrooge, frankly that's not the reason I'm firing him for.

 

Was Dorsey a scapegoat? Or did McDermott actually go out on a limb to give the guy way more of an opportunity than he deserved? 

 

In any event, the article does seem to back up what a lot of people think about McDermott not being willing to learn from his mistakes and adapt. If true, it's just a damn shame. McDermott seems like a smarter guy than that. If he's going to stubbornly stick to the same decisions and schemes and concepts that let us down time and time again, there's no doubt in my mind he should be let go.  

[DrDawkinstein]

3 hours ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

In sorry but that whole thing sounds like a complete lie. 
 

McD wanted his OL to wear work boots instead of Jordan’s during a walk through? What? 

 

3 hours ago, boyst said:

 

See my quote above

That is a very specific lie. Lies in stories are either completely fabricated or too specific with a manufactured backstory. That passes my sniff test of truth but the accuracy could always be off - as a joke. McChump could have said in a joking manner that his OL needs to be tough and not wearing Jordans. They should be wearing cowboy boots, and carharrts, and drive f650's, and dip Redman... All in a analogic metaphor. 

 

1 hour ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

I agree.

 

You are not going to risk injury to your players forcing them to wear work boats, prima facie absurd.  Also more than likely a violation of many CBA and NFL rules/regulations.

 

Wow, I leave for a couple hours to go to lunch, want to come back to talk about footwear and we're already ramped up to "McD envoking the 9/11 terrorists"!

 

Back to this tho.

 

Yeah, no way did he mandate or even suggest players actually wear work boots. He was obviously busting their chops and calling them out to be tougher.

 

THAT SAID, it is piss poor coaching to even do that.

 

Mike McDaniel sees that and buys the entire OL matching Jordans.

Pete Carroll sees that and shows up in his own Jordans the next week.

Bill Belichick wouldnt even notice what shoes they are wearing because he's busy making sure players know what theyre doing in situational football, and keeping Floyd off a Mayday FG defense.

 

McD, Marrone, Greggggg Williams, and other wannabes are the type to see that and call it out that he wants "work boots and carharts".

[Warcodered]

3 hours ago, Simon said:

 

When players were upset by this edict, center Mitch Morse actually drew a Jordan logo on one of his sharkskin cowboy boots...

 

  

This is one of those things you think/hope isn't true on one level but also kind of want to be true for Morse because it's hilarious.

 

Though this and any other story any in there with players on the team right now seem a little odd, I mean they sound ridiculous and he has to know that someone is going to ask them about them right? Like if Morse gets asked about this story and says it never happened or explains the whole thing was just a bunch of jokes that no one cared about he's going to look like a ***** hack.

57 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

This right here already completely discredits this entire biased hit piece, and I am not even a McD excuse maker.  In fact, if Bills miss the playoffs I think McD should be fired because 12 men on the field and end of Philly decisions (timeout on the FG kick, not trying with Allen and 20 seconds with 1 TO), and holding onto Dorsey 2 weeks too long.  

 

But for the last time, Dorsey EARNED his firing.  He isn't a scape goat.  6 weeks prior to his firing against the weakest part of our schedule that included 3 of the worst teams in the NFL at the time we played them, the Dorsey led offense averaged 20.5 PPG, we went 2-4 and could have easily been 0-6 if not for 2 failed final plays by our 2 opponents we beat.  I said it all offseason, coming back again with Dorsey was GAMBLING on Allen and Diggs prime with an unproven OC who had lots of issues in his first year and too easily out coached.  

 

First 2 games after Dorsey, offense is avg 33 ppg against 2 tough defenses, including one (Jets) the Ken Dorsey led offense averaged 17 PPG against and was 1-2 with both losses to Zack Wilson.  

 

For someone to pretend Dorsey was a scapegoat or premeditated scape goats is utterly absurd.  In fact, McD's BIGGEST mistake was NOT firing Dorsey sooner.  He was out of his league last year at OC, and he was clearly out of his league this year again and McD held on to the point where Bills are basically now in an 8 game playoff to try and make the SB as another loss would make it very very difficult to get into the playoffs, let alone win 3 games to get to the SB.  
 

 

Pretty much this, Dorsey earned getting shown the door and should have gotten walked sooner, not sure McDermott necessarily was able to make that decision sooner, a position as high as OC is going to need to get the okay from ownership to get fired midseason. But either way it happened and the offense turned things around with plenty of time for McDermott to own his own failures.

[PBF81]

1 minute ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

I just want some clarification here. Not trying to pick a fight, but the way I'm reading this seems...odd.

 

You're saying that in the early days of McDermott we had the worst scoring average of the drought years . Fine. Mind you we were trotting players like Mike Tolbert, Chris Ivory and Kelvin Benjamin out there as well so I see that as possible without needing to even look that up. Then over the years under McDermott we built the offense to be the strength of the team...this somehow proves McDermott is clueless about offense. 

 

Mind you I am not a McD supporter and am not defending him here. Just trying to get the rationale here is all.

 

Not at all, I appreciate the objective take and questions and back-n-forth.  

 

To start, remember, it was McD that brought Benjamin (along with many other crap JAGS) over from Carolina.  So let's not discount that.  

 

That aside, the level of talent on this roster was not significantly different from Ryan's two seasons, particularly his last one, to McD's first three, other than for Allen.  

 

In 2015 we scored 397 points.  (23.7/game)  ... and ranked 12th in offense as such.  

 

2016:  399, 24.9, 10th

 

2017:  302, 18.9, 22nd 

2018:  374, 23.4, 18th 

2019:  314, 19.6, 23rd 

 

That's an average of 330 before Allen skyrocketed in 2020.  Keep in mind that was with Taylor also in 2017, who posted his worst season here under McD too, and Allen in 2018 and 2019 apart from a few games where "Peterman gave us the best chances of winning," according to the one that you and others are going to bat for.  

 

The only worse average for any of our coaches, not only during the draft era, but for the Bills franchise at all, was Jauron.  

 

You can connect the dots.  But one of the things that cannot be done is giving McD credit for Allen's rise.  That should be a given at this point.  

 

 

[JESSEFEFFER]

After Rex, it was clear that the Pegulas wanted a detail oriented, set the right culture guy.  Trouble is that details oriented leaders often obsess over nonsensical details because they do not know the one detail that can get them beat.  Sometimes that one detail has been his elite, playmaking QB who can get tricked into seeing opportunities for plays that aren't really there.  So, he has probably developed the thought that he needs to reign Josh in with better "situational football" acumen.

 

For Want of a Nail

For want of a nail the shoe was lost.
For want of a shoe the horse was lost.
For want of a horse the rider was lost.
For want of a rider the message was lost.
For want of a message the battle was lost.
For want of a battle the kingdom was lost.
And all for the want of a horseshoe nail.

 

But, on the other side of the coin is Captain Queeg and his obsession with the strawberries.  It takes some real wisdom to not devolve into that guy.  That story about McDermott's heated altercation with a beat reporter for writing about bulletin board type material posted at drinking fountains (where the reporters could see them) and that they were practicing a fake punt play, smacked of Captain Queeg to me.  As did Chris Brown's suspension for answering Tasker's on-air question about O-Line personnel groupings in a preseason practice which sounded like a McDermott inspired thing to me, too. The off season work hours thing mentioned here sounds petty and Queeg-like, as did making the "very concerned" statement about Diggs. 

 

Yeah, consistently getting beat in big games by last minute execution errors seems like evidence of a guy whose leadership fails when the game pressure is on.  Sean needs some self reflection/correction before it's too late.

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

I thought it strange that after the Giants and Bills game, McD and Daboll didn't even look at each other and didn't even shake hands.

 

You can tell they hated each other

[NoSaint]

19 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

I don’t disagree with the conclusions, but sourcing a manifesto like this with the isaiah mckenzie’s and quinton spain’s of the world has me actually defending mcdermott.  Every NFL coach who’s been around for 7+ years has accumulated a list of disgruntled ex’s .  So out of 300+ players, coach and staff mcdermott has had the last 7 years, one psycho reporter has religiously tracked down anybody who might have a beef with mcdermott.  Reporter comes off as unhinged.  

we will wait for the flood of folks defending him. 
 

morse unfortunately has an uncomfortable interview coming at some point 
 

Daboll was allegedly pretty unhappy when he chose to leave. Is he scorned as a disgruntled ex too? You can’t pretend there aren’t red flags and warning signs that support this potential narrative. 
 

I said weeks ago that there was some energy around the team as if players lost faith in him