Matt Araiza accused of rape, served with a lawsuit.

[Beck Water]

16 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

 

The civil suit is to push the DA to make a decision on charges. There seems to be zero people involved who say that a rape did not happen. The girl was 100% raped. The police have 100% stalled efforts to protect SDSU football. 

Whether Araiza is involved in being in the room is currently debatable. 

If the police had not stalled, I don't think that the Bills are dealing with Araiza in a civil suit at the moment. That has nothing to do with his guilt or innocence.

 

Mango, I'm 100% not sure the bolded is true.  After an initial wait, the police seem to have taken the young woman's claims seriously and to put some investigative effort into her case.

 

I know that it can take months just to process samples through a crime lab, and some people here who say they are involved with SVU investigations say that 8-10 months to put all the evidence together and forward it to the DA for a decision on charges is not uncommon.  The victim acknowledges being intoxicated when she arrived, and to have been blacking out during the rape with no clear memories of what happened (for example, when the TV station showed the picture of bruises around her neck, they said she was asked if those marks were from strangulation and her response was she couldn't remember). 

 

That kind of case is notoriously difficult to prosecute, so the DA would understandably want to take his or her time and review what is probably a thick packet of evidence thoroughly.

 

I do agree that one goal here is probably to push the DA's office and the university to act, but I'm not sure they're "stalled" as a matter of "protecting SDSU football".

Edited August 26, 2022 by Beck Water

[HamSandwhich]

16 minutes ago, cle23 said:

 

Yes, those things can happen during consensual sex, but rarely do women then tell everyone it was rape, and go to the hospital for a rape kit just for the fun of it.  

I’m not saying one way or the other until all facts come to light. There are instances where people will actually do that. 

[ExiledInIllinois]

6 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said:

https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-punish-matt-araiza-alleged-050203348.html
 

 

 

🌙 🌚 🌔 🌕 🌖 🌛  😜 

 

We have touchdown! You're about 1/2 behind in this Tolstoy novel... 

 

Am I allowed to return to the ShoutBox without pissing off the moody ones? 

 

😉

Edited August 26, 2022 by ExiledInIllinois

[YoloinOhio]

Just now, aceman_16 said:

Which is BOTH a college and a high school there

Araiza attorney said he had witnesses who claim she told them she went to Grossmont college 

[muppy]

Just now, ColoradoBills said:

I haven't read much of this thread since last night but I did see this on the Channel 8 TV site.

Not sure if it has been posted.  Seems the police have a lot of stuff that they went through.

 

 

local CBS affiliate. Yep. I hadn't seen this posted mate.

[CountDorkula]

2 minutes ago, dje85 said:

 

This could be why the Bills aren't just canning him like many want them to as well. 

If he isn;t subject tot he leagues personal policy conduct and then was cut just because of this the Bills and NFL could have a major lawsuit on their hands in regards from Araiza imo.

NFL is employment at will, you can be cut for any reason. 

[Mango]

6 minutes ago, aceman_16 said:

I sorry you feel this way. Your posts in this thread read as if you have some axe to grind or some sort of agenda. It may be good for some of us to just put access to this subject away for a day and see how the thoughts to social media changes. Good luck and stay healthy.

 

My axe to grind is that there are zero people who are disputing whether this girl was gang raped for 90 minutes and a player on the Bills is involved at any level. At the baseline of facts that everybody agrees on, Matt Araiza had sex with a girl that was so drunk he needed to go help her lay down.

My axe to grind is that there are 121 pages of old men who don't believe (respect) women.

There is no agenda. And your insinuation that such a stance of believing women and not wanting that trash in my town or on my football team is disgusting. 

[ExiledInIllinois]

1 minute ago, muppy said:

local CBS affiliate. Yep. I hadn't seen this posted mate.

What's the vibe in San Diego?

[UKBillFan]

3 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

My axe to grind is that there are zero people who are disputing whether this girl was gang raped for 90 minutes and a player on the Bills is involved at any level. At the baseline of facts that everybody agrees on, Matt Araiza had sex with a girl that was so drunk he needed to go help her lay down.

My axe to grind is that there are 121 pages of old men who don't believe (respect) women.

There is no agenda. And your insinuation that such a stance of believing women and not wanting that trash in my town or on my football team is disgusting. 

I don’t think there is complete agreement that she wanted to lie down because she was drunk. If she was, then if it goes to court, the question will be put as intoxicated or incapacitated.

 

ETA - Until defendants are found guilty in court, it is a case of innocent until proven guilty, and therefore is alleged.

Edited August 26, 2022 by UKBillFan
Added a comment

[hondo in seattle]

4 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

I haven't read much of this thread since last night but I did see this on the Channel 8 TV site.

Not sure if it has been posted.  Seems the police have a lot of stuff that they went through.

 

 

 

Thanks for sharing.

 

The fact that charges seem imminent doesn't seem to bode well for Araiza.

But if I were the Bills, I'd wait to see how much of the evidence I could review.  

[mannc]

2 minutes ago, CountDorkula said:

NFL is employment at will, you can be cut for any reason. 

No, it's not and no you can't.  Players are union members and their employment is subject to a collective bargaining agreement.  They are not "at-will" employees.

[Mango]

6 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

The consent question is alleged by the prosecution, and countered by the defence. It has not been proven.

 

OK. Lets go down that path. Nobody was in the room. 

Why would he bring her up to an empty room and lay her in a bed alone and then leave to go about his night? 
 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

8 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

🌙 🌚 🌔 🌕 🌖 🌛  😜 

 

We have touchdown! You're about 1/2 behind in this Tolstoy novel... 

 

Am I allowed to return to the ShoutBox without pissing off the moody ones? 

 

😉

 

You do know that my current job IS

putting men [edit] and women [/edit] back on the moon 🌝

right?

I don’t have time to read 100 pages 

 

the BIG NASA 🚀 launch coming up is just One of many steps in the process 

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by SlimShady'sSpaceForce

[1ManRaid]

16 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

 

The civil suit is to push the DA to make a decision on charges. There seems to be zero people involved who say that a rape did not happen. The girl was 100% raped. The police have 100% stalled efforts to protect SDSU football. 

Whether Araiza is involved in being in the room is currently debatable. 

If the police had not stalled, I don't think that the Bills are dealing with Araiza in a civil suit at the moment. That has nothing to do with his guilt or innocence.

 

Yeah I think it is highly likely she was raped.  But I also think it's entirely possible she's misremembering things and her brain is falsely tying him to the rape in a desperate bid to make sense of a traumatic and chaotic thing that happened to her.  She so clearly remembers having sex with him, but then details only get fuzzy after so she wasn't roofied (if she was) until after his involvement.  Again, it's also possible he WAS involved in the rape, but from what I'm seeing there isn't any evidence of that yet.  Would be really strange for him to roofie her only AFTER having sex with her, that's like begging to be caught because her sex with you would be the one thing she's most likely to remember.

[CountDorkula]

3 minutes ago, mannc said:

No, it's not and no you can't.  Players are union members and their employment is subject to a collective bargaining agreement.  They are not "at-will" employees.

a team can cut a player for any reason. 

[BullBuchanan]

12 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

He’s specifically singling out araiza only as well… when he’s not the only one named 

Because he allegedly orchestrated the whole thing and is the primary suspect.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

23 minutes ago, aristocrat said:

 

We can also have him place on the exempt list until this whole thing gets sorted out and cut him after that. 

 

So does exempt list count towards 53 man roster and salary cap?

[mannc]

25 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

I agree. I think at the very best Araiza is a dirt bag and I don't want him on the roster. Even if he wasn't in that room, and he brought her up their not knowing anybody else would sleep with her. He still had sex with a girl who was so drunk she couldn't actually consent and he knew it by bringing her someplace to sleep it off after the fact.

I had another post above this where I thought the police's attempts to protect SDSU are the biggest reason we are in this predicament and you summarized that perfectly. 

You appear to be basing this extreme opinion--kick this guy off the Bills' roster before there's any sort of adjudication or, to our knowledge a thorough investigation--on what's been said by a plaintiff's lawyer and what's been alleged in the plaintiff's complaint.  I don't think that's prudent.  If I'm wrong about that, tell me what else you're basing your opinion on. 

Edited August 26, 2022 by mannc

[Bruffalo]

I don't know what's true or not, but I can say that I won't feel bad for Araiza if he's cut ASAP.  

 

If there's even a chance he did what he's being accused of, then I hope charges are brought forward. 

[UKBillFan]

4 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

OK. Lets go down that path. Nobody was in the room. 

Why would he bring her up to an empty room and lay her in a bed alone and then leave to go about his night? 
 

I don’t know - I think the defence is she asked to lie down so he took her to a room to do so then left. It may be more in depth in the official statements which have not been released.

[hondo in seattle]

3 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

My axe to grind is that there are zero people who are disputing whether this girl was gang raped for 90 minutes and a player on the Bills is involved at any level. At the baseline of facts that everybody agrees on, Matt Araiza had sex with a girl that was so drunk he needed to go help her lay down.

My axe to grind is that there are 121 pages of old men who don't believe (respect) women.

There is no agenda. And your insinuation that such a stance of believing women and not wanting that trash in my town or on my football team is disgusting. 

 

Mango, it's not that we don't respect woman.  But I've personally seen people falsely accused of things and suffer immeasurably because of it.  We all know the Brian Banks story - he went to jail for a false rape accusation.  Sadly, sometimes people tell terrible lies about each other.   

 

I don't know if she was raped.  If she was, I don't know if Araiza was involved.  I'd love to see all the evidence the police have collected.  Some of it may be damning.  Maybe it's exculpatory.  Let's see.   

 

But if he is guilty, you're right for calling him "trash" and I hope he goes to prison.  

[djp14150]

6 hours ago, Matt_In_NH said:

 

This is the court of public opinion.  While it is true you can sue for anything it is also true that it is not typical for a 17 year old to go to the police and claim she was gang raped when it did not happen.  People can make judgements about what is reported....look a the DW thing, Browns fans turning in their fan cards, he has not been charged with a crime.   The girl was 17, she went to a party and was in and out of consciousness while a bunch of animals take turns with her...that crap is just crazy.  But I also understand it is common.  There is a huge market for drugs that put girls in this state.  Girls have to make sure they watch they drink at all times, and have a cover on it.  This stuff happens at all colleges.  She goes to the police and they make phone calls with Matt.  Why would he tell her she needs to be worried about chlamydia?  She was 17 and this happened in California....there are no Romeo and Juliet laws.  One way or another he did the wrong thing here....and it sure seems more than statutory.   First telling her to get tested then saying I dont remember anything...yeah right.  How stupid is he for even having that phone conversation?  

 

it’s actually quite common for young women to claim rape when sex occurs for various other reasons.  Sometimes  itwas rape, it could have bern regrettable sex or she might have bern impaired somehow and don’t remember. Some come out after where she thought relationship and it was a one night stand. To him.

 

the police doing phone calls is illegal on many levels without consent or warrant.  If they did this they should be fired.

 

if he knew about the sex and maybe knew who did it and found out this person has an std would be a wa6 fir him to say to get checked.  She might be accusing him because he was a person she remembers or now knows because he got drsfted in the nfl so $$$ reappears in her eyes.

 

if she did a rape kit at a hospital right after the incident the police are informed about this.

 

 

[ExiledInIllinois]

Just now, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

So does exempt list count towards 53 man roster and salary cap?

Why on the exempt list? He's gonna go out there and boom 💥 another 82 yarder.  Is that what people are afraid of?

[mannc]

2 minutes ago, CountDorkula said:

a team can cut a player for any reason. 

No, they cannot.  They are bound by the terms of the CBA.  They can cut a player, but the player has the right to file a grievance if he believes the team's action violates the CBA.

[Yobogoya!]

Just now, mannc said:

You appear to be basing this extreme opinion--kick this guy off the Bills' roster--on what's been said by a plaintiff's lawyer and what's been alleged in the plaintiff's complaint.  I don't think that's prudent.  If I'm wrong about that, tell me what else you're basing your opinion on. 

 

I mean I get it if your opinion is that any guy who has drunk sex with a girl at a college party is a dirt bag, I won't say that's not valid. 

 

But you'd probably have to jetison 80% of the Bills roster if not the league if you think most of these guys aren't guilty of that act. 

[ddaryl]

7 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

My axe to grind is that there are zero people who are disputing whether this girl was gang raped for 90 minutes and a player on the Bills is involved at any level. At the baseline of facts that everybody agrees on, Matt Araiza had sex with a girl that was so drunk he needed to go help her lay down.

My axe to grind is that there are 121 pages of old men who don't believe (respect) women.

There is no agenda. And your insinuation that such a stance of believing women and not wanting that trash in my town or on my football team is disgusting. 

 

 

when there is concrete proof that Matt was involved I'll jump on the let him fry campaign.

 

 

I do not see 121 pages on men who do not believe women. What I see is 121 pages of let it paly itself out and let the facts come forward

[Mattymafia]

3 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Because he allegedly orchestrated the whole thing and is the primary suspect.

Also because hes the only one anyone has ever heard of

[Awwufelloff]

This is pretty cut and dry with California state law. Hes on tape admitting to having sex with a 17 year old. That's illegal and a felony if hes over 3 yrs older than she was. There are no if, ands, or buts about it. The sooner we move on from this the better.

Edited August 26, 2022 by Awwufelloff

[TheWeatherMan]

10 minutes ago, Mango said:

 

My axe to grind is that there are zero people who are disputing whether this girl was gang raped for 90 minutes and a player on the Bills is involved at any level. At the baseline of facts that everybody agrees on, Matt Araiza had sex with a girl that was so drunk he needed to go help her lay down.

My axe to grind is that there are 121 pages of old men who don't believe (respect) women.

There is no agenda. And your insinuation that such a stance of believing women and not wanting that trash in my town or on my football team is disgusting. 

Jump to conclusions much?

[BIGFOOTspaceman]

3 minutes ago, CountDorkula said:

a team can cut a player for any reason. 

Can they cut a player whose wife passed away and the funeral is on Sunday and they sure would like to put their loved one to rest? You sure? Any reason? 

[CountDorkula]

2 minutes ago, mannc said:

No, they cannot.  They are bound by the terms of the CBA.  They can cut a player, but the player has the right to file a grievance if he believes the team's action violates the CBA.

Conduct detrimental to the team. Next. 

[mannc]

Just now, Yobogoya! said:

 

I mean I get it if your opinion is that any guy who has drunk sex with a girl at a college party is a dirt bag, I won't say that's not valid. 

 

But you'd probably have to jetison 80% of the Bills roster if not the league if you think most of these guys aren't guilty of that act. 

And again, almost 100% of the information that's publicly available at this point is coming from a plaintiff's lawyer.

[Mattymafia]

Just now, Awwufelloff said:

This is pretty cut and dry with California state law. Hes on tape admitting to having sex with a 17 year old. That's illegal and a felony if hes over 3 yrs older than she was. There are no if, ands, or buts about it. The sooner we move on from this the better.

There are because in the state of california, there is a different precedent if the person 16-17 is shown to have lied about their age. Thats where his lawyer is going to go. 

[mannc]

1 minute ago, Awwufelloff said:

This is pretty cut and dry with California state law. Hes on tape admitting to having sex with a 17 year old. That's illegal and a felony if hes over 3 yrs older than she was. There are no if, ands, or buts about it. The sooner we move on from this the better.

How do you know he's on tape admitting that?  Has the tape been released or are you relying on what a plaintiff's lawyer is telling you is on the tape?  And your legal conclusion is simply wrong.

[CountDorkula]

Look @Gene1973 I appreciate your interactions.

{Frowny face} {Rolls eyes} {Dislike}

[HappyDays]

8 minutes ago, Mango said:

Matt Araiza had sex with a girl that was so drunk he needed to go help her lay down.

 

It has not been proven that Araiza knew she was too drunk to consent, or that she was too drunk to consent, at that part of the night. There's no timeline listed in the lawsuit at all. All we know for sure is that they had sex, and then at some point she was allegedly raped by a group of men while blackout drunk. Nothing about that framing tells us that Araiza committed a crime or did anything wrong at all.

 

The issue I have with a lot of these title IX cases in general is that a lot of times it involves two individuals who are both very drunk and I don't think it's fair that one party is automatically guilty in that scenario. That kind of logic implies that sex is something men do, and something women have done to them. I don't think that's a fair standard. If Araiza and the girl were both drunk and hooked up and she ended up regretting it, I don't believe that is a crime. And obviously we don't know for sure exactly how malicious it was. It is entirely possible that she was clearly blackout drunk and he took advantage of her in which case of course he committed a crime, but there is no evidence of that assertion.

 

The focus really should be on the gang rape and how culpable Araiza was in participating or knowing that it happened. Those are the facts that need to come out before a decision is made.

[hondo in seattle]

2 minutes ago, Awwufelloff said:

This is pretty cut and dry with California state law. Hes on tape admitting to having sex with a 17 year old. That's illegal and a felony if hes over 3 yrs older than she was. There are no if, ands, or buts about it. The sooner we move on from this the better.

 

There are ifs and buts...  

 

"A statutory rape case is a California “wobbler” offense. This means that the crime can be charged as either a misdemeanor or a felony depending on the facts of the case."

 

www.shouselaw.com/ca/defense/laws/age-of-consent/

[SoCal Deek]

I’ve not read much of this thread but yikes there are a ton of nuances to this matter. For example, you’d have to believe the Bills have some cause of action if this was known to player but undisclosed at the time of the draft…much like an injury. Has this been brought up? (Not that there’s much the organization could get from a recent college grad.)

[BullBuchanan]

2 minutes ago, Mattymafia said:

Also because hes the only one anyone has ever heard of

You do realize that the investigation and evidence was gathered long before most people ever heard of him right? He probably had a similar amount of notoriety as the other two players referenced.

[buffalostu2]

Is it possible the light she spoke about in the room at the time shows video evidence to the contrary of rape and the police or school have it?

 

Also is it possible that the rape test came up with no results after being two days out?   Tests/samples can be botched or tampered with. 

 

Like everyone else I am confused at the timeline and no charges.   I am mostly concerned for the girl and her well being and disgusted at the alleged accounts. 

 

 

 

Edited August 26, 2022 by buffalostu2