"A Coaching Clinic in Bizarro World" - Coaching Extends Drought

[Hapless Bills Fan]

This article got referenced in the "Allen tried to do too much" thread, but I thought it was very on-point and deserved more looks.

I think it's, unfortunately, quite on-point.  Discuss!

 

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-playoffs-2020-bills-sean-mcdermott-coach-bad-calls/1hmflvozh6wsi1vbwi4iax3o7v

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Just want to give props to @wppete who posted it originally. 

 

[transplantbillsfan]

Article makes a lot of valid points.

 

Another question: what happened to the no-huddle the team was running so much in order to have Daboll talking into Allen's headset about what he saw as long as he could?

 

We grabbed the lead and went into a shell. It's McDermott's coaching philosophy. Everyone likes to counter with our 4th down aggressiveness, but I don't think it's really a bold decision to go for it on 4th and short with our QB.

 

I hope the whole "play fearless" mantra comes into play next season and for seasons to come as we work to become the new Kings of the AFC East... because at least Marsha lost today.

Edited January 5, 2020 by transplantbillsfan

[Nextmanup]

On McDermott's decision to go for it on 4th and 27:

 

"It might have been the single worst decision any coach made in any NFL game this season."

 

Ouch!

 

McDermott has made too many in-game tactical errors for too long for anyone to argue this sort of thing is his strong suit.  

 

It's almost as bad as his challenge record.

 

 

[offyourocker]

No questions.  We did all we could to lose this game.  It was bizarre.  If I see one more Gore run next year for half yard, I will stop watching football 

3 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

On McDermott's decision to go for it on 4th and 27:

 

"It might have been the single worst decision any coach made in any NFL game this season."

 

Ouch!

 

McDermott has made too many in-game tactical errors for too long for anyone to argue this sort of thing is his strong suit.  

 

It's almost as bad as his challenge record.

 

 

He does a great job motivating his players and prepping them but the game day management has to be a serious concern for ownership I would think (or at least hope)

[MJS]

It will be better for this team next year when Gore is not on it. He hasn't been effective for most of the season. Yeldon should have been in there instead. I think it was a respect thing to have him active and contributing, but effectiveness should always trump showing a vet player respect.

 

If you are pleasantly surprised when your running back can get more than 1 yard on a play, that means you shouldn't be giving that player snaps. With Singletary, you're surprised if he gets stuffed for 1 yard. The most Gore should have been doing is pass protection on 3rd down.

Edited January 5, 2020 by MJS

[Boatdrinks]

I really hoped Sean was the guy to bring some respectability back to the Bills. Now they’re talking about “ yet another in the list of epic Bills playoff losses”. That really sucks. It’s one thing to lose in the playoffs, but the more you look back at this one the more embarrassing it is. A 16-0 lead in the 2nd half should lead to a win in the playoffs, but McD was McDud tonight. 

[Scott7975]

Yeah, this is just as much on Dumboll as it is on McDermott.

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

Some guys are good teachers and leaders, but not game managers.  This is where I am with Dabol, it's not that his offense playbook is bad, I just don't think Dabol is a good playcaller.  There's a difference.

[ILBillsfan]

This article is spot on to the bone headed head scratching plays that the offense called at the end of the half and then all of the second quarter

 

And to imagine they went all aggressive on the first possession of the gam.  the decision to go for it on 4th and forever was the most idiotic play with all three timeouts ever... Either kick it or punt and hope your d holds

 

Unfortunately I expect McDermott to do same things next year and not realize that you need to keep pressing the offense until you have the other team buried.  FG's do not win games period yet they went ultra conservative up 16-0 like the game was over.  this wont be the last time either

 

 

[Big Blitz]

I'm just going to say this.  Yes the coaches had their worst game of the season.  Maybe the McD era. 

 

But what I think happened was they mistakenly stuck to a formula that worked all season.  I can't blame them....but in this case I just have to 

 

"Oh we're up 16 with 17 minutes left?  Our D has this." Why would they feel like it was in the bag?  Because we dominated the first half.  False, horribly false sense of security.  

 

They underestimated Watson, the best QB we've played all year and what they do in the 2nd half and I think a lot of fans are missing that tonight.  He is so friggin good.   A great QB made 2 guys miss on that (2nd) dagger play.  The first being the 3rd and 18.  That play is on the coaches.  

 

Watson is just special.  A great QB made great plays.  He only attempted 25 passes.  They scored TDs.  We didn't.

 

Total total team loss.  

[transplantbillsfan]

God man!

 

Just reflecting back on that sequence at the end of the 1st half irritates the heck outta me!!!

 

Ball just outside of the red zone at the 23 with 30 seconds left in the half with the clock stopped after driving pretty much the entire length of the field and you hand it to Gore up the middle??? Seriously?!?!?! And then Allen is forced to waste another play by spiking it?

 

15 seconds and 2 plays wasted in a 30 second range where we had plenty of time to potentially score a TD.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

God man!

 

Just reflecting back on that sequence at the end of the 1st half irritates the heck outta me!!!

 

Ball just outside of the red zone at the 23 with 30 seconds left in the half with the clock stopped after driving pretty much the entire length of the field and you hand it to Gore up the middle??? Seriously?!?!?! And then Allen is forced to waste another play by spiking it?

 

15 seconds and 2 plays wasted in a 30 second range where we had plenty of time to potentially score a TD.

 

I know, right?  The author nails it.

[LABILLBACKER]

27 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

On McDermott's decision to go for it on 4th and 27:

 

"It might have been the single worst decision any coach made in any NFL game this season."

 

Ouch!

 

McDermott has made too many in-game tactical errors for too long for anyone to argue this sort of thing is his strong suit.  

 

It's almost as bad as his challenge record.

 

 

His tactical and time management abilities are terrible.  He's a great DC trying to ride the process as a successful HC. It's not working yet? Hopefully Sean can learn from someone. Somehow.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

25 minutes ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

Some guys are good teachers and leaders, but not game managers.  This is where I am with Dabol, it's not that his offense playbook is bad, I just don't think Dabol is a good playcaller.  There's a difference.

 

I think some aspects of Daboll's playbook are bad - or maybe you wouldn't call it the playbook, the personnel decisions.  He's too cute.  "I know, let's send DiMarco, they won't expect that"

 

If DiMarco were outplaying Knox all season, why have we seen Knox all season?  Was Knox banged up or something?  It's mind-boggling.

[Reed83HOF]

3 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

God man!

 

Just reflecting back on that sequence at the end of the 1st half irritates the heck outta me!!!

 

Ball just outside of the red zone at the 23 with 30 seconds left in the half with the clock stopped after driving pretty much the entire length of the field and you hand it to Gore up the middle??? Seriously?!?!?! And then Allen is forced to waste another play by spiking it?

 

15 seconds and 2 plays wasted in a 30 second range where we had plenty of time to potentially score a TD.

We don't play for TDs and we don't put teams away, it has been who we were through the entire season. Yes I wanted a 300yard 4TD game from Josh a few times, not just for Josh though - it is to see that we can put the game a away and stomp on a team and stay on for the full 60 minutes = we don't do that. Is it coaching philosophy or is it a fear of mistakes from poor execution by the offense? I think it is a bit of both, but mostly coaching

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, LABILLBACKER said:

His tactical and time management abilities are terrible.  He's a great DC trying to ride the process as a successful HC. It's not working yet? Hopefully Sean can learn from someone. Somehow.

 

My only hope if we stick with Daboll, is that he and McDermott do a deep-dive retreat and invite someone outside to give input into their play calling and coaching decisions.

The problem with someone internal, and lower in the heirarchy, is that there will always be the concern for "career limiting moves" if it's taken wrong.

 

1 minute ago, Reed83HOF said:

We don't play for TDs and we don't put teams away, it has been who we were through the entire season. Yes I wanted a 300yard 4TD game from Josh a few times, not just for Josh though - it is to see that we can put the game a away and stomp on a team and stay on for the full 60 minutes = we don't do that. Is it coaching philosophy or is it a fear of mistakes from poor execution by the offense? I think it is a bit of both, but mostly coaching

 

You're absolutely right.  We need to learn that killer "step on their throat!" instinct.

[Doc Brown]

I mean what are you trying to do on 4th and 27?  Hope for either a miracle touchdown or a pick in the end zone to pin them back at their 20?  It's amazing we even got the ball back to tie it thanks to O'Brien.

[Reed83HOF]

1 minute ago, Doc Brown said:

I mean what are you trying to do on 4th and 27?  Hope for either a miracle touchdown or a pick in the end zone to pin them back at their 20?  It's amazing we even got the ball back to tie it thanks to O'Brien.

or PI

[Doc Brown]

Just now, Reed83HOF said:

or PI

It showed me he didn't have a lot of faith in his kicker or punter.  Also, you think you're going to get a PI when they haven't called one in play penalty on the Texans all day?

[Reed83HOF]

Just now, Doc Brown said:

It showed me he didn't have a lot of faith in his kicker or punter.  Also, you think you're going to get a PI when they haven't called one in play penalty on the Texans all day?

Hausch can't hit beyond 50 and our punter blows. Still should have punted....

 

I was simply stating that you left PI out - it was never going to be called even if it occurred

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Those play calls definitely cost us along with huge sacks taking us out of FG range and refs thinking blocking is a personal foul.

 

That run with before the first half was just dumb, we didn't have time to run every play should have been a pass there.

 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

33 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think some aspects of Daboll's playbook are bad - or maybe you wouldn't call it the playbook, the personnel decisions.  He's too cute.  "I know, let's send DiMarco, they won't expect that"

 

If DiMarco were outplaying Knox all season, why have we seen Knox all season?  Was Knox banged up or something?  It's mind-boggling.

These stubborn coaches have their favorites.  Gore, Dimarco, Lee Smith, Kroft. They get to play well beyond their limited productive value based on the same stupid loyalty that kept Peterman & Zay on this team so long. That same ridiculous loyalty doesn't exist in Belichick's world. Sitting Duke and TJ all season serves these guys right. Stupid is as stupid does.

[Doc Brown]

31 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

Hausch can't hit beyond 50 and our punter blows. Still should have punted....

 

I was simply stating that you left PI out - it was never going to be called even if it occurred

Unless you're defending the Hal Mary in Foxboro.   

[Reed83HOF]

9 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

This ***** been going on all year and I've been roasted for calling it out.... what's so surprising? 

they had 21 games this season to get this ironed out and still can't

[Buftex]

1 hour ago, Reed83HOF said:

Hausch can't hit beyond 50 and our punter blows. Still should have punted....

 

I was simply stating that you left PI out - it was never going to be called even if it occurred

Our punter only blows, sometimes...it is so strange.  He is so inconsistent.  He had a couple of really great games this year, but you can almost bank on it that he will have one awful kick per game.

[wppete]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

This article got referenced in the "Allen tried to do too much" thread, but I thought it was very on-point and deserved more looks.

I think it's, unfortunately, quite on-point.  Discuss!

 

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/nfl-playoffs-2020-bills-sean-mcdermott-coach-bad-calls/1hmflvozh6wsi1vbwi4iax3o7v

 

Yeah I Completely agree. It’s really sad to read but definitely on point. 

[Freddie's Dead]

It won't happen, but McD should be fired for the decision to go for it on 4th and 27 alone.

[WideNine]

1 hour ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

Some guys are good teachers and leaders, but not game managers.  This is where I am with Dabol, it's not that his offense playbook is bad, I just don't think Dabol is a good playcaller.  There's a difference.

 

Same here, and I have felt this way for most of the year. Daboll can come up with some real offensive wizardry and cool unique plays, but there are times when I think he seems more dedicated to proving how unique is offensive play calls can be while showing a stubborn disconnection with what is happening on the field; What is working, what isn't working, how is the o-line holding up, how Allen is holding up, etc...

 

Well, got to let this one go and at least NE crapped the bed at home... makes this a slightly easier pill to swallow.

 

 

 

 

[Thurman#1]

While I do agree with several points in the article, particularly the clock management at the end of the half when they call a run with 30 seconds left and certainly going for it on 4th and 27, I don't think it's wrong to run Gore.

 

We constantly hear on here how they pass too much, and how they need to run more to take the burden off Allen. And then when they do that and it doesn't work you hear the opposite. And then we hear others saying we run too much and need to put it in Allen's hands ... but when they do that and it doesn't work, then again it was a bad play call.

 

As long as they pass sometimes with Gore in there so it isn't a giveaway that when he's in there it means a run is coming, I don't mind them running him sometimes. Make a hole and he does the job.

 

He does need to work on clock management. I'd expect him to realize that in his review of the game. I hope we'll see some changes. But this isn't a dynamic offense - it doesn't have the personnel or the experience just yet - and that's going to come out sometimes.

Edited January 5, 2020 by Thurman#1

[CSBill]

3 hours ago, Nextmanup said:

On McDermott's decision to go for it on 4th and 27:

 

"It might have been the single worst decision any coach made in any NFL game this season."

 

Ouch!

 

McDermott has made too many in-game tactical errors for too long for anyone to argue this sort of thing is his strong suit.  

 

It's almost as bad as his challenge record.

 

 

 

That play, yeah, have to agree. Even if you miss the FG from there they were in a better place after the 2nd sack. By the way, what happened to our line on those two plays, on both, multiple defenders running untouched towards the QB????

 

[Buddo]

There's plenty of blame to go around tbh.

 

The second half and OT, seemed a bit like an exhibition of shooting ourselves collectively in the foot.

 

Poor play calling lead to some of the time management issues.

 

There's absolutely nothing wrong with playing a soft zone coverage on 3rd and 18, providing you don't drop all the way beyond the 18 yards needed, fcol. Someone, somewhere, needs to be looking at the sticks and making sure the drop is 3 yards before, not after. Right play called, awful execution.

 

Similarly with the blitz that Watson escaped to set up the OT FG winner. Great play called, but another combination of poor execution (tackling), and a good job by Watson, and the game is done.

 

I don't think it was wrong of McDermott to answer the question as he did. Allen did try to do too much. But as others have pointed out, it was largely as a result of poor play calling on the early downs. The perpetual run up the middle on 1st down for 1 yard (if we were lucky) immediately gets you looking for harder plays to get your yardage.

 

Defensively, I think we generally do a good job. We could do with being more consistently aggressive with additional blitzes, but for the most part the balance isn't too bad. We have given ourselvesproblems by going to 'prevent' too early in some games, but the D is more than capable of making RZ stops to leave just FGs as an option, so we get away with it somewhat.

 

Offensively, I'm not too sure what the plan is, because we regularly go from stuff that is working to extremely vanilla.

 

I don't know what it is that makes them like it, but you too often see OCs in the NFL, get so cute they fool nobody, except themselves, by thinking that bad plays called will work, when they haven't all game.

 

I do like a lot of the play design by Daboll, but I don't like the notion that we only play 'proper' offense, to get a lead, at which point it's stick it up the jersey, and let the D do its thing. We might need more talent on offense (we do for sure, it was a figure of speech), but there's still enough there to be continuing to try and make plays, rather than simply control clock.

[GunnerBill]

Look there were some bad coaching decisions. The Gore run at the end of the first half was a nonsense and they got away from Singletary completely after half time which was a mistake. 

 

But I always believe that while coaching matters, talent matters more. Sean McDermott didn't fail to toe tap inside the 5. Brian Daboll didn't drop the ball in the endzone. Leslie Frazier didn't panic on 3rd and 18 and lose sight of the sticks. Ken Dorsey didn't spin like a top, run towards his own endzone and take back breaking sacks / penalties twice in a row. That was all the players. Even the drive when we punted early in the 2nd half was just a wrong read by Allen on a 3rd down RPO. He gives to Singletary who runs into the pile when the keeper was wide, wide open for a 1st down. 

 

I believe fans look at coaches because often it is the easier fix. Replace Brian Daboll and the offense immediately improves. Maybe. He certainly hasn't convinced anyone he is the answer. But I don't believe anyone else could make a top half of the league offense out of these pieces either. 

 

Coaching matters. It always matters. But in the end talent wins. The more talented football team won last night. 

Edited January 5, 2020 by GunnerBill

[Codyny13]

Everyone blaming coaches when our QB LOOKED LIKE HE HAD A STROKE OUT THERE. Major Allen supporter he’s my guy going forward, but he crashed and burned at the end of that game. He has to get better.

[TwistofFate]

We had 172 yards rushing and averaged 5.7 yards a carry.  No, it's not outrageous to think Singletary who was averaging 4.7 yards a carry, could pick up yards on the inside. (he did so multiple times with shifty moves) 

 

Gore averaged just under 3 yards per carry at 2.7.  Not outrageous to hand him the ball either. 

 

The thought process was simple, they didn't want negative plays or long distance 3rd downs. 

 

If you get little to nothing on 1st, then allow Allen the chance to throw on 2nd and not get anything, you've just created a 3rd and long. 

 

Some coaching decisions were insane....like the 4 and 20 something...I was pulling my hair out, but...this "conservative" approach is nothing more than not having real confidence in Josh Allen. 

 

Josh melted down in the second half and IMO, they called plays accordingly to shield him. 

 

Edited January 5, 2020 by TwistofFate

[Mshaw]

That playoff game showed McD won't do anything here other than sneak into the playoffs a few times

 

the only reason we were in the game was bc Bill obrien is almost as bad as he is. 

[Coach Tuesday]

Am I the only one who thinks it was Allen who audibled into the Gore runs?  He yelled “KILL KILL” both times, suggesting the play that was called was a pass and he called it off.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Am I the only one who thinks it was Allen who audibled into the Gore runs?  He yelled “KILL KILL” both times, suggesting the play that was called was a pass and he called it off.

 

I have to say I didn't notice it at the time. When you say both which is the other one? I will try and watch back. 

[Coach Tuesday]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I have to say I didn't notice it at the time. When you say both which is the other one? I will try and watch back. 

After the Hopkins fumble.  Might’ve been Singletary.  Both times I thought he checked to the run.

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

After the Hopkins fumble.  Might’ve been Singletary.  Both times I thought he checked to the run.

 

Just checked the first one. Allen definitely kills whatever the call was. I suspect you are right. The two yard Gore run looks as if it was on Josh not the coaches. 

 

The second one are you thinking play before the Watt sack? I don't even think running it there was a particularly bad call - people can't believe both that we got away from the run too much and at the same time that running once in three plays inside the 15 was too conservative. As for whether Allen changed the play he is definitely shouting something at the line. I think it was an "Alert" to change the protections though rather than a "Kill" to change the play. 

Edited January 5, 2020 by GunnerBill