racketmaster Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Drafting both Fromm and Bass shows foresight. The moves give us a glimpse as to what we should expect to see in the coming seasons. The Bills are going into their 3rd season with Allen and it won’t be long before he gets a healthy pay raise with the 5th year option. The window of having a cheap starting qb is nearing an end and with that things will change. Allen is getting to the point in his career where he will no longer need a veteran in the room to “show him the way”. He is the franchise qb and with that he should be the leader in the room. Fromm may not displace Barkley this year but I fully expect that he will take over the backup qb role at the end of the 2020 season. The Bills can save cap space by not resigning Barkley and going with the cheaper rookie contract as the backup. These are moves that need to be made especially when trying to resign other players coming up such as Tre White and Dawkins. It would be nice to keep Barkley but Fromm can be just as good and will save cap space which is important. Bass is a similar situation to Fromm but I think he has a better chance to actually unseat Hauschka this year. He has a much stronger leg and if he shows he can be reliable on the shorter kicks it would be difficult to cut him because he would likely be signed elsewhere. Bass has the opportunity to improve the position and save a good deal of cap space as Hauschka costs 3 million against the cap this year. There are many more moves like the above two that will be required of Beane in the next few years. The period in which Beane can overspend on veteran special teams players is also soon closing. In the drafts to come you will see the Bills target more players who can take over for higher priced veterans. So I like the moves of Fromm and Bass as you only get so many draft picks each year to use and they have begun the process of using later round picks who have a legitimate chance to make the team and help out cap situation down the road. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 It didn't take a crystal ball to understand Barkley is a liability at backup. Or that Hauschka is getting close... 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said: It didn't take a crystal ball to understand Barkley is a liability at backup. Or that Hauschka is getting close... Sure, but the team has rarely been a position to solve problems before they become gaping holes. Beane has shown a dogged determination to give himself options so he's not locked into moves he really doesn't want to make. It was inconceivable that we'd be discussing possibly filling the backup QB role before it became a gaping hole a few seasons ago. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StHustle Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said: It didn't take a crystal ball to understand Barkley is a liability at backup What are you basing this off of? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 15 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said: Sure, but the team has rarely been a position to solve problems before they become gaping holes. Beane has shown a dogged determination to give himself options so he's not locked into moves he really doesn't want to make. It was inconceivable that we'd be discussing possibly filling the backup QB role before it became a gaping hole a few seasons ago. It was a gaping hole that they filled with Barkley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cal Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Fromm is garbage 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 I love both picks!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceVilanch Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Cal said: Fromm is garbage Fromm is human. 2 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Fromm is not garbage. He has to work on his arm strength, but he makes good decisions when in college and throws with anticipation. Bass has a cannon for a leg, and I agree with the OP these were good forward thinking decisions. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) 14 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said: Fromm is not garbage. He has to work on his arm strength, but he makes good decisions when in college and throws with anticipation. Bass has a cannon for a leg, and I agree with the OP these were good forward thinking decisions. Must be hard to walk Edited May 1, 2020 by HOUSE 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, machine gun kelly said: Fromm is not garbage. He has to work on his arm strength, but he makes good decisions when in college and throws with anticipation. Bass has a cannon for a leg, and I agree with the OP these were good forward thinking decisions. His arm strength is better than people give him credit for He throws from his own 14 yard line a tight hard spiral right on the money to the WR in stride to the opposing 40. Edited May 1, 2020 by DJB 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racketmaster Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 Fromm should be a very solid backup qb in the NFL with low end starter upside. His arm strength, although not great, is a little better than some give him credit for as I believe some of his under throws are the result of him not using his legs and relying to much on just his arm. There are throws in the 50-60 yard variety (Vanderbilt and Alabama 2018) that resulted in touchdowns because he put the deep ball on target with little "air" under them. The throws show that he does have the necessary arm strength but he needs to be more consistent in his mechanics. To me he should end up being a player in between Matt Barkley and Kirk Cousins which makes him an excellent 5th round pick. It is almost a certainty that he will be the primary backup to Allen in the 2021 season with Barkley not being resigned and allowing the Bills to save cap $ they will need to allocate for Allen and others. Point being is that Beane will continue to be on the lookout for players in the draft, waivers, free agency that can fill roles on the team at affordable options. I would fully expect Milano to be replaced by a drafted player or an undervalued free agent rather than allocating large $ to him. Edmunds will get the big $ at the position and the Bills will not be able to afford to pay 2 large salaries to LBs. So unless Milano takes a significant hometown discount to stay with the Bills he will be one of the first good players drafted by this regime to end up walking out the door. Drafting Zack Moss instead of signing a veteran RB like Gordon is another great way to save cap dollars. Having 2 primary RBs on rookie deals saves money that can be put elsewhere. Trading for Diggs and paying a higher premium for the cost controlled contract is what Beane does instead of paying a lesser draft price for Hopkins but then paying significantly more in cap $ for him resulting in not signing or resigning another good player. That is why I find much of the talk of acquiring Ngakoue and others like him to be mostly outlandish. We currently have a decent amount of cap space but things are going to get tight real soon and there is no way the Bills go out and start paying huge dollars to outsiders and then have to let others like Dawkins or White go as a result. Think about how much cap $ it will take to retain White, Dawkins, Milano (if they decided on that route which is unlikely) as 2 of them are on the last year of their contract and the other will get a significant pay increase with the 5th year option before he signs a mega deal here or elsewhere. After 2 years, both Edmunds and Allen get big raises with their 5th year options and most likely long-term mega deals. The $ will be spent on these core players, not elsewhere. And once $ is spent on those core players many "peripheral" talent on this team will end up walking out the door. So every drafted player and value free agent that can slide into a peripheral players spot will help maintain the core for years to come. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Hauschka is done. he gets cut this season. Barkley lasts 1 more year giving Fromm time to learn playbook. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racketmaster Posted May 1, 2020 Author Share Posted May 1, 2020 5 minutes ago, DJB said: His arm strength is better than people give him credit for He throws from his own 14 yard line a tight hard spiral right on the money to the WR in stride to the opposing 40. No question about it. I believe Fromm has a stronger arm than Barkley and it is not that close. Fromm does have his share of under throws but just as the clip above shows he has plenty of deep throws with little air under them and deep crossers and outs with zip on the ball. It just seems at times he just tries to rely on just his arm without driving with his legs and he said as much in one of his interviews with Chris Simms. His arm will never be confused with Allen or Mahomes but it is good enough to get the job done. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JinxedBill Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) Foresight sure. Also a luxury to managing the cap accurately, roster strength and winning culture. You can draft for the future when you have the present in order. Very nice feeling. Edited May 1, 2020 by JinxedBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 11 minutes ago, JinxedBill said: Foresight sure. Also a luxury to managing the cap accurately, roster strength and winning culture. You can draft for the future when you have the present in order. Very nice feeling. Well said. I’m hoping the days of making a big money splash on a washed up free agent are behind us for a little while anyway. It’s amazing to see the transformation in the roster, and just as frightening to see how fragile this all is. You swing and miss on Allen, Edmunds, Tre, and/or Singletary and you have a mess! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) I like the picks. But it's not foresight. They chose the guy who was highest on their board each time. They've made that clear. If you want to call going BPA foresight, well, I guess in a way you can say that. But the specific guys weren't picked so much for strategic purposes as to raise the level of talent. And I do love this F.O. But the strategic moves purpose-driven, tend to come in free agency. Edited May 1, 2020 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 45 minutes ago, DJB said: His arm strength is better than people give him credit for He throws from his own 14 yard line a tight hard spiral right on the money to the WR in stride to the opposing 40. I would like to see examples of him throwing the 10-yard out. Even though I hate that play, it would give me a better idea of his arm strength. 37 minutes ago, papazoid said: Hauschka is done. he gets cut this season. Barkley lasts 1 more year giving Fromm time to learn playbook. If Fromm shows himself to be competent in training camp in preseason, I wouldn’t mind cutting Barkley. I was psyched when the Bills were able to re-sign him last year for almost nothing but his play in those two games left me underwhelmed. Fromm at worst can lose games just as easily as Barkley can. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 2 minutes ago, Doc said: If Fromm shows himself to be competent in training camp in preseason, I wouldn’t mind cutting trading Barkley for a 5th. I was psyched when the Bills were able to re-sign him last year for almost nothing but his play in those two games left me underwhelmed. Fromm at worst can lose games just as easily as Barkley can. Fix'd 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan Huff Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 11 hours ago, StHustle said: What are you basing this off of? Most recently, the Jets game at the end of the regular season last year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 33 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said: Fix'd Can’t see that happening. Would love it but not likely. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Just now, Doc said: Can’t see that happening. Would love it but not likely. We got a 5th for AJ McHotMom. It's possible! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billl Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Nobody is giving up assets to acquire a 30 year old Matt freaking Barkley. He was literally the worst backup QB in the league last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StHustle Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 2 hours ago, Brennan Huff said: Most recently, the Jets game at the end of the regular season last year Oh ok so one game...LETS GO WITH FROMM! Smh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billl Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 9 minutes ago, StHustle said: Oh ok so one game...LETS GO WITH FROMM! Smh One game? He’s 30 years old and has 10 career TDs, 21 INTs, 10 fumbles, and 2,500 passing yards. You could literally sign any practice squad QB and get equal or better production. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan Huff Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, StHustle said: Oh ok so one game...LETS GO WITH FROMM! Smh SMH. I said most recently. Do you understand what that means? SMH. He didn’t very good at all throughout the season. Oh and I’m shaking my head still. Actually the only time he did look good was the first half a game 2 years ago. Smh 7 minutes ago, Billl said: One game? He’s 30 years old and has 10 career TDs, 21 INTs, 10 fumbles, and 2,500 passing yards. You could literally sign any practice squad QB and get equal or better production. And there it is Edited May 1, 2020 by Brennan Huff 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 Remember when Fromm was considered one of the top prospects? And Beane got him for a song and a haiku. I didn't see the need but he's far from a wasted pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngbills Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 A) Fromm was never considered a top prospect. Has always been what he is - a game manager type and likely back up at best. B) Barkley is not paid that much. So no it was not some genius move to find a cheaper back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCofNC Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 1 hour ago, ngbills said: A) Fromm was never considered a top prospect. Has always been what he is - a game manager type and likely back up at best. B) Barkley is not paid that much. So no it was not some genius move to find a cheaper back up. Look back 2 years and he was considered a top prospect. He beat out 2 other top prospects, he's not a bad player, just limited by an average arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted May 1, 2020 Share Posted May 1, 2020 7 hours ago, DJB said: His arm strength is better than people give him credit for He throws from his own 14 yard line a tight hard spiral right on the money to the WR in stride to the opposing 40. So he’s got that going for him.... ? Fromm has very good potential to be a long term good BU QB, as does Bass becoming our new place kicker. That and everywhere Beane can save one to three or four million within the roster makes signing our best an easier task and less burdensome on the salary cap. Smart moves by Beane knowing what is coming down the pike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hebert19 Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 On 5/1/2020 at 8:25 AM, racketmaster said: Fromm should be a very solid backup qb in the NFL with low end starter upside. His arm strength, although not great, is a little better than some give him credit for as I believe some of his under throws are the result of him not using his legs and relying to much on just his arm. There are throws in the 50-60 yard variety (Vanderbilt and Alabama 2018) that resulted in touchdowns because he put the deep ball on target with little "air" under them. The throws show that he does have the necessary arm strength but he needs to be more consistent in his mechanics. To me he should end up being a player in between Matt Barkley and Kirk Cousins which makes him an excellent 5th round pick. It is almost a certainty that he will be the primary backup to Allen in the 2021 season with Barkley not being resigned and allowing the Bills to save cap $ they will need to allocate for Allen and others. Point being is that Beane will continue to be on the lookout for players in the draft, waivers, free agency that can fill roles on the team at affordable options. I would fully expect Milano to be replaced by a drafted player or an undervalued free agent rather than allocating large $ to him. Edmunds will get the big $ at the position and the Bills will not be able to afford to pay 2 large salaries to LBs. So unless Milano takes a significant hometown discount to stay with the Bills he will be one of the first good players drafted by this regime to end up walking out the door. Drafting Zack Moss instead of signing a veteran RB like Gordon is another great way to save cap dollars. Having 2 primary RBs on rookie deals saves money that can be put elsewhere. Trading for Diggs and paying a higher premium for the cost controlled contract is what Beane does instead of paying a lesser draft price for Hopkins but then paying significantly more in cap $ for him resulting in not signing or resigning another good player. That is why I find much of the talk of acquiring Ngakoue and others like him to be mostly outlandish. We currently have a decent amount of cap space but things are going to get tight real soon and there is no way the Bills go out and start paying huge dollars to outsiders and then have to let others like Dawkins or White go as a result. Think about how much cap $ it will take to retain White, Dawkins, Milano (if they decided on that route which is unlikely) as 2 of them are on the last year of their contract and the other will get a significant pay increase with the 5th year option before he signs a mega deal here or elsewhere. After 2 years, both Edmunds and Allen get big raises with their 5th year options and most likely long-term mega deals. The $ will be spent on these core players, not elsewhere. And once $ is spent on those core players many "peripheral" talent on this team will end up walking out the door. So every drafted player and value free agent that can slide into a peripheral players spot will help maintain the core for years to come. This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreboding Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 Didn't they say Bradys arm strength wasn't good coming out either? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billl Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 3 hours ago, foreboding said: Didn't they say Bradys arm strength wasn't good coming out either? So now every player with a pop gun arm is Tom Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroutDog Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 https://www.ledger-enquirer.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/guerry-clegg/article242434981.html The author states that a year from now Fromm with be the Bills starter. I’m not buying it. “Don’t be surprised a year from now if he’s the Bills starter because he’s too good to not play. This much is certain. Fromm will say all of the right things because he’s a good teammate. But he’s not going to Buffalo with the intention of being Allen’s backup.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 So strange to me that fans can make such definitive statements about players who haven't played a single down in the NFL, or even players that have barely played. You'd think they'd want to hedge their bets a little in case they turn out to be wrong, which happens often enough. Every single year there are players that were drafted in the later rounds that turn out to be quality starters and sometimes even elite players. Nobody knows how these guys will turn out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billspro Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 On 4/30/2020 at 7:18 PM, Cal said: Fromm is garbage This post is going to be proven wrong. Fromm is going to be a great backup. It wouldn’t be surprising at all if he had a Ryan Fitzpatrick type of career. Barkley is lucky we don’t have a full offseason or Fromm would have beat him out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billspro Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 Jake Fromm ceiling is David Carr. I wouldn’t rule him out reaching that level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thronethinker Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 Shouldn’t all draft picks be based off of forsight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bockeye Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 (edited) Anyone watching the 6:00 Bills/Dallas game on replay tonight? Watching now and forgot that Haushka missed an extra point, 50 yd FG, and bounced one off the upright at 41 that luckily went in. Makes the Bass pick look all that better. Edited May 3, 2020 by Bockeye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo44 Posted May 3, 2020 Share Posted May 3, 2020 13 minutes ago, Bockeye said: Anyone watching the 6:00 Bills/Dallas game on replay tonight? Watching now and forgot that Haushka missed an extra point, 50 yd FG, and bounced one off the upright at 41 that luckily went in. Makes the Bass pick look all that better. Yeah but then he went on a hot streak and didn’t miss another kick the rest of the year. I think they put in a claim for McLaughlin after this game but Indy got him due to a priority waiver claim 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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