WR Trent Sherfield signed

[DrDawkinstein]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Didn’t realize Cincy and Philly won the SB.  Because if memory serves me it was KC who won and didn’t have a 1A let alone a 1B at WR.  

 

But to answer your question…Cincy has a 1B WR because their QB, WR1, and WR2 are ALL on rookie contracts.  Philly has a 1B WR because their QB and WR 1B are on rookie contracts.  
 

Bottom line is you don’t need to have a 1B at WR, and most teams don’t unless they have a rookie contract at QB and hit on at least one of the WRs at 1A or 1B through the draft.

 

It still amazes me how anyone can still not understand this.  

 

Take it a step further, Cincy has a 1A and 1B because they got their QBs knee blown out and they tanked a season. If Buffalo fans want that, then I dont know what to tell them.

 

Also, they wont have a 1A and 1B for long. They'll be lucky to get one more season out of them before losing at least one of them.

 

For Philly, someone needs to list all the botched investments they made at WR before finally trading for Brown. And Bills fans can decide how they'd feel about Beane after all that.

 

So to recap. If we want to be like Cincy or Philly, then we need to have Josh go down with a season ending injury and/or make a bunch of bad 1st round picks at WR before doubling down and investing even more into the position via trade from the other conference. Not a great plan either way, imo. I'll stick to being patient with Beane as he picks and chooses his opportunities.

[Aussie Joe]

3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Singletary is in Houston right now.  We shall see.

$1.5 m tops 

[Warriorspikes51]

Jeez people...the SUN is out in Buffalo today! Smile  

Edited March 20, 2023 by Warriorspikes51

[newcam2012]

2 minutes ago, strive_for_five_guy said:

Between signing guys like Beasley and Brown for the late season push and then Harty and Sherfield in the offseason, it’s clear the team was not happy with the production of guys like McKenzie.  Agree they need to find additional WR talent in the draft too.

As it stands right now, the WR core is a big question mark. Feels like some darts throws.

[BananaB]

4 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Harty > John Brown, McKenzie
Sherfield > Crowder, Kumerow 

There is no proof Hardy is better than either of those guys and Crowder has done a lot more in this league then Sherfield. The only one you might be right on is Kumerov 

[NewEra]

11 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

2 years 12 mil with incentives up to 18 mil seems fair for both sides

Yeah that works for me- we’ll see what Beane and the rest of the league feels. 

[ColoradoBills]

4 minutes ago, Logic said:

If Harty and Sherfield represent an effort to improve the bottom of the WR depth chart and the depth at that position, then they're high quality signings.

If, on the other hand, their signing allows Beane to feel that WR has been adequately addressed and causes him to ignore the position in the draft, then I'm not too happy.

As depth, special teams, and a means of diversifying the skillsets at WR, they're great. As "the answer" to improving the position group overall...not so much.

 

 

I have to believe that a WR is in the plans by Day 2 at the latest.  I too would be disappointed if it wasn't.

[NewEra]

15 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Didn’t realize Cincy and Philly won the SB.  Because if memory serves me it was KC who won and didn’t have a 1A let alone a 1B at WR.  

 

But to answer your question…Cincy has a 1B WR because their QB, WR1, and WR2 are ALL on rookie contracts.  Philly has a 1B WR because their QB and WR 1B are on rookie contracts.  
 

Bottom line is you don’t need to have a 1B at WR, and most teams don’t unless they have a rookie contract at QB and hit on at least one of the WRs at 1A or 1B through the draft.

 

It still amazes me how anyone can still not understand this.  

Amen

[Beck Water]

15 minutes ago, NewEra said:

We don’t even know what he wants- only that he wants more than 4M.  It looks as if Beane won’t pay him what he wants present time. 

 

That said, I don’t think it’s on Beane as much as it’s on the rest of the league. If no one will pay him what he thinks he’s worth, which looks to be the case (so far), his price will come down and possibly into a range where we can afford him.   If that happens, maybe Beane will pay him what he wants. 

 

TBH, the dream I have regards getting a WR high in the draft for the change....so I kind of hope we don't pay OBJ what he wants, because I think it's either-or-not-both.  And if we want to stay competitive, we really do need to "draft and develop".

[Big Turk]

20 minutes ago, BananaB said:

If I was Josh I’d say FU I’m never restructuring  again. 

 

Players have no say whether their contract gets restructured or not most times. Teams include clauses when they sign that allow them to do it at the teams discretion.

 

There is only a win for them when a players contract gets restructured, they get more money up front.

[Warriorspikes51]

5 minutes ago, BananaB said:

There is no proof Hardy is better than either of those guys and Crowder has done a lot more in this league then Sherfield. The only one you might be right on is Kumerov 

 

It's HARTY and actually yes there is. Analytics show he has elite ability when given opportunities.

[CapeBreton]

People are going to be pissed when we don’t draft a WR, not a great class so I like the Harty and Sherfield signings. I hope they draft a TE instead. 

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, Big Turk said:

 

Players have no say whether their contract gets restructured or not most times. Teams include clauses when they sign that allow them to do it at the teams discretion.

 

There is only a win for them when a players contract gets restructured, they get more money up front.

 

Beat me to it. Just shows how little the quoted posted understands about contracts and team building.

 

Restructuring the way Josh and Von get restructured is a BONUS for the player. Players WANT to restructure that way. To say he wouldnt as some sort of punishment to the team is just silly.

[B-Man]

 

 

I would have to venture that this means no Wide receiver in the first or second rounds from Beane.

 

 

 

.

[Chandler#81]

29 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Def better depth.

 

I’ll hold out hope they are still planning on adding an upgrade to Davis… Real shame it will again cost them if they feel they don’t need to use high end resources for WR2. 

Josh will need more apologies at seasons end of this is the case. 😅

I wouldn’t ‘hold out hope’ for very long, if I were you. We Draft late in each round because the team continues to evolve with the ‘always grow’ mindset Beane preaches. As such, finding a WR that late typically means it’s 3 years before they typically come into their own. I, too, hope we select a WR early but we’re not likely to see it pay early returns like a vet signing can.

[BananaB]

1 minute ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

 

It's HARTY and actually yes there is. Analytics show he has elite ability when given opportunities.

If this was last March and Beane signed HarTy and let McKenzie slip away this board would have been in an uproar. ***** easy to say he’s better now that McKenzie ***** up his shot, but there is no proof this guys shot will turn out better. 

[Beck Water]

18 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Didn’t realize Cincy and Philly won the SB.  Because if memory serves me it was KC who won and didn’t have a 1A let alone a 1B at WR.  

 

But to answer your question…Cincy has a 1B WR because their QB, WR1, and WR2 are ALL on rookie contracts.  Philly has a 1B WR because their QB and WR 1B are on rookie contracts.  
 

Bottom line is you don’t need to have a 1B at WR, and most teams don’t unless they have a rookie contract at QB and hit on at least one of the WRs at 1A or 1B through the draft.

 

It still amazes me how anyone can still not understand this.  

 

C'mon Man.  KC has a 1A+ receiver.  His name is Travis Kelce, and he was 3rd in the league for receptions, 8th for yards, and had the highest catch % of receivers with the top 10 yards.

 

You don't get to discount him just because he's a TE and not a WR.  So yes, KC had a 1B or at least a #2 WR with Juju S-S.

 

I don't know if generically a team needs to have a 1B or even a strong #2 at WR, but when they have as little run game as the Bills have, they'd better have a bit more at WR than the Bills had last season, or 1A is gonna get locked in a vault.  Where, BTW, Kelce apparently can not be placed because of his size and physicality.

[brianthomas]

11 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Take it a step further, Cincy has a 1A and 1B because they got their QBs knee blown out and they tanked a season. If Buffalo fans want that, then I dont know what to tell them.

i get the sentiment but you dont need to tank to get a talented wr. As evidenced by the wr's available in the past 2 drafts we could've taken where we drafted.

Christian Watson or George Pickens last year. Elijah Moore, Rondale Moore, Amon-Ra St Brown the year prior. Sure its not Jamarr Chase but not many are.

But it takes proper player evaluation & drafting these guys too. Saying its due to us being too good just seems like a misdirection or an excuse, for any position group, because there are & have been talented players out there available for us to choose. You just have to pick the 'right' ones i guess.

[freddyjj]

16 minutes ago, BananaB said:

There is no proof Hardy is better than either of those guys and Crowder has done a lot more in this league then Sherfield. The only one you might be right on is Kumerov 

Hardy may not be but Harty is 😎

[ColoradoBills]

18 minutes ago, Aussie Joe said:

$1.5 m tops 

 

That's exactly Mike Boone and Dare Ogunbowale money.  Both of them are already on Houston and both on their last year with next to no

dead money.  Singletary is a much better back and will get more $s then those 2.  Houston could free up $3M cutting those guys.

Not that they have cap space issues, just saying.

 

Actually, Dameon Pierce and Singletary would make a good combo attack.  Devin will sign for more than $1.5M. 

[TC in St. Louis]

Wait and see.  He might be a very good signing.  

[WotAGuy]

38 minutes ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

Too early for over reactions.

GTFO with that crap. The whole team is trash!  Errrrgh!

[26TrapDraw]

2 hours ago, R.O. said:

 

Lmao anyone notice how Waddle caught everyone?

[HOUSE]

Kind of reminds me of Gabe with hands

This probably means the end of Kumerow who will most likely hook up with Aaron Rogers in NY

 

.

Edited March 20, 2023 by HOUSE

[26TrapDraw]

47 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I don’t know a ton about him, but all my friends who are Dolphin fans are not happy he landed here and said we are gonna love him.  
 

So be interesting to see how he fits in.  

Funny I told my friends/family who are Giants fans the same thing about Hodgins 😵

Edited March 20, 2023 by BeefCurtns

[DrDawkinstein]

7 minutes ago, brianthomas said:

i get the sentiment but you dont need to tank to get a talented wr. As evidenced by the wr's available in the past 2 drafts we could've taken where we drafted.

Christian Watson or George Pickens last year. Elijah Moore, Rondale Moore, Amon-Ra St Brown the year prior. Sure its not Jamarr Chase but not many are.

But it takes proper player evaluation & drafting these guys too. Saying its due to us being too good just seems like a misdirection or an excuse, for any position group, because there are & have been talented players out there available for us to choose. You just have to pick the 'right' ones i guess.

 

Fair enough. There are certainly ways to do it better than the Bills. Just funny with Cincy and Philly being the examples used and the specific paths they took.

[SydneyBillsFan]

2 hours ago, Beast said:

When you’re broke you shop at the Dollar General. 🤷🏼

 

If you've only got 49 cents, where do you shop then?

[Beck Water]

18 minutes ago, strive_for_five_guy said:

Between signing guys like Beasley and Brown for the late season push and then Harty and Sherfield in the offseason, it’s clear the team was not happy with the production of guys like McKenzie.  Agree they need to find additional WR talent in the draft too.

 

People took it that way, but I think it means the Bills weren't happy with the production of Tanner Gentry or the potential of the guys they had on the PS at the time. The Bills were straight up desperate for bodies at WR after week 9 when Kumerow went on IR.  We only had 4 healthy WR (Diggs, Davis, McKenzie, Shakir) and we were elevating and activating Tanner Gentry for 2 games until we signed John Brown.

 

It's pretty notable that even after we signed Brown, McKenzie got 52% of the snaps to Brown's 16%, 64% to Brown's 5%, 56% to Beasley's 14%,  36% to Beasley's 9%, 56% to Brown's 12%.

 

Beasley and Brown didn't get more snaps until McKenzie was out with a hammy for the MIA WC game and probably still not 100% for the Bengals.

 

NOW, overall, did the Bills think they needed to move on from McKenzie?  Clearly they did, or they wouldn't have gone out and paid Harty $3.745M then cut McKenzie and signed Sherfield, who had roughly the same yards last season as McKenzie did.   

 

But it's also pretty clear that they didn't sign Brown and Beasley because they thought they were better than McKenzie last season; they signed them because they were desperate for a fifth body at WR who had the potential to play better than Gentry, a PS guy, or a guy off the street with no knowledge of our offense.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

I think that makes Buffalo +3 in free agent signings. Pretty sure none of them are worth a 3rd round comp pick that Beane appears to be on the verge of wasting. Hope we start losing some guys or there will be zero compensation for Edmunds.

[Airseven]

29 minutes ago, Logic said:

If Harty and Sherfield represent an effort to improve the bottom of the WR depth chart and the depth at that position, then they're high quality signings.

If, on the other hand, their signing allows Beane to feel that WR has been adequately addressed and causes him to ignore the position in the draft, then I'm not too happy.

As depth, special teams, and a means of diversifying the skillsets at WR, they're great. As "the answer" to improving the position group overall...not so much.

 

 

This is fair. I pray for the former but fear and expect the latter. Predictably, Beane has cornered the "depth WR aka core special teamer" market

[SCBills]

31 minutes ago, Logic said:

If Harty and Sherfield represent an effort to improve the bottom of the WR depth chart and the depth at that position, then they're high quality signings.

If, on the other hand, their signing allows Beane to feel that WR has been adequately addressed and causes him to ignore the position in the draft, then I'm not too happy.

As depth, special teams, and a means of diversifying the skillsets at WR, they're great. As "the answer" to improving the position group overall...not so much.

 

 

Well said.

 

If they go out and sign/trade/draft for a legit WR2 type/prospect, along with already having upgraded McKenzie/Kumerow with Harty/Sherfield, I'll be very happy with the remake of the WR room.

 

If this is the entirety of their WR plan.... good luck Josh.

[NewEra]

22 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

TBH, the dream I have regards getting a WR high in the draft for the change....so I kind of hope we don't pay OBJ what he wants, because I think it's either-or-not-both.  And if we want to stay competitive, we really do need to "draft and develop".

Interesting.  You could be right. I just don’t see the WRs that will be available as having as much of an impact in 2023 as OBj would.  I would hope we could sign him to deal that guarantees 1 year so we can move on next year if we want.  

[Beck Water]

11 minutes ago, brianthomas said:

i get the sentiment but you dont need to tank to get a talented wr. As evidenced by the wr's available in the past 2 drafts we could've taken where we drafted.

Christian Watson or George Pickens last year. Elijah Moore, Rondale Moore, Amon-Ra St Brown the year prior. Sure its not Jamarr Chase but not many are.

But it takes proper player evaluation & drafting these guys too. Saying its due to us being too good just seems like a misdirection or an excuse, for any position group, because there are & have been talented players out there available for us to choose. You just have to pick the 'right' ones i guess.

 

This is exactly right.  I normally think Brandon Beane is a pretty straight shooter, but I winced when he said that thing about not wanting to suck enough to draft Chase.  It reeked of excuse-making to me, exactly for the reasons you said - there were quality WR available where we drafted or for a modest draft move trade.

 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

35 minutes ago, Logic said:

If Harty and Sherfield represent an effort to improve the bottom of the WR depth chart and the depth at that position, then they're high quality signings.

If, on the other hand, their signing allows Beane to feel that WR has been adequately addressed and causes him to ignore the position in the draft, then I'm not too happy.

As depth, special teams, and a means of diversifying the skillsets at WR, they're great. As "the answer" to improving the position group overall...not so much.

 

Excellent post. I've tried to keep an open mind knowing the this is just phase 1 of the offseason and the full plan won't be known until after the draft. 

I am going to reserve judgment on Beane until then. 

[Beck Water]

3 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Interesting.  You could be right. I just don’t see the WRs that will be available as having as much of an impact in 2023 as OBj would.  I would hope we could sign him to deal that guarantees 1 year so we can move on next year if we want.  

 

I don't follow college football enough to have an opinion on the WR in the draft that's worth the powder it'd take to blow it to hell.

 

I do follow "draftology" enough to know that the chances of getting a player who can contribute in Year 1 are better in the 1st and 2nd round, slide some in the 3rd, and that day 3 guys, if they do contribute, typically take a couple years to find their feet.

 

I also have pretty good respect for Greg Cosell and if he names 2 WR he thinks can contribute their 1st years and believes at least 1 will be available where the Bills pick, to me that's worth listening to.

[Warcodered]

 

[Beck Water]

53 minutes ago, BananaB said:

If I was Josh I’d say FU I’m never restructuring  again. 

 

Fortunately, you are not our QB1

 

C'mon man - having a petulant snit about a WR signed to compete at the bottom of the roster, and one who actually did contribute for the Dolphins last year?

[LABILLBACKER]

8 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

Well said.

 

If they go out and sign/trade/draft for a legit WR2 type/prospect, along with already having upgraded McKenzie/Kumerow with Harty/Sherfield, I'll be very happy with the remake of the WR room.

 

If this is the entirety of their WR plan.... good luck Josh.

Exactly,  so now we pray for a cheap Dhop/ OBJ 2 yr signing. 

[HOUSE]

4 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly,  so now we pray for a cheap Dhop/ OBJ 2 yr signing. 

Beane never makes an obvious signing, this means it will be a no name from Biscayne 

[Bruffalo]

9 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly,  so now we pray for a cheap Dhop/ OBJ 2 yr signing. 

I'm still fully on the OBJ train for a sensible deal. Even if they sign either of them I still want a WR in the first 3 rounds.