Breece Hall Please!!

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, MrEpsYtown said:

 

To be fair, no one gets outside in the NFL. But I agree, I didn't like the pick because of lack of upside. i think he would excel in a Ravens top gap scheme offense. But again, you have to feed him carries for him to really impact the game. 

I just want a RB that meets all 3 of my metrics because they foretell of a good NFL career if they stay healthy. I have the stats to back it up. Breece Hall is in good company. 

[Einstein's Dog]

58 minutes ago, muppy said:

81 pages of chat discussion for One possible draft choice............ we will ll know in a few scant hours just what that Brandon Beanes'  draft board looks like. I wonder if he slept last night.   Either way I know he and war room central will be ready. BRING IT!~!~ 

 

 

Maybe not in a few hours though- there are a lot of mocks that have Hall going to us at 57 (where he is a much better fit).

[MrEpsYtown]

Just now, IronMaidenBills said:

I just want a RB that meets all 3 of my metrics because they foretell of a good NFL career if they stay healthy. I have the stats to back it up. Breece Hall is in good company. 

 

I get you. And I do like that Hall has break away speed and can catch the football. Then he can have more impact on the game. My place is that you can find guys like that outside of the first round. If Hall can impact the game getting 10-15 carries a game with 2-3 catches mixed in that's great. But is that worth a first is my question. 

[Milanos Milano]

2 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

 

I get you. And I do like that Hall has break away speed and can catch the football. Then he can have more impact on the game. My place is that you can find guys like that outside of the first round. If Hall can impact the game getting 10-15 carries a game with 2-3 catches mixed in that's great. But is that worth a first is my question. 

Nobody in the draft meets my 3 metrics other than Breece Hall. Kenneth Walker is the closest and his metrics profile matches Reggie Bush the best. 
It’s possible to have a great NFL career without meeting it, but the risk % bust increases. 

Edited April 28, 2022 by IronMaidenBills

[Solomon Grundy]

1 minute ago, MrEpsYtown said:

If Hall can impact the game getting 10-15 carries a game with 2-3 catches mixed in that's great. But is that worth a first is my question. 

Can’t we ask the same about the WR position? 

[Putin]

I will LMFAO is Breece Hall is there at pick 57 and we still pass on him !!! 

[SCBills]

9 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Well, I finally opened this thread.   Kind of amazing that one guy's passion has pushed this threat to nearly 100 pages!

 

I just watched Hall's 2021 highlights.   He certainly looks like an upgrade from Singletary, but I have to say I don't see the greatness Ironmaiden sees.   I don't see Marshawn Lynch.   

 

However, he does look like a quality back, and his receiving skills seem very good.  If his name is called at 25, I'll be happy because I'll know that Beane and McDermott will have decided that he's the back they need.  

 

I'm trying to figure out why he doesn't look like the RB his testing/results seem he is..

 

Is it as simple as ISU's uniforms are trash and BIG XII tier 2 telecasts are awful quality?  Because he's running away from people, but doesn't look like a 4.39 guy.  The tape just doesn't look explosive, yet his track record has him doing explosive things.

 

I never watched him live, but when I watched Najee or Etienne, I saw explosiveness.  Najee hurdling people and Etienne's absurd acceleration.  Also Bama/Clemson games are top tier quality broadcasts almost every time. 

 

Breece Hall does look incredibly fluid as a receiving option, and if teams are going to give us RB checkdowns all game, Breece Hall looks like the type of guy to make them regret doing that.  

 

To me, he looks like a 3 down back, with top tier receiving skills and 4.39 speed.   If we go that route at 25, i'll question the asset allocation of a RD1 RB, but would definitely be excited about what he brings to the offense. 

[muppy]

7 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

Maybe not in a few hours though- there are a lot of mocks that have Hall going to us at 57 (where he is a much better fit).

well Bills trading down is not really a consideration this year ...Trade UP or stand pat and let the draft come to them the chips/players fall as they may. I do love reading you football heavyweights slugging it out here ..all sides of the issue. This date has been circled on my calendar IM READY for ANYTHNG

 

EDIT: as soon as I typed that Im thinking watch Beane trade down now

 

lol

Edited April 28, 2022 by muppy

[MrEpsYtown]

Just now, Solomon Grundy said:

Can’t we ask the same about the WR position? 

 

Totally. A 1st round receiver this year probably won't even play much. But serviceable running backs are easier to find. Serviceable wide receivers are not good enough. I think that is the difference, at least in my mind. 

2 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

I'm trying to figure out why he doesn't look like the RB his testing/results seem he is..

 

Is it as simple as ISU's uniforms are trash and BIG XII tier 2 telecasts are awful quality?  Because he's running away from people, but doesn't look like a 4.39 guy.  The tape just doesn't look explosive, yet his track record has him doing explosive things.

 

I never watched him live, but when I watched Najee or Etienne, I saw explosiveness.  Najee hurdling people and Etienne's absurd acceleration.  Also Bama/Clemson games are top tier quality broadcasts almost every time. 

 

Breece Hall does look incredibly fluid as a receiving option, and if teams are going to give us RB checkdowns all game, Breece Hall looks like the type of guy to make them regret doing that.  

 

To me, he looks like a 3 down back, with top tier receiving skills and 4.39 speed.   If we go that route at 25, i'll question the asset allocation of a RD1 RB, but would definitely be excited about what he brings to the offense. 

 

And Kenneth walker looks like he was shot out of a cannon. Maybe it is because Hall is bigger. Big running backs look slow. Like, Freddy Jackson always looked slow to me, but he was running right by dudes. 

[Milanos Milano]

Lol @NewEraI’m still waiting for these LOTS of RBs that stunk that met my metrics. 

Edited April 28, 2022 by IronMaidenBills

[teef]

29 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

@teef

 

Are you going to let him talk about you like this?

he's seen me naked, and it made him feel like less of a man.

[Process]

I refuse to believe BBB, the best gm in the business, would waste a first round pick on a RB.

 

Not happening.

[CapeBreton]

Went back and watched Iowa State vs Oklahoma State for Breece Hall, but Malcolm Rodriguez stole the show, I hope the Bills noticed him!

[NewEra]

47 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

A 40 below 4.4 ? And a RAS above 8 and at least 2 years of solid production 1,400+ or 1 year 1,800+ ? List them. There aren’t many. Runners like Reggie Bush and Darren McFadden are the floor. 

What were the RAS of the RBs you listed?  
 

RAS doesn’t mean anything….rachad white has a RAS over 9 and he’s too slow. 

[No_Matter_What]

I think Tremaine Edmunds would be ecstatic if we drafted Hall.

 

Imagine how less attention he would get from the Bills fans!

Edited April 28, 2022 by No_Matter_What

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

56 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

Why on earth would this stud last until 25???

 

Because these days the "rule" has become don't draft a RB in round 1

 

 

48 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Edgerrin James, LT, AP, Barry Sanders, and JT all had roughly the same metrics as Breece Hall. That’s good enough for me at 25. 

 

Not sure I'd use those guys in this argument as they were kind of from a different era when it was OK to select a RB in round 1. Timeframe wise admittedly AP is borderline.

 

Having said that I've kind of come around and am OK with selecting Hall at 25.  If they could trade down a handful and get him then, even better!

 

What's changed my mind is read enough articles about how Beane and McD have never drafted a boundry CB very high, so why start now.  The only reason is because of the injury to White, but they probably have a much better idea where he is in his recovery.  Add in Hyde and Poyer are so good at safety can get away with a weaker #2 CB.  So I'll rule out CB in round 1 for these reasons.  Likely they will still sign a vet FA too.

 

WR or IOL would be other options, but not a huge need for either of them in 2022.  IOL would also be kind of high in round 1, though is late round 1

 

The biggest arguments against drafting a RB in round 1 is they have short careers.  With Josh Allen at QB, this team isn't going to become a Ground Chuck offense so Halls likely wouldn't see the wear and tear that a Henry or Taylor get.  He also may get many receptions out of backfield.  Would a RB catching a pass be any worse career wise than WR catching a pass?

 

Also read an article yesterday that talked about how it doesn't make sense for say for a team like Jax or the Jets to draft a RB in round 1 as the team is still a few years away from competing and by then the RB could be over the hill, particularly if asked to do alot until QB was ready.  But the Bills offense is ready to roll now so not as risky of a move.

 

Likely a RB like Hall could do much more to improve the team in 2022 other than any other position with the possible exception of CB #2 (and punter) and that may or not be the case there too.

[Solomon Grundy]

39 minutes ago, appoo said:

One thing I'm annoyed by Bills Twitter are the people who constantly bring up CEH and the Chiefs. Those are very different. Why? CEH didn't actually add anything new to the offense.

I remember the Bills defensive game plan was to stop the Chiefs passing game and dared them to run the ball. 200+ rushing yards later... 

 

[The Wiz]

Instead of reading all 84 pages, I have to ask,  why is this thread 84 pages???

 

Was every Edmunds thread merged into this one?

Edited April 28, 2022 by The Wiz

[Solomon Grundy]

36 minutes ago, Putin said:

I will LMFAO is Breece Hall is there at pick 57 and we still pass on him !!! 

Me too!! 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

32 minutes ago, muppy said:

well Bills trading down is not really a consideration this year ...Trade UP or stand pat and let the draft come to them the chips/players fall as they may. I do love reading you football heavyweights slugging it out here ..all sides of the issue. This date has been circled on my calendar IM READY for ANYTHNG

 

EDIT: as soon as I typed that Im thinking watch Beane trade down now

 

lol

 

Why wouldn't trading down be a consideration?  Supposedly there's only about 20 players with round 1 grades, so would make sense to trade down. 

 

Only reason not to is not getting a good return on trade value as other teams have the same concern.  So maybe they take 75 cents on the dollar.  Is that still better than not trading down but getting someone who's maybe only the 40th best player?  Instead trade down take the 40th best player and get an extra pick or two.  Or as one article stated if 2 QB's are gone before #25, then teams may want to trade up and would give good value in return as only one decent one left to pick from.

[Milanos Milano]

12 minutes ago, NewEra said:

What were the RAS of the RBs you listed?  
 

RAS doesn’t mean anything….rachad white has a RAS over 9 and he’s too slow. 

I know that RAS doesn’t mean everything, that’s why I included the 3 metrics I provided. You are right, Rachaad is to slow for my metrics. It doesn’t mean he can’t become a good pro, it just means the bust % is higher. 
 

The only scrubs I could fine so far is Tevin Coleman. But like I said, it’s 80%+ success rate. Which not many better correlations. 
 

All the RBs I listed had a RAS better than 9. And Barry Sanders supposedly broke the gauge lol. 

Edited April 28, 2022 by IronMaidenBills

[stinky finger]

1 hour ago, SoMAn said:

The old 'triplets' thing might be outdated, but on the other hand, maybe it's a counter to all the defenses like the Bills' who are now focusing on pass coverage. If we had a back that could catch and power through the front line, it might save some wear and tear on our QB - keeping him from running so often on those short yardage situations.

At the very least, it could provide more RPO schemes, opening up the mid to deep part of the field for the TEs and WRs.

 

I want to give opposing defenses match up nightmares.   With a QB like JA and the other skill positions, including a threatening RB, it could keep opponents up at night trying to figure out how to stop the Bills.

I’m all for providing weapons to the offense - even at RB. Though using our 1st overall on one isn’t my cup of tea. 
 

Go Bills!!

[JoPoy88]

2 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

I know that RAS doesn’t mean everything, that’s why I included the 3 metrics I provided. You are right, Rachaad is to slow for my metrics. 
 

The only scrubs I could fine so far is Tevin Coleman. But like I said, it’s 80%+ success rate. Which not many better correlations. 

i am so shocked your cherry-picked metrics support your position

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, inaugural balls said:

I’m all for providing weapons to the offense - even at RB. Though using our 1st overall on one isn’t my cup of tea. 
 

Go Bills!!

Even if they meet the metrics of RBs like AP, JT, Edgerrin, and Sanders? 

1 minute ago, JoPoy88 said:

i am so shocked your cherry-picked metrics support your position

Name a better correlator. 

[NewEra]

8 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

I know that RAS doesn’t mean everything, that’s why I included the 3 metrics I provided. You are right, Rachaad is to slow for my metrics. It doesn’t mean he can’t become a good pro, it just means the bust % is higher. 
 

The only scrubs I could fine so far is Tevin Coleman. But like I said, it’s 80%+ success rate. Which not many better correlations. 
 

All the RBs I listed had a RAS better than 9. And Barry Sanders supposedly broke the gauge lol. 

I didn’t realize that 40 time had ANY correlation with running back success.  Do you have any stats that support this?

 

4.48 rb is too slow.  

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, NewEra said:

I didn’t realize that 40 time had ANY correlation with running back success.  Do you have any stats that support this?

 

4.48 rb is too slow.  

It does have a correlation if it’s coupled with an elite RAS score and great college production that I outline earlier. All 3 used together is the best formula for NFL success that I’ve found to date. If you know one that is better, let me know. 

[buffalo2218]

I gotta give ya credit IronMaiden, you've toted the Breece Hall banner quite a bit. With the new OL signings as well as Josh under center, Hall could be quite a steal. Props to ya man

[JoPoy88]

6 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Even if they meet the metrics of RBs like AP, JT, Edgerrin, and Sanders? 

Name a better correlator. 

Dude you’ve thrown so many ridiculous comparisons to this guy and flung so much **** at the wall in this thread I can’t keep it straight anymore. Some may respect your tenacity or whatever but it’s embarrassing to me. You’re just a shill.

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, JoPoy88 said:

Dude you’ve thrown so many ridiculous comparisons to this guy and flung so much **** at the wall in this thread I can’t keep it straight anymore. Some may respect your tenacity or whatever but it’s embarrassing to me. You’re just a shill.

Statistics is shilling? If I’m wrong, prove I’m wrong. 

[NewEra]

7 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

It does have a correlation if it’s coupled with an elite RAS score and great college production that I outline earlier. All 3 used together is the best formula for NFL success that I’ve found to date. If you know one that is better, let me know. 

Do you have anything to post that shows this?  I’m not disagreeing, I believe you.  I’m just a info ***** and like to read things for myself to better understand it

[JoPoy88]

3 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Statistics is shilling? If I’m wrong, prove I’m wrong. 

why would I do that? When people offered counterarguments to you in this thread, cited guys like Joe Marino and others, you just dismissed them out of hand, claiming that their opinions are irrelevant and the stats cited are wrong or don’t matter. So why can’t I do the same to you and your BS? What good enough for you is good enough for us, yes?

[NewEra]

Just now, JoPoy88 said:

why would I do that? When people offered counterarguments to you in this thread, cited guys like Joe Marino and others, you just dismissed them out of hand, claiming that their opinions are irrelevant and the stats cited are wrong or don’t matter. So why can’t I do the same to you and your BS? What good enough for you is good enough for us, yes?

Cmon man…..you know why.  

[julian]

IronMaudenBills , I personally want to see corner, WR or oline at pick 25… and as long as we have Josh Allen I’m never going to worry about our run game. 
 

 That being said, I admire your ability to take on all the criticism and stick to your guns, and I’m not sure you’re wrong on Hall.

 

 If they agree with you and take Hall, I’m going to be the biggest Breece Hall fan and hope he’s a difference maker. 

Edited April 28, 2022 by julian

[Solomon Grundy]

Steve Tasker seems to rue the choice of Breece Hall😂😂😂

[Milanos Milano]

16 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Do you have anything to post that shows this?  I’m not disagreeing, I believe you.  I’m just a info ***** and like to read things for myself to better understand it

There is no place to read it because it’s my own doing. As far as I know the three metrics being used together hasn’t been done anywhere online. It’s only happened a handful of times. It’s not a large sample size. It’s elite company. 

[muppy]

33 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Why wouldn't trading down be a consideration?  Supposedly there's only about 20 players with round 1 grades, so would make sense to trade down. 

 

Only reason not to is not getting a good return on trade value as other teams have the same concern.  So maybe they take 75 cents on the dollar.  Is that still better than not trading down but getting someone who's maybe only the 40th best player?  Instead trade down take the 40th best player and get an extra pick or two.  Or as one article stated if 2 QB's are gone before #25, then teams may want to trade up and would give good value in return as only one decent one left to pick from.

thank you for this. My thinking was that since (at least to me) it appears like this past offseason was done to fill holes through free agency that the few pieces of the roster that need shoring up would be a top tier guy , best player available on their draft board, to help the team this year.  As well as shore up with guys to  develop. But the roster top to bottom seems pretty stacked with exception of the CB and OL..imo less WR and RB......what I DO know is about half or less of what the decision makers at 1bd do. I do trust their judgment and their process bottom line. Its clearly fun to conjecture.

[newcam2012]

31 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Statistics is shilling? If I’m wrong, prove I’m wrong. 

Statistics are only as good as the input and information placed into the evaluation. Numbers can always be deceptive and not accurate based on the data that was imputed. Additionally, there are so many other viable in football that really can't be computed analytically. If it were that simple, teams would always hit home runs with their draft choices. Look at Brady as a great example. Heck, Josh Allen is a surprise by analytics too. No QB has improved his accuracy like him. 

15 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

There is no place to read it because it’s my own doing. As far as I know the three metrics being used together hasn’t been done anywhere online. It’s only happened a handful of times. It’s not a large sample size. It’s elite company. 

Nice disclaimer. Small sample sizes have the biggest margin for error. 

[SWATeam]

18 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

There is no place to read it because it’s my own doing. As far as I know the three metrics being used together hasn’t been done anywhere online. It’s only happened a handful of times. It’s not a large sample size. It’s elite company. 

Have you emailed Beane???

[Milanos Milano]

3 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Statistics are only as good as the input and information placed into the evaluation. Numbers can always be deceptive and not accurate based on the data that was imputed. Additionally, there are so many other viable in football that really can't be computed analytically. If it were that simple, teams would always hit home runs with their draft choices. Look at Brady as a great example. Heck, Josh Allen is a surprise by analytics too. No QB has improved his accuracy like him. 

Nice disclaimer. Small sample sizes have the biggest margin for error. 

It’s a category where only the freakiest of athletes are found. Of course it’s going to be a small sample size. AP, JT, Edgerrin, and Sanders is great club to be in. Only Tevin Coleman is the outlier. 

1 minute ago, SWATeam said:

Have you emailed Beane???

Lol it would probably go unread or in the spam file haha. 

[Bray Wyatt]

15 more pages to go! Cmon only a few hours left, dont let me down!